Houston Center Redevelopment

[j_cuevas713]

This part of downtown is getting a very Millennium Park/Central Park vibe to it. 

[nate4l1f3]

Will the side facing the Four Seasons change at all?

[Luminare]

11 hours ago, Urbannizer said:

Latest design for The Shops at Houston Center

 

 

For comparisons sake. Here it is as of now in 2019:

 

 

Yeah...would be a significant improvement.

[cspwal]

This change will make Sears -> Ion look like a fresh coat of paint

[Subdude]

12 hours ago, Urbannizer said:

Latest design for The Shops at Houston Center

 

I appreciate what they are trying to do.  Four Houston Center has always been fortress-like from the street, in line with the original vision for the complex, so opening it up to the street makes sense.  That said, the renovations are so unconnected in style with the original structure that they seem like they were just tacked on the facade.  Instead of just trying to look generically modern, I would have made more of an effort to integrate with the building.  At a minimum, matching the brick facing would have not made it look like so much of an afterthought.  

[Texasota]

I kinda like that it looks like two completely different buildings. It helps break up the block and make it feel less like one massive thing. 

Edited January 14, 2020 by Texasota

[bobruss]

I agree. It needed a fresh update and  I think once the project is complete it will make better sense. That mall has never drawn a crowd. This will be more inviting and open it up to the visitors to downtown.

4 hours ago, Texasota said:

I kinda like that it looks like two completely different buildings. It helps break up the block and make it feel less like one massive thing. 

I also see where Subdude is coming from but my hope is that the materials in transition make sense and create an inviting entry to the retail.

Only time will tell.

[Naviguessor]

It will more blend and match the environment being created across the street, which also stands out from the buildings behind and above. So, I expect that, in context, that the streetscape will make sense, hold the attention and the supporting structures just be background. 

[Subdude]

My concern is that misguided modernizations are almost always regretted in retrospect.  A perfect example is the "modernization" of buildings on Main Street during the 1960s.  Plenty of buildings had new "modern' facades slapped on them - in some cases mainly at street level, and in other instances (Lamar Hotel, West Building, 806 Main) entirely new facades.  Without exception the results were horrendous.  Just about every one of them has been demolished, whereas if they had kept the original character (Rice Hotel) I think the odds would have been better that they would have survived.  The Houston Center redevelopment design strikes me as looking just as slapped-on, and I'd wager that sometime in the near future people will be saying "What were they thinking?". 

[Luminare]

16 hours ago, Subdude said:

I appreciate what they are trying to do.  Four Houston Center has always been fortress-like from the street, in line with the original vision for the complex, so opening it up to the street makes sense.  That said, the renovations are so unconnected in style with the original structure that they seem like they were just tacked on the facade.  Instead of just trying to look generically modern, I would have made more of an effort to integrate with the building.  At a minimum, matching the brick facing would have not made it look like so much of an afterthought.  

 

49 minutes ago, Subdude said:

My concern is that misguided modernizations are almost always regretted in retrospect.  A perfect example is the "modernization" of buildings on Main Street during the 1960s.  Plenty of buildings had new "modern' facades slapped on them - in some cases mainly at street level, and in other instances (Lamar Hotel, West Building, 806 Main) entirely new facades.  Without exception the results were horrendous.  Just about every one of them has been demolished, whereas if they had kept the original character (Rice Hotel) I think the odds would have been better that they would have survived.  The Houston Center redevelopment design strikes me as looking just as slapped-on, and I'd wager that sometime in the near future people will be saying "What were they thinking?". 

 

In general I agree with your premise, but it really does come down to context. In this case its the absence of context. Where prior renovations to classical style facades into abstract modern facades was a stripping of context which, once taken out or replaced, looks like a mistake in hindsight, this is the complete opposite where if this gets updated again 20 years from now its added context on top of an abstract form which in hindsight one sees how lifeless the prior version was before the alteration and the instead its the alteration that will most likely be remembered more fondly for its efforts. A reduction of detail to abstract is really hard to achieve very well, just as its really hard to condense something complex and make it really simple. The opposite is true for detail. While the detail that gets added might not by itself be successful the continued process of adding detail is what is admired and later appreciated. Just look at cities over history that gradually replaced their building stocks from very low detail buildings to more elaborate detailed buildings and its those buildings with more detail that get more attention and are more likely to survive each change out of building stock. Houston is also a really special case because as soon as it was just starting to add a lot of classical detail and detail in general it was right on the doorsteps of Modernism which...well we know what happened with that for good and bad. This is actually an interesting opportunity for the city as a whole to start adding new layers of detail, so as a city we can establish a better and more unique context. This particular building you can literally find this look and style of building all over the place. Its just not unique enough to justify it remaining as is, and on top of that its initial premise as a building as failed which only further begs the question of if it should remain. The problem with this building is that its so massive that the only way to make it successful in the time being is to chip away at it piece by piece and adding new layers to it piece by piece. I'm actually going to be more interested not what this layer of "modernization" does, but what the next 2 or 3 on top of this will look like. Then it might be something really interesting.

[mollusk]

Funny - they're substituting in white and grey just as brown is starting to return (as breathlessly revealed by the fishwrap the Chron yesterday).

Edited January 15, 2020 by mollusk

[Montrose1100]

On 1/15/2020 at 7:35 AM, Subdude said:

My concern is that misguided modernizations are almost always regretted in retrospect.  A perfect example is the "modernization" of buildings on Main Street during the 1960s.  Plenty of buildings had new "modern' facades slapped on them - in some cases mainly at street level, and in other instances (Lamar Hotel, West Building, 806 Main) entirely new facades.  Without exception the results were horrendous.  Just about every one of them has been demolished, whereas if they had kept the original character (Rice Hotel) I think the odds would have been better that they would have survived.  The Houston Center redevelopment design strikes me as looking just as slapped-on, and I'd wager that sometime in the near future people will be saying "What were they thinking?". 

It would be interesting to see a modern, street level friendly approach in the style of the original buildings. I agree, as I'm not fond of erasing history, regardless if anyone thinks it's ugly nor not.

 

However, given the upper portions of the towers remain intact, I approve of this. So long as they don't completely erase the identity...

[Houston19514]

On 1/14/2020 at 3:48 PM, Subdude said:

I appreciate what they are trying to do.  Four Houston Center has always been fortress-like from the street, in line with the original vision for the complex, so opening it up to the street makes sense.  That said, the renovations are so unconnected in style with the original structure that they seem like they were just tacked on the facade.  Instead of just trying to look generically modern, I would have made more of an effort to integrate with the building.  At a minimum, matching the brick facing would have not made it look like so much of an afterthought.  

 

Perhaps once it is built the contrast between the new and old won't be as stark as rendered. There's good reason to hope for this result given the renderings and reality of the renovations to  One Houston Center and Two Houston Center.

[BeerNut]

Is that open air seating I spy on top?

[Nate99]

[Avossos]

1 hour ago, Nate99 said:

This is turning out way better than I expected...

[KinkaidAlum]

I agree. I was concerned they were going to transform them too much. As a 70s kid, I've always liked these two black boxes. I actually think these street level improvements compliment the architecture quite well.

[mollusk]

Me too, Avassos... but I'm still going to miss that round escalator pod (I know, space limitations, ADA, etc., etc.)

[Nate99]

The end product should work out much better for the area, I think HC was supposed to be some massive mall complex that was cut way short. I'm not sure if the original designs would have held up better had that vision come to pass, but this has some real potential.  Add some more residential and whatever else they're doing with the Skanska stuff, and you have the DG walking area radius looking like a really great neighborhood. 

[Montrose1100]

I don't know if this has been answered or not, but will JoS. A. Banks remain a ground floor tenant? 

[Montrose1100]

Wow that is awesome. I wonder when the fortresses on Louisiana & Smith will follow suit?

[strickn]

From other threads, Brookfield is the owner who has been renovating Total Plaza, Allen Center and Heritage Plaza (though that one's not quite along Louisiana & Smith) too.

[Houston19514]

3 hours ago, strickn said:

From other threads, Brookfield is the owner who has been renovating Total Plaza, Allen Center and Heritage Plaza (though that one's not quite along Louisiana & Smith) too.

 

I wish they would renovate the Heritage Plaza Parking Garage.

[Triton]

19 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

 

I wish they would renovate the Heritage Plaza Parking Garage.

Haven't seen it in a while... is it in bad shape?

[Nate99]

Skybridge to 1HC is open. 
 

 

[X.R.]

23 hours ago, Triton said:

Haven't seen it in a while... is it in bad shape?

 

Not really, I use that garage once a week-ish, and to me its just antiquated in design. Getting in and out sucks. It also doesn't make sense for its location, you get some foot traffic walking to the park over there. 

 

When are the repairs supposed to be done? I know they are kind of zooming, but I feel like this has been going on a while, and the lobby in the houston center is a little...rough with all of the construction stuff. 

[Nate99]

Status of McKinney Street: jacked. 
 

[Luminare]

21 minutes ago, Nate99 said:

Status of McKinney Street: jacked. 
 

 

Oh wow, so they really are going to alter that street. I thought that was just a projection into the future of what they wanted to see, but nope they are doing it right now. A reduced McKinney St in this area will go a long way to making this feel like a place.

[Big E]

3 hours ago, Nate99 said:

Status of McKinney Street: jacked. 
 

 

Wait, why are they tearing up the street again?

[Luminare]

3 minutes ago, Big E said:

 

Wait, why are they tearing up the street again?

 

This part of McKinney is being reduced from 3 lanes and 1 parking lane to 2 lanes and 1 parking lane. The parking lane will also be structured, so not one continuous road. They will probably be busting up the sidewalks at some point in order to match the streetscape they will be doing as well.