Improvements On Main Street

[staresatmaps]

They must be forgetting that emergency vehicles can drive on the light rail lines. Would have been much better if they allowed the sidewalk space to be used and left the vehicle lane for walking, but ADA wins again. I don't imagine many of these businesses will be willing to spends thousands on these highly regulated enclosures that are only set to last until March.

[mollusk]

9 hours ago, staresatmaps said:

They must be forgetting that emergency vehicles can drive on the light rail lines.

 

They may be able to drive there, but I wouldn't want to try to thread a ladder or a water cannon through the wires that power the trains.

[j_cuevas713]

On 10/19/2019 at 10:22 AM, ATH said:

A few years ago, we investigated the condition of the original facade at the Main Food Store Building in the hope that its restoration could have been funded through the Main Street Market Square Redevelopment Authority's historic facade grant program.  At the time, the current facade panels were beginning to deteriorate, and the owner agreed to allow a study to be done of the condition of the original building facade.  Much of the original facade remains in tact, however when they added the new skin, the structural steel supports which hold the new facade were attached to the original structure, and no care was taken when making the  penetrations through the original stone to do these attachments.  In fact, there were so many penetrations through the original stone that a restoration would likely not have been feasible.  All too bad, because the original building was a beauty.

So this has no chance of being saved? 

[staresatmaps]

On 12/11/2020 at 2:33 PM, j_cuevas713 said:

So this has no chance of being saved? 

If only we could just erase a few decades.

[Avossos]

On 12/11/2020 at 2:33 PM, j_cuevas713 said:

So this has no chance of being saved? 

There is always.. ALWAYS a chance... just needs someone to spend the money.

[Tumbleweed_Tx]

this one? A talented stone artist could easily save it. 

[Ross]

12 hours ago, Avossos said:

There is always.. ALWAYS a chance... just needs someone to spend the money.

That's always the issue. One of the first preservation controversies I remember here was the demolition of the publishing company building on Allen Parkway. The owners said something like "We can't afford to spend $2 million and finish with a building worth $1 million". You can't blame owners for not making decisions that don't make economic sense.

6 hours ago, Tumbleweed_Tx said:

this one? A talented stone artist could easily save it. 

But would the owners able to afford the costs to do that? Perhaps they can not do any further damage, in case a future owner feels like paying the costs.

[Tumbleweed_Tx]

that looks like why they put the frame around it, to not damage what is already there.

[j_cuevas713]

17 hours ago, Tumbleweed_Tx said:

this one? A talented stone artist could easily save it. 

I thought they were referring to the other convenient store further down. The one that caught fire. I believe this one is fully restorable just needs the money. 

[quietstorm]

From: https://www.houstontx.gov/planning/MoreSpace-MainStreet.html

The City is extending the program until March 2023 and is expanding it to include more businesses. Not sure why it’s temporary, but it’s a good start. According to the link, four businesses on Main currently participate. 

[pokemonizepic]

hopefully it eventually just becomes permanent, this program adds vibrancy to main st. IMO

[Houston19514]

1 hour ago, pokemonizepic said:

hopefully it eventually just becomes permanent, this program adds vibrancy to main st. IMO

I watched a council committee presentation and discussion of this program recently and it appears it is definitely going the direction of permanent.  (I don't know what the hold up is...)

[j_cuevas713]

Yeah this is super cool. It really opens up a ton of space in Houston for pedestrians. I wonder what other places outside of downtown could take advantage of this. 

[Texasota]

19th st. Main St. through Midtown. South side of University in the Village. Harrisburg. Gray between Bagby and Wilson.

A version of it as a short term, low-cost approach to Lower Westheimer and Washington would be nice. A complete rebuild of the street is a big project, but maybe some paint and bollards in the meantime?

[phillip_white]

15 hours ago, j_cuevas713 said:

Yeah this is super cool. It really opens up a ton of space in Houston for pedestrians. I wonder what other places outside of downtown could take advantage of this. 

The city could implement this on any street with concentrated bars and restaurants. Austin's 6th Street allows vehicles during the day and bollards close it around 8-9 PM nightly.

[nate4l1f3]

I’ve always loved this idea but at the same time I’ve been disappointed that I’ve only seen maybe 2 businesses take advantage of it. Also, when I’m DT I rarely see any citizens taking advantage either. Hopefully that changes soon. 

[Houston19514]

3 minutes ago, nate4l1f3 said:

I’ve always loved this idea but at the same time I’ve been disappointed that I’ve only seen maybe 2 businesses take advantage of it. Also, when I’m DT I rarely see any citizens taking advantage either. Hopefully that changes soon. 

More restaurants are interested, but it takes a bit if an investment. So they have been hesitant because of the short-term nature.  They expect at least a couple more will jump in now that they have another full year, and more would do it if/when it becomes permanent.

Also, they are very much interested in looking at other areas where this could be implemented.

 

[mattyt36]

2 hours ago, nate4l1f3 said:

I’ve always loved this idea but at the same time I’ve been disappointed that I’ve only seen maybe 2 businesses take advantage of it. Also, when I’m DT I rarely see any citizens taking advantage either. Hopefully that changes soon. 

The homeless problem in that area doesn’t help, but I guess it’s gotten a lot better than it was.

[nate4l1f3]

13 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

More restaurants are interested, but it takes a bit if an investment. So they have been hesitant because of the short-term nature.  They expect at least a couple more will jump in now that they have another full year, and more would do it if/when it becomes permanent.

Also, they are very much interested in looking at other areas where this could be implemented.

 

Ahhh that makes sense actually.  Thanks for that perspective 👍🏼

[texan]

Significant overhaul in the works for a portion of Main St. downtown. This project would permanently remove vehicle lanes from these sections of Main St. and raise the grade of the former roadway to sidewalk level.

https://www.houstontx.gov/council/committees/qol/20231025/More-Space-Main-Street.pdf

[downtownian]

I live downtown on Main. I am pro-pedestrian improvements in general. Every other section of downtown that has this becomes a homeless encampment. Not sure what the intent is but if the city wants to create large areas for homeless encampments, this would be the best path forward. 

[Texasota]

What are you talking about? Main Street downtown is really the only area anywhere in the city that's been pedestrianized like this.

I genuinely have no idea what other streets you could be referring to, but these seven blocks have the advantage of lots of foot traffic and more weekend/evening foot traffic in particular than the rest of downtown. Encampments seem pretty unlikely, and, though I have mixed feelings about this, I think it's safe to say that the Downtown Management District will do everything in their power to keep any from forming on this stretch. 

[downtownian]

47 minutes ago, Texasota said:

What are you talking about? Main Street downtown is really the only area anywhere in the city that's been pedestrianized like this.

I genuinely have no idea what other streets you could be referring to, but these seven blocks have the advantage of lots of foot traffic and more weekend/evening foot traffic in particular than the rest of downtown. Encampments seem pretty unlikely, and, though I have mixed feelings about this, I think it's safe to say that the Downtown Management District will do everything in their power to keep any from forming on this stretch. 

Main Street between Dallas and Lamar is completely closed to traffic and is basically this plan. I walk by it daily on the way to the gym and it’s a homeless encampment. Not saying homeless encampments are good or bad but they seem like they’re the outcome to pedestrian improvements like this. 
 

The downtown management district has limited ability to remove homeless 

[Texasota]

The problem with that block is that it's completely vacant except for that corner store. So you have the combination of a store that provides a useful service for people with limited/inconsistent means, a covered area that provides (at least some) shelter, and few reasons for other people to be there. 

Yes, you have the SB station, but the stations are so closely spaced downtown that it's not very inconvenient to go up to Central Station. 

There is so much more activity north of Rusk that I just don't think it's a comparable situation, but even look just one block north (Lamar to McKinney) or the west side from McKinney to Walker. Do you see the same homeless concentration there? 

[downtownian]

42 minutes ago, Texasota said:

The problem with that block is that it's completely vacant except for that corner store. So you have the combination of a store that provides a useful service for people with limited/inconsistent means, a covered area that provides (at least some) shelter, and few reasons for other people to be there. 

Yes, you have the SB station, but the stations are so closely spaced downtown that it's not very inconvenient to go up to Central Station. 

There is so much more activity north of Rusk that I just don't think it's a comparable situation, but even look just one block north (Lamar to McKinney) or the west side from McKinney to Walker. Do you see the same homeless concentration there? 

At Lamar and McKinney, yes. 
From McKinney to walker, no. 

[wilcal]

I think that this is a really good plan.

The fire access solution is interesting. It is kind of annoying that Metro wouldn't just allow fire trucks to drive on top of the light rail lines as needed, but maybe they would be broken in some way. 

I also don't think it is a surprise that they are stopping at Rusk. For a "fun" project in grad school I did a mini feasibility of closing the entire length of Main all of the way through Midtown, and I assumed that the JW Marriott losing their valet access would be a big sticking point. 

There's also a parking lot between Franklin and Congress, and it appears that they are keeping a fire lane (car access?) across that part of the block. It is my understanding that the city would be forced to purchase that land if you cut off car access because it would be a taking because of the current car-focused use.  

Overall this is a great plan, and I hope they keep marching it south and Midtown starts to close it in that corridor.

[Triton]

On 11/15/2023 at 9:01 PM, texan said:

Significant overhaul in the works for a portion of Main St. downtown. This project would permanently remove vehicle lanes from these sections of Main St. and raise the grade of the former roadway to sidewalk level.

https://www.houstontx.gov/council/committees/qol/20231025/More-Space-Main-Street.pdf

I also hope that this improves traffic in the area. If we only need red lights for light rail or the occasional pedestrian needing to cross, that should hopefully improve the travel times as well.

[wilcal]

18 hours ago, Triton said:

I also hope that this improves traffic in the area. If we only need red lights for light rail or the occasional pedestrian needing to cross, that should hopefully improve the travel times as well.

For east/west travel? Good luck. Everything is mostly timed for north/south priority.

[Triton]

8 hours ago, wilcal said:

For east/west travel? Good luck. Everything is mostly timed for north/south priority.

Agreed but that east/west travel can take quite a hit while waiting at the rail lights. Not only do you have to wait for the trains to pass which is fine, seconds later it may turn green for yet the vehicle traffic to cross too, thus causing further delays. 

I have to wait for quite a while just to drop off/pick up my son to/from daycare in this area so trust me, I know. 

My hope is, if they eliminate vehicle traffic, this may improve east/west traffic in this small area. 

[004n063]

On 11/16/2023 at 9:30 AM, downtownian said:

At Lamar and McKinney, yes. 
From McKinney to walker, no. 

McKinney to Walker is not fully pedestrianized, and neither block has nearly the density of active tenants that the "last" eight blocks of Main have.