University Debates: Sports, Fundings, And Developments

[gmac]

UT should open this new research campus near the Port of Dallas then because it's gonna be B-I-G. 

 

There is a whole lot of stupid in this thread. You have one guy literally celebrating UT's Chancellor being named by Watchdog as one of the world's scariest people for the various ways he has violated the law!

 

I'm still trying to figure out why you think we have ever heard of this "Watchdog" bunch. I have no idea why that is supposed to be a big deal.

[swtsig]

jesus this thing has devolved into ridiculousness including an overwhelming bitterness by the UH contingency. there's never been any love lost there and it is painfully obvious in this thread.

 

and i'd agree with ADCS that being near a major logistical hub is part of the lure in a long list of lures that makes Houston an attractive option to UT.

[Timoric]

-

Edited July 10, 2019 by Timoric

[jmitch94]

This thread had devolved to a YouTube comments section. I really doubt I will be visiting this thread until dirt starts moving because nothing productive can come of all this.  

[monarch]

UT should open this new research campus near the Port of Dallas then because it's gonna be B-I-G. 

 

There is a whole lot of stupid in this thread. You have one guy literally celebrating UT's Chancellor being named by Watchdog as one of the world's scariest people for the various ways he has violated the law!

^^^ i cannot help but wonder just what does this same "watchdog" group thinks about donald trump??  will he make their 2016 list??

i for one believe that our ADMIRAL MCCRAVEN.. is the coolest of the cool.  not to mention quite accomplished, admirable, and brilliant!

definitely worth "celebrating"....

[KinkaidAlum]

I'm sorry, but if you are unaware of Watchdog and the work they do to protect our democracy, then that says more about you than me. Here's a clue; GOOGLE IT.  McRaven is in a lot of hot water for his role in the UT admissions scandal and for his active cover up of evidence despite legal requests to release materials. Now he's in charge of UT potentially violating the Constitution of The State of Texas and using PUF funds to buy and finance land without consent. That's a clear violation of our laws. The fact that so many don't seem to care is quite frightening. This is a really big deal. The PUF is a big deal. Using it illegally should also be a big red flag. 

 

 

[monarch]

I'm sorry, but if you are unaware of Watchdog and the work they do to protect our democracy, then that says more about you than me. Here's a clue; GOOGLE IT.  McRaven is in a lot of hot water for his role in the UT admissions scandal and for his active cover up of evidence despite legal requests to release materials. Now he's in charge of UT potentially violating the Constitution of The State of Texas and using PUF funds to buy and finance land without consent. That's a clear violation of our laws. The fact that so many don't seem to care is quite frightening. This is a really big deal. The PUF is a big deal. Using it illegally should also be a big red flag. 

^^^ oh cheer up kinkaidalum.  what on earth is wrong with you??

once our brand new and shining symbol of LONGHORN power and prestige is up and operable...

i shall be the first one to offer to escort you throughout our new research complex.

i am quite certain that you being the very astute person that you are... that you shall at some point come to accept and genuinely respect all that we are trying to accomplish with this magnificent houston market.

 now we do indeed love  you kinkaidalum...

now why don't you cheer up and go out there and hook'em! 

[cloud713]

Exactly. This entire thread blows my mind.. Are people really more concerned with what's "fair" for their alma mater, or what's best for Houston...

[arbpro]

The items always ignored and avoided by those advocating for this campus are:

1. It is not a "research" center. Research centers don't require athletic fields and facilities. It is a school campus, but the herd prefers the term "research" because it offers some legitimacy to the encroachment.

2. There is never an argument offered as to why the process has ALWAYS required the UH abide by the decision taking and the jurisdiction of the Coordinating Board. Prior decisions of the Coordinating Board resulted in denials of UH requests to move forward with expansion. UH accepted the outcomes and took no steps to effectuate expansion without the prior consent of the Board. The UT did not acquire approval of the Coordinating Board to move forward with this school campus. The Chairman of the Board stated he knew nothing of the purchase of the land until he heard it in the news. The only explanation as to why the process rules apply to the UH and not to the UT is because UT is somehow exempt from process and at leave to make its own rules and to do what it wants, when it wants and where it wants. If encroachment rules are applied to one public university, then they should be applied to all of them. 

3. The advocates howl about the notion that nobody should want to stand in the way of better. I'm fine with competition. But competition structured upon a system that willfully discriminates in the manner that state funds are received confers the UT with unfair advantage in this so-called "competition." When one school receives hundreds of millions of state funds from the PUF, and the other receives none, how is that competition? Don't demand all the money and then tell me about "competition." If you want to compete then do it without a disparity in resources.

 

The UT has started a fight. A fight it will get. Either encroachment rules are going to be applied uniformly, fairly, and across the board against all public universities or the funds derived from the PUF are going to be distributed on the basis of the number of students. But the UT no doubt believes it is knighted by God to be entitled to all the money. And the rules? Oh, they just apply to the "common folk" not the privileged.

Edited February 11, 2016 by arbpro

[LarryDierker]

good point. It will be a blast keeping up with UTH's t-ball team.

 

[monarch]

The items always ignored and avoided by those advocating for this campus are:

1. It is not a "research" center. Research centers don't require athletic fields and facilities. It is a school campus, but the herd prefers the term "research" because it offers some legitimacy to the encroachment.

2. There is never an argument offered as to why the process has ALWAYS required the UH abide by the decision taking and the jurisdiction of the Coordinating Board. Prior decisions of the Coordinating Board resulted in denials of UH requests to move forward with expansion. UH accepted the outcomes and took no steps to effectuate expansion without the prior consent of the Board. The UT did not acquire approval of the Coordinating Board to move forward with this school campus. The Chairman of the Board stated he knew nothing of the purchase of the land until he heard it in the news. The only explanation as to why the process rules apply to the UH and not to the UT is because UT is somehow exempt from process and at leave to make its own rules and to do what it wants, when it wants and where it wants. If encroachment rules are applied to one public university, then they should be applied to all of them. 

3. The advocates howl about the notion that nobody should want to stand in the way of better. I'm fine with competition. But competition structured upon a system that willfully discriminates in the manner that state funds are received confers the UT with unfair advantage in this so-called "competition." When one school receives hundreds of millions of state funds from the PUF, and the other receives none, how is that competition? Don't demand all the money and then tell me about "competition." If you want to compete then do it without a disparity in resources.

 

The UT has started a fight. A fight it will get. Either encroachment rules are going to be applied uniformly, fairly, and across the board against all public universities or the funds derived from the PUF are going to be distributed on the basis of the number of students. But the UT no doubt believes it is knighted by God to be entitled to all the money. And the rules? Oh, they just apply to the "common folk" not the privileged.

^^^ no problem arbpro!  so you think / advocate that UT deserves a fight...

well please trust me my HAIF comrade, should we have to fight... then we shall...

and we shall take no prisoners...

[arbpro]

Monarch,

 

Sorry but I don't "trust you." Is there any particular reason I should? 

 

I note you offer no substantive response. I would think that would be the thing to do in vocalizing your position. Obviously, you are exceptionally adroit at cutting and pasting images, but that is about it. 

 

With respect to your "we shall take no prisoners" portent, same  will surely strike fear in every person on Cullen Blvd. When you have nothing in PUF funds and have always had nothing, I am not certain as to exactly what there is to lose. No doubt you will have a 4th grade internet image for that too.

[KinkaidAlum]

What's hilarious is everybody talking about UT-Austin and the Longhorns. It's as if nobody knows that UTEP, UTSA, UT-Arlington, UTD, UTT, UTRGV, etc... exist. Those schools aren't the Longhorns and they are certainly not UT-Austin. Only UT-Dallas is highly regarded. 

 

That's my main beef. Is this the best use of state resources or should the state realize there is already a large, urban, diverse public school in Houston and maybe spend some money on it? I truly don't know the answer but it is beyond naive to assume UT-Houston will be anything like UT-Austin. It'll take decades for it to become even an afterthought in this state. 

 

Ask yourself this, if you were accepted to UTSA, Texas State, Houston, A&M, UT-Dallas, Texas Tech, and UT-Houston, which would you choose? 

 

 

[gmac]

I'm sorry, but if you are unaware of Watchdog and the work they do to protect our democracy, then that says more about you than me. Here's a clue; GOOGLE IT.  McRaven is in a lot of hot water for his role in the UT admissions scandal and for his active cover up of evidence despite legal requests to release materials. Now he's in charge of UT potentially violating the Constitution of The State of Texas and using PUF funds to buy and finance land without consent. That's a clear violation of our laws. The fact that so many don't seem to care is quite frightening. This is a really big deal. The PUF is a big deal. Using it illegally should also be a big red flag. 

 

I did, in fact, Google that publication, and... Yup, sounds like we oughta strap McRaven in at Huntsville and let the pentobarbital flow freely in those bastardly, dastardly veins.

 

Because Watchdog sez he be the 9TH EEEVULLLEST!!!1!

 

I was hoping he would be higher in the rankings so I could be more outraged.

 

My goodness, I hope UT AND A&M build campuses in Houston. The more the merrier.

[Naviguessor]

Ya know, I really wasn't sure where I stood on this project. On one hand, I have very close and long family ties that stretch decades back, and desire what's best for UH (emotional). On the other hand, I am excited by the prospects for houston to have another top institution to boast about and to benefit from (practical). But now, I think I've chosen a side. For one, it's probably illegal and will eventually be proven so (or at the very least an unlevel paying field will be exposed). But primarily, because I'm really put off by the arrogance and hubris of some of the Longhorns in this forum. Not something I often witness from the exes. It's not terribly Texan. Perhaps it's the Aggie in me. But on this one, I'd like to see Bevos horns get sawed off. Maybe, just for the sake of it.

[cloud713]

What's hilarious is everybody talking about UT-Austin and the Longhorns. It's as if nobody knows that UTEP, UTSA, UT-Arlington, UTD, UTT, UTRGV, etc... exist. Those schools aren't the Longhorns and they are certainly not UT-Austin. Only UT-Dallas is highly regarded. 

 

That's my main beef. Is this the best use of state resources or should the state realize there is already a large, urban, diverse public school in Houston and maybe spend some money on it? I truly don't know the answer but it is beyond naive to assume UT-Houston will be anything like UT-Austin. It'll take decades for it to become even an afterthought in this state. 

 

Ask yourself this, if you were accepted to UTSA, Texas State, Houston, A&M, UT-Dallas, Texas Tech, and UT-Houston, which would you choose? 

Good points.. UT-H (if it were a school, and not a research campus) would definitely not be UT-Austin.

Though why can't UH find another way to get money rather than demanding handouts from the state? Rice seems to be doing just fine without PUF money...

Also, why the heck is UH's endowment so small? They dont even have close to a billion dollars...

A&M would clearly be the best bet.. then Tech. UH and Texas State would come in front of the UT-satelite schools though, so maybe thats your point?

[bobruss]

Okay so its all right for UT and A&M to have received handouts from the state (PUF), for the last i don't know 75 years, buts its not right for the other two state schools to ask for a share of those same handouts.

Rice is a private school and they don't get state funds. They happen to be one of the best endowed Universities in the U.S. .

 

No one has yet explained how it is legal for UT to buy land and propose building a school here without going before the same state agency that

wouldn't allow U.of H. to build a satellite campus in the Woodlands because it would be to close to A&M and Sam Houston.

I do wish we were participating in the committee, just to know whats going on.

[cloud713]

Okay so its all right for UT and A&M to have received handouts from the state (PUF), for the last i don't know 75 years, buts its not right for the other two state schools to ask for a share of those same handouts.

Rice is a private school and they don't get state funds. They happen to be one of the best endowed Universities in the U.S. .

No one has yet explained how it is legal for UT to buy land and propose building a school here without going before the same state agency that

wouldn't allow U.of H. to build a satellite campus in the Woodlands because it would be to close to A&M and Sam Houston.

I do wish we were participating in the committee, just to know whats going on.

With all due respect, UT and A&M are the premier public universities in this state. UH... Isn't. And both systems have schools spread all over Texas, making the schools more accessible to all Texans rather than just catering to one metro..

Exactly.. Rice doesn't get state funds, yet Rice manages to be one of the top ranked universities in the country with fantastic facilities and faculty (and quite the stockpile of cash), even with only a few thousand students.. Why can't UH take notes from the private schools on how else to collect money/improve the school instead of relying on the state?

Is what UT is doing illegal? Maybe, well see once it's determined wether it's a research campus or a full blown university.

[asubrt]

But primarily, because I'm really put off by the arrogance and hubris of some of the Longhorns in this forum. Not something I often witness from the exes. It's not terribly Texan.

 

It's just one, and trust me, he is not representative of the rest of us. This forum as a whole really ought to stop acknowledging him, and maybe his incessant troll act will finally stop.

[KinkaidAlum]

Good points.. UT-H (if it were a school, and not a research campus) would definitely not be UT-Austin.

Though why can't UH find another way to get money rather than demanding handouts from the state? Rice seems to be doing just fine without PUF money...

Also, why the heck is UH's endowment so small? They dont even have close to a billion dollars...

A&M would clearly be the best bet.. then Tech. UH and Texas State would come in front of the UT-satelite schools though, so maybe thats your point?

 

Rice is a private school. UH is public. 

 

As for the endowment, the UH system endowment is the 117th biggest in the nation. It's not small for the age of the school or for being a public school. UH's endowment is larger than schools like Iowa State, Arizona, Oklahoma State, Oregon, Arizona State, Florida State, Clemson, Auburn, South Carolina, New Mexico, West Virginia, Ole Miss, Kansas State, South Florida, UMass, Mississippi State and a host of others. 

 

Private schools tend to have much larger endowments. Heck, Trinity in San Antonio has a larger endowment than Baylor with about a fifth of the students. Rice's endowment is in the top 20 in the nation and the school is tiny. 

[monarch]

Monarch,

 

Sorry but I don't "trust you." Is there any particular reason I should? 

 

I note you offer no substantive response. I would think that would be the thing to do in vocalizing your position. Obviously, you are exceptionally adroit at cutting and pasting images, but that is about it. 

 

With respect to your "we shall take no prisoners" portent, same  will surely strike fear in every person on Cullen Blvd. When you have nothing in PUF funds and have always had nothing, I am not certain as to exactly what there is to lose. No doubt you will have a 4th grade internet image for that too.

^^^ substantive..

adroit..

portent..

i am becoming a bit impressed as per your articulation... pretty indeed.

however, my good HAIF comrade.. there has been plenty of previous "substantive" arguments related to our "thread" status quo.  and yet, you still cannot seem to comprehend the bottom line.

nonetheless, it has now become apparent that you have become "adroit" at throwing out the constant soundbites that this particular thread has become numb / stale with.

with respect to your "a fight it will get" "portent", you sound as though you are personally getting ready to throw down the gauntlet.  and yet, you seem quite weary indeed.

and in regards to my "cutting and pasting" techniques... don't get so very intimidated about it, it is proven, and it works.  (it gets your undying attention didn't it)

stop boasting / arguing about something that you are simply not going to win at arbpro!  

TEXAS shall always be TEXAS!  

at the very end of the day in austin, tx... there comes a beautiful burnt orange sunset

it is what it is...

[blackjacks100]

With all due respect, UT and A&M are the premier public universities in this state. UH... Isn't. And both systems have schools spread all over Texas, making the schools more accessible to all Texans rather than just catering to one metro..

Exactly.. Rice doesn't get state funds, yet Rice manages to be one of the top ranked universities in the country with fantastic facilities and faculty (and quite the stockpile of cash), even with only a few thousand students.. Why can't UH take notes from the private schools on how else to collect money/improve the school instead of relying on the state?

Is what UT is doing illegal? Maybe, well see once it's determined wether it's a research campus or a full blown university.

I don't know...maybe it's because Rice charges 40k for its tuition????? UH depends on the state because it's a PUBLIC university. Anything PUBLIC (parks, roadwork, schools, etc.) receives funding from the government. You saying UH shouldn't get any money from the state because it's only in one metro is like saying HISD shouldn't get any funding from the state because it's only in Houston........

[KinkaidAlum]

It costs $41,000 to attend Rice. It used to cost NOTHING to attend Rice. Rice first began charging tuition in 1965.

 

UH could raise a lot of money by charging students $41,000 rather than $7,500 but then again, 95% of the students would have to drop out. 

[arbpro]

Ya know, I really wasn't sure where I stood on this project. On one hand, I have very close and long family ties that stretch decades back, and desire what's best for UH (emotional). On the other hand, I am excited by the prospects for houston to have another top institution to boast about and to benefit from (practical). But now, I think I've chosen a side. For one, it's probably illegal and will eventually be proven so (or at the very least an unlevel paying field will be exposed). But primarily, because I'm really put off by the arrogance and hubris of some of the Longhorns in this forum. Not something I often witness from the exes. It's not terribly Texan. Perhaps it's the Aggie in me. But on this one, I'd like to see Bevos horns get sawed off. Maybe, just for the sake of it.

 

TAMU understands that the governing body for public university expansion is the Coordinating Board. When TAMU sought a merger with a law school in Houston, such expansion was deemed an encroachment. When TAMU's application for expansion was denied, it complied with the decision and located its law school in Fort Worth. Every state supported university seems to be able to understand the process except one. As you correctly observe, "arrogance and hubris" is fully employed.

Edited February 11, 2016 by arbpro

[OkieEric]

This forum as a whole really ought to stop acknowledging him, and maybe his incessant troll act will finally stop.

 

He's an interesting character - this may sound weird, but I'm honestly not sure if he's even aware that he's trolling

 

I am totally for UT building a research hub here, but I can definitely understand UH rejecting a spot on the task force.  If they were to say yes, it would suddenly give McRaven's plan (whatever it is) a bit more validation.  

 

Anyway, the task force list seems like a pretty impressive and diverse bunch, and includes TMC's CEO - it's a bit unclear how or if this impact TMC3, but if both get going then it will really be something.  I just don't understand what the heck all of these people will be researching

[cloud713]

I don't know...maybe it's because Rice charges 40k for its tuition????? UH depends on the state because it's a PUBLIC university. Anything PUBLIC (parks, roadwork, schools, etc.) receives funding from the government. You saying UH shouldn't get any money from the state because it's only in one metro is like saying HISD shouldn't get any funding from the state because it's only in Houston........

Im not saying UH shouldn't get any state money.. just that they should try to find another way to get more money besides whining about the PUF.

Maybe UH should raise its tuition a bit..?

And that last part makes absolutely no sense. Please show me an ISD that is state wide. Of course HISD should get state funding, just like every other REGIONAL "ISD" gets state funding. If there were a major state district AND some random independent district in one little area of the state you can bet your bottom dollar the state district would receive the lions share of the funding.. not the little regional district. Now you see my example of why UH and Tech dont get the same type of funding as the statewide university systems...?

[cloud713]

UH could raise a lot of money by charging students $41,000 rather than $7,500 but then again, 95% of the students would have to drop out. 

And why do you think that is? Rice doesnt have that problem. Nor does Baylor, TCU, etc.. If UH wants more money, UH needs to focus on improving its reputation and establishing quality academics/faculty. Then maybe UH can start getting better students/alumni (and donors), raise the tuition, thus pulling in more money, and then the school wouldn't be worried about some silly PUF funds... 

Edited February 11, 2016 by cloud713

[Montrose1100]

Ask yourself this, if you were accepted to UTSA, Texas State, Houston, A&M, UT-Dallas, Texas Tech, and UT-Houston, which would you choose?

Which ever is furthest from my parents.

[samagon]

http://www.bizjournals.com/houston/morning_call/2016/02/uh-turns-down-spot-on-ut-system-task-force-but.html

 

So UH wants a say, but doesn't accept when an offer for a say is extended by UT? 

 

why would they choose to legitimize what they believe to be illegal?

[JJxvi]

Okay so its all right for UT and A&M to have received handouts from the state (PUF), for the last i don't know 75 years, buts its not right for the other two state schools to ask for a share of those same handouts.

Rice is a private school and they don't get state funds. They happen to be one of the best endowed Universities in the U.S. .

 

No one has yet explained how it is legal for UT to buy land and propose building a school here without going before the same state agency that

wouldn't allow U.of H. to build a satellite campus in the Woodlands because it would be to close to A&M and Sam Houston.

I do wish we were participating in the committee, just to know whats going on.

 

Handouts?

 

The PUF was specifically created to fund the University of Texas and Texas A&M. Period. Thats what it was created to do not some ambiguous "fund all university public eductaion in Texas" or whatever Cougars and Red Raiders and whoever else that wants a "handout" now believes

 

 It was actually probably created specifically to fund Texas only, but A&M got its piece basically because it dates to a murky time when it wasn't clear that the A&M College was going to be a separate entity from the University of Texas.

Edited February 11, 2016 by JJxvi