Buffalo Bayou Master Plan

[jgriff]

I’m not sure that just because the dog park floods that it is in the wrong location. The entire park is where it is because it’s a huge area of land that’s not developed and is not privately owned. Think about the reasons for that. Could we have a park this size in another location? How about we move it 1/4 mile South into an area that floods much less often and buy 124 acres there? Kick all the people out of their houses and pay several million per acre. I think cleaning up the flood debris will be cheaper in the long run.

 

The flooding is not a suprise. The park was designed to flood. The dog park was redesigned this time to be more resilient.

[Houston19514]

40 minutes ago, Visitor said:

Orlando and also Charlotte which receives the same annual rainfall as Houston. 

 

 

 

Charlotte's annual rainfall is significantly less than Houston's. And it's not just annual rainfall that matters.  How it arrives also matters.  Do they get 8 inch downpours like we had Wednesday without any flooding?

[Rube88]

Not a weather person, but elevation may also play a part. Charlotte sits at 750 feet above see level, but Orlando and Houston are both in the low 80's. 

[Ross]

17 hours ago, Visitor said:

You really think the rate of flooding in this city is acceptable? (and I'm not talking about the dog park built 50' from the bayou to be specific).

 

Rain is not new to me nor is torrential rain. Flooding like Houston does, and the fact streets are "designed to flood" is unusual.

 

Other places I have lived experience more annual rain than Houston and experience the same heavy rain and they don't flood at nearly the rate of Houston. It's not common place to have highways shutdown and underpasses impassable. 

 

I'm not hear to debate, you have your opinion and I have mine. There are things I very much like about Houston, city planning is not one of them. 

The streets have always been designed to flood, because Houston is too flat to get heavy downpours drained quickly. I lived on Stella Link where the YMCA is in the 80's, and Bray's Bayou was over its banks at least once a year back then. Rice University and the Medical Center flooded in 1976 and 1979. Most of the intersections on Richmond and Westheimer outside the Loop flooded after an inch of rain. Freeways that are in trenches will flood - that's better than buildings flooding.

[Twinsanity02]

I'm not trying to scare anyone away, but folks sometimes it rains real hard in Texas. Here are some years and numbers.   1921 Thrall TX, 38 inches over 18 hours,  1935 D'Hannis TX 22 inches over 2.75 hours,  1979 Alvin TX 42 inches over 24 hours ( 24 hour US record) . Then there was the 1994 flooding in north Harris County and near Lake Livingston with Kickapoo creek receiving between 25 to 36 inches over a 6 hour period!  I'm not suggesting passivity, but there only so much one can do with that kind of rain. Anyway it's better than what Reunion island received in 1980 from cyclone Hyacinthe.  Twenty one feet of rain.

[Jared625]

21 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

 

Charlotte's annual rainfall is significantly less than Houston's. And it's not just annual rainfall that matters.  How it arrives also matters.  Do they get 8 inch downpours like we had Wednesday without any flooding?

 

I have lived in both Houston and Orlando area. Yes Orlando does give heavy downpours in a short time span but the difference comes down to the soil. Orlando and Florida in general is all sand and porous limestone base soil. The water get absorbed into the ground far easier and faster than the clay soil in Houston. That does create another issue of sinkholes in Florida that we really don't have to deal with here, but in relation to flooding it helps them tremendously.

[skooljunkie]

No doubt roads will flood anywhere for a short period of time during 4-inch+ per hour rains, however it seems that drain pipes are way too small (and likely collapsed/clogged with silt) along many major roads in Houston. They were built 5-10 decades ago when we didn’t tend to think about regional drainage. 

 

For example, water sits for up to an hour on Westcott and Washington after intense downpours and these streets are on relatively high ground between two bayous. Drive along during a light shower and you’ll spot drain after drain clogged. Clogged drains are by far the most challenging item to get fixed via 311 (and believe me, I’ve 311ed a lot over the years). My guess is the old, small drainage pipes are also the easiest to clog up. 

 

How are rebuilds like Shepherd and Kirby doing now? A small car could be driven through the new storm pipes that were put underground along Tuam recently. I’m going to bet I could not even fit in the storm drain pipes under Richmond Ave. That road needs to be rebuilt with or without the train. In sum, Rebuild Houston.  

 

 

 

[Timoric]

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Edited July 12, 2019 by Timoric

[urbanize713]

FYI the dog park is up and running within two weeks of the flood that “ruined” the dog park. Buffalo bayou posted pics of dogs already making use of the lake/pool and running around. Guess no one  is going to post that on reddit though and say how wrong they were but I digress. Cheers to our awesome park!

[Urbannizer]

Should hear more about the next phase soon.

 

http://realtynewsreport.com/2018/10/11/transforming-a-bayou-into-an-award-winning-park-qa-with-anne-olson-of-buffalo-bayou-partnership/

 

We also have a major planning project underway along the bayou’s East Sector.  We have spent the past year gathering input from neighborhood residents and stakeholders as to what they would like to see along this stretch of the waterway.  

The final plan will be completed by the end of the year.

[H-Town Man]

From the interview:

 

"Memorial Park’s master plan is very focused on conservation.  As a result, the plan does not recommend a trail along the bayou’s edge.  I believe the Memorial Park Conservancy team would like to do riparian restoration along the bayou.  They definitely see the bayou being very natural."

 

Translation: The people who live across the bayou from Memorial Park have made it known, in no uncertain terms, that they do not want to see a soul walking anywhere near the bank and looking at their yards. Since most of them are connected in some way to the people giving money for the project, there's really no chance of there ever being a trail along there. For most Memorial Park users, there may as well not even be a bayou running next to that park. Enjoy looking at Memorial Drive instead. It's pretty.

 

 

[Houston19514]

54 minutes ago, H-Town Man said:

From the interview:

 

"Memorial Park’s master plan is very focused on conservation.  As a result, the plan does not recommend a trail along the bayou’s edge.  I believe the Memorial Park Conservancy team would like to do riparian restoration along the bayou.  They definitely see the bayou being very natural."

 

Translation: The people who live across the bayou from Memorial Park have made it known, in no uncertain terms, that they do not want to see a soul walking anywhere near the bank and looking at their yards. Since most of them are connected in some way to the people giving money for the project, there's really no chance of there ever being a trail along there. For most Memorial Park users, there may as well not even be a bayou running next to that park. Enjoy looking at Memorial Drive instead. It's pretty.

 

 

 

Memorial Park's Master Plan includes hiking trails that run pretty close to the bayou along most of its length through the park.

[H-Town Man]

4 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

 

Memorial Park's Master Plan includes hiking trails that run pretty close to the bayou along most of its length through the park.

 

Why do you think she would have said that then? There must be a difference between "along the bayou's edge" and "pretty close to the bayou."

 

[Angostura]

1 hour ago, H-Town Man said:

 

Why do you think she would have said that then? There must be a difference between "along the bayou's edge" and "pretty close to the bayou."

 

 

I assume it's in reference to doing a trail like there is downstream of Shepherd. To do that kind of trail upstream of Shepherd would require clearing a bunch of vegetation along the north bank of the bayou. If you look at the two sections (upstream and downstream of Shepherd) they look pretty different.

 

 

[swtsig]

2 hours ago, H-Town Man said:

From the interview:

 

"Memorial Park’s master plan is very focused on conservation.  As a result, the plan does not recommend a trail along the bayou’s edge.  I believe the Memorial Park Conservancy team would like to do riparian restoration along the bayou.  They definitely see the bayou being very natural."

 

Translation: The people who live across the bayou from Memorial Park have made it known, in no uncertain terms, that they do not want to see a soul walking anywhere near the bank and looking at their yards. Since most of them are connected in some way to the people giving money for the project, there's really no chance of there ever being a trail along there. For most Memorial Park users, there may as well not even be a bayou running next to that park. Enjoy looking at Memorial Drive instead. It's pretty.

 

 

 

talk about a dramatic yet totally unsubstantiated post. buffalo bayou park has had serious problems with erosion, it's not crazy to think that MPC realizes this and made a conscientious decision to protect the banks of the bayou as opposed to develop them. There are miles and miles of hiking and biking trails there now, regardless. 

[H-Town Man]

1 hour ago, swtsig said:

 

talk about a dramatic yet totally unsubstantiated post. buffalo bayou park has had serious problems with erosion, it's not crazy to think that MPC realizes this and made a conscientious decision to protect the banks of the bayou as opposed to develop them. There are miles and miles of hiking and biking trails there now, regardless. 

 

(shrug) It's a little naïve to think that there's no connection between the difficulty of getting to or near most of Buffalo Bayou in Memorial Park (the one overlook at the arboretum excepted) and the multi-million dollar mansions on the other side of it. If the new trails offer meaningful overlooks of the water, I will be pleasantly surprised. It is possible to build trails at the top of the banks without building them within the banks as is the case east of Shepherd, and thereby avoiding erosion. A nice walkway along the top of the bank with some jut-outs over the water. Not holding my breath.

 

Edited October 16, 2018 by H-Town Man

[H-Town Man]

It looks like pages 84-85 of the master plan are about what we can expect from the riparian trails. Visibility of the waterway seems low. Some wooden piers extending out like the one at the arboretum would be an appropriate, conservation-minded solution. An extended boardwalk along/above part of the shoreline would be more ambitious. And a canoe rental somewhere. One can hope.

 

https://issuu.com/memorialparkhouston/docs/mph_mpbook_final_small_webversion_a_c7f9e7eed3d03c

[Triton]

Are there any plans to make a better connection from Shepherd to Memorial Park? The side walk is rather small in most places and I usually have to get off the sidewalk on my bike to let people pass me. 

[jgriff]

8 hours ago, Triton said:

Are there any plans to make a better connection from Shepherd to Memorial Park? The side walk is rather small in most places and I usually have to get off the sidewalk on my bike to let people pass me. 

 

I agree. I’ve walked it many times and fear for my life on foot. I’d be even more worried on a bike. It’s so close to the road that if cyclist falls they could possibly go into traffic.

[gene]

haha i have probably driven my bike past you many times then! i agree...lets widen those sidewalks!!! 

[Houston19514]

On 10/16/2018 at 9:48 PM, Triton said:

Are there any plans to make a better connection from Shepherd to Memorial Park? The side walk is rather small in most places and I usually have to get off the sidewalk on my bike to let people pass me. 

 

They would love to, but I believe it's all private property, all pretty densely developed. 

[Angostura]

6 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

 

They would love to, but I believe it's all private property, all pretty densely developed. 

 

And yet they seem to have found room for six lanes of car traffic. 

[LBC2HTX]

Not sure why there's so many tears about not having a path along the bayou. If you want that, then go to BBP or one of the other many bayou paths around Houston. Plus, its not like the bayou is eye-pleasing. 

[Reporter]

PLEASING is in the eye of the beholder. So take your unpleasing OPINION and                it.

[jgriff]

1 hour ago, LBC2HTX said:

Not sure why there's so many tears about not having a path along the bayou. If you want that, then go to BBP or one of the other many bayou paths around Houston. Plus, its not like the bayou is eye-pleasing. 

 

I walk BBP a lot. Sometimes the Bayou is "eye pleasing". The main issue with the trails that are close to the bayou for me is that they are often closed or impassible. They get washed away over and over again.  I probably wouldn't use them much except they are needed to get away from all the people on bikes that don't appear to have brakes. 

[H-Town Man]

1 hour ago, LBC2HTX said:

Not sure why there's so many tears about not having a path along the bayou. If you want that, then go to BBP or one of the other many bayou paths around Houston. Plus, its not like the bayou is eye-pleasing. 

 

Buffalo Bayou is the city's most salient geographical feature. Memorial Park is the city's largest park. You should be able to get good views of the bayou in the park.

 

Maybe the new trails will allow this and maybe they won't, but it's something they need to get right.

 

[Triton]

Oh, when I meant larger paths, I was talking about expanding the sidewalks on Memorial Drive from Memorial Park to BBP at Shepherd. It appears doable to me... in fact, the city is expanding the sidewalks from the White Oak Bike Trail to the Woodlands Park for better connectivity. True, there's only one business and one residential property to deal with, but I wish the city would try to at least make the effort of making this a safer path from one major park to the other.

 

Edit: I think a bike trail along the bayou from this park to the other park would be way too costly. You would have to build the infrastructure just to keep the path stable along this more cliff-like area and would need to tear down quite a bit of woods area. Plus, given the backlash from the better off, it's likely not going to happen.

[Houston19514]

There will be views of the bayou available to all in the new Memorial Park.  Anyone interested in the plans for Memorial Park should read the Master Plan.  https://issuu.com/memorialparkhouston/docs/mph_mpbook_final_small_webversion_a_c7f9e7eed3d03c

[H-Town Man]

1 hour ago, Houston19514 said:

There will be views of the bayou available to all in the new Memorial Park.  Anyone interested in the plans for Memorial Park should read the Master Plan.  https://issuu.com/memorialparkhouston/docs/mph_mpbook_final_small_webversion_a_c7f9e7eed3d03c

 

I've read it - see my post the previous page:

 

It looks like pages 84-85 of the master plan are about what we can expect from the riparian trails. Visibility of the waterway seems low. Some wooden piers extending out like the one at the arboretum would be an appropriate, conservation-minded solution. An extended boardwalk along/above part of the shoreline would be more ambitious. And a canoe rental somewhere. One can hope.

 

https://issuu.com/memorialparkhouston/docs/mph_mpbook_final_small_webversion_a_c7f9e7eed3d03c

[Triton]

3 hours ago, H-Town Man said:

 

I've read it - see my post the previous page:

 

It looks like pages 84-85 of the master plan are about what we can expect from the riparian trails. Visibility of the waterway seems low. Some wooden piers extending out like the one at the arboretum would be an appropriate, conservation-minded solution. An extended boardwalk along/above part of the shoreline would be more ambitious. And a canoe rental somewhere. One can hope.

 

https://issuu.com/memorialparkhouston/docs/mph_mpbook_final_small_webversion_a_c7f9e7eed3d03c

 

Used to be a canoe rental at the Dunlavy. I actually took it. I want to say after Harvey or some other thunderstorm, it all got washed out and I never saw them again but it appears they have this website: http://bayoucityadventures.org/buffalobayou/index.html. So maybe they are back. The price was ridiculous though... It was like $50 or $60 for a canoe which apparently their prices have gone down if it's truly $45 now.... something you can get in Austin for $12 an hour. We need more competition from other canoe places along the bayou to bring it down.