The Boulevard Project

[BeerNut]

8 hours ago, j_cuevas713 said:

https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/transportation/article/Uh-oh-Silver-region-s-first-bus-rapid-transit-16983737.php

I had to give my 2 cents to some of the comments people made. I'm sorry but people are just plain dumb as bricks. "Nobody will ever use this" "What a waste of money" Blah Blah Blah

Unmoderated comments on news sites are always a dumpster fire of boomer logic.

[BEES?!]

Not really surprised. It doesn’t really go anywhere yet, but I forsee the eventual link ups with the University corridor and the continuation of the line along the Inner Katy route to help its ridership.

[j_cuevas713]

On 3/10/2022 at 1:48 AM, BEES?! said:

Not really surprised. It doesn’t really go anywhere yet, but I forsee the eventual link ups with the University corridor and the continuation of the line along the Inner Katy route to help its ridership.

Yep I even made that comment. And I got like 10 thumbs down lmao. But in reality this line will increase greatly once the University and Inner Katy link up.

[BEES?!]

18 hours ago, j_cuevas713 said:

Yep I even made that comment. And I got like 10 thumbs down lmao. But in reality this line will increase greatly once the University and Inner Katy link up.

Yeah people are just tryin’ to be mad on the internet lol. I’ve learned to not even engage, because half the time they just want to be negative.

[gene]

Hi all! I have been begging for a www.houstonbcycle.com location in Uptown for awhile now and of course just on or off Post Oak Blvd was the desired location...and lo and behold they have installed one now at 1500 Post Oak Blvd in front of the BHP building! Last night they had both regular bikes and e-bikes at the location. Just thought i would let everyone know!

[kennyc05]

2 hours ago, gene said:

Hi all! I have been begging for a www.houstonbcycle.com location in Uptown for awhile now and of course just on or off Post Oak Blvd was the desired location...and lo and behold they have installed one now at 1500 Post Oak Blvd in front of the BHP building! Last night they had both regular bikes and e-bikes at the location. Just thought i would let everyone know!

Man what the hell is going on with the floating rings I'm wondering when they're gonna hang them back up. .

[gene]

I know @kennyc05!!! Last word was that they were having to make them bigger to fit the larger intersections...i miss them too!!!!! haha! 

[BEES?!]

I saw this video posted recently to Youtube:

MARTA (Atlanta) video covering the Boulevard Project

 

thought it was interesting. Nothing we didn’t already know, but kinda neat to see. 

Edited September 24, 2022 by BEES?!

[kennyc05]

1 hour ago, BEES?! said:

I saw this video posted recently to Youtube:

MARTA (Atlanta) video covering the Boulevard Project

 

thought it was interesting. Nothing we didn’t already know, but kinda neat to see. 

Cool video!

[Luminare]

On 9/23/2022 at 12:18 PM, kennyc05 said:

Man what the hell is going on with the floating rings I'm wondering when they're gonna hang them back up. .

If I had to guess, maybe some coordination issues? Its a private installation over a public right-of-way and now over public transit infrastructure, so it might be a discussion regarding that. I have no clue btw. Just a hunch.

[kennyc05]

22 minutes ago, Luminare said:

If I had to guess, maybe some coordination issues? Its a private installation over a public right-of-way and now over public transit infrastructure, so it might be a discussion regarding that. I have no clue btw. Just a hunch.

It's crazy that it's taken this long though. The project has been finished close to 3 years now.

[Luminare]

6 minutes ago, kennyc05 said:

It's crazy that it's taken this long though. The project has been finished close to 3 years now.

I work in this industry and trust me I don't like how long things take either. I think I posted in another thread about a job I know about where the punch list items, basically the wrapping up of the project, has taken around 1-2 years! Not a complicated job either. This is also currently a contractors market, many are slammed or fully booked. Sometimes windows to squeeze a project in no matter how small or easy it might seem, and when that time window shuts it drag things for awhile. This project might have been done 3 years ago, but the testing of the BRT was only done 1-2 years ago, and probably any punch list items with that project I'd imagine have only been recently completed with the past year or so. I certainly missed the rings when I was driving do the Boulevard in April when I revisited Houston. Hopefully they can get them done. Maybe call some people related to this for an update? Make yourself vocal? You'd be surprised what happens when you are thorn in someone's side.

[BEES?!]

By the way, per their September meeting, Metro is now laying the groundwork to extend the Silver Line into Gulfton. It doesn’t say exactly how far it’ll go- I’m sure they’re hammering out details right now. Sounds like they’re targeting 2026 for opening the extension
 

METRO Meeting PDF- starts on page 6

 

They’re shooting for having the LPA by December/January

Edited September 30, 2022 by BEES?!

[cspwal]

Was that part of the bond initiative? 2019 seems like a decade ago at this point

[gene]

omg funny conversation just now with Uptown Houston staff...they said they PROMISE that the rings/ufos will be back...the first one was supposed to return by end of year but now pushed to February. they said that having to completely rebuild them so large has been a major feat and unfortunately just taking a lot longer than they even imagined. so there ya go...

i did tell the office that i will bring them a box of donuts the day they are reinstalled so that practically guarantees these will go up asap 🤪🍩

[004n063]

Does anybody know why all of the stops are located after the lights, when the buses nearly always have to sit through a full light cycle? The double-stop thing is really annoying and adds up (there's really no excuse for Bus "Rapid" Transit to have an average velocity of 10mph or less). I hope the University and Inner Katy lines don't make the same mistake.

[Houston19514]

14 minutes ago, 004n063 said:

Does anybody know why all of the stops are located after the lights, when the buses nearly always have to sit through a full light cycle? The double-stop thing is really annoying and adds up (there's really no excuse for Bus "Rapid" Transit to have an average velocity of 10mph or less). I hope the University and Inner Katy lines don't make the same mistake.

Would it really make a run-time difference?  Some times the light will be green when the bus arrives at the light; some times it will be red.  With stations before the light, if it's green when the bus arrives, it stops at the station before the light, missing that green, causing delay.  Conversely, with stations after the light, they get to the station on that green light and carry on.

Plus, if I'm not mistaken, they have ability to override the traffic signals if they need to in order to stay on schedule.

Of course the dedicated BRT lanes are different from a standard bus route, but I recall reading  some information that indicated that "far-side" stops had operational advantages over "near-side" stops.

[BEES?!]

I know METRO answered that at some point, but I don’t remember where. It might’ve had to do with them not wanting to load at a stoplight in case it gets stuck for a cycle or something (ie- they stop at the station on a green light and end up having to wait longer because it turned red, and buses aren’t allowed to actually change traffic lights, but can hold them) , but I honestly don’t remember for sure.

Edited January 16, 2023 by BEES?!

[004n063]

2 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

Would it really make a run-time difference?  Some times the light will be green when the bus arrives at the light; some times it will be red.  With stations before the light, if it's green when the bus arrives, it stops at the station before the light, missing that green, causing delay.  Conversely, with stations after the light, they get to the station on that green light and carry on.

Plus, if I'm not mistaken, they have ability to override the traffic signals if they need to in order to stay on schedule.

Of course the dedicated BRT lanes are different from a standard bus route, but I recall reading  some information that indicated that "far-side" stops had operational advantages over "near-side" stops.

I imagine you're probably right, but only because the silver line buses only get partial priority at lights. Done right, I would think that it'd be possible to time the standard cycle so that the bus arrives toward the end of the red cycle, and always gets the go signal within 15-30s of boarding.

This seems to be the case at most red line stops (it is at Ensemble/HCC, anyway).

It's not particularly important now, because, to be honest, the whole Silver Line isn't particularly important now. But with the longer University and Inner Katy lines, and with the Silver Line becoming a connector, I really think these kinks are worth working out. Half an hour for less than five miles is slower than most of the standard buses.

Throw in the fact that a lot of its future riders will probably be riding the full length (between IK and UL), plus the 15-minute headways, and we're talking about an extremely lackluster service.

The good news is that these do seem like solvable problems - that is, features that could essentially be "turned on" once the other lines boost the SL's utility. But I haven't seen anything that makes me optimistic that the SL will change or that the others will be any different.

Edited January 16, 2023 by 004n063

[j.33]

2 hours ago, Houston19514 said:

Plus, if I'm not mistaken, they have ability to override the traffic signals if they need to in order to stay on schedule.

So METRO has yet to actually get the TSP up and running on the Silver Line. It is installed, but there has been some software glitches along the way and they're trying to work out the kinks. Hopefully TSP will come into play soon. Also, METRO has severely padded the Silver Line's schedule. They need to make it way more aggressive, buses can prob traverse the corridor between 25-35 min...not the 45ish minutes they have currently in the schedule.  If you are a rider of the Silver Line, I would suggest filling out a public comment asking about status of TSP so METRO understands it is an important component for the rider's experience and try to get it online sooner rather than later. 

[Houston19514]

8 minutes ago, Justin Welling said:

So METRO has yet to actually get the TSP up and running on the Silver Line. It is installed, but there has been some software glitches along the way and they're trying to work out the kinks. Hopefully TSP will come into play soon. Also, METRO has severely padded the Silver Line's schedule. They need to make it way more aggressive, buses can prob traverse the corridor between 25-35 min...not the 45ish minutes they have currently in the schedule.  If you are a rider of the Silver Line, I would suggest filling out a public comment asking about status of TSP so METRO understands it is an important component for the rider's experience and try to get it online sooner rather than later. 

Good to know.  But I would hope they could get it below 25-35 min.  The current schedule shows 27 minutes end-to-end, not 45ish.  They need to work for 20 min.

Edited January 16, 2023 by Houston19514

[j.33]

36 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

The current schedule shows 27 minutes end-to-end, not 45ish.

My bad, you know what I meant tho. Whatever the current schedule is already way too conservative with timing. 

[004n063]

1 hour ago, Houston19514 said:

Good to know.  But I would hope they could get it below 25-35 min.  The current schedule shows 27 minutes end-to-end, not 45ish.  They need to work for 20 min.

Even that is not great. The line is 4.7 miles long. 20 minutes is biking pace. It needs to be the fastest option, or its ridership will remain in the triple digits.

[cspwal]

When I rode it, I’m pretty sure it was only going about 35 on the dedicated ramp between post oak and NWTC

[Houston19514]

36 minutes ago, 004n063 said:

Even that is not great. The line is 4.7 miles long. 20 minutes is biking pace. It needs to be the fastest option, or its ridership will remain in the triple digits.

What do you imagine the fastest option would be for a BRT?  FWIW, I've started digging into it a bit.  It looks like LA Metro's BRT Route 754 averages 12 miles per hour.  If we got the Silver Line down to 20 minutes, that would be about 14 miles per hour.  One of the dirty little secrets about mass transit - it's not necessarily fast

Edited January 16, 2023 by Houston19514

[j.33]

I get what you're saying, but route 754 in Los Angeles is not BRT. It does not have dedicated lanes and its running in mixed traffic throughout one of LA's most congested corridors: Vermont Ave. It is more like Houston METRO's route 402 Quickline service. 

If you want to compare Silver Line to other BRT routes, try the G Line in Los Angeles, which is 100% dedicated bus lanes, like the Silver Line.  

[004n063]

21 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

What do you imagine the fastest option would be for a BRT?  FWIW, I've started digging into it a bit.  It looks like LA Metro's BRT Route 754 averages 12 miles per hour.  If we got the Silver Line down to 20 minutes, that would be about 14 miles per hour.  One of the dirty little secrets about mass transit - it's not necessarily fast

No, you're right. 20min wouldn't be too bad. Though I do think the Inner Katy line (/segment? Is it still being considered as a one-seater with the silver line?) And the Westpark and Lockwood segments of the University Line could and should aim for average velocities north of 20mph and an end-to-end time as close to an hour as possible. 

You're definitely right that transit isn't that fast (though neither is driving, necessarily - the other day I beat my driving friends from MKT to White Rhino on Milby by nearly ten minutes, and I doubt I was ever going over 20mph). But comparing Houston to other BRT cities (I think of CDMX and Bogotá before I think of LA, personally) misses two factors: first, that those other cities have a lot more destinations packed into those miles, so in a sense their miles go "further;" and second, that those other cities simply do not have the kind of roadway capacity (nor the typical travel velocities) Houston has.

In other words, as long as we are the (pretty much) the world's most spread out major city, we should probably be aiming for the world's fastest rapid transit.

[cspwal]

What I'm hearing is maglev subways throughout the city allowing me to get from downtown to Katy in 5 minutes

[004n063]

29 minutes ago, cspwal said:

What I'm hearing is maglev subways throughout the city allowing me to get from downtown to Katy in 5 minutes

Nah, I'm not talking about regional rail or HSR. I'm talking about a BRT line that is actually BRT and not just a heavily window-dressed local bus.

The Silver Line has great (and expensive) infrastructure, but there are little flaws that cause it to run no faster than the #25 local, and with less frequency.

[BEES?!]

I wonder if there should just be a silver line general thread, covering the Uptown portion of the route, Inner Katy, and now the Gulfton extension? Or mods, if y’all think the Gulfton portion should be its own thread, do let me know and feel free to move my posts :)
 

During their last board meeting, Metro released their proposed route for the Gulfton extension of the Silver Line. It sounds like this is a route they’re pretty confident with, though one of the board members did ask that they consider the possibility of somehow connecting the Hillcroft TC. (However it is going to be a stop on the University Line, which will connect up to the Silver line via the Lower Uptown TC)

Here is the meeting packet that talks about it. Info on Gulfton starts on page 70.