Astroworld Plot Redevelopment News

[NenaE]

IMO - the architects need to include more green space, all I see are bldgs. in the rendering. And it Looks like a self-contained mini-city.

[CDeb]

This thread title keeps making me think of terrorist or other conspiratorial activity.

Gotta' stop reading Clancy.

[swtsig]

Looks like everyone is on the same page

well the fact that some (if not all) of the property is on the market would seem to indicate that this "project" is nothing more than a pipe dream.

[citizen4rmptown]

IMO - the architects need to include more green space, all I see are bldgs. in the rendering. And it Looks like a self-contained mini-city.

Theres actually more green space, from this view, in front of the twin towers.

members have posted renderings of this in previous posts.

[sevfiv]

No linky, sorry.

Where did you get the rendering?

[lockmat]

Where did you get the rendering?

I think it's also the same rendering that's in the video at Crosswell's website.

[kennyc05]

It's important to have vision, but you shouldn't stray too far from reality:

lol lol lol lol

[swtsig]

saw new renderings today (or renderings i dont recall seeing before).... seemed to encompass a slightly smaller parcel of land, or perhaps the scale was smaller. regardless, the buildings had a more modern look and the the project was less dense. the central twin towers were replaced by a singular, modern blue glass tower, and there were smaller, similar towers flanking either side of the central waterway.

i'll see if i can find it, although it was a hard copy i was looking at.

EDIT: n/m... the renderings i saw looked almost identical to ones posted awhile back.

Edited June 24, 2009 by swtsig

[JJxvi]

That looks like it would be a sweet college campus.

[Houston Texan]

That'd be awesome if that ever came to fruition. I have a townhome in the area that I would love to easily rent out in the future.

But a business center would be just as equally nice. I just hope that whoever develops the project (or any project there) implements a grid like system for traffic in and out of the area. Some of the major streets there get congested in the mornings and especially during events at reliant.

Any city planners out there listening?

That looks like it would be a sweet college campus.

[SoonerFanInHouston]

I am not an architect or business person that knows about developing land and costs, but someone please tell me why they could not take that large chunk of land and create a suburban style master planned community, that is in town. i would think they could build lots of houses and make lots of money. People would love to live in town with suburban amenities.

[lockmat]

I am not an architect or business person that knows about developing land and costs, but someone please tell me why they could not take that large chunk of land and create a suburban style master planned community, that is in town. i would think they could build lots of houses and make lots of money. People would love to live in town with suburban amenities.

they'd have to be mansion esque, is my guess.

[Urbannizer]

From last month...

What's Next For Astroworld Lot?

POSTED: Monday, December 14, 2009UPDATED: 6:53 am CST December 15, 2009

"To put it in perspective, it's about 85 to 90 city blocks," said Allen Crosswell, a real estate developer with Croswell Torian Commercial Properties in Houston. "So, it's a pretty big development."

Investors hired Crosswell to oversee development of the project initially named "South Pointe".

Architects helped put a dream plan on paper -- it included condos, high-rise office buildings, restaurants and medical towers. It's a massive plan with millions of square feet of potential.

"They felt there was enough momentum to put a plan in place and sell off the parcels pretty quick," said Crosswell. "I think they had more of a two-year plan. Then the credit crisis of 2008 hit."

And now, that crisis means three years later the land still sits empty. There have been serious buyers with contracts, but they all fell through. Some contracts fell through as recently as October.

"I'd like to be able to promote to you that we are going to build four or five buildings," said Crosswell. "But that's not the case today."

"The only thing I would like is whatever they bring here, that it boost the economic base here in the city of Houston," Adams said.

Developers say that's the grand hope and believe it's possible the land could end up becoming an extension of the Texas Medical Center. But for now, there are no buyers and no concrete plans in place.

It's become a never-ending real estate roller coaster ride.

"For the right price, we'd pretty much sell it anybody," Crosswell said.

The new price tag for the land could be around $110 million. There are tentative plans to put two major city streets inside the property. Developers say the first buyer will likely dictate what the entire project will be.

http://www.click2houston.com/newsarchive/21962931/detail.html#story

[Geoff8201]

Personally, I have to ask what does Houston need there. More mixed use development? More Medical Center extensions? Necessity is the mother of invention afterall.

Let me interject my wishful thinking... very wishfully... by saying it's too bad Houston, as large as we are, doesn't have a theme park. Astroworld went down the drain, but I'm not talking about another Astroworld... Rumors have been coming and going for years about another Disney park... why not a smaller Disney park that's geared with more Tomorrowland type rides? This is Space City afterall, I see a theme.

Yes, it's a want more than a need, and I await many replys to why this is impractical... but what the hell, we don't dream enough on here.

[TheNiche]

Personally, I have to ask what does Houston need there. More mixed use development? More Medical Center extensions? Necessity is the mother of invention afterall.

Let me interject my wishful thinking... very wishfully... by saying it's too bad Houston, as large as we are, doesn't have a theme park. Astroworld went down the drain, but I'm not talking about another Astroworld... Rumors have been coming and going for years about another Disney park... why not a smaller Disney park that's geared with more Tomorrowland type rides? This is Space City afterall, I see a theme.

Yes, it's a want more than a need, and I await many replys to why this is impractical... but what the hell, we don't dream enough on here.

Let's say that Disney tried to establish a theme park in the Houston area. Why would they put it on the site of a defunct theme park? Seems like they'd be better off either closer to IAH or on Galveston Island.

[lockmat]

"For the right price, we'd pretty much sell it anybody," Crosswell said.

In my opinion, doesn't it seem odd that he would come out and say that. Doesn't seem like he's giving himself very good leverage.

[lockmat]

Looks like this was more than just a rendering to get the site sold, possibly.

From Bisnow:

...last week she (Melissa Wells with CREW) met with a group wanting to create a mixed-use project there and learned the plans aren’t going anywhere largely because Houston is requiring $18M in improvements before anyone can build.

source: http://www.bisnow.com/houston_commercial_real_estate_news_story.php?p=8038

$18 Mil seems like a lot of money for site improvements, but then again, I don't have a clue. What on earth would cost $18M that would need to be improved? Anyone have an idea?

[LegacyTree]

For mixed use: sanitary sewer improvements, transportation improvements, and site drainage/retention.

I'd guess this will sit vacant for many years to come. Perhaps an industrial office park at some point.

Edited April 14, 2010 by LegacyTree

[Houston19514]

Wall Street Journal reports today that Ft Worth-based Mallick Group bought the Astroworld site. Says they haven't decided how to develop it but noted TMC is running out of land, so "we're looking at medical and a number of things . . . offices, apartments"

[lockmat]

Wall Street Journal reports today that Ft Worth-based Mallick Group bought the Astroworld site. Says they haven't decided how to develop it but noted TMC is running out of land, so "we're looking at medical and a number of things . . . offices, apartments"

Nice catch...

<H6>Astroworld Redux

Michael Mallick often visited Houston's Astroworld amusement park as a child. Now, the real-estate developer and investor aims to revive the 104-acre swath where the park once stood.

Mallick Group, based in Fort Worth, bought the Astroworld site on May 21 from local investors Angel/McIver Interests for an undisclosed price. The latter group had bought the land from Six Flags Inc. in 2005 for $77 million shortly after the park was razed.

Mr. Mallick hasn't decided yet how to develop the parcel, but he noted that Houston's medical complex, Texas Medical Center, is roughly 1 mile north of the site. "They're running out of land," he said. "So we're looking at medical [uses] and a number of things—offices, apartments."

—Kris Hudson

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703961204575280983865743598.html?mod=WSJ_Commercial_LEFTTopNews</H6>

[livincinco]

Wall Street Journal reports today that Ft Worth-based Mallick Group bought the Astroworld site. Says they haven't decided how to develop it but noted TMC is running out of land, so "we're looking at medical and a number of things . . . offices, apartments"

This opens up a whole new set of potential uses for the Astrodome as a continued expansion of the Medical Center. World's largest operating theater or maybe a state of the art physical therapy facility?

[Trae]

Wall Street Journal reports today that Ft Worth-based Mallick Group bought the Astroworld site. Says they haven't decided how to develop it but noted TMC is running out of land, so "we're looking at medical and a number of things . . . offices, apartments"

TMC - South?

[TheNiche]

This opens up a whole new set of potential uses for the Astrodome as a continued expansion of the Medical Center. World's largest operating theater or maybe a state of the art physical therapy facility?

This site has nothing to do with the Astrodome.

TMC - South?

The South Campus already exists. This would be: TMC - Further South.

[porTENT]

This site has nothing to do with the Astrodome.

This site is only connected to the Astrodome in nostalgic imagination.

What will become of the pedestrian bridge that connects to this site?

[ricco67]

This site is only connected to the Astrodome in nostalgic imagination.

What will become of the pedestrian bridge that connects to this site?

The bridge was upgraded a tad before the last rodeo so pedestrians are easily able to use it when they parked on that land.

I'm not entirely sure what I would be happy with on that plot of land.

On one hand, I wouldn't mind a mixed development of those of midtown, or T&C or a hybrid of the two, a Medical heavy development that also allowed apartment/condos/hotels, or simply a an extension of the medical center.

My concern is that I don't know if the light rail would have the capacity for whatever development they have down there. The trains are STUFFED when people get on them from the Smithlands parking area and from what I've heard, there are more people getting on from the Reliant station in the mornings.

Edited June 3, 2010 by ricco67

[TheNiche]

My concern is that I don't know if the light rail would have the capacity for whatever development they have down there. The trains are STUFFED when people get on them from the Smithlands parking area and from what I've heard, there are more people getting on from the Reliant station in the mornings.

It doesn't. That's why the TMC shuttles were resumed within the first few years or light rail service. Increasing the frequency of shuttle service as light rail becomes more crowded should solve the Smithlands problem, but the Red Line was simply under-engineered to meet the needs of long-term demand.

Hopefully the University Line won't have any limitations on triple-car trains.

[ricco67]

It doesn't. That's why the TMC shuttles were resumed within the first few years or light rail service. Increasing the frequency of shuttle service as light rail becomes more crowded should solve the Smithlands problem, but the Red Line was simply under-engineered to meet the needs of long-term demand.

Hopefully the University Line won't have any limitations on triple-car trains.

I didn't realize they even STOPPED the shuttles at one point. The complex is just too long of a walk for people that work in the "back" of the TMC. I don't know if even with the upgrade of the trains if it will be enough. Once the other lines are completed, the stretch between Wheeler station and The east lines are going to be incredibly crowded.

On a related topic:

Recently I put in a request from metro on boardings (today was the deadline for them to supply me with info) estimates vs. projections and they haven't responded. Once I get that info, I hope to make the info available.

Aside from the acknowledgment that they RECEIVED the request, i heard nothing more from them.

[lockmat]

It doesn't. That's why the TMC shuttles were resumed within the first few years or light rail service. Increasing the frequency of shuttle service as light rail becomes more crowded should solve the Smithlands problem, but the Red Line was simply under-engineered to meet the needs of long-term demand.

Hopefully the University Line won't have any limitations on triple-car trains.

What do you mean by under-engineered?

[TheNiche]

I didn't realize they even STOPPED the shuttles at one point. The complex is just too long of a walk for people that work in the "back" of the TMC.

To clarify, they had at one point eliminated shuttles servicing Smithlands, and were instead routing shuttles out of the TMC Transit Center.

Recently I put in a request from metro on boardings (today was the deadline for them to supply me with info) estimates vs. projections and they haven't responded. Once I get that info, I hope to make the info available.

Aside from the acknowledgment that they RECEIVED the request, i heard nothing more from them.

I made that request about four years ago, but I forget the name of the guy that (eventually) handled it. The data was limited in usefulness because they only track physical boardings, not origin, destination, transfer points, LRT trip time, total trip time, or rider demographics.

One thing that was clear at the time was that Reliant Park, Rice University, and the Museum District were crappy trip generators.

[TheNiche]

What do you mean by under-engineered?

Blocks in the downtown and midtown areas are too short to accommodate trains of more than two LRT vehicles at once. METRO is going to replace our existing livery with larger-capacity rail cars, but it isn't going to add so much capacity that we can overcome the two-vehicle issue in the long term...especially as the system continues to be expanded.

The only way to increase capacity is to increase the frequency of service, however there is a geometric relationship between LRT frequency and auto congestion induced by LRT.