Crime In Downtown

[kylejack]

this thread is so terrible now

[emirate25]

This happened a couple of months back and finally there is some background on the downtown jumper. He worked for UBS...

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/headline/metro/6536260.html

[IronTiger]

Recently, I read an article about the Heights fires that surprised me.

It was the 22nd arson that has taken place since August in a historic Houston neighborhood called the Heights, known more for its comforting small-town feel in the midst of big city sprawl than for being the center of criminal activity.

Most of you live in the Heights, don't seem to be the criminal types, and, today at least, generally like living there. But it still surprised me. Sure, the Heights is a really diverse neighborhood, but the "center of criminal activity" in Houston seems a bit harsh.

Prior to reading the article and some research afterward I have/had a few candidates for crime centers:

CANDIDATE #1: Greenspoint

AKA Gunspoint, Greenspoint has had 18 homicides in 2008...and that was a major drop. However, Greenspoint is attempting to clean up its act and remodel its dilapidated shopping mall.

CANDIDATE #2: The Fifth Ward

The Fifth Ward is still very poor compared to the rest of Houston and there are no national chains there. Not even Fiesta. Like Greenspoint, it was bad in the 1980s, got a nickname ("The Bloody Fifth", apparently) but is cleaning up.

CANDIDATE #3: Southwest Houston (Sharpstown)

This is another area of Houston that I haven't heard good things about.

I don't know. I think that the SE Houston, inner-loop, has a fair amount of crime...or at least, that's what I think I heard.

What do you think?

[trymahjong]

I've spoken about PIP --positive Interaction program with HPD-- but telling us the crime stats each month is at the heart of this program-{city wide meets everyother month-- local meets monthly}-- Updates on the Center of criminal activity are always on the agenda-- 2 sections come to mind-- one is further south than sharpstown but still close to I59 and the other is far west on westheimer-- HPD does storefront HPD--where there was a tradition of hight criminal activites and now those places aren't the hotbeds they once were but also if the crime rate goes significantly up-- a mobile storefront is put in place.

And about the Heights --awhile back I posted that the murder rate in the Heights had gone up 900%--that was true-- there had only been ONE murder in the previous 12 months in the Heights-- but 8 bodies were found in the heights area-- that had been murdered somewhere else--If there was only ONE murder-- that doesn't exactly scream. . . . . . . center of criminal activity

[Ross]

To me, a better indicator of criminal activity than murders is the number of robberies, burglaries, assaults, etc that occur.

The term "Bloody Fifth" predates the 80's

[TheNiche]

If anybody cares to look at the most recently available crime data in Excel format from HPD, it will reveal that there are significant concentrations of murders in places that aren't reputed as crime centers. Acres Homes/Independence Heights was a problem area. So was the Near Northside between downtown and Northline Mall. There was one murder in the 'greater Heights' but that was east of Main Street, so nobody really cares. Aside from those neighborhoods, murder very predictably tended to occur at crappy apartment complexes, and since there is such an abundance of such complexes in southwest Houston, southwest Houston did not fare well. However...there were zero (0) murders in Greenspoint, Fifth Ward, or in Sharpstown...none, nada, zip.

Furthermore, I used the crime data and a geocoding program to determine the lat/long geographic centroid of each of the 24 murders that were known by HPD to have occurred in the City of Houston. The "murder center" of Houston was...[brace yourselves]...River Oaks. Specifically, the murder centroid of Houston is on the grounds of Bayou Bend, former residence of Ima Hogg and a component of the Museum of Fine Arts Houston. Behold Houston's nefarious murder centroid! Fear it!

[tmariar]

FWIW, I don't believe the author of that article intended to suggest anything about the level of general criminal activity in the Heights. The article focused on a specific criminal activity, the string of arson incidents, and referenced the Heights as the center of criminal activity for that reason. The center of the arson incidents, not all criminal activity in Houston. The author probably should have said "a center" rather than "the center", but I still think the author's intent is pretty apparent in context.

[UrbaNerd]

@Niche: And you can blame that damn Butler!

[24zulu]

@Niche: And you can blame that damn Butler!

Colonel Mustard in the conservatory, with a candlestick... or, maybe Dr. John Hill is back!!! Anyone see anyone with fresh plastic surgery in River Oaks ??

[WAZ]

If anybody cares to look at the most recently available crime data in Excel format from HPD, it will reveal that there are significant concentrations of murders in places that aren't reputed as crime centers. Acres Homes/Independence Heights was a problem area. So was the Near Northside between downtown and Northline Mall. There was one murder in the 'greater Heights' but that was east of Main Street, so nobody really cares. Aside from those neighborhoods, murder very predictably tended to occur at crappy apartment complexes, and since there is such an abundance of such complexes in southwest Houston, southwest Houston did not fare well. However...there were zero (0) murders in Greenspoint, Fifth Ward, or in Sharpstown...none, nada, zip.

Furthermore, I used the crime data and a geocoding program to determine the lat/long geographic centroid of each of the 24 murders that were known by HPD to have occurred in the City of Houston. The "murder center" of Houston was...[brace yourselves]...River Oaks. Specifically, the murder centroid of Houston is on the grounds of Bayou Bend, former residence of Ima Hogg and a component of the Museum of Fine Arts Houston. Behold Houston's nefarious murder centroid! Fear it!

Excellent point.

Houston is huge. It's tempting to divide it into quadrants, and say "this quadrant is dangerous; that quadrant is safe." But as you've pointed out, that's not how Houston works.

It is infinitely more fruitful to look at the actual crime data and the real-world forces that affect crime. I'm talking neighborhood by neighborhood, street by street; even property by property. Only by doing that can you actually understand anything about crime in Houston.

[IronTiger]

Crime really shouldn't be the number of murders. Most murders (as opposed to drive by shootings) aren't just some poor guy who was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Most are deliberately planned, often outside of the neighborhoods.

And although I don't want to seem racist, general statistics seem to show that poor minority neighborhoods get the most crime. That's why I suggested the Fifth Ward.

Nor do I think that crime in the Heights (or River Oaks) will dramatically increase and cause the area to "go downhill".

[TheNiche]

Crime really shouldn't be the number of murders. Most murders (as opposed to drive by shootings) aren't just some poor guy who was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Most are deliberately planned, often outside of the neighborhoods.

Murders are a pretty good indicator of violent crime IMO because people bother to report most murders as they are committed or when bodies are found. Many robberies, assaults, and even rapes are not reported or are otherwise misreported.

And although I don't want to seem racist, general statistics seem to show that poor minority neighborhoods get the most crime. That's why I suggested the Fifth Ward.

Don't get me wrong. I'm a believer in the effectiveness of profiling; but you might take age profiles into account. Fifth Ward has a fairly large elderly population whose crime-committing heyday is behind it.

Edited January 4, 2010 by TheNiche

[RedScare]

Crime really shouldn't be the number of murders. Most murders (as opposed to drive by shootings) aren't just some poor guy who was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Most are deliberately planned, often outside of the neighborhoods.

You are absolutely wrong. Most murders (roughly 70%) are committed by a spouse, boyfriend or family member or acquaintance. Most of these are not planned, but "crimes of passion". Of the remaining 30%, most are unplanned murders that occur during the commission of another crime.

However, given the relatively few murders that occur (281 in Houston in 2009), as opposed to robbery (3,500) and burglary (28,000), murder can be considered a poor indicator of overall crime.

[TheNiche]

However, given the relatively few murders that occur (281 in Houston in 2009), as opposed to robbery (3,500) and burglary (28,000), murder can be considered a poor indicator of overall crime.

I should be more specific about what I'd meant. IMO, murder is a reasonable indicator of the geographic distribution of violent crime by community (i.e. 'Greater Heights'), but not of the quantity of violent crimes in aggregate or the geographic distribution of such crime by individual neighborhood (i.e. Houston Heights, Woodland Heights, Sunset Heights, Brooke Smith, etc.). Clearly there are further limitations. You can't tell that the Heights scores high for arson or that Montrose and Midtown score high for rape because neither score high for murder.

Still, as a general indicator, I think that murder is useful.

[IronTiger]

You are absolutely wrong. Most murders (roughly 70%) are committed by a spouse, boyfriend or family member or acquaintance. Most of these are not planned, but "crimes of passion". Of the remaining 30%, most are unplanned murders that occur during the commission of another crime.

However, given the relatively few murders that occur (281 in Houston in 2009), as opposed to robbery (3,500) and burglary (28,000), murder can be considered a poor indicator of overall crime.

That's not what I meant. I meant like murders that involve, if you were the victim, not knowing the murderer. There's few of those, I mean. So, I was right in the fact that 30% of murders are not "unrandom" and instead in commission of another crime. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

And furthermore, what about non-violent crimes? Any neighborhoods suspect to break-ins?

Edited January 4, 2010 by IronTiger

[WAZ]

Recently, I read an article about the Heights fires that surprised me.

It was the 22nd arson that has taken place since August in a historic Houston neighborhood called the Heights, known more for its comforting small-town feel in the midst of big city sprawl than for being the center of criminal activity.

Most of you live in the Heights, don't seem to be the criminal types, and, today at least, generally like living there. But it still surprised me. Sure, the Heights is a really diverse neighborhood, but the "center of criminal activity" in Houston seems a bit harsh.

Prior to reading the article and some research afterward I have/had a few candidates for crime centers:

CANDIDATE #1: Greenspoint

AKA Gunspoint, Greenspoint has had 18 homicides in 2008...and that was a major drop. However, Greenspoint is attempting to clean up its act and remodel its dilapidated shopping mall.

CANDIDATE #2: The Fifth Ward

The Fifth Ward is still very poor compared to the rest of Houston and there are no national chains there. Not even Fiesta. Like Greenspoint, it was bad in the 1980s, got a nickname ("The Bloody Fifth", apparently) but is cleaning up.

CANDIDATE #3: Southwest Houston (Sharpstown)

This is another area of Houston that I haven't heard good things about.

I don't know. I think that the SE Houston, inner-loop, has a fair amount of crime...or at least, that's what I think I heard.

What do you think?

Curious, why is "Sharpstown" in parenthesis after "Southwest Houston?" Why not put Gulfton in parenthesis? Alief? Fondren Southwest?

And do you really mean all of Sharpstown? Or is it the commercial area around the Sharpstown Mall?

An aside, did anyone else read the article in Cite Magazine about the Baker Ripley Community Center for Gulfton and Sharpstown?

[kylejack]

Recently, I read an article about the Heights fires that surprised me.

It was the 22nd arson that has taken place since August in a historic Houston neighborhood called the Heights, known more for its comforting small-town feel in the midst of big city sprawl than for being the center of criminal activity.

Most of you live in the Heights, don't seem to be the criminal types, and, today at least, generally like living there. But it still surprised me. Sure, the Heights is a really diverse neighborhood, but the "center of criminal activity" in Houston seems a bit harsh.

That sentence says that its NOT known for being the center of criminal activity. There's nothing at all surprising in that sentence.

[IronTiger]

Kylejack: to me, the sentence still looks like it's implying the Heights to be crime filled. But you may be right and it's just a poorly written sentence.

[kylejack]

I think the journalist's point was that the Heights is normally considered a nice little small-town atmosphere and that the idea of crime was alien to people here. I agree that its kind of a silly sentence, but I don't think he was saying the Heights is the crime center of the city.

Anyway, I would be interested to see a color-coded map of crimes in the city. A murder map, a robbery map, etc. Its perfectly easy to get the crime data for the various patrol areas of HPD. The problem is that the patrol areas are not uniform in size or population, so its not ideal for comparing one patrol area to another. Would be interested to see others' ideas on how to best approach this.

[TheNiche]

I think the journalist's point was that the Heights is normally considered a nice little small-town atmosphere and that the idea of crime was alien to people here. I agree that its kind of a silly sentence, but I don't think he was saying the Heights is the crime center of the city.

The sentence in question said that the Heights was "known more for" being one thing than the other. The implication was that it is either both things at once or possibly that those things are mutually exclusive and that the Heights is only actually the latter thing; and the emphasis is on how the Heights is perceived.

I might say, for instance, that the Fifth Ward is known more for being a center of crime than for its disproportionately large elderly population. In the context of what I said about the "Bloody Fifth" earlier, what would you think about that statement? Does it communicate to you that there is another side to the Fifth Ward that most people overlook? That's what was intended. And I believe that that is what was also meant by the "center of crime" statement with respect to the Heights.

Anyway, I would be interested to see a color-coded map of crimes in the city. A murder map, a robbery map, etc. Its perfectly easy to get the crime data for the various patrol areas of HPD. The problem is that the patrol areas are not uniform in size or population, so its not ideal for comparing one patrol area to another. Would be interested to see others' ideas on how to best approach this.

http://houstoncrimemaps.com/

Edited January 4, 2010 by TheNiche

[Fringe]

I think the journalist's point was that the Heights is normally considered a nice little small-town atmosphere and that the idea of crime was alien to people here. I agree that its kind of a silly sentence, but I don't think he was saying the Heights is the crime center of the city.

I agree. The Heights is different from other crime areas listed in that middle class people are wanting to move in instead of out.  

[Robert W. Boyd]

The question of which areas have the most crime (or highest crime rate) is tricky to answer.

1) total crime versus crime rate. Different areas of Houston have different population densities. Also, different neighborhoods are different sizes. So if you add up all the crimes in a big neighborhood and compare that to a small neighborhood, it may make the big neighborhood appear more dangerous when in fact the crime rates are identical or even even greater in the small neighborhood. Consequently, I think one should look at crime rates versus total number of crimes. (That, of course, makes the task harder.)

2) What is the purpose of figuring out the crime rate neighborhood by neighborhood (or zip-code by zip-code, or police beat by police beat)? If it is to figure out the chance that you, as a resident in, worker in, or visitor of a particular location are in greater or lesser danger of crime, then you should look at crimes that happen to random people. So property crimes would be the best measure.

3) For this reason, murder rates are probably not the best way to look at crime in a particular area. For the most part, murders aren't random. Acquaintances (particularly spouses and significant others) are common murder victims. People involved in criminal activities (drug dealers) are often victims. It may be that there is a strong correlation between the murder rate and other crime rates. But I think it is better to look at other crimes than murder.

I would definitely like to see a crime map of Houston with crime rates for each census tract (which are divisions used by the census that are smaller than zipcodes). I would like it to include all crimes, and see versions for more specific crimes (assault, burglary, car burglary, robbery, etc.). That would give you a really good idea of which areas are the safest and most dangerous in Houston, and probably would contain a few surprises.

[Fringe]

I find a telling sign is to just observe how many commercial shops and residential homes have burglar bars in different neighborhoods. 

[Gthenewsgirl]

Wondering about whether the Runnels Street tracks near the lofts are really designated quiet zones. I saw threads on here from 2009 but wonder if the situation has gotten better. Any help/info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!!

[LarryDallas]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7310659.html

The red light camera issue was nothing compared to this. Most people I know don't even know about the downtown cameras that already number in many and will soon number in many many more.

How soon before they put a camera in your house and your car so they can "help you" if you are in trouble?

[foxmulder]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7310659.html

The red light camera issue was nothing compared to this. Most people I know don't even know about the downtown cameras that already number in many and will soon number in many many more.

How soon before they put a camera in your house and your car so they can "help you" if you are in trouble?

They stated what they are for...They are not putting them in neighborhoods. People need to quit being paranoid. 1 in 6 billon i doubt anyone sits and watches one person move from one area to another.

[trymahjong]

I have heard of the kazillion cameras in Manhattan---this is how the police got to much info so fast on the Times square bomber but check this out

http://www.mediaeater.com/cameras/overview.html

that seems to be the otherside of the coin

it makes you contemplate the question of public cameras very carefully

[kylejack]

They stated what they are for...They are not putting them in neighborhoods.

They put them in my neighborhood.

[Gary]

Very Orwellian of them.

[dbigtex56]

They put them in my neighborhood.

There's a sort of kiosk in the 2300 block of Grant Street (behind Auto Zone) which contains security cameras.