NRG Park Mixed-Use Development

[kennyc05]

27 minutes ago, shasta said:

I also wonder about NRG Stadium.

I fully expect to start hearing some rumblings about needing a newer stadium in the next decade.

The new stadiums are light years better than what we built in 2000-2002.

Hopefully they will build the new one in Ea-Do so we can have a true sports district.

I honestly think Toyota Center and NRG just needs massive renovations and that should be sufficient. 

[j_cuevas713]

12 minutes ago, kennyc05 said:

I honestly think Toyota Center and NRG just needs massive renovations and that should be sufficient. 

I agree. A simple facade update and maybe some more elements around the building dedicated to the Rockets would be cool. A Rockets village would be nice. 

[shasta]

23 minutes ago, kennyc05 said:

I honestly think Toyota Center and NRG just needs massive renovations and that should be sufficient. 

Th McNairs, who literally run a real estate development company, can develop all of that park lot land around NRG a mixed- use destination but they choose not to. 

[mattyt36]

2 hours ago, j_cuevas713 said:

Yeah I read how they were expecting the arena to spur growth in that neighborhood but it didn't. I wonder if that massive parking lot had anything to do with it instead of building up and around the arena. 

Seems like it had to be way more related to the fact that they already had the coliseum complex there (i.e., they already owned the land), and like us with NRG, they also wanted it also to be used for the Stock Show and required the surrounding buildings.  Are there any examples of arenas in more remote areas spurring any economic development considering there are less than 50 dates a year?  If the local leaders did say that, I'd say they were being entirely disingenuous.

Edited July 21, 2023 by mattyt36

[Houston19514]

1 hour ago, shasta said:

Th McNairs, who literally run a real estate development company, can develop all of that park lot land around NRG a mixed- use destination but they choose not to. 

Well, they actually cannot.

2 hours ago, shasta said:

I also wonder about NRG Stadium.

I fully expect to start hearing some rumblings about needing a newer stadium in the next decade.

The new stadiums are light years better than what we built in 2000-2002.

 

In what ways are the newer stadiums better than NRG?

[editor]

On 7/21/2023 at 2:41 PM, j_cuevas713 said:

Yeah I read how they were expecting the arena to spur growth in that neighborhood but it didn't. I wonder if that massive parking lot had anything to do with it instead of building up and around the arena. 

It's happened before.

When New Comiskey Park (now Guaranteed Rate Field) was built, the entire neighborhood of bars, restaurants, and mixed-income housing that surrounded it was plowed under for massive surface parking lots.

A decade later, people started wondering why the are was a dead zone, while Wrigley Field remained a vibrant, desirable neighborhood even with a hundred-year-old stadium.

About a decade ago there was a push to turn the Comiskey parking lots back into a neighborhood, but that got derailed by the 2008 crisis, and everything that has followed since.

Since the stadium and the parking lots are owned by the State, and not real estate billionaires, it could still happen. 

 

[HOUCAJUN]

On 7/21/2023 at 3:36 PM, shasta said:

I also wonder about NRG Stadium.

I fully expect to start hearing some rumblings about needing a newer stadium in the next decade.

The new stadiums are light years better than what we built in 2000-2002.

Hopefully they will build the new one in Ea-Do so we can have a true sports district.

At this point, it will be a multi billion dollar building. Who's footing the bill? 

[Houston19514]

On 7/21/2023 at 3:36 PM, shasta said:

I also wonder about NRG Stadium.

I fully expect to start hearing some rumblings about needing a newer stadium in the next decade.

The new stadiums are light years better than what we built in 2000-2002.

I’ll ask again.  In what ways are the new stadiums light years better than NRG?  What do they have that NRG lacks?

[Twinsanity02]

1 hour ago, Houston19514 said:

I’ll ask again.  In what ways are the new stadiums light years better than NRG?  What do they have that NRG lacks?

My guess is that the exterior isn't as "sexy" as LA's or Atlanta or Dallas. I cannot think of anything else the place lacks. There are 30 stadiums. In terms of capacity we rank number eight. Is this because we have the 2nd or 3rd largest art museum in the US and now feel the football stadium should rank the same? Just asking.

[Brooklyn173]

An interesting article from earlier this year. It touches on some of the items mentioned in this thread.

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/football/2023/nfl-new-stadiums-whats-next-1234709192/

[LosFeliz]

Well, the crazy palaces in Los Angeles and the burbs of DFW have a lot more suites and can expand to 100,000 for super large events.

So, they could give a Super Bowl or NCAA Championship tens of thousands more seats. 

* I am 100% against public money for stadiums 

[Big E]

On 7/21/2023 at 3:36 PM, shasta said:

Hopefully they will build the new one in Ea-Do so we can have a true sports district.

There is no way they can build an NFL stadium in EaDo. They'd have to take out half the neighborhood for the stadium alone, not even getting into the issue of parking.

 

On 7/21/2023 at 4:30 PM, shasta said:

Th McNairs, who literally run a real estate development company, can develop all of that park lot land around NRG a mixed- use destination but they choose not to. 

NRG Park is owned by the Harris County Sports and Convention Corporation. No redevelopment is happening to the area without their approval. And both the Houston Rodeo and the Rockets would veto any redevelopment as it would cut into their event parking.

[Houston19514]

14 hours ago, LosFeliz said:

Well, the crazy palaces in Los Angeles and the burbs of DFW have a lot more suites and can expand to 100,000 for super large events.

So, they could give a Super Bowl or NCAA Championship tens of thousands more seats. 

* I am 100% against public money for stadiums 

It doesn't seem to have worked out that way.  NRG stadium has hosted more NCAA championships and Super Bowls than AT&T Stadium.  FWIW, AT&T Stadium cannot add "tens of thousands" more seats. For the one Super Bowl they have hosted, they attempted to add 15,000 extra seats.  But a bunch of those were deemed unsafe.  The rest of AT&T's expanded capacity capability is standing room.

As to SoFi, attendance at Super Bowl LVI was 70,048; less than their stated capacity of 70,148.  Are you certain that they can expand to 100,000 for super large events?  If so, I wonder why they wouldn't have done so for the Super Bowl of large events, so to speak.

[shasta]

On 7/23/2023 at 12:06 PM, Houston19514 said:

I’ll ask again.  In what ways are the new stadiums light years better than NRG?  What do they have that NRG lacks?

capacity, atmosphere, amenities, location, exterior, etc.

There are many things that put it behind the newer stadiums.

 

Both MMP and NRG were of the first generation of "barn" retractable roof stadium designs  yet both keep them closed almost 100% of the time.

[Houston19514]

4 minutes ago, shasta said:

capacity, atmosphere, amenities, location, exterior, etc.

There are many things that put it behind the newer stadiums.

 

Both MMP and NRG were of the first generation of "barn" retractable roof stadium designs  yet both keep them closed almost 100% of the time.

Thank you, but that tells us nothing.

NRG's capacity is equal to SoFi's.

Atmosphere, amenities, location, etc. tells us nothing. What does NRG Stadium need to provide a better "atmosphere" (other than a winning team, which is a different topic).  What amenities do these other stadiums have that NRG stadium lacks?  

Guess what, AT&T Stadium rarely opens its roof.  The frequency or infrequency of roof openings tells us nothing about what the stadium lacks.

You keep telling us NRG is light years behind and there are many things that put it behind, but so far you've not been able to show us even one specific thing.

[hbg.50]

14 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

Thank you, but that tells us nothing.

NRG's capacity is equal to SoFi's.

Atmosphere, amenities, location, etc. tells us nothing. What does NRG Stadium need to provide a better "atmosphere" (other than a winning team, which is a different topic).  What amenities do these other stadiums have that NRG stadium lacks?  

Guess what, AT&T Stadium rarely opens its roof.  The frequency or infrequency of roof openings tells us nothing about what the stadium lacks.

You keep telling us NRG is light years behind and there are many things that put it behind, but so far you've not been able to show us even one specific thing.

Isn’t it obvious?  We should get new stadiums because “everyone else” is getting new ones and by golly we are entitled to always have the latest and greatest!

[Twinsanity02]

46 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

Thank you, but that tells us nothing.

NRG's capacity is equal to SoFi's.

Atmosphere, amenities, location, etc. tells us nothing. What does NRG Stadium need to provide a better "atmosphere" (other than a winning team, which is a different topic).  What amenities do these other stadiums have that NRG stadium lacks?  

Guess what, AT&T Stadium rarely opens its roof.  The frequency or infrequency of roof openings tells us nothing about what the stadium lacks.

You keep telling us NRG is light years behind and there are many things that put it behind, but so far you've not been able to show us even one specific thing.

Just wait. The "World Class City" hustle should soon kick in.

[thatguysly]

Texans just need to model the Falcons and drop food/drink prices.

[shasta]

45 minutes ago, thatguysly said:

Texans just need to model the Falcons and drop food/drink prices.

Since you mentioned the Atlanta Falcons:

Georgia Dome- Opened in 1992

Mercedes Benz Stadium- Opened in 2017....25 YEARS AFTER THE GEORGIA DOME OPENED!

 

NRG will be 25 years old in 2027...I'm just saying, give it another 10 years and we will start hearing cries for a new stadium

Edited July 24, 2023 by shasta

[LosFeliz]

 

NRG is a great stadium. It doesn't need replacing. But I love what the Chargers/Rams did with the area around Sofi. Think of if as a Discovery Green surrounding NRG rather than just massive parking lots. 

Of course Sofi offers almost double the amount of luxury seats compared to NRG (13,000 to 7,700O) and 65 more suites as well as things like field cabanas. It's insanely over the top.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 24, 2023 by LosFeliz

[Houston19514]

27 minutes ago, shasta said:

Since you mentioned the Atlanta Falcons:

Georgia Dome- Opened in 1992

Mercedes Benz Stadium- Opened in 2017....25 YEARS AFTER THE GEORGIA DOME OPENED!

 

NRG will be 25 years old in 2027...I'm just saying, give it another 10 years and we will start hearing cries for a new stadium

. . .  because NRG Stadium lacks . . . what exactly? 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Houston19514

[shasta]

17 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

. . .  because NRG Stadium lacks . . . what exactly? 

I've been there for NFL, college football, the Rodeo and Concerts...it is not a top stadium.

If you think it is..fine, we will agree to disagree,  but I just pulled a comp, in another southern city,  that replaced their stadium after 25 years. We are at age 21 right now.

Edited July 24, 2023 by shasta

[Houston19514]

33 minutes ago, shasta said:

I've been there for NFL, college football, the Rodeo and Concerts...it is not a top stadium.

If you think it is..fine, we will agree to disagree,  but I just pulled a comp, in another southern city,  that replaced their stadium after 25 years. We are at age 21 right now.

And yet you can't name a single thing it lacks or a single thing a new stadium would provide that NRG does not, or a single way in which NRG could/should be improved.

And your "comp" tells us nothing whatsoever about NRG Stadium or your claim that NRG Stadium is light years behind the new stadiums.

Edited July 24, 2023 by Houston19514

[samagon]

the Texans signed a 30 year lease for NRG stadium, so there's 9 years left before they will move to a new facility, and 6 or 7 years before a new stadium might be built as a replacement to keep the Texans from moving.

same with the Oilers though, if they demand a new stadium, or they go to a different city, they can leave.

I do want to know also, what does our stadium not have that it needs?

Edited July 24, 2023 by samagon

[LosFeliz]

It doesn't need anything. But some of the newer stadiums are larger. Some have bells and whistles we don't have like field cabanas/on field suites. Some have huge SRO areas packed with restaurants and bar options. Some have better settings near their city centers. Some that are "remote" like ours have built entertainment districts nearby. 

It's OK to admit that NRG lacks some things and some stadiums are just more of a wow factor AND to also say NRG is a perfectly good stadium. Shades of gray. 

 

[monarch]

^^^ the NFL will no longer allow houston to host another SUPERBOWL unless changes are indeed forthcoming to NRG STADIUM.  the stadium in its current state, is no longer considered viable or state-of-the-art enough for NFL SUPERBOWL matches.  therefore, houston is no longer considered for the HIGHLY SOUGHT AFTER SUPERBOWL ROTATION.  personally, i find it simple SILLY SEASON rhetoric, to keep espousing about... "what is the stadium lacking"?  well, if you do not know by now... then just go and present the same IRRELEVANT QUERY to the entire league itself.  i am most certain that the NFL officials shall be more than happy to espouse NRG's overwhelming lack of current state-of-the-art amenities.  heck, houston or someone... is going to have to shell out a lot of money to renovate NRG STADIUM for the forthcoming FIFA WORLD CUP that it has just been awarded.  therefore, in order for NRG STADIUM to continue to carry its current WORLD CLASS standing, it's going to have to be updated/renovated... BIG TIME...  

[freundb]

So in six years NRG went from hosting the Super Bowl, to being so decrepit it can't play host to big games?

Why will no one give examples of what's so wrong with it? I've only been a handful of times, but I didn't find it to be a poor stadium. Maybe its cuz I'm from the north where I grew up going to Lambeau Field, which by the way, doesn't have on field suits, or cabanas, or crazy concessions, yet is always hailed as one of the best places to watch a football game. The only reason it can't host a Super Bowl is because the city/metro is quite small and cannot support the circus that comes with the Super Bowl. 

NRG is fine, people are just caught up in getting the newest shiny $5 billion waste of money.

 

[hbg.50]

1 hour ago, monarch said:

^^^ the NFL will no longer allow houston to host another SUPERBOWL unless changes are indeed forthcoming to NRG STADIUM.  the stadium in its current state, is no longer considered viable or state-of-the-art enough for NFL SUPERBOWL matches.  therefore, houston is no longer considered for the HIGHLY SOUGHT AFTER SUPERBOWL ROTATION.  personally, i find it simple SILLY SEASON rhetoric, to keep espousing about... "what is the stadium lacking"?  well, if you do not know by now... then just go and present the same IRRELEVANT QUERY to the entire league itself.  i am most certain that the NFL officials shall be more than happy to espouse NRG's overwhelming lack of current state-of-the-art amenities.  heck, houston or someone... is going to have to shell out a lot of money to renovate NRG STADIUM for the forthcoming FIFA WORLD CUP that it has just been awarded.  therefore, in order for NRG STADIUM to continue to carry its current WORLD CLASS standing, it's going to have to be updated/renovated... BIG TIME...  

This is at least the second time you’ve spouted this without providing a source.  I think it’s nonsense, and BTW NRG will be hosting the College Football Championship next year.

[Houston19514]

2 hours ago, monarch said:

^^^ the NFL will no longer allow houston to host another SUPERBOWL unless changes are indeed forthcoming to NRG STADIUM.  the stadium in its current state, is no longer considered viable or state-of-the-art enough for NFL SUPERBOWL matches.  therefore, houston is no longer considered for the HIGHLY SOUGHT AFTER SUPERBOWL ROTATION.  personally, i find it simple SILLY SEASON rhetoric, to keep espousing about... "what is the stadium lacking"?  well, if you do not know by now... then just go and present the same IRRELEVANT QUERY to the entire league itself.  i am most certain that the NFL officials shall be more than happy to espouse NRG's overwhelming lack of current state-of-the-art amenities.  heck, houston or someone... is going to have to shell out a lot of money to renovate NRG STADIUM for the forthcoming FIFA WORLD CUP that it has just been awarded.  therefore, in order for NRG STADIUM to continue to carry its current WORLD CLASS standing, it's going to have to be updated/renovated... BIG TIME...  

ROFL.  So I guess we’re so far gone, the query of “what are we lacking” is irrelevant.  
 

[monarch]

4 hours ago, steve1363 said:

This is at least the second time you’ve spouted this without providing a source.  I think it’s nonsense, and BTW NRG will be hosting the College Football Championship next year.

^^^ question:  just how difficult is it to bring up google?  answer:  not difficult at all.  in fact, it's quite easy...

What does Houston need to do for NRG Stadium to host another Super Bowl?

HOUSTON – Now in its 16th year of use, NRG Stadium remains among the premier stadiums in the NFL.

However, the next four Super Bowls will be played in either brand new stadiums, or in facilities that have been renovated.

To secure the Super Bowl five years from now, NRG will no doubt have to look different than it does now.

The question Harris County leaders, the Houston Texans and the Harris County Sports and Convention Corporation are wrangling with right now, is how much different.

“I'm not sure what the answer to that is, but you have to evaluate the competitive set, the competitive nature, and I know the county is evaluating what is going on at NRG Park and they will continue to invest in it,” said Ric Campo, chairman of the Super Bowl 51 Host Committee.

Channel 2 has learned those conversations were taking place long before the Super Bowl and they continue to take place.

It’s too early to say what those upgrades might cost, and in spite of what other cities have done and are doing to stay in the game, Campo doesn’t believe Houston needs a brand new stadium to be awarded the Super Bowl five years from now.

“Even though it's 16 years old, it's still state-of-the-art. The way it was built, it's a timeless design. That design is not going to change,” Campo said.

https://www.click2houston.com/news/2017/02/09/what-does-houston-need-to-do-for-nrg-stadium-to-host-another-super-bowl/