METRORail University Line

[VelvetJ]

Hmmmmm, there's something rotten in the state of Denmark.

[nmainguy]

I'm glad Kinkaid stated what was obvious to me after about your second post: you came in all innocent and then showed your true colors.

Kinkaid, ricco, Large, Red, my self and others have only reiterated what I have said from the begininng in addition to my broken record response: the ballot lanquage is flawed. There is no Westpark corridor from Wheeler station. This is in reference to an area-not a specific street or road. Buy a map. Study it. If you still disagree, garner support and demand another referendum. If you are not going to do that, then step aside so that those of us that want to move forward can do so. All your twisted pronouncements do is muck up the process.

I think we should form a band and call it the large and riccoRed Kinkade Texas band on nmain-with a touch of Velvet

[Houstonian in Iraq]

I'm glad Kinkaid stated what was obvious to me after about your second post: you came in all innocent and then showed your true colors.

Kinkaid, ricco, Large, Red, my self and others have only reiterated what I have said from the begininng in addition to my broken record response: the ballot lanquage is flawed. There is no Westpark corridor from Wheeler station. This is in reference to an area-not a specific street or road. Buy a map. Study it. If you still disagree, garner support and demand another referendum. If you are not going to do that, then step aside so that those of us that want to move forward can do so.

So lets not lose sight......If you haven't contacted the reps listed above to state your position I recommend you do so .

[RedScare]

I think we should form a band and call it the large and riccoRed Kinkade Texas band on nmain-with a touch of Velvet

I think bigtex is gonna be jealous.

[nmainguy]

I think bigtex is gonna be jealous.

Well we can't have that sooooo, how about "large and riccoRed Kinkade Texas band on nmain-with a touch of Velvet featuring our very own bigtex Houstonian in Iraq"? [appearing nightly on the U Line]

[Original Timmy Chan's]

6. INNER KATY

What are the voters gonna do when Metro tries to build a rail line that's not in "Inner Katy?"

[nmainguy]

What are the voters gonna do when Metro tries to build a rail line that's not in "Inner Katy?"

...or on "North Hardy"...damn...I just checked my Key Map: there is no North Hardy...or Inner Katy! What a world, what a world!!!!!

[gavoodi]

Nice try, Gavoodi.

I am talking about the entire Richmond Corridor. I am giving you 30 miles from Midtown to Westchase to list what has been built of significance ON Richmond in the last 6 years. There's plenty of vacant land and property to build on in that stretch.

Compare that to what has been built on Main/Fannin since the light rail was announced.

There's simply no comparison. Game over.

I gotta give you credit though. You hid your anti-rail bias for all of about two seconds in trying to come across as some curious bystander who wanted to see the new excitement of light rail. But, like most talk radio ditto heads, you couldn't hide your anger for that long.

If you are so against rail...then don't ride it. It's really that simple. But, it isn't your right to deny rail to the people who VOTED FOR IT.

Sorry I couldn't get back to you earlier. I had to take another ride on the rail so I could be as informed (?) as many of the rail pumpers here. Yesterday I only rode as far as the museum. I felt I needed to stop for some culture and to join with the crowds from the rail in exploring the various exhibits. The museum itself did not seem very crowded with rail goers I might add. I asked the guard if they got a lot of rail traffic but he did not know. He pointed that the parking lot always had a lot of cars though. Perhaps if the museum were converted into a Wal-Mart it might draw more rail traffic. Wal-Mart seems popular.

I started my journey today at the Medical Center. I did buy a ticket today because riding for free seemed to upset some people here. The train was clean and had a few people on it. Going through the Medical Center we headed towards Reliant passing block after block of mediocrity posing as high density housing. Feeling a need to wash out my eyes after viewing this bleak landscape I searched for a drug store or restaurant with a water fountain but there was none. No bustlng crowds eager to jump on the rail there either. It was as empty as Main street was yesterday.

As an FYI I did vote FOR rail but what I voted for said Westpark. Since there is so much teeth gnashing here that says Westpark doesn't really mean Westpark it really means Richmond I'll put that part behind me. In reading many of the rail pumper posts here I was actually under the impression that maybe there was something that would be beneficial for businesses by having a rail line deliver customers to their doors. That's why I got on the rail to check it out and witnessed empty businesses and deserted streets.

To be fair with the rail pumpers I'll check it out again during the week.

Finally, your ditto head remark. I'm a libertarian. You on the other hand sound like a pro development Dick Cheney republican. I bet you were secretly cheering when people lost their homes and freedmanstown was leveled to build more of your high density housing.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

When are they going to start ripping apart Richmond the lay down the tracks? I think that will be a glorious day, and i cannot wait for it to happen.

[gavoodi]

When are they going to start ripping apart Richmond the lay down the tracks? I think that will be a glorious day, and i cannot wait for it to happen.

I've been around for a while and I realize that you may be a child but there was a time in the early eighties when Richmond was ripped up (twice) and businesses were destroyed. How sad to wish for it again.

[KinkaidAlum]

I love Cheney.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

I've been around for a while and I realize that you may be a child but there was a time in the early eighties when Richmond was ripped up (twice) and businesses were destroyed. How sad to wish for it again.

Im moved.................

[ldogg]

I've been around for a while and I realize that you may be a child but there was a time in the early eighties when Richmond was ripped up (twice) and businesses were destroyed. How sad to wish for it again.

hmmm.... and both times business have returned and the street has flourished.... looks like you anti-rail pumpers shouldn't be forcasting the doom and gloom for the area if rail goes down it... seems like a pretty resilient area that will rebound stronger than before... perfect for rail...

you make a convincing argument... put rail down Richmond... it'll survive it!!

[nmainguy]

Excellent reply, Idogg.

BTW, gavoodi is a plant.

[ssullivan]

I've been around for a while and I realize that you may be a child but there was a time in the early eighties when Richmond was ripped up (twice) and businesses were destroyed. How sad to wish for it again.

Well, let's face the fact that Richmond between Kirby and Main is in really bad condition, and is going to be due for a major reconstruction project sometime in the next 10 years anyway. Rail is not the only reason streets get rebuilt.

And not all businesses die because a street is under construction. It may make it more difficult for them for a year or two, but that's temporary, and it's something that no business is totally immune from, no matter its location.

If all businesses suffered such devestating results when a transportation corridor is rebuilt, then there should be nothing but abandoned buildings along all of our freeways (most have seen major reconstruction projects in the last 10 years), downtown should have absolutely no street-level business due to the amount of reconstruction that went on there in the last five years, and the only places where businesses exist should be corridors that have not seen a construction project in a decade or two. Yes, I am well aware that there are businesses that will suffer, and some will probably close. Unfortunately that cannot be prevented. But again, it comes down to the fact that while a few businesses may suffer and close, many more people will benefit for many decades to come by the rail project. The best thing for the city and Metro to do is offer generous buy-out and relocation packages and financial assistance for those who will be most adversely affected during the construction period.

Rail is a major investment in this city's future. If we continue to neglect our transportation needs, Houston is going to reach a critical mass where the current streets and freeways cannot continue to be expanded to accomodate the city's growth. At that point, our population will start to decline, and the inner city will become much more blighted than it is now. Our entire region's economy will suffer greatly. Do we really want to be the next Detroit or St. Louis?

I do feel sorry for those who will suffer during rail construction. That's why I believe the city and Metro really need to find a way to work together and come up with the funding to minimize the negative effects for these individuals and businesses. But rail remains the single best way for us to greatly expand the carrying capacity of existing transit corridors with the least amount of disruption. What happens if rail is not built along Richmond, and in 10 years the street is nothing but a 24 hour-a-day traffic jam? Those same businesses are going to suffer just as much, only this time it will be a lasting problem, as opposed to a temporary one during a construction period. And at some point the city will likely try to widen Richmond, which will only result in major right of way acquisitions that will permanently destroy almost all businesses along the street. This is a far worse scenario than expanding the corridor's capacity through mass transit.

[gavoodi]

Excellent reply, Idogg.

BTW, gavoodi is a plant.

A plant? By who?

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

A plant? By who?

"He who walks behind the rows"

[largeTEXAS]

Well, let's face the fact that Richmond between Kirby and Main is in really bad condition, and is going to be due for a major reconstruction project sometime in the next 10 years anyway. Rail is not the only reason streets get rebuilt.

And not all businesses die because a street is under construction. It may make it more difficult for them for a year or two, but that's temporary, and it's something that no business is totally immune from, no matter its location.

If all businesses suffered such devestating results when a transportation corridor is rebuilt, then there should be nothing but abandoned buildings along all of our freeways (most have seen major reconstruction projects in the last 10 years), downtown should have absolutely no street-level business due to the amount of reconstruction that went on there in the last five years, and the only places where businesses exist should be corridors that have not seen a construction project in a decade or two. Yes, I am well aware that there are businesses that will suffer, and some will probably close. Unfortunately that cannot be prevented. But again, it comes down to the fact that while a few businesses may suffer and close, many more people will benefit for many decades to come by the rail project. The best thing for the city and Metro to do is offer generous buy-out and relocation packages and financial assistance for those who will be most adversely affected during the construction period.

Rail is a major investment in this city's future. If we continue to neglect our transportation needs, Houston is going to reach a critical mass where the current streets and freeways cannot continue to be expanded to accomodate the city's growth. At that point, our population will start to decline, and the inner city will become much more blighted than it is now. Our entire region's economy will suffer greatly. Do we really want to be the next Detroit or St. Louis?

I do feel sorry for those who will suffer during rail construction. That's why I believe the city and Metro really need to find a way to work together and come up with the funding to minimize the negative effects for these individuals and businesses. But rail remains the single best way for us to greatly expand the carrying capacity of existing transit corridors with the least amount of disruption. What happens if rail is not built along Richmond, and in 10 years the street is nothing but a 24 hour-a-day traffic jam? Those same businesses are going to suffer just as much, only this time it will be a lasting problem, as opposed to a temporary one during a construction period. And at some point the city will likely try to widen Richmond, which will only result in major right of way acquisitions that will permanently destroy almost all businesses along the street. This is a far worse scenario than expanding the corridor's capacity through mass transit.

ssulivan, this is a great post! This truly is a critical moment in our city's history. All those who haven't contacted the officials please do. urbanspace posted the email address for Nick Swyka, Culberson's district director. I'm posting it just in case you forgot.

nick.swyka@mail.house.gov

[gavoodi]

Our entire region's economy will suffer greatly. Do we really want to be the next Detroit or St. Louis?

And at some point the city will likely try to widen Richmond, which will only result in major right of way acquisitions that will permanently destroy almost all businesses along the street. This is a far worse scenario than expanding the corridor's capacity through mass transit.

Cheap scare tactics.

Cite proof that Richmond will be widened.

[RedScare]

Cheap scare tactics.

Cite proof that Richmond will be widened.

Cite proof that businesses will be hurt by rail on Richmond.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

Cite proof that businesses will be hurt by rail on Richmond.

I wonder if he/she can cite proof of that.........

[nmainguy]

A serious question:

Has anyone heard a resonable alternative from Wong and Culberson? I know they say "The people voted for Westpark!" but that's not a very well thought out response if you actually read the ballot language. I hear alot of misleading information from the anti-rail crowd:

"Richmond will be destroyed just like Main was"

[Main wasn't and neither would Richmond]

"They will cut down every tree and take people's homes away!"

[No homes were taken on the Red Line and hundreds of trees were planted]

"The ballot said Westpark!"

[from Wheeler...doesn't exist]

So where are the counter arguments to the very many thoughtfull ideas presented in this thread?

I guess I just get frustrated when people with no ideas except to do nothing come on board to just rant and deflect.

[dbigtex56]

I'm curious as to how gavoodi is able to acertain whether a rail rider has purchased a ticket, or by what means a museum patron arrived.

Of course people sometimes ride the train without paying. This is illegal, and Metro has personnel to enforce the laws. Eventually scofflaws will be caught.

Motorists are not permitted to drive without a valid inspection sticker, proof of insurance, and a driver's licence, yet some do anyway. They too will eventually be caught. It's surprising how many people actually do obey the law. How sad that gavoodi reserves his scepticism to rail riders. Is there a racial componant at work?

[nmainguy]

I'm curious as to how gavoodi is able to acertain whether a rail rider has purchased a ticket, or by what means a museum patron arrived.

Of course people sometimes ride the train without paying. This is illegal, and Metro has personnel to enforce the laws. Eventually scofflaws will be caught.

Motorists are not permitted to drive without a valid inspection sticker, proof of insurance, and a driver's licence, yet some do anyway. They too will eventually be caught. It's surprising how many people actually do obey the law. How sad that gavoodi reserves his scepticism to rail riders. Is there a racial componant at work?

It may be as simple as gavoodi is just a common law-breaker and we know they are a dime-a-dozen. I suggest if he/she insists on acting like a child, being sent to bed without dinner might be a good lesson learned.

BTW, if it is racial-it's stupid never-the-less.

[RedScare]

I'm curious as to how gavoodi is able to acertain whether a rail rider has purchased a ticket, or by what means a museum patron arrived.

Is there a racial componant at work?

Nah, it is just gavoodi's ignorance of transit procedures not being allowed to ruin a good story. You see, gavoodi was reminded several times that the fact that he purchased a bus fare on Richmond allowed him to ride the rail for free. But, since gavoodi wanted to use this old and tired argument of freeloading rail riders, he ignored the fact that he was riding legally, so he could make a point.

He also ignored the fact that patrons could have a METRO Pass, allowing them to ride anytime without buying a ticket, or that they could have purchased a day pass, or that they had a single pass, which allows a patron to ride for 3 hours without buying a new ticket.

Of course, this is a person who rides the DOWNTOWN Main Street line on SATURDAY afternoon, and cannot understand where the people are.

[Houstonian in Iraq]

Of course, this is a person who rides the DOWNTOWN Main Street line on SATURDAY afternoon, and cannot understand where the people are.

And on Sunday

gavoodi Posted Yesterday, 11:34 PM

I had to take another ride on the rail so I could be as informed......

I started my journey today at the Medical Center...... No bustlng crowds eager to jump on the rail there either. It was as empty as Main street was yesterday.

Sunday is the slowest day of the week in any US city. Everyone is hungover from Saturday or getting ready for the work week.

What we have on this thread is a reflection of how the city stands on the issue. The over whelming majority want this line to go down Richmond( see it as imperative to Houston's growth), a very very few near or on Richmond( see it as distructive) don't want it to go through.

A very wise man once said........"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few"

[nmainguy]

A very wise man once said........"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few"

Commie!!!

[Houston19514]

I prefer not to become juvenile on this issue. I"m simply stating that the confusion is in the desciption of the various transportation corridors. The fourth one is called the Westpark Corridor which leads one to believe that's where it will be placed. Election ballot wording has always been confusing here and on many other issues particularly on controversial subjects. The ** items were supposedly rail specific corridors at the time and some have subsequently been changed to bus rapid transit.

1. NORTH HARDY

**A. UH-Downtown to Northline Mall

B. Northline Mall to Greenspoint

C. Greenspoint to Bush IAH Airport

2. SOUTHEAST

**A. Downtown/Bagby to Dowling

**B. Dowling to Griggs/610

C. Griggs/610 to Park & Ride in the vicinity of Hobby Airport

D. Sunnyside: Southeast Transit Center to Bellfort

E. Sunnyside: Bellfort to Airport Blvd.

3. HARRISBURG

**A. Dowling to Magnolia Transit Center

B. Magnolia Transit Center to Gulfgate Center

C. Gulfgate Center to Telephone Road

4. WESTPARK

**Wheeler Station to Hillcroft Transit Center

5. UPTOWN/WEST LOOP

Westpark to the Northwest Transit Center

6. INNER KATY

Downtown/Bagby to Northwest Transit Center

7. SOUTHWEST COMMUTER LINE

Fannin South Park & Ride to Harris County line

So, by the logic of the Richmond opponents, is route number 1 (the "North Hardy") required to run only on Hardy Street or the Hardy Toll Road Right-of-way?

Is route number 3 (the "Harrisburg") required to run only on Harrisburg?

Is route number 5 (the "Uptown/West Loop") required to run in the West Loop Right-of-Way?

Is route number 6 (the "Inner Katy") required to run on Katy Road or on the Katy Freeway Right-of-Way?

[dbigtex56]

What we have on this thread is a reflection of how the city stands on the issue. The over whelming majority want this line to go down Richmond( see it as imperative to Houston's growth), a very very few near or on Richmond( see it as distructive) don't want it to go through.

What we have on this thread is a reflection of how people who are truly interested in this issue feel. I'm afraid that many (most?) Houstonians have other things on their minds and haven't spent much time considering the Metro route expansion.

Those who are directly impacted by the construction of the Richmond path have a lot personally at stake. They are highly motivated and have worked hard to make their views known to those who will ultimately make the decisions. Unless we make the effort to make our voices heard, elected officials may think we agree with the anti-Richmond faction. Apathy is our greatest enemy.

Write those emails today! Tell your friends, and volunteer to help them compose emails. We need numbers to sway this issue in our direction.

[RedScare]

So, by the logic of the Richmond opponents, is route number 1 (the "North Hardy") required to run only on Hardy Street or the Hardy Toll Road Right-of-way?

Is route number 3 (the "Harrisburg") required to run only on Harrisburg?

Is route number 5 (the "Uptown/West Loop") required to run in the West Loop Right-of-Way?

Is route number 6 (the "Inner Katy") required to run on Katy Road or on the Katy Freeway Right-of-Way?

Actually, there is a bit too much "logic" in this question. gavoodi stated that he is a Libertarian. For everything else a Libertarian may stand for, Libertarianism is most useful in opposing money spent on anything that a Libertarian will not use. Therefore, though Libertarians support public money spent for armies, streets, highways and water systems, they are allowed to oppose spending on mass transit, if they do not plan to use it.

gavoodi stated that even though he lives less than 5 miles from Downtown, he rarely goes there. Since he has no need for LRT, he opposes money spent on it. The fact that the majority of citizens voted for it is of no consequence. Since he does not need it, he is opposed to it.

I agree that there is plenty of wasteful spending in the US. I do not agree that this is one of them. $2.8 Billion for an increased capacity of 30,000 cars on the Katy Freeway sounds wasteful, yet I heard no Libertarian opposition, as well as no vote on the matter.

The only thing one needs to garner from gavoodi's posts is that there are those that oppose the rail on Richmond. If you don't let your elected officials know that they are a minority view, you have no one to blame but yourself.

Send that email!