METRORail University Line

[Trae]

Why have it elevated on Westiheimer where it's at it's widest?

Boy, you trying to kill thses folks crossing 4 lanes of traffic to get to rail.

[Houston19514]

What about Alabama? Is there something about Alabama that makes it impossible?

[ricco67]

W. Alabama would be ideal if it had it's own underpass on 610 and then just cruise onto westhiemer from there, but it would then miss the greenway plaza area.

[texas911]

Why is this such a hot topic?

Again, the rail is going through Richmond in Afton Oaks, its already a freaking 6 lane mini highway!!!! I see people zooming through there all the time. How is rail going to change this? Rail is even quieter than most of the cars that run through there.

It is just silly.

[GhostDog]

Why have it elevated on Westiheimer where it's at it's widest?

So the rail line would not be subjected to the traffic along Westheimer and would be more efficient...

Nor would we want 8 lanes of westheimer being held up for multiple trains per hour...

Get it up off the ground and it can function on its own...

Someone else mentioned the pedestrians crossing westheimer to get to the rail...

Might as well have the rail elevated...

just a thought.

What about Alabama? Is there something about Alabama that makes it impossible?

Personally me thinks the rail should be along routes that would add to the commercial business in that area.

Westheimer of course is our most popular street for commercial shopping...SO why not link it directly along a route that will aid in brining more consumers to those areas...

If its on Alabama- might as well have it along Westpark...

I think along westheimer would also give it a more urban feel as well...

[nmainguy]

Again, the rail is going through Richmond in Afton Oaks,

Really? Are you sure? Do you have a source?

[CDeb]

One arguement i heard from a business owner on Richmond is---my furniture store will suffer from the lack of customers due to the rail line operating on Richmond, because customers will not be able to haul their furniture home. When i buy furniture, i dont haul it in my car, i pay the extra fee to have it delivered to my home.

Maybe he does a lot of business in end tables and lamps.

[zaphod]

One arguement i heard from a business owner on Richmond is---my furniture store will suffer from the lack of customers due to the rail line operating on Richmond, because customers will not be able to haul their furniture home. When i buy furniture, i dont haul it in my car, i pay the extra fee to have it delivered to my home.

lol.

"Derrr.... ima gonna go buy some furniture....lets go hop on the train..."

Since when does anyone even consider using mass transit when going to get furniture. And its not like window shoppers riding the train will even be interested in buying furniture. last time i checked you dont buy a recliner on impulse.....

normal people with common sense who are gonna haul it away themselves plan ahead and borrow their neighbors pickup before buying furniture.

Stupidest arguement ever

Edited June 24, 2006 by zaphod

[CDeb]

June 26, 2006, 1:33AM

Public input on University light rail line sought

Opinions will be included in federal environmental impact statement

Copyright 2006 Houston Chronicle

The Metropolitan Transit Authority will hold public meetings this week on its planned University light rail line, the subject of keen debate over potential routes on Westpark and Richmond.

The gatherings, called scoping meetings, are required by federal law. The format will be an open house with no formal presentation or public speeches. There will be several displays with information boards and staff will be available to hear residents' concerns.

Visitors may fill out comment cards or dictate their comments to a stenographer. The public input will be noted in the federally required environmental impact statements.

Metro spokesman George Smalley noted that "environmental" is interpreted broadly to include social impact and quality of life, not just impact on the natural environment.

Smalley said Metro will schedule a meeting in late July to report on the progress of its engineering and environmental work of the line to that point. That work is scheduled to be completed by year's end.

[nmainguy]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metrop...an/4001343.html

The meetings, each from 4 p.m. to 7 p.m., are scheduled for Tuesday at the Third Ward Multi-Service Center, 3611 Ennis, and Thursday at the Holiday Inn Select, 2712 Southwest Freeway at Kirby.

[Highway6]

Is anyone from this forum going to either of the meetings this week ?

After hearing about how heated the anti-richmond folks can get, i figure I wanna go see one of these meetings in person. I intend to attend the Thursday one.

anyone else ??

[Original Timmy Chan's]

Is anyone from this forum going to either of the meetings this week ?

After hearing about how heated the anti-richmond folks can get, i figure I wanna go see one of these meetings in person. I intend to attend the Thursday one.

anyone else ??

I'm gonna try to get out of work on time tomorrow to make the 3rd Ward meeting before 7pm. I figure that one will have more focus on the UH/TSU/3rdWard area, which is what I'm mainly interested in.

I'm also interested in the SE Line...I'd like to put my dos centavos in on that alignment...it sounds like a foregone conclusion that it will cut from Scott over to MLK via Wheeler on the south boundary of UH. While that alignment is nice for UH, I think it makes ZERO sense for the surrounding community to avoid the intersection of OST and Scott. The Wheeler alignment goes to MacGregor Park (and by ZERO commercial establishments), while the intersection of OST and Scott is all commercial for many blocks around there.

Have the scoping meetings for the SE Line been held yet?

[HTownStuck]

Is anyone from this forum going to either of the meetings this week ?

After hearing about how heated the anti-richmond folks can get, i figure I wanna go see one of these meetings in person. I intend to attend the Thursday one.

anyone else ??

I will not be able to attend, as I will be out of town on vacation.

If you do attend, remember, you MUST be vocal. This rail line must go down Richmond, all the way, and to Hell with Afton Oaks. I don't believe they really care about trees anyway. Something tells me if they found oil on the Richmond median, they would be the first to dig.

If someone is anti-rail, and their arguments are weak and idiotic, DO NOT be afraid to stand up and say, "No, you idiot, that is completely ridiculous." Remember, these people practice the politics of deception. They will try to drown you out. You must match their shouting power.

Remind those who say "we voted for rail on west park" that they are WRONG. they voted on the west park corridor. Remind them that the Main Street line does not stay on Main Street.

Tell them that it will help business in the long run, by bringing people to the area. Remind restaurants how easy it will be for people who work downtown to jump on the rail and eat.

But most importantly, don't be afraid to call people idiots.

[Highway6]

I will not be able to attend, as I will be out of town on vacation.

If you do attend, remember, you MUST be vocal. This rail line must go down Richmond, all the way, and to Hell with Afton Oaks. I don't believe they really care about trees anyway. Something tells me if they found oil on the Richmond median, they would be the first to dig.

If someone is anti-rail, and their arguments are weak and idiotic, DO NOT be afraid to stand up and say, "No, you idiot, that is completely ridiculous." Remember, these people practice the politics of deception. They will try to drown you out. You must match their shouting power.

Remind those who say "we voted for rail on west park" that they are WRONG. they voted on the west park corridor. Remind them that the Main Street line does not stay on Main Street.

Tell them that it will help business in the long run, by bringing people to the area. Remind restaurants how easy it will be for people who work downtown to jump on the rail and eat.

But most importantly, don't be afraid to call people idiots.

I'm anti-Richmond.... you still want me to be vocal ????

just kidding chief.

[nmainguy]

But most importantly, don't be afraid to call people idiots.

The name calling usually comes for the Afton Oaks people. It makes them look just like what they are: idiots

Seriously, I would recommend taking the high road and leave the invective to the bitters from AO. Everytime they open their mouths, they diminish their case.

BTW, I predict this will NOT go through AO to begin with. There's nothing there to go to. It would be a waste of track and it will make the AOers have to find something else to complain about.

[HTownStuck]

The name calling usually comes for the Afton Oaks people. It makes them look just like what they are: idiots

Seriously, I would recommend taking the high road and leave the invective to the bitters from AO. Everytime they open their mouths, they diminish their case.

BTW, I predict this will NOT go through AO to begin with. There's nothing there to go to. It would be a waste of track and it will make the AOers have to find something else to complain about.

I want it to go through Afton Oaks, now more than ever because I want to see those people LOSE.

But, while I think it would be OK on West Alabama, it makes more sense to put it down Richmond so that it can jet over to the West Park Park and Ride.

I do think that if it is on West Alabama, they should just close down the bloody street to vehicular traffic and make it rail and pedestrian ONLY.

[Highway6]

I want it to go through Afton Oaks, now more than ever because I want to see those people LOSE.

But, while I think it would be OK on West Alabama, it makes more sense to put it down Richmond so that it can jet over to the West Park Park and Ride.

I do think that if it is on West Alabama, they should just close down the bloody street to vehicular traffic and make it rail and pedestrian ONLY.

Having read Christof Spieler's blog Intermodality.. I think he has some pretty clear and thoughtout ideas.

two of which are :

Run it Richmond till right after Weslayn.. then have it curve south at the railroad line at Suffolk..

Elevate it as it turns south... a) doesnt interfere with Richmond traffic b ) use the turn to cross over the rr tracks.. which it would have to do at some point anyways. c) added bonus.. have the main richmond lanes run under the tracks at this same point.. thus actually improving traffic on Richmond and Afton Oaks

From there run it along Westpark just between Suffolk and Sage.. then curve it back north.

This also alows this line to end running parallell to the Uptown line... (possible rail extension) as opposed to dead ending perpendicular to the line.. (if it went westheimer or alabama).. and he makes the point that this could allow for a Intermodal transit station at the SE corner of the 59/610 exchange, which would be good for future growth to bellaire, sharpstown, etc.

[HTownStuck]

Having read Christof Spieler's blog Intermodality.. I think he has some pretty clear and thoughtout ideas.

two of which are :

Run it Richmond till right after Weslayn.. then have it curve south at the railroad line at Suffolk..

Elevate it as it turns south... a) doesnt interfere with Richmond traffic b ) use the turn to cross over the rr tracks.. which it would have to do at some point anyways. c) added bonus.. have the main richmond lanes run under the tracks at this same point.. thus actually improving traffic on Richmond and Afton Oaks

From there run it along Westpark just between Suffolk and Sage.. then curve it back north.

This also alows this line to end running parallell to the Uptown line... (possible rail extension) as opposed to dead ending perpendicular to the line.. (if it went westheimer or alabama).. and he makes the point that this could allow for a Intermodal transit station at the SE corner of the 59/610 exchange, which would be good for future growth to bellaire, sharpstown, etc.

I can't see Houston paying for that extensive project.

[Highway6]

I can't see Houston paying for that extensive project.

Of course they will.. they have to.

the light rail will have to cross that railroad no matter wht street it runs along in that coridor.

and it cant cross that railroad at grade... it has to go up or down...

[ricco67]

the odds are quite good that it will go over, as that what they had in mind for the various rail crossings on the North Line as well as the East line.

I will attend the Holiday Inn Select location. If they get vocal, I'll remind them that *I* voted for the same proposition and that the lives of the city do NOT revolve around the people at AO.

<hencesforth, whenever mentions that piece of snobbery land, we shall call it "AO." >

[nmainguy]

the light rail will have to cross that railroad no matter wht street it runs along in that coridor.

and it cant cross that railroad at grade... it has to go up or down...

Actually tracks can cross at grade-but they won't. Ideally it would turn north on Weslyan from Richmond then west on Westhiemer then underground east of the tracks and continue under ground to the Galleria.

[GovernorAggie]

People seem to forget the fact that the county plans on building rr overpass on Richmond anyway--with or without METRO. A 2200 foot overpass to be exact.

I think that it could curve down on Wesleyan and then west onto Westpark and use the existing bridge over the RR. Then I would take it out to illcroft. Anyone notice that most of the Park-N-Rides are along Westpark (Mission Bend, Westchase, Gessner, Hillcroft).

[nmainguy]

People seem to forget the fact that the county plans on building rr overpass on Richmond anyway--with or without METRO. A 2200 foot overpass to be exact.

I've heard no complaints from the AOers regarding this. Are they OK about it?

[The Voice of University Oaks]

I'm also interested in the SE Line...I'd like to put my dos centavos in on that alignment...it sounds like a foregone conclusion that it will cut from Scott over to MLK via Wheeler on the south boundary of UH. While that alignment is nice for UH, I think it makes ZERO sense for the surrounding community to avoid the intersection of OST and Scott. The Wheeler alignment goes to MacGregor Park (and by ZERO commercial establishments), while the intersection of OST and Scott is all commercial for many blocks around there.

Well, I prefer the Wheeler alignment, for obvious reasons. But it is true that ridership is projected to be smaller on an alignment that uses Wheeler and MLK rather than Scott and Griggs. Missing the Southeast Transit Center is a minus as well. Apparently, a lot of opposition is coming from the Riverside Terrace neighborhood on the south side of Braes Bayou; they don't think that the line can be built down Scott Street without having to take additional right-of-way and they think it will negatively impact their homes. I don't think METRO has made a final decision about the alignment, however.

Have the scoping meetings for the SE Line been held yet?

They were probably held a couple of years ago during the Southeast Line Enivironmental Impact Statement process. The Southeast and North corridors are way ahead of the other corridors in terms of design because tstudy began on them before the 2003 referendum.

[GovernorAggie]

I've heard no complaints from the AOers regarding this. Are they OK about it?

The real question is do they know about it...and my answer would be No. Even if they did, just because it is an arm of Judge Eckels' office, aka the Untouchable One, it will go over just fine.

By the way, I find it strange and even disturbing that while these people spit venom at METRO but they absolutely love Mayor White. Do they realize that Mayor White controls the METRO Board? 5 of the 9 members are his appointees. METRO operates at the direction of the Board, and the Board is controlled by the Mayor (btw, 2 members are from Judge Eckels and 2 are from the Multi-Cities).

[Trae]

Actually tracks can cross at grade-but they won't. Ideally it would turn north on Weslyan from Richmond then west on Westhiemer then underground east of the tracks and continue under ground to the Galleria.

I actually think this is the best alignment for the light rail.Underground would work well on Westheimer. Then, going down Richmond until Weslayan would do good for the Greenway Plaza District (as well as Sunday services for Lakewood Church).

[Transit Nut]

Just as a reminder, these scoping meetings will have a different format than the previous meetings coordinated by the City Councilmembers.

http://metrosolutions.org/go/doc/1068/122997/

"Please note that there will be no formal presentations at the scoping meetings, nor will there be an open microphone or public Q & A session as was done at the April meetings."

Thus, I don't think anyone will have a chance to be "vocal" or "heated," but those attending will be able to share their thoughts with METRO representatives in a productive manner.

[Original Timmy Chan's]

Well, I prefer the Wheeler alignment, for obvious reasons. But it is true that ridership is projected to be smaller on an alignment that uses Wheeler and MLK rather than Scott and Griggs. Missing the Southeast Transit Center is a minus as well. Apparently, a lot of opposition is coming from the Riverside Terrace neighborhood on the south side of Braes Bayou; they don't think that the line can be built down Scott Street without having to take additional right-of-way and they think it will negatively impact their homes. I don't think METRO has made a final decision about the alignment, however.

I know UH is already assuming that the SE line will go down Wheeler. Probably because they know that the Riverside Terrace folks have more stroke than the folks from Scott Terrace, LaSallette Place, Foster Place and South Union that would actually use the line daily.

Like I said, a Wheeler alignment would be great for UH, but in the big picture, I think the corner of Scott and OST (or Scott and Griggs, at least) needs to be served with light rail.

VOUO, do you know the difference in projected ridership between the two alignments?

There have been a number of new businesses built at Scott and OST since 2003: the CVS, the WAMU shopping center, the shopping center at Scott/Griggs, the new Sonic. I wonder how those new businesses would affect ridership projections, if the projections were done in 2006 (rather than 2003)?

[Highway6]

Actually tracks can cross at grade-but they won't. Ideally it would turn north on Weslyan from Richmond then west on Westhiemer then underground east of the tracks and continue under ground to the Galleria.

No, i do agree with you.. that would be my first choice too.. serves highland village and stops at the front door of the galleria.

But i also really don't see them paying to have half a mile running under ground to not interfere with galleria traffic or the 610 intersection.

so rr to westpark to sage would be my second and more doable choice.

[nmainguy]

No, i do agree with you.. that would be my first choice too.. serves highland village and stops at the front door of the galleria.

But i also really don't see them paying to have half a mile running under ground to not interfere with galleria traffic or the 610 intersection.

so rr to westpark to sage would be my second and more doable choice.

I actually suggested that route not for the convienience of drivers but for the convienience of riders. LRT is not meant to accomodate and facilitate more auto traffic. It is meant to reduce such traffic.