METRORail University Line

[Slick Vik]

Lanier's decision doomed a good rail system for 22 years and counting. HOV lanes cost $1 billion. Funny the rail haters never complain about that underutilized waste of money.

[samagon]

In Lanier's defense, didn't he gut the money that was set aside for rail to make the city safer by adding heads to the police force?

If I'm remembering that correctly, I'd say at the time that was the smarter play.

Edited January 22, 2013 by samagon

[Houston19514]

In Lanier's defense, didn't he gut the money that was set aside for rail to make the city safer by adding heads to the police force?

If I'm remembering that correctly, I'd say at the time that was the smarter play.

That, and the rail "system" he doomed was hardly a "system" and was only "good" in the sense that (and to those for whom) any rail built any where at any time is by definition "good".

Further, It is a little disingeuous to claim that Lanier acted contrary to the will of the voters. He ran very explicitly on an anti-rail platform against the pro-rail incumbent, Kathy Whitmire, and he won the election.

Edited January 22, 2013 by Houston19514

[mfastx]

In Lanier's defense, didn't he gut the money that was set aside for rail to make the city safer by adding heads to the police force?

If I'm remembering that correctly, I'd say at the time that was the smarter play.

I read somewhere that Houston's murder rate remained mostly unchanged for many years after the hiring of additional cops..

That, and the rail "system" he doomed was hardly a "system" and was only "good" in the sense that (and to those for whom) any rail built any where at any time is by definition "good".

Further, It is a little disingeuous to claim that Lanier acted contrary to the will of the voters. He ran very explicitly on an anti-rail platform against the pro-rail incumbent, Kathy Whitmire and he won the election.

IIRC it was a monorail plan, but later changed to mostly grade-seperated light rail.

And many people say it was "good" because the proposed lines were mostly grade-seperated, unlike the at-grade lines today. Usually grade seperated lines are superior.

[Houston19514]

IIRC it was a monorail plan, but later changed to mostly grade-seperated light rail.

And many people say it was "good" because the proposed lines were mostly grade-seperated, unlike the at-grade lines today. Usually grade seperated lines are superior.

It was passed in 1988 as a transit plan with the technology unspecified. Kathy Whitmire was planning to build monorail. It was never changed to grade-separated light rail. There are a lot of things about elevated lines that make them inferior to lines on the surface. (Much more difficult and time-consuming to evacuate the vehicles in an emergency or break-down; higher cost of construction...)

Edited January 22, 2013 by Houston19514

[Slick Vik]

That, and the rail "system" he doomed was hardly a "system" and was only "good" in the sense that (and to those for whom) any rail built any where at any time is by definition "good".

Further, It is a little disingeuous to claim that Lanier acted contrary to the will of the voters. He ran very explicitly on an anti-rail platform against the pro-rail incumbent, Kathy Whitmire, and he won the election.

It was a start to something and was grade separated

It was passed in 1988 as a transit plan with the technology unspecified. Kathy Whitmire was planning to build monorail. It was never changed to grade-separated light rail. There are a lot of things about elevated lines that make them inferior to lines on the surface. (Much more difficult and time-consuming to evacuate the vehicles in an emergency or break-down; higher cost of construction...)

Why even have referendums? The reason Lanier won was Wayne delcefino that slimy rat.

[SkylineView]

As someone who builds models for a living... has the METRO ever publicly released any of their data?  I have to assume that they have (probably several times) hired consultants to put together data and reports detailing income levels, traffic flow, growth projections, detailed breakdowns of density by zip and sub-zip, resi to commercial travel & employment etc... I would love to get the data and just play around with it.  I'm not saying I could come up with anything (this is a bit outside my day-to-day), but it would be interesting, and might let the 'common public' put some numbers behind the rhetoric.

 

[IHB2]

The park and ride and HOV lanes have had the largest legacy costs for the agency and the least amount ridership w/r/t those costs. More people ride the singular rail than the whole P&R system everyday. So it's ok to spend money on people who have it already but it's waste of money to spend it on folks w/o the means to buy a $11k automobile?

edit: http://www.ridemetro...Report_FY12.pdf

 

 

I specifically said that METRO's P&R and HOV work, and that's great for the users, but cumulatively METRO's vision over time has failed to provide the biggest bang for the buck for the people that are transit-dependent in its service area.

 

I don't really give a damn what mode of transit serves those people, but they are not now being served (IMO and by METRO's recent admission) even though METRO has spent plenty of money building rail lines and allegedly improving bus service.

 

The quickest fix is now and has always been more buses, more stops, in more neighborhoods for the truly dependent. The planned and built rail lines will never be a good enough answer for those "w/o the means to buy an $11k automobile" except for that relatively small % that lives within walking distance of a rail line. Stopping or reducing bus service to some of these areas of highest need b/c of low ridership is false economy IMO, but is required if your agency has spent itself into a hole.

 

So, no, it's not OK.

 

And Kinkaid Alum's observation that perhaps the entire system would be better if METRO had not had to give up 25% of its sales tax collections - not only is the observation unprovable, it ignores the problem that METRO has more or less continuously failed to provide the best service it could with the money it does collect. There is no reason to believe that METRO would have magically become more competent at planning had the agency had that 25% of the tax revenue to spend.

Edited January 23, 2013 by IHB2

[IronTiger]

Monorail wouldn't have worked, unless you wanted some expensive toy people-mover in downtown Houston.

 

Many moons ago, I saw this rendering of a station in the Galleria/Uptown area, in which the streets would be torn up and the light rail be built one level underground (with the roads being rebuilt). Whatever happened to that?

[kdog08]

I specifically said that METRO's P&R and HOV work, and that's great for the users, but cumulatively METRO's vision over time has failed to provide the biggest bang for the buck for the people that are transit-dependent in its service area.

 

I don't really give a damn what mode of transit serves those people, but they are not now being served (IMO and by METRO's recent admission) even though METRO has spent plenty of money building rail lines and allegedly improving bus service.

 

The quickest fix is now and has always been more buses, more stops, in more neighborhoods for the truly dependent. The planned and built rail lines will never be a good enough answer for those "w/o the means to buy an $11k automobile" except for that relatively small % that lives within walking distance of a rail line. Stopping or reducing bus service to some of these areas of highest need b/c of low ridership is false economy IMO, but is required if your agency has spent itself into a hole.

 

So, no, it's not OK.

 

And Kinkaid Alum's observation that perhaps the entire system would be better if METRO had not had to give up 25% of its sales tax collections - not only is the observation unprovable, it ignores the problem that METRO has more or less continuously failed to provide the best service it could with the money it does collect. There is no reason to believe that METRO would have magically become more competent at planning had the agency had that 25% of the tax revenue to spend.

 

The quickest fix is money and lots of it. You are confusing corruption and/or incompetence by METRO with the flaws of our proposed rail system. The best plan would be an expansion of rail NOT at the cost of buses. In fact, the best plan would involve expanding the bus system along with the rail system along with the hike and bike along with other commuting solutions. All of which require investment of money. 

[IronTiger]

You don't have to be poor to use buses or light rail.

[brijonmang]

Saw this satire and thought some of you might get a kick out of it.  Figured this would be a good thread to use for it considering the METRO trash talk.

 

http://thenewsleak.blogspot.com/2013/03/houston-metro-giddy-over-1-ranking.html

 

 

[urban909]

John Culberson has released a survery regarding the proposed University Line. (via houstontomorrow.org)

 

http://www.houstontomorrow.org/initiatives/story/respond-to-representative-culbersons-transit-survey/

[samagon]

March 31 is the cutoff.

 

Thanks for posting by the way.

 

Apparently, the option you select on that page just creates a form letter, so if you select the wrong one, you just edit it to say what you want. For instance, I selected "I live near Richmond and support it" and change it from "I live near Richmond..." to "I live near the Eastwood Transit Center (the eastern terminus of the proposed University Line)..."

[kylejack]

What an odd "survey".

[H-Town Man]

It's kind of hard to accomplish great things when you are constantly under attack.

What if METRO hadn't been losing a quarter of its funding over all these years?

What if Lanier had not gone against the will of the voters and used rail money to expand park and rides and concrete pours to appease his wealthy builder/developer/engineering buddies?

What if federal matching funds hadn't been denied to the region?

METRO is a mess, but this shouldn't come as a surprise. It's hard to be anything but when its been surrounded by Lanier, Culberson, DeLay, and (insert the name of any of the long line of idiotic Harris County Commissioners here).

 

Not to mention all the people who have been programmed by talk radio to march around angrily repeating the same cliches over and over about "boondoggles" and "albatrosses" and "toy trains," etc., as though they would ever be satisfied by any transportation plan that wasn't 100% expanded roadway.

[totheskies]

Sources tell me that there are going to be some big steps forward with the University Line coming soon.  The current plan is to build it out to Greenway plaza (right to the line where it crosses John Culberson's Congressional district), and then watch Houstonians get mad until he caves.  Construction planned for 2014. 

[mfastx]

Sources tell me that there are going to be some big steps forward with the University Line coming soon.  The current plan is to build it out to Greenway plaza (right to the line where it crosses John Culberson's Congressional district), and then watch Houstonians get mad until he caves.  Construction planned for 2014. 

 

That'd be hilarious.

[Mister X]

I love that strategy. Hope it happens.

[RedScare]

Culberson's district goes to Shepherd. It would miss Greenway Plaza by a pretty good distance. Not to mention that tormenting Congressmen is not a very effective way of getting rail projects funded. This sounds like drunken wishful thinking.

[kylejack]

Culberson's district goes to Shepherd. It would miss Greenway Plaza by a pretty good distance. Not to mention that tormenting Congressmen is not a very effective way of getting rail projects funded. This sounds like drunken wishful thinking.

 

If you think there's a way to get Culberson to support rail, I am all ears. He and Delay were the anti-rail tag team for years. It's purely ideological for Culberson.

[RedScare]

It is not a matter of getting him to support it. Simply having him not torpedo it would be helpful. But, go run that rail right up to his front door and see what that gets you. He'll be putting anti-METRO riders in every bill for the next 20 years.

[kylejack]

He is not God and he doesn't own his district. Over a decade of not building certainly hasn't changed his behavior at all. He's vehemently anti-rail regardless of whether construction starts or not, but it's not just his decision to make. Federal funding was issued despite his opposition and can be issued again.

[IHB2]

He is not God and he doesn't own his district. Over a decade of not building certainly hasn't changed his behavior at all. He's vehemently anti-rail regardless of whether construction starts or not, but it's not just his decision to make. Federal funding was issued despite his opposition and can be issued again.

 

Politically, I'd say he does "own" his district, especially since he does not need very many votes from inside the Loop to win, given the level of his support in the northern and western portions of his district.

 

I spoke with his Hou office chief of staff last week about the questionaire.

 

Her response was that Culberson wants some updated info from Richmond Ave only (not any other part of the line in his district that also affects his constituents) to share with Ted Cruz, Ted Poe, Steve Stockman.

 

She specifically mentioned those names.

 

Draw your own conclusion.

[kylejack]

Politically, I'd say he does "own" his district, especially since he does not need very many votes from inside the Loop to win, given the level of his support in the northern and western portions of his district.

 

I don't care if he goes on serving his district. That will happen regardless. Meanwhile, I would like to see our local officials proceed with building the rail. Being Congressman for a district doesn't give a person the right to build a moat around the district that no rail can cross. Those decisions are made by local officials, and funded by local money and state and federal allocations. He is one member of a Congress of 535.

[KinkaidAlum]

Sadly, I am in his district. Man, gerrymandering in this town is insane. 

 

I hope the University Line happens. It is CRUCIAL to the entire system to have an East-West line. However, my contacts at UH have indicated that METRO is no longer talking about taking land for the U-Line...

[IronTiger]

I thought it was the Galleria/Uptown line that was supposed to connect up to Greenway Plaza? 

 

[IHB2]

Sadly, I am in his district. Man, gerrymandering in this town is insane. 

 

I hope the University Line happens. It is CRUCIAL to the entire system to have an East-West line. However, my contacts at UH have indicated that METRO is no longer talking about taking land for the U-Line...

 

 

me too. I'm 1 measly block from not being in his district! US59 separates us like a wide river from his base of support running from Afton Oaks to the northwest suburbs. we have different interests on our side in common with our own adjacent neighborhoods. gerrymander r us.

 

even worse, I'm that same measly block away from freedom from Dan Patrick.

 

and of course our state rep is West U lawyer Sarah Davis, who appears to be about 14 years old and cannot seem to decide in the legislation she offers or supports whether she's a Christian rightwing scold or a feminazi.

 

 

 

otherwise, it's a great neighborhood

Edited March 23, 2013 by IHB2

[KinkaidAlum]

But, she had cancer so she is qualified!

 

Those commercials touting her "cancer survivor" status annoyed me. 

 

[Slick Vik]

Sources tell me that there are going to be some big steps forward with the University Line coming soon.  The current plan is to build it out to Greenway plaza (right to the line where it crosses John Culberson's Congressional district), and then watch Houstonians get mad until he caves.  Construction planned for 2014. 

 

I heard something very similar. "METRO is going to do what it wants to do."