The Herons Kingwood Marina: 300-Acre Master Planned Mixed-Use Development

[Timoric]

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Edited July 12, 2019 by Timoric

[Response]

Wow. Makes Austin look like a pile of puke!

[EllenOlenska]

Is Kingwood that dense? It reminds me of an only slightly smaller version of those Chinese ghost cities within a city. 

[toxtethogrady]

I can't believe all that real estate has any prospective tenants. Unless the GHP is going to make an aggressive push to bring in business from out of town, it's going to be a while.

 

But you might be amused at this interesting diss in the Boston version of Bisnow, regarding our neighbors up north....
"Dallas Office Park by the Sea"

[Nate99]

37 minutes ago, EllenOlenska said:

Is Kingwood that dense? It reminds me of an only slightly smaller version of those Chinese ghost cities within a city. 

 

Literally, no, figuratively, it's debatable. 

 

1 minute ago, toxtethogrady said:

I can't believe all that real estate has any prospective tenants. Unless the GHP is going to make an aggressive push to bring in business from out of town, it's going to be a while.

 

But you might be amused at this interesting diss in the Boston version of Bisnow, regarding our neighbors up north....
"Dallas Office Park by the Sea"

 

Yeah, that's the really hard part. How does this compare to XOM's Springwoods campus in terms of office square footage?  You would need a lead tenant of that scope/scale to fill that space in where there would surely be city-on-city competition to bring them in. 

 

At least whatever bribe Houston might have floated to GE didn't win, that war horse pulled up lame. Looking at you Boston. 

[toxtethogrady]

Houston may yet get Baker Hughes back as a locally-based company.

[pablog]

This should not be built. This city floods more and more each year. 

[bobruss]

Look at what happened in Kingwood yesterday and will probably happen again this weekend.

Someone in the government or insurance needs to stand up and say no more building in the flood plains.

They also need to start buying up properties, homes, businesses and whatever that are currently in the flood plain to be 

cleared and turned into green space. It's time to wake up and stop screwing around with all of this flood, rebuild, flood, rebuild, flood, rebuild................

 If Houston wants to get pst this stigma they need to take charge and make some serious changes, because its not getting any better and it's only going to get worse.

I'm tired of my insurance policies going up so some homeowner can rebuild 4 or 5 times in the same flood prone lot. 

This is ridiculous and after a couple time it seems like there would be a wake up call.

[por favor gracias]

45 minutes ago, bobruss said:

Look at what happened in Kingwood yesterday and will probably happen again this weekend.

Someone in the government or insurance needs to stand up and say no more building in the flood plains.

They also need to start buying up properties, homes, businesses and whatever that are currently in the flood plain to be 

cleared and turned into green space. It's time to wake up and stop screwing around with all of this flood, rebuild, flood, rebuild, flood, rebuild................

 If Houston wants to get pst this stigma they need to take charge and make some serious changes, because its not getting any better and it's only going to get worse.

I'm tired of my insurance policies going up so some homeowner can rebuild 4 or 5 times in the same flood prone lot. 

This is ridiculous and after a couple time it seems like there would be a wake up call.

 

I drove through Kingwood late last night and thought the exact same thing. The cost of irresponsible planning is immeasurable.

[wilcal]

 

 

1

1 hour ago, bobruss said:

I'm tired of my insurance policies going up so some homeowner can rebuild 4 or 5 times in the same flood prone lot. 

 

Is that even a thing still?

 

I thought if your improvement was damaged >50% of the value, even over multiple events, then you have to elevate it/etc. 

[arche_757]

31 minutes ago, por favor gracias said:

 

I drove through Kingwood late last night and thought the exact same thing. The cost of irresponsible planning is immeasurable.

Kingwood and a few other areas were over developed (sadly) without regard to the 10,000 lbs gorilla staring them in the face: upstream flooding and river management, or lack thereof in event of flooding.  This is the same for the areas near the Brazos in Fort Bend, and areas built in the flood pool(s) of Buffalo Bayou.  It’s a shame.

 

What’s  even worse is that elevating structures another foot or two - at the time - probably wouldn’t have been that costly.  Now it’s a BIG expense.  Not saying that they wouldn’t have flooded otherwise during certain extreme events, but I’ll wager quite a few would have been fine.

 

We need a regional flood authority, with regional control and -importantly- oversight of these yokel river authorities.  This should be true moving forward state-wise... but I’m not going to hold my breath.

[Nate99]

Still think something like this could be net beneficial if planned and executed appropriately, but that's a giant if. 

 

This latest round of flooding in Kingwood stinks to high heavens with a lot of suspicion on work around a new development outside of KW proper in Montgomery County just to the north of Elm Grove.  The rainfall rates last Friday and this Tuesday were horrendous, but not unprecedented. 

 

Not sure how accurate/speculative any of this is, but here's a summary of what happened in Elm Grove.  

 

https://reduceflooding.com/2019/05/09/elm-grove-looks-for-answers-and-doesnt-have-to-look-far/?fbclid=IwAR1ClS0zJtGHCkmxgGmZ5LrpD5vlV_6HXIT9Zmq1NP2TOhBy2xRw-Ke259Q

 

The issue here was insufficient storm runoff/detention capability, during Harvey, it was the river/lake rising.  Seems like some civil engineering needs to happen either way.

 

Oh, and while you're at it, how about adding an exit or three that doesn't get cut off during an emergency.  Bridging Kingwood Drive to Huffman sounds like a good start.  

Edited May 10, 2019 by Nate99

[Twinsanity02]

As bad as the rainfall in Kingwood was, look up Kickapoo Creek , near Lake Livingston, October 1994. An area there received 25 to 36 inches in a 6 hr period. This area of the country can get incredible rainfalls. Though some flooding is unavoidable, it is the epitome of folly to knowingly ignore steps to reduce this risk.

[wilcal]

http://www.ourtribune.com/headlines/21985-controversial-high-rise-project-in-kingwood-may-die.html

 

“The Army Corps of Engineers pulled and withdrew the permit of Romerica. They [Romerica] could not answer all of the questions that were posed by various groups within the 30-day time frame they had to reply within the statutes,” he said.

Romerica requested an extension and suspension of the terms of the permit application process, Rehak said, but the Corps denied the request and pulled the application. He noted that Romerica can reapply at some future date when they work out all the details and submit all the information they are supposed to provide. The application was withdrawn without prejudice.

[htownbro]

On 5/22/2019 at 4:03 PM, wilcal said:

http://www.ourtribune.com/headlines/21985-controversial-high-rise-project-in-kingwood-may-die.html

 

“The Army Corps of Engineers pulled and withdrew the permit of Romerica. They [Romerica] could not answer all of the questions that were posed by various groups within the 30-day time frame they had to reply within the statutes,” he said.

Romerica requested an extension and suspension of the terms of the permit application process, Rehak said, but the Corps denied the request and pulled the application. He noted that Romerica can reapply at some future date when they work out all the details and submit all the information they are supposed to provide. The application was withdrawn without prejudice.

this is officially dead.

[Twinsanity02]

3 hours ago, htownbro said:

this is officially dead.

Chucky darns

[Nate99]

15 hours ago, htownbro said:

this is officially dead.

 

Fun to dream, yes, but so many gigantic and glaringly obvious issues to get through. There's a template to approach something in that area if one was feeling similarly inspired, that is, start with flood mitigation and work with the CoE before you scare the pearl clutchers with your high rise renderings.  

 

It has been instructive listening to the local feedback loop.  Every development is assumed to make flooding worse and traffic unmanageble, never mind that new/expanded roads and the storm drains that would come with them get massive resistance every time they are raised for discussion. Selling the locals on any kind of medium scale project or larger is going to be tough. These people really like their back yards exactly the way they are and are willing to indulge in fantasies about renegade sand pits and nefarious river authorities out to get them. It's a niche, we'll see if it holds value. 

[Mr.Clean19]

Move it to East River!

[Urbannizer]

https://theheronskingwood.com/

 

Quote

At this time, The Herons project is on hold. The most recent flooding event in the Kingwood area brings home the ever-more pressing needs of Lake Houston’s recovery and continued maintenance. Our project will continue to be on hold until the lake infrastructure is restored and enhanced for proper water flow management.

 

With the recent events, we have devoted all our efforts to the betterment of the existing waterways and working with city officials toward the resiliency of the surrounding area. Our top priority is to create a safe environment to be enjoyed by all residents and provide a pathway for new development on Lake Houston.

[htownbro]

20 minutes ago, Urbannizer said:

https://theheronskingwood.com/

 

In other words this is dead.

[Twinsanity02]

I thought someone stuck a fork in this one. It's been done for some time.

[mollusk]

[Mr.Clean19]

I'll be the one swimming against the flow on this one. This would have been fun to have in the area. 

[Nate99]

15 minutes ago, Mr.Clean19 said:

I'll be the one swimming against the flow on this one. This would have been fun to have in the area. 

 

You're not alone, I think it would have been great, but there seem to be very few Kingwood residents that think likewise.  Heck, I might have moved into it. 

 

The project as rendered seemed beyond ambitious, and even if there were unanimous support in the area for it, I wouldn't bet on it going forward, but the NIMBY-ism machine got spooled up on this really quickly. Somehow everyone was convinced that the development on the lake would necessarily make flooding worse. Something this big could be designed as a win-win in that regard, but no one trusts anyone enough to even manage the obvious stuff that needs to get fixed. 

 

Perhaps the developer is either waiting for memories to fade (the inability to go six months without water in homes isn't helping) or wants to take another cut at it once a more fulsome drainage mitigation plan is in flight. My hopes are low that any such plan will get beyond nominal gestures. 

 

 

Edited October 24, 2019 by Nate99

[Mr.Clean19]

At least at this point it would be hard for the developer to make it worst. Waiting for things to be fixed and then starting could be a disaster. If they are serious and Kingwood really wants the flood protection, they should push for the county and TIRZ to incorporate flood protection for a wide area into the funding and design. 

[Nate99]

6 minutes ago, Mr.Clean19 said:

At least at this point it would be hard for the developer to make it worst. Waiting for things to be fixed and then starting could be a disaster. If they are serious and Kingwood really wants the flood protection, they should push for the county and TIRZ to incorporate flood protection for a wide area into the funding and design. 

 

There are a few things in flight (gates on LH dam, more dredging, etc.), but even those seem like a tough political slog to get executed, and not for lack of willingness to fund I don't think, though there is an element of, "why don't we see if we can get federal money for this", to be sure. 

 

If something on the scale of Harvey were to happen again, the loss of taxable value in the area would be horrendous. 

Edited October 24, 2019 by Nate99

[dreed]

Whatever happened to the Kingwood Marina project? I was looking forward to this project. I read about the community fighting against this project, but I have not heard anything else. Any update on this project? 

 

https://www.torrisi-procopio.com/projects/the-herons-kingwood-marina-houston-2017.html

[Twinsanity02]

I'm guessing hurricane Harvey may have cast a veto, but not certain. After all Harvey and the October 1994 flood would suggest  proceeding with caution is best.

[Nate99]

Haven't heard anyone mention it in a while. I'm still very much in favor of the idea, but also very skeptical that something of that scale could get built there.

[toxtethogrady]

On 4/20/2022 at 11:35 AM, Nate99 said:

Haven't heard anyone mention it in a while. I'm still very much in favor of the idea, but also very skeptical that something of that scale could get built there.

I'm seeing more than a few zombie projects come back to life in the last few months. If 1717 Bissonnet can be revived as the Langley, there's no reason someone won't attempt to put the shock paddles to this one...

Edited May 8, 2022 by toxtethogrady