Texas Central Project

[Triton]

On 2/26/2024 at 9:40 PM, Zorin said:

I'm beginning to question the actual viability of this project, just off of what I see in northwest Harris County.  Playing around with alignment maps, it appears that the preferred route would roughly take it through the Dunham Pointe edition south of 290 and Mason Rd, then where the curve north starts, I'm having trouble discerning whether it would run through Grand Prairie or Jubilee.  This is not mentioning other developments occurring on the northern side of 290.  

I realize none of this is set in stone so to speak, but would developers really be pouring truckloads of cash into developing these areas, unless they KNEW their developments would not be subject to eminent domain?  Even if they did ED the land, they still have to pay fair market value, and going low at 250K per house, that will add up fast! 

With the amount of time that has passed since the original schematics, there is no doubt they will have to do a new study. It just is what it is. The Amtrak collaboration is still fresh so I would hold off before calling this fully doomed. 

[Zorin]

On 2/29/2024 at 8:07 AM, Triton said:

With the amount of time that has passed since the original schematics, there is no doubt they will have to do a new study. It just is what it is. The Amtrak collaboration is still fresh so I would hold off before calling this fully doomed. 

That's completely fair.  

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to nay-say in the least, rather I'm just trying wrap my head around the logistics of the situation given the massive amount of development that has taken place......and who knows what's coming!

 

[Triton]

Man the forces of misinformation are strong. Absolute BS story with thousands of people believing this nonsense.... They have no source whatsoever. 

https://www.instagram.com/p/C4N28wxsHdP/?igsh=MTU5M21hemxnZ2tiYw==

This is part of the Texas Central project.

[Triton]

CNBC on Texas Central

 

[MaxConcrete]

On 3/7/2024 at 4:01 PM, Triton said:

Man the forces of misinformation are strong. Absolute BS story with thousands of people believing this nonsense.... They have no source whatsoever. 

https://www.instagram.com/p/C4N28wxsHdP/?igsh=MTU5M21hemxnZ2tiYw==

This is part of the Texas Central project.

Actually, there is a press report which quotes the owner of Reunion Tower saying it would be "sacrificed".

https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/politics/reunion-tower-could-be-sacrificed-dallas-high-speed-rail-plan/287-08706a39-e74f-4913-842c-a3452c8192b0

Quote

Renderings commissioned by Hunt Realty Investments show the train line passing inches from the Hyatt Regency's hotel room windows and the Reunion Tower complex. This would force the company to sacrifice more than 1,000 hotel rooms, its affordable housing development plans and the iconic Reunion Tower Ball, Hunt Realty Investments President Colin Fitzgibbons said. 

The meaning of the word "sacrifice" isn't clear. Does it mean financially diminished? Does it mean the owner would want to demolish it? Someone could infer the owner would be inclined to demolish the tower if its value is greatly reduced.

The renderings from the Dallas Morning News show the elevated rail line coming very close to the tower and hotel, but not requiring its demolition.

The WFAA news report says that officials are still quoting $30 billion for Houston to Dallas. The $30 billion number has been used for several years, even though highway construction costs are up around 50% in the last two years. They mention a minimum of $6 billion for Dallas to Fort Worth, which is a minimum of $200 million per mile, which seems low because it includes long tunnels.

There is a controversy raging in Dallas about Texas Central. To make a long story short, the tentative plans for the Dallas to Fort Worth section include tunnels for Arlington and Fort Worth, but an elevated structure for Dallas, and Dallas officials say they also should have a tunnel.

What's most bewildering about all this is that everyone in North Texas is acting as if Texas Central is actually going to be built. It surely isn't viable as a private entity, and I don't see any way even half of the cost will be covered by the federal government. So this is probably a big fuss about something that won't even happen.

 

 

[Houston19514]

On 3/7/2024 at 4:01 PM, Triton said:

Man the forces of misinformation are strong. Absolute BS story with thousands of people believing this nonsense.... They have no source whatsoever. 

https://www.instagram.com/p/C4N28wxsHdP/?igsh=MTU5M21hemxnZ2tiYw==

This is part of the Texas Central project.

The project described in the linked Instagram post is not part of the Texas Central project.

[Triton]

13 minutes ago, Houston19514 said:

The project described in the linked Instagram post is not part of the Texas Central project.

Is this some line to Fort Worth or something? I didn't realize there was any other HSR proposed in Texas

 

Edit: oh so this would be an extension to Fort Worth.

Quote

To make a long story short, the tentative plans for the Dallas to Fort Worth section include tunnels for Arlington and Fort Worth, but an elevated structure for Dallas, and Dallas officials say they also should have a tunnel.

 

[JClark54]

 

3 hours ago, Triton said:

Is this some line to Fort Worth or something? I didn't realize there was any other HSR proposed in Texas

 

Edit: oh so this would be an extension to Fort Worth.

 

The Fort Worth-Dallas high-speed rail line is being proposed by the North Central Texas Council of Governments, a regional transport planning body not directly affiliated with Texas Central. You can read about it here: 

https://www.nctcog.org/trans/plan/transit-management-and-planning/general-public-information/transit-planning-activities/transit-planning-projects/high-speed-rail

The NCTCOG is proposing a line from Dallas to Fort Worth that would connect with Texas Central's Dallas station, were one to be built. The route study that drew this discussion was initiated in 2020. 

The last presented Texas Central design calls for an elevated Dallas station. NCTCOG's proposal calls for trenching the route along the highway until Dallas, where it will be elevated for the purposes of connecting with the Texas Central station. The stated reason is speeding up the process of transferring from the Fort Worth-Dallas train to the Texas Central portion.  

 

Edited March 11 by JClark54

[Triton]

1 hour ago, JClark54 said:

 

The Fort Worth-Dallas high-speed rail line is being proposed by the North Central Texas Council of Governments, a regional transport planning body not directly affiliated with Texas Central. You can read about it here: 

https://www.nctcog.org/trans/plan/transit-management-and-planning/general-public-information/transit-planning-activities/transit-planning-projects/high-speed-rail

The NCTCOG is proposing a line from Dallas to Fort Worth that would connect with Texas Central's Dallas station, were one to be built. The route study that drew this discussion was initiated in 2020. 

The last presented Texas Central design calls for an elevated Dallas station. NCTCOG's proposal calls for trenching the route along the highway until Dallas, where it will be elevated for the purposes of connecting with the Texas Central station. The stated reason is speeding up the process of transferring from the Fort Worth-Dallas train to the Texas Central portion.  

 

Awesome, thank you. 

When I first came across this in /r/Dallas, I thought this was yet another attempt into scaring people about the Texas Central project. I guess this extension will have its own hurdles now.

[wilcal]

SOUND THE KLAXONS

https://www.newsweek.com/texas-poised-first-bullet-train-line-us-1888433

President Joe Biden is reportedly seeking to revive a project that would construct a high-speed railway from Houston to Dallas in Texas utilizing Japanese bullet trains.

According to a Reuters report on Tuesday, citing unnamed administration sources, the White House is looking to make an announcement on the project following talks between Biden and Japanese Prime Minister Fumio Kishida in Washington, D.C., this week.

[Triton]

50 minutes ago, wilcal said:

SOUND THE KLAXONS

https://www.newsweek.com/texas-poised-first-bullet-train-line-us-1888433

President Joe Biden is reportedly seeking to revive a project that would construct a high-speed railway from Houston to Dallas in Texas utilizing Japanese bullet trains.

According to a Reuters report on Tuesday, citing unnamed administration sources, the White House is looking to make an announcement on the project following talks between Biden and Japanese Prime Minister Fumio Kishida in Washington, D.C., this week.

Damn... So now Trump will be against this? 

[texan]

On 4/10/2024 at 4:17 PM, Triton said:

Damn... So now Trump will be against this? 

Once upon a time he considered it an infrastructure priority. Unfortunately, consistency doesn't mean anything to most politicians if it can be traded for winning.

https://www.texastribune.org/2017/01/24/report-texas-bullet-train-among-new-federal-transp/

[Triton]

31 minutes ago, texan said:

Once upon a time he considered it an infrastructure priority. Unfortunately, consistency doesn't mean anything to most politicians if it can be traded for winning.

https://www.texastribune.org/2017/01/24/report-texas-bullet-train-among-new-federal-transp/

Anytime Biden comes in support of something (Think TikTok ban), Trump comes out swinging against it, even if he's the one who first brought up the issue. With this being election season, if Trump comes out against this for "the farmers", consider this project dead in Texas. 

[BeerNut]

‘Now’s the time’: Amtrak leader urges momentum on Dallas-to-Houston high-speed rail

Quote

Andy Byford, Amtrak’s senior vice president of high-speed rail development, told participants of the 20th annual Southwestern Rail Conference in Hurst that the Dallas-to-Houston corridor “ticks all the boxes” for a high-speed rail project. It would connect two large population centers, it has straightforward topography and “suboptimal alternatives” for travel, pointing to congestion on Interstate 45 and area airports.

 

[JBTX]

Non-paywalled link to the interview in question:

https://youtu.be/wr0NJZP3g7Q

[AcresMansions]

Imagine still trying to market yourself as the Energy Capital of the world but the lights don't even stay on during a light drizzle and we don't have high speed driverless electric rail zigzagging across the Texas triangle

thousand dollars cars and the entire car lobby, Spain and Japan are beating down the door to invest in this but we're too dumb to do some common sense checkers. Why when hicks out in the sticks want to demolish communities in our urban wealth generating centers to widen their preferred commute route everything goes according to plan, but when the cities want something any idiot with half an acre of tax-dodging "farmland" can hold up everything until inflation makes the project infeasible.

Edited May 4 by AcresMansions

[august948]

15 hours ago, AcresMansions said:

Imagine still trying to market yourself as the Energy Capital of the world but the lights don't even stay on during a light drizzle and we don't have high speed driverless electric rail zigzagging across the Texas triangle

thousand dollars cars and the entire car lobby, Spain and Japan are beating down the door to invest in this but we're too dumb to do some common sense checkers. Why when hicks out in the sticks want to demolish communities in our urban wealth generating centers to widen their preferred commute route everything goes according to plan, but when the cities want something any idiot with half an acre of tax-dodging "farmland" can hold up everything until inflation makes the project infeasible.

Houston being called the Energy Capital of the world doesn't have anything to do with electricity generation.  Cars and wider highways are exactly on point with that.  I've been trying to buy just half an acre of tax-dodging farmland for a while now.  Can you tell me where that is available?  All the stuff out in the sticks is much larger and, frankly, a tad expensive. 

As for the inflation, you'll have to talk to Uncle Joe about that.

[Ross]

51 minutes ago, august948 said:

Houston being called the Energy Capital of the world doesn't have anything to do with electricity generation.  Cars and wider highways are exactly on point with that.  I've been trying to buy just half an acre of tax-dodging farmland for a while now.  Can you tell me where that is available?  All the stuff out in the sticks is much larger and, frankly, a tad expensive. 

As for the inflation, you'll have to talk to Uncle Joe about that.

You can't get an ag exemption on a half acre. 

[august948]

9 hours ago, Ross said:

You can't get an ag exemption on a half acre. 

Yes.

[AcresMansions]

way to fixate on a fraction of one part of a whole rant that really didn't require a response. especially from simple folk who think the president controls the inflation lever in between staff debriefs or that Houston's energy capital moniker is anything other than marketing for a pretty unremarkable town.

[editor]

On 5/4/2024 at 4:14 PM, AcresMansions said:

Imagine still trying to market yourself as the Energy Capital of the world but the lights don't even stay on during a light drizzle and we don't have high speed driverless electric rail zigzagging across the Texas triangle

thousand dollars cars and the entire car lobby, Spain and Japan are beating down the door to invest in this but we're too dumb to do some common sense checkers. Why when hicks out in the sticks want to demolish communities in our urban wealth generating centers to widen their preferred commute route everything goes according to plan, but when the cities want something any idiot with half an acre of tax-dodging "farmland" can hold up everything until inflation makes the project infeasible.

We almost had it.  A quarter century ago, it was called the Trans Texas Corridor.  Superhighways linking the major cities of Texas with rail, pipelines, and fiber optic conduits down the center.

It was supported by both Republican and Democratic politicians, but was killed by people who make their money from ever-sprawling suburbs and exurbs and turning what's left of Texas into cul-de-sacs and strip malls.  

[august948]

1 hour ago, editor said:

We almost had it.  A quarter century ago, it was called the Trans Texas Corridor.  Superhighways linking the major cities of Texas with rail, pipelines, and fiber optic conduits down the center.

It was supported by both Republican and Democratic politicians, but was killed by people who make their money from ever-sprawling suburbs and exurbs and turning what's left of Texas into cul-de-sacs and strip malls.  

That take differs a little from the take on wikipedia for the TTC.  No mention of cul-de-sacs and strip malls but lots about environmental and private property issues.  And about being opposed by both parties.

Seems a bit incongruent that suburban developers would oppose a new highway.

 

Quote

Criticism

A citizens uprising was started in 2003 by Linda and David Stall of Fayette County, after reading a small notice in a trade paper about a hearing to be held by TxDOT in their rural town of Fayetteville, Texas. The Stalls notified their friends and neighbors. Eight hundred people showed up to a town hall with a seating capacity of 100. David Stall, a city manager, and Linda Stall, an escrow officer of a Texas title company, founded CorridorWatch.org to lead the building of a network of people who worked together to defeat the construction project. The Motorcycle Riders Caucus, active within both the Democratic and Republican parties, was categorically opposed to toll roads, and they were the most powerful caucus in Texas. Its chair Sputnik helped to develop Stall's network into an immense, diverse coalition of voters opposed to the corridor. As lobbyist for the Texas Motorcycle Rights Association, Sputnik convinced many state legislators to vote against it.

American author and conservative activist Jerome Corsi vehemently opposed the corridor and wrote a book titled The Late Great USA: NAFTA, the North American Union, and the Threat of a Coming Merger with Mexico and Canada.^[22][23] In 2002, the TTC was estimated to cost between US$145.2 billion to $183.5 billion to complete the entire 4,000-mile (6,400 km) network.^[9] Some criticisms have focused on the enormous width of the corridors. ^{[citation needed]} The planned system, if built out to its fullest extent, could have required about 584,000 acres (2,360 km²) of land to be purchased or acquired through the state's assertion of eminent domain.^{[citation needed]} Environmentalists were concerned about the effects of such wide corridors and private land owners have expressed concerns about property rights.^[24] Opponents also alleged that noise from the TTC would be of such a high volume that it would render the area within one mile (1.6 km) of the corridor uninhabitable by humans, at least during periods of peak traffic on all components of the corridor (freight and passenger rail, truck lanes, and passenger lanes) if they are colocated and built to full capacity.^[25]

According to TxDOT documents released in June 2002, "Governor Rick Perry wrote Transportation Commission Chairman John W. Johnson on January 30, 2002 to outline his vision for the Trans Texas Corridor. The governor asked the three-member commission to assemble the Texas Department of Transportation’s top talent to create and deliver a Trans Texas Corridor implementation plan in 90 days."^[2]

In spite of public complaints–and both the 2006 platforms of the Texas Republican^[26] and Democratic^[27] parties opposing the plan–Governor Rick Perry continued to support the TTC.^[28]

Among the opponents to the corridor was the Republican State Representative Lois Kolkhorst of Washington County, who opposed on the basis that the project would undermine private property rights.^[29]

In the 2010 gubernatorial elections, Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison ran several attack advertisements regarding the TTC as Perry's attempts to expand government and take land from the average Texan. Ultimately, the advertisements did not have a great effect as Hutchison bowed out following her loss in the Republican primary.^[citatio

 

[Houston19514]

3 hours ago, editor said:

We almost had it.  A quarter century ago, it was called the Trans Texas Corridor.  Superhighways linking the major cities of Texas with rail, pipelines, and fiber optic conduits down the center.

It was supported by both Republican and Democratic politicians, but was killed by people who make their money from ever-sprawling suburbs and exurbs and turning what's left of Texas into cul-de-sacs and strip malls.  

 

2 hours ago, august948 said:

That take differs a little from the take on wikipedia for the TTC.  No mention of cul-de-sacs and strip malls but lots about environmental and private property issues.  And about being opposed by both parties.

Seems a bit incongruent that suburban developers would oppose a new highway.

 

 

Yeah, that was a bit of historical revisionism.  The TTC concept (proposed by Governor Rick Perry) was pretty much still-born because of concerns over property-takings related to the very wide rights-of-way that would have been required

Edited May 13 by Houston19514

[BeerNut]

The Dream of a Texas Bullet Train Lives On

Quote

“The private financing pieces would be a lot easier if Texas would just say, ‘We support this project,’” says Rick Harnish, executive director of the US High Speed Rail Alliance, an outside advocacy group.