122-Townhome Development In Rice Military

[MidtownCoog]

I agree. See my first reply.

I miss the old Feagan. It had a nice rural feel right in the heart of the city.

Now these people living in gated communities think they discoverd Feagan.

It's a shame.

[MiDTOWNeR]

It had a nice rural feel right in the heart of the city.

That pretty much sums up life in the loop. It has a gritty rural feel to it. Like I said...third world. A drive inside the loop in these rural feeling areas is an off road adventure with all the roads in disrepair.

Every problem has a solution, but lefties excell at pointing out problems and offering zero solutions.

So why dont they seem to get solved in Houston? Even with all the new development within the rice military area, it is still amazingly gritty and rural.

[utdeveloper]

Pointing out the problems IS a part of the solution. The right either fails to admit there are problems or generally blames them on individuals and tells them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

As for Boston's racist reputation, shove it honky.

If you have such a big problem with the way the area is being developed...go do something about it. This land (Ned Holmes tract) has been on the market for quite sometime. Actually, it sold for under market value. I am tired of hearing people complain, but aren't willing to put there butt on the line. Rohe & Wright, one of the developers is putting up the money, and as long as they are following city code...your complaints aren't going to be heard. Sorry, money talks...

[KinkaidAlum]

New projects have the potential to be GREAT for this city. I am just frustrated that for every Pavilions, Post Midtown, or TMC Transit Center, we get 500 strip malls, 1,000 auto dependent condos, 10 new CVS stores in a two mile radius, gated communities, garden apartments, and some big box stores announced on high profile corners.

We are expecting a huge population increase of an estimated 3 million more people over the next 25 years. Building gated enclaves Inside the Loop, Big Box Costcos on the proposed University Line, 6 blocks of Midtown Apartments with no ground floor retail but plenty of parking, drive-thru CVSs all over the Inner Loop, and mile after mile of strip malls is really just going to end up costing us in the long run. You think traffic is bad now? Wait until more high rises, 4 story condos with surface level garages, and the like are built out without the pedestrian or transit in mind. You think pollution is bad? Just wait until that many more cars are on the road because we still haven't created an environment in which living free of the car is a realistic option.

I don't want to force people into a lifestyle. I want people to realize that our current lifestyle is NOT sustainable for so many different reasons. The problems Houston face are huge. We need to start addressing them NOW. We are way to mature of a city now to still be allowing developers to make a quick buck and for the residents affected to have to just hope that what's being created today will just be temporary.

[Guest danax]

We are expecting a huge population increase of an estimated 3 million more people over the next 25 years. Building gated enclaves Inside the Loop, Big Box Costcos on the proposed University Line, 6 blocks of Midtown Apartments with no ground floor retail but plenty of parking, drive-thru CVSs all over the Inner Loop, and mile after mile of strip malls is really just going to end up costing us in the long run.

The huge population increase will mostly come from poor immigrants who will drive up the poverty, low SAT scores, etc. mentioned in your previous post, which will create more areas like Gulfton and so the gated enclaves will likely continue to be built.

And as utdeveloper mentioned, the City will approve anything that conforms to Chap 42 in the City code and there is nothing in there to force the types of development that you, and many of us, want. Myopic projects designed to meet the immediate market are all we get. The "long run" is not a concern, by either the City or the developers.

So, unless either of these things change, we can expect Houston to dance more and more to the raucous rhythms of Rio than to the blue-blooded beats of Boston.

[musicman]

raucous rhythms of Rio than to the blue-blooded beats of Boston.

I'm going to have to call you the alliteration master.

[musicman]

New projects have the potential to be GREAT for this city. I am just frustrated that for every Pavilions, Post Midtown, or TMC Transit Center, we get 500 strip malls, 1,000 auto dependent condos, 10 new CVS stores in a two mile radius, gated communities, garden apartments, and some big box stores announced on high profile corners.

Many of the things you strive for will not come to fruition because additional requirements on the developer mean additional funding will be required. If the developments are rental in nature, then most likely they are only out to make a buck.

If the City decides to change building requirements in certain areas, i'm sure there will be complaints by developers because of these additional requirements. It is all about making the developers happy.

[VelvetJ]

If the City decides to change building requirements in certain areas, i'm sure there will be complaints by developers because of these additional requirements. It is all about making the developers happy.

And this is a good thing? If not, why is it taking so long for our citizens to realize our city codes need a change?

Danax stated, "The long run is not a concern, by either the City or the developers." My question is why haven't our citizens or city leaders yet realized it's time to think about "The long run"?

I have stated for as long as I've been a member of this site that Houston always seem to be a step behind. Why do we allow ourselves to do so? Why do we seem to "get it" after everyone else? This has nothing to do with wanting the east and west coast to think we are cool. This is about Houston making wise decisions for itself and thinking about our city's future. It's about doing what is best for the city. Seriously.

[MiDTOWNeR]

And this is a good thing? If not, why is it taking so long for our citizens to realize our city codes need a change?

Danax stated, "The long run is not a concern, by either the City or the developers." My question is why haven't our citizens or city leaders yet realized it's time to think about "The long run"?

I have stated for as long as I've been a member of this site that Houston always seem to be a step behind. Why do we allow ourselves to do so? Why do we seem to "get it" after everyone else? This has nothing to do with wanting the east and west coast to think we are cool. This is about Houston making wise decisions for itself and thinking about our city's future. It's about doing what is best for the city. Seriously.

But there is nothing wrong with no-zoning Houston, so what is there to look out for?

[musicman]

And this is a good thing? If not, why is it taking so long for our citizens to realize our city codes need a change?

Danax stated, "The long run is not a concern, by either the City or the developers." My question is why haven't our citizens or city leaders yet realized it's time to think about "The long run"?

I have stated for as long as I've been a member of this site that Houston always seem to be a step behind. Why do we allow ourselves to do so? Why do we seem to "get it" after everyone else? This has nothing to do with wanting the east and west coast to think we are cool. This is about Houston making wise decisions for itself and thinking about our city's future. It's about doing what is best for the city. Seriously.

I dont see us as a step behind. unfortunately you're not aware of how City Hall functions. The city caters to the developers not the average citizen. The developers increase the city's bank account by increasing hte tax base.

what changes are you recommending specifically? You've mentioned nothing that we can respond to.

[TheNiche]

...because we still haven't created an environment in which living free of the car is a realistic option.

The thing about pedestrian environments...you really have to torture most people with the prospect of an unbearably slow vehicular commute to get them to walk. If they can reasonably drive or ride on a vehicle to their destinations, they will. And if they have to walk, for lack of a better option, then stores will cater to them.

Stores will go where the people are. The "great" pedestrian environments of the world were created in an era with different technologies. The people walked in order to commute, and thus stores were built to be walkable in order to cater to the customer base. Very simple, really.

True enough that there are exceptions to what I've just said, and you pointed them out in an earlier post, but they cater to niche markets. So if this is what you dream of as being available to the masses, then you're first going to have to hurt a lot of people to get it.

[KinkaidAlum]

Why do you keep insisting that I am trying to force a certain type of lifestyle on the masses?

All I have ever argued is that in a city the size of Houston, there should at least be THE OPTION of choosing a pedestrian friendly, transit-oriented neighborhood.

We simply do not have that now. In the few places were the opportunity existed to create it (Midtown/Downtown proves the market is there), developers are destroying that chance by plopping down what they know (suburban style developments) in the HEART of the city.

If you cannot see that when 8 million people live here instead of 5 million that this will be a problem, then I cannot help you.

[Overseas]

I think the argument that we either have a car-friendly environment or a pedestrian-friendly environment really is a false dichotomy. I currently live in Sydney, and Australia is a very car-friendly place. But it also is also has fairly decent (by American standards, though not European ones) urban public transport, and numerous pedestrian-friendly areas.

Many people want their suburban McMansion, shop in malls, and drive here and there, but they are also fighting to have new rail lines and bus route installed more quickly than the government is going to build them, and they like being able to get out of the car and walk about. There is both a huge mall and cute shopping streets in my nearby vicinty. I think numerous cities in Canada also shows there can be a middle-ground on these points. Even in London, where I used to live, supermarkets and Home Depot like stores had big parking lots, but they weren't the only option.

Creating density and pedestrian-friendly areas doesn't have to involve "hurting" people. It just involves doing something differently than we've been doing it for the past 60 years.

KincaidAlum is right - if we keep wasting land like we do, when there are 8 million people never given any other option but to be in a car-only environment, much of what makes Houston such a great place will be lost.

[VelvetJ]

I dont see us as a step behind. unfortunately you're not aware of how City Hall functions. The city caters to the developers not the average citizen. The developers increase the city's bank account by increasing hte tax base.

what changes are you recommending specifically? You've mentioned nothing that we can respond to.

So is it your opinion the city of Houston caters to developers no more than most other American cities?

The point I was trying to make was, yes developers bring in money to the city, however there is a downside to a city making pleasing developers the priority and it seems not enough Houstonians are aware, or even worse, don't care enough about that downside, to make decisions that will take our city into a more responsible future.

With regard to specific changes I would like to see, well for starters altering our setback rule for certain areas of the city that want it changed. For instance Midtown is a golden opportunity and there are already signs of that opportunity being squandered due to that rule.

We as citizens have the opportunity to vote in those that understand the importance of altering some of our outdated rules but we don't seem to take advantage of that.

I agree with KinKaidAlum in that Houston should at least offer the option to live in more pedestrian friendly enviroments, but that option for the most part, does not exist here and any steps to create such options is viewed by too many as "trying to be like other cities", instead of looking at the benefits of the pedestrian friendly option.

[The Great Hizzy!]

With regard to specific changes I would like to see, well for starters altering our setback rule for certain areas of the city that want it changed. For instance Midtown is a golden opportunity and there are already signs of that opportunity being squandered due to that rule.

I agree with this. Allowing specific communities the opportunity to alter certain city ordinances in this regard could be beneficial. Though, I think it needs to be looked at in greater detail so that certain criteria for change can be established.

I agree with KinKaidAlum in that Houston should at least offer the option to live in more pedestrian friendly enviroments, but that option for the most part, does not exist here and any steps to create such options is viewed by too many as "trying to be like other cities", instead of looking at the benefits of the pedestrian friendly option.

The market dictates this. You either can accept this for what it is or be frustrated the majority of the time. People HAVE been looking at this for decades now. The overwhelming majority of Americans don't care. Houston's not immune to this. Though, I do agree that the market that does have an interest in this should be allowed a viable opportunity to create such a landscape. The notion that Houston is "slower than most" in this regard is a fallacy at the worse or inconclusive at best. It's a statement that seems to made out of frustration. We have no real data, however, to prove this. It's a subjective offering.

[WesternGulf]

Simple, it's zoning.

[TheNiche]

Why do you keep insisting that I am trying to force a certain type of lifestyle on the masses?

All I have ever argued is that in a city the size of Houston, there should at least be THE OPTION of choosing a pedestrian friendly, transit-oriented neighborhood.

We simply do not have that now. In the few places were the opportunity existed to create it (Midtown/Downtown proves the market is there), developers are destroying that chance by plopping down what they know (suburban style developments) in the HEART of the city.

If you cannot see that when 8 million people live here instead of 5 million that this will be a problem, then I cannot help you.

As the city grows in terms of population, so too shall it grow in terms of the offerings made by the private sector to the market. This city is constantly reinventing itself.

My problem with your assertions is that you lack patience and have shown interest in mandating through government policy that your elitist viewpoint be made legally enforcable in a way that would disrupt market efficiency across a very broad area. To be clear, I wouldn't mind so much policy changes to support pedestrian-oriented development in a small neighborhood; I just know that no such thing is at all likely to happen by means of new deed restrictions and also that implementing such a policy even on a small area would require that zoning be created for the entire City--that is a grossly unacceptable political consequence as far as I'm concerned.

Creating density and pedestrian-friendly areas doesn't have to involve "hurting" people. It just involves doing something differently than we've been doing it for the past 60 years.

I am not against the idea of having a pedestrian-friendly option. I accept that there is a niche market that really enjoys that kind of an atmosphere.

But the political reality is that a set of laws encouraging such development in a small area would necessarily have far-reaching consequences for the entire City...and Houston is a giant of a city. Zoning creates a big bureaucracy. It creates market inefficiencies. It fosters sameness between neighborhoods. To me, it IS ticky tacky; not a solution to it.

[Subdude]

Sorry, I will try and learn from the Right. I should see the positive in,

6) today's news of median household income $6,000 less than the national average

Yeah, things look great when you drive home to Summerland and turn on the flat screen to watch Blue Collar T.V.!

Does anyone have a link to this story? Couldn't find it.

thx.

[musicman]

So is it your opinion the city of Houston caters to developers no more than most other American cities?

City government seeks changes for developers more quickly than they do for citizens. Bob Lanier was the Mayor who pushed many of the processes that are used today.

With regard to specific changes I would like to see, well for starters altering our setback rule for certain areas of the city that want it changed. For instance Midtown is a golden opportunity and there are already signs of that opportunity being squandered due to that rule.

People have been complaining about the CVS having parking lots that are too vast. If retail was built without parking, then they'd be parking on the street where they could. Residents would be complaining that their guests have no place to park. The business would suffer because those that would be driving have no "easy" place to park. Yes the residents would walk there but they aren't the only customers that need to be catered to.

We as citizens have the opportunity to vote in those that understand the importance of altering some of our outdated rules but we don't seem to take advantage of that.

which current councilmembers support your ideas? Peter brown claimed he was going to change development rules and yet NOTHING has been done. You have to remember the city is only seeming $$ with each permit they grant.

I agree with KinKaidAlum in that Houston should at least offer the option to live in more pedestrian friendly enviroments, but that option for the most part, does not exist here and any steps to create such options is viewed by too many as "trying to be like other cities", instead of looking at the benefits of the pedestrian friendly option.

there are many areas that are pedestrian friendly in Houston. I can walk to the library/park/convenience store/neighborhood grocery store easily. I can ride my bike/bus to two shopping areas failrly easily. I think many here have too many restrictions on what they want. they want pedestrian friendly/near a train stop/beatifully landscaped, etc. This is asking a lot. People have mentioned Rice village as pedestrian friendly, but i sure don't consider it automobile friendly because of the poor parking situation. I used to go to G'man frequently on skates but would rarely go by car just because of the parking. Lucily my favorite restaurant, Benjy's has its own parking.

[KinkaidAlum]

Elitist?

Man, you're a trip. Elitist would be my making a living off of the status quo in Houston as you do but trying to convince the masses that the status quo (or open market as you like to call it) is great and just needs a little tweaking.

I also didn't realize that Houston's elite were calling for greater transit options, friendlier environmental regulations, and stricter land-use regulations. What a crock.

[TheNiche]

Elitist?

Man, you're a trip. Elitist would be my making a living off of the status quo in Houston as you do but trying to convince the masses that the status quo (or open market as you like to call it) is great and just needs a little tweaking.

I also didn't realize that Houston's elite were calling for greater transit options, friendlier environmental regulations, and stricter land-use regulations. What a crock.

I use the term "elitist" as part of the "elitist vs. populist" framework. Not as a ranking of socioeconomic class. I suspect that there are various correlations among different household income levels, but that isn't really a variable of interest.

[HoustonMidtown]

Does anyone have any info on the quite large development going in near the corner of Reinerman and Feagan? I think it used to be an old farm...it takes up almost a whole block. They are just building the sales office but there aren't any signs up yet.

[RedScare]

There was a thread started on this project when it was first announced last year.

http://www.houstonarchitecture.info/haif/i...5&hl=FEAGAN

I suppose we can assume that the drainage protests fell on deaf ears.

[HoustonMidtown]

There was a thread started on this project when it was first announced last year.

http://www.houstonarchitecture.info/haif/i...5&hl=FEAGAN

I suppose we can assume that the drainage protests fell on deaf ears.

Thanks for the link - I tried to search but the search didnt find anything....sorry for the duplicate thread....

[Subdude]

There was a thread started on this project when it was first announced last year.

http://www.houstonarchitecture.info/haif/i...5&hl=FEAGAN

I suppose we can assume that the drainage protests fell on deaf ears.

Duplicate topics merged

[jt16]

Duplicate topics merged

Just read this thread. Some of you people should spend some time in third world countries before comparing Houston to them. There is opportunity here beyond what anyone in many South American and African countries could even dream of. To make this topic related, I wonder how 122 new units will affect home prices in the area.

[The Great Hizzy!]

Just read this thread. Some of you people should spend some time in third world countries before comparing Houston to them. There is opportunity here beyond what anyone in many South American and African countries could even dream of. To make this topic related, I wonder how 122 new units will affect home prices in the area.

It's not uncommon for some people to resort to extremism when pointing out a supposed flaw or when voicing disproval about a certain thing that bugs them personally. They may have the best intention but it is what it is. As it particularly relates to the internet, it's sometimes difficult to gauge the degree in which someone might exaggerate.

In any case, we're here to review and discuss architecture as it relates to the built environment, and I wonder, just like with any new project, how this new project will relate to its surroundings. Sometimes, it doesn't appear that certain projects are well thought out from an asthetics standpoint. A good example is the Tremont Tower.

[moni]

Just a comment, Houston is blessed with a very large geographic area. About five cities could fit inside it's city limits, including NY, NY. When I visit my friends in Chicago, I cannot park in front of their homes because I will be towed away, only parking for the residents. You really don't want that do you?? I mean, when I visit my Chicago friends, I always brag about living "out west". Huge parking lots, park anywhere you want to, and how great it is to have all the space available. At the end of a work day in cities like Chicago, you grab a bus, stand up until someone exits, hanging on to the overhead strap, diesel fumes coming inside at every stop, it is ugly and awful. The El is great, but sometimes you have to walk quite a while to find a station. I wouldn't give up my big box stores, big parking lots, free onstreet parking for any of the "pedestrian friendly" cities in the U.S. Canada is a little different, but we don't live in Canada.

[Guest danax]

Just a comment, Houston is blessed with a very large geographic area. About five cities could fit inside it's city limits, including NY, NY. When I visit my friends in Chicago, I cannot park in front of their homes because I will be towed away, only parking for the residents. You really don't want that do you?? I mean, when I visit my Chicago friends, I always brag about living "out west". Huge parking lots, park anywhere you want to, and how great it is to have all the space available. At the end of a work day in cities like Chicago, you grab a bus, stand up until someone exits, hanging on to the overhead strap, diesel fumes coming inside at every stop, it is ugly and awful. The El is great, but sometimes you have to walk quite a while to find a station. I wouldn't give up my big box stores, big parking lots, free onstreet parking for any of the "pedestrian friendly" cities in the U.S. Canada is a little different, but we don't live in Canada.

Houston is coming of age in the 21st century, where cars are still king, and so is forming itself into a place where you'll always have the option of driving or riding rail or bus. Chicago and NY are sort of stuck with a car-hostile setup. I'm becoming more and more comfortable with that idea, as opposed to the "classic urban" fantasy. Here we'll have pockets of "walkable" nabes butting up against freeways and box store boulevards. The Rice Military area, where this project will be located, is an example of that sort of hybrid. Housing is becoming dense but cars are still welcome.

Houston the chameleon, the mish-mash master. And we wouldn't have it any other way, right?

[Jax]

I like that vision, a city that can have the benefits of both urban and suburban styles. If Houston were more like NYC or Montreal I'd probably complain that everything is too expensive and too crowded. My apartment is 100 times nicer than anywhere I ever lived in Montreal and I pay less. Having the best of both worlds would be pretty cool, I think. Once we have more metro rail lines and some of these urban style developments we keep hearing about, we might just have it that way.

More than a chameleon, I like to think of Houston as the city of contrasts.