Shamrock Tower At 617 Main St.

[pineda]

I talked with someone last week who is with the mortgage company dealing with the Shamrock Tower. He said that the Shamrock is 70% under contract (with buyers), which of course can't be considered "sold" until they go through closing. He also mentioned that they're in discussions with Whole Foods Market to lease out the lower street-level area of the Shamrock. Just thought I'd pass it along...

[Subdude]

See! There's hope yet!

[kjb434]

Great news Pindeda.

In any high-rise, technically nothing is sold until it is finished. It is just under contract. Have 70% is a great number. This should be enough. Maybe they are waiting on Whole Foods in case they have to make any changes to the first floor layouts for utilities. A grocery store has different needs than most retail outlets.

It will be kind of funny having a McDonalds next to a Whole Food though. Organic vs Fast Food.

[yaga]

I really hope this gets built, along with the Galleria Mix-use Pavillion project and the Downtown Pavillions project, I think these 3 projects could really change development patterns in Houston.

[houston-development]

keep in mind that we are talking about two completely different developments. one is a high-rise and the other is a 4 storey over 1 or 2 level podium.

I have said over and over, i hope the shamrock is built; its good for the city. if all of the reservations are converted into legit contracts, in theory, the deal should get done. however, theres more to it than that... if it were just that easy, the deal would have already been done.

anyhoo... found some old renderings for the grammercy site. this is when tracy planned on building them as apartments.

[kjb434]

Pineda's post was about the Shamrock and not Grammercy.

If the 70% under contract is true, then its good news.

[houston-development]

Pineda's post was about the Shamrock and not Grammercy.

If the 70% under contract is true, then its good news.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i know and its been 70% (allegedly) for several months now.

[kjb434]

But several months ago it was 70% reserved. He is saying 70% under contract now. Unless he got his terms mixed up, this looks good. Having this much under contract would mean that financing could come through and move forward with the project.

I guess we should ask pineda whether the 70% was just the reserve number which we already knew or if its the contract number.

[pineda]

I did ask if the 70% was "reserved", which basically means nothing, or "under contract", which means the buyers on intent on going through with this. He made it very clear that meant "under contract", and was very excited about the project. He also mentioned the McDonald's vs. Whole Foods thing, and said that even though this would appear to be an odd juxtaposition, that it made perfect sense, because it serves two different markets. Makes sense to me.

[houston-development]

if the salesperson said 70% was under contract and was very clear about it, then it has to be true

good for tracy, i guess we should see ground-breaking and a revamped website soon

seriously though, if 70% of the contracts are signed, sealed, and delivered, in theory, he should be able to break ground any day now. unless, of course, they have to hold up and adjust the bottom level to whole food's specs. it would then be another justifiable delay... right?

[Houston Retail]

I vote to close this thread until we see dirt move.

C'mon. This post has been viewed over 13,000 times and it talks about nothing.

Reminds me of a Seinfeld Episode. "A Post about nothing"

[kjb434]

I was thinking the whole foods thing could be a delay just because the space it would need is different than most retailers. But then again, McDonald's need some of the same requirements. At this time also, it just could be getting things approved by the city: permits, siteplans, and etc.

I feel much better about this project now. Thanks for the clarification pineda.

[skwatra]

Reminds me of a Seinfeld Episode. "A Post about nothing"

not that there's anything wrong with that.

[UrbaNerd]

I vote to close this thread until we see dirt move.

C'mon. This post has been viewed over 13,000 times and it talks about nothing. 

Reminds me of a Seinfeld Episode. "A Post about nothing"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It also reminds me of the episode where they spent the entire thing waiting in the lobby of the Chinese restaurant. The guy said "oh..5-10 minuties", but of course, they waited..and when they left at the end of the episode, their table was finally ready. Hopefully, the same thing will happen to The Shamrock.

As soon as everyone gives up..

"Shamrock..now under construction..."

[Houston Retail]

"Seinfeld - Party of 4!!!"

[YakuzaIce]

I talked with someone last week who is with the mortgage company...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Pineda, is this someone you know personally, or did you just happen to meet him/her once. If the former, then could you keep us updated on any changes etc... This seems much more reliable considering it is an employee of the mortgaging company, and not some salesperson in their trailer.

[Gary]

not that there's anything wrong with that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ha,ha. I get it.

[Subdude]

I don't have online access for a link, but on Wednesday the Wall Street Journal ran an article about how Whole Foods Market has found a niche opening stores in residential highrises. It says that 12 of the 59 stores planned are in mixed-use developments, including condos in Miami, Seattle, Washington, San Francisco, Chicago, Vancouver, Seattle, and Chevy Chase MD. No word on Houston/Shamrock Tower however.

[Houston Retail]

Metropolitan Magnet

If Whole Foods Market Is Part

Of a Retail/Condo Complex,

New Apartments Sell Briskly

By RYAN CHITTUM

Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL

May 11, 2005; Page B1

The sheer size and glamour of the 74-story Met 3 condo tower in Miami should be enough to bring in buyers. But with more than 50,000 condos in development in the city right now, what really sets Met 3 apart is the Whole Foods Market that fills its ground floor.

***Edited to remove copyrighted material***

Edited May 17, 2005 by Subdude

[jpcampbell]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm sure it's designed well, but I would not want to be on the top floor of that if a hurricane hits.

[kjb434]

Who would be in the building if a hurrican hits? The should evacuate anyway.

[The Great Hizzy!]

Typically, they "demand" evacuation from such buildings. Obviously, they don't "make" you leave but they try to get you to leave, and they can legally fine your or what have you if you don't, though it's relatively rare.

[jpcampbell]

Who would be in the building if a hurrican hits?  The should evacuate anyway.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, my comment wasn't so much geared to any poor soul on top of that building. It was more of me being amazed that a building of that shape could be engineered to made sound during Hurricane force winds. That being said, you wouldn't catch me up there if it got gusty. That's all I meant.

It reminds me of this mid-rise on Richmond west of the loop whose height:depth ratio is quite large. The one from this post looks a million times better visually though.

[kjb434]

You would be surprised how strong these buildings can be. Many condos in the huricane risky areas are designed to have strong superstructure and the windows and other interior walls can be blown out in the worst storms. This allows renovating the building after to be an easier process.

Actually, many steel frame skyscrapers have this characteristic.

[brijonmang]

so is there any new news with the old shamrock these days? has anyone that works downtown seen a change?

[The New Juniper]

However, the questions I was trying to tackle were 1) Is lack zoning responsible for what has been happening with Shamrock Towers and 2) Is lack of zoning responsible for the lack of street life and residential interest in down town Houston.

1. No, not in any way, shape or form

2. Perhaps. However, imho, the tunnel system has more to do with the lack of downtown street life than zoning. Retailers flock to the tunnels (and with our crime and weather, who blames them?), which leaves the street level spaces empty. Which, in turn, provides places for homeless to congregate, which makes the streets feel unsafe, which drives the retailers into the tunnels. Endless cycle if you get my drift.

I am a huge proponent of the tunnels, but they are killing the street level retail. The perception of life and (more importantly) safety on the streets will bring retail, but also home buyers. Chicken and the egg I realize, but retailers want more home OWNERS in downtown before they'll come and people are hesitant to buy downtown b/c there is so little retail.

Back to the point - There was NO WAY Shamrock was ever going to go. Anyone who ever believed this developer would pull it off was kidding themselves. Great site. McDonald's will have to go back - NO MATTER what else is ever built.

Cluster $^%$ if epic proportions. The good folks at Keller (although the head realtor down there was a jack a** imho) got led down the primrose path to a pot of mush.

Live and learn. Downtown is showing promise. We should look more to the Railyard project than to Shamrock for hopes of a realistic revitalization.

TNJ

[NewMND]

(and with our crime and weather, who blames them?),

I know, it's just like Baghdad!

[uncertaintraveler]

However, imho, the tunnel system has more to do with the lack of downtown street life than zoning.  Retailers flock to the tunnels (and with our crime and weather, who blames them?), which leaves the street level spaces empty.  Which, in turn, provides places for homeless to congregate, which makes the streets feel unsafe, which drives the retailers into the tunnels.  Endless cycle if you get my drift.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I realize this isn't a great analogy, and it isn't even very much on point, but Singapore has a lot of tunnels in their downtown area (mostly connected with their metro system), and I seem to recall them having about the same amount of commercial activity in them as Houston's tunnels do. At the same time, though, Singapore is bustling with street level activity too. Maybe if Houston could round up the homeless the way Singapore does, our downtown would be a truly bustling place?

[kjb434]

I don't think the ACLU and other civil right groups would be happy if we start shipping the homeless our or throwing them jail.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to do that, but crazy lawers would defend a couple of them in a class action. Houston needs to enact no peddling ordinances and loitering laws and enforce them. This way, the homeless can get removed from the street not for being homeless, but for breaking the law.

[The New Juniper]

I don't think the ACLU and other civil right groups would be happy if we start shipping the homeless our or throwing them jail.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to do that, but crazy lawers would defend a couple of them in a class action.  Houston needs to enact no peddling ordinances and loitering laws and enforce them.  This way, the homeless can get removed from the street not for being homeless, but for breaking the law.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Couldn't agree more. It is such a lightening rod issue (homelessness) for this City. However, it's the elephant in the room that no one wants to acknowledge. If people are breaking the law, they should be arrested. We should not choose to enforce the laws that serve to bolster our conscience. These practices are against the law for a reason and it is killing our downtown.