Luminare Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Even with the recent "setback". TCR is still pursuing a late 2019 or early 2020 start date. https://www.houstonchronicle.com/neighborhood/spring/news/article/Houston-Dallas-high-speed-rail-construction-may-13620560.php#photo-14995150 TCR brings aboard financial advisers to begin capital-raising efforts. https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news/2019/02/22/texas-central-citi-mufg.html Seems like its full steam ahead to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
august948 Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Luminare said: Even with the recent "setback". TCR is still pursuing a late 2019 or early 2020 start date. https://www.houstonchronicle.com/neighborhood/spring/news/article/Houston-Dallas-high-speed-rail-construction-may-13620560.php#photo-14995150 TCR brings aboard financial advisers to begin capital-raising efforts. https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news/2019/02/22/texas-central-citi-mufg.html Seems like its full steam ahead to me. Full steam ahead? Now that's what would really be awesome....😀 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cspwal Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 They want to a high speed train though 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
august948 Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 I'm down with that.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
102IAHexpress Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 Good article in today's WSJ regarding why high speed rail has failed to materialize in the US. Illinois is shown as the example of why it has failed to take off. Governments are realizing that European/Chinese like high speed rail is not feasible in the US. However, higher speed rail is more feasible (up to 110/mph). The article remains open minded about investor backed high speed rail projects like the ones in Texas and Florida. https://www.wsj.com/articles/high-speed-rail-in-the-u-s-remains-elusive-illinois-shows-why-11551713342 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ozone Files Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 Sharing some content from /r/houston: The above links to a cached ABC13 article: Quote FORT WORTH, Texas (KTRK) -- Plans for the high speed rail in Texas that will take you from Houston to Dallas in 90 minutes are racing forward. Texas Central, the company in charge of the project, announced Thursday its petition to issue a Rule of Particular Applicability (RPA) has been granted by the Federal Railroad Administration. With this new approval from the Department of Transportation, the FRA will now be able to start writing the regulation that will apply to the project and allow the environmental impact study to move forward.RELATED: History of Texas bullet train project The company says an RPA is a project-specific rule that is written for unique projects like the high speed rail. "The Federal Railroad Administration's action on the RPA marks a major achievement to make this project a reality for all Texans," said Texas Central chairman Drayton McLane. "This is a bold move by the Secretary, and the Department of Transportation, to ensure we implement the safest passenger rail system in the world." Texas Central has signed an agreement with the Spanish rail operating company, Renfe. Renfe runs more than 7,500 miles of track across Europe. Associated video: https://abc13.com/video/embed/?pid=2311749 And TCR Press Release regarding the news: https://www.texascentral.com/posts/another-major-milestone-for-your-high-speed-train/ Another post also shared this Japan Railway Journal episode about the project: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mw41m2pE60U Rather dull but learned about the various Shinkansen design iterations with a perfect safety rating for over 50 years. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
102IAHexpress Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 Update. Texas Central signs design-build agreement with Italian firm Salini Impreglio https://www.salini-impregilo.com/en/texas-high-speed-rail.html 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ozone Files Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 (edited) Swiping more news from /r/houston: https://www.texascentral.com/posts/design-build-contract-signed-with-salini-impreglio/ Some excerpts: Quote On the heels of the recent regulatory announcement on the RPA, we’re excited to announce another major accomplishment. We’re pleased to share that we have signed a design-build contract with the joint venture of Salini Impregilo, one of the largest civil engineering contractors in the world, and its U.S. subsidiary Lane Construction Company. Salini Impregilo is active in more than 50 countries on five continents, with experience building more than 4,000 miles of railway infrastructure around the world – in Australia, Europe, Asia and the Americas. As part of the design-build scope, Salini-Lane will supply the civil infrastructure work for the new high-speed train service between Houston and North Texas. This includes the design and construction of the viaduct and embankment sections along the entire route, the installation of the track system and construction of related buildings and services along the route that will house maintenance and other rail system equipment. Also from the PDF press release: Quote The Texas train will be based on Central Japan Railway’s Tokaido Shinkansen train system, the world’s safest mass transportation system. The new Shinkansen N700S is the 6th generation of this train and will be debuted before this summer’s 2020 Olympics. The system has transported more than 10 billion passengers in over 54 years with a perfect record of zero passenger fatalities or injuries from operations, and an impeccable on-time performance record. The project’s total investment is expected to be approximately $20 billion with the civil works estimated at $14 billion. This would conservatively lead to an estimated $36 billion in economic benefits state-wide over the next 25 years, including the creation of 10,000 jobs per year during peak construction and 1,500 permanent jobs when fully operational. EDIT: @102IAHexpress and I posted the news simultaneously 😁 Edited September 13, 2019 by The Ozone Files 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfastx Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 Good to hear. I see the timeline is sliding a bit, hopefully they can actually start construction in 2020, and that it is successful and inspires other projects. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 2 hours ago, mfastx said: Good to hear. I see the timeline is sliding a bit, hopefully they can actually start construction in 2020, and that it is successful and inspires other projects. Sliding though isn't on the Private end, but the Public end. You can imagine why it would take even longer if this was an all government job. They still need a couple more approvals to finally get this going. I'm sure if there wasn't this many hops to jump through they probably would have started a couple years ago. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfastx Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 14 hours ago, Luminare said: Sliding though isn't on the Private end, but the Public end. You can imagine why it would take even longer if this was an all government job. They still need a couple more approvals to finally get this going. I'm sure if there wasn't this many hops to jump through they probably would have started a couple years ago. I thought the timeline was sliding because of NIMBYs and lawsuits? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 18 minutes ago, mfastx said: I thought the timeline was sliding because of NIMBYs and lawsuits? Partly correct, yes. Again the only reason these two have held any sway in this process is because the opposition has been able to gain favor by a few judges and reps. If they didn't have any of that support then again the timeline wouldn't have slid this far. With that being said...its amazing that they are still chugging away. Easy does it and steady as she goes. The fact they were able to finalize that project signing is a great sign. You aren't going to make that kind of commitment as an international company unless its going to happen. At this point its not a matter of if anymore, but a matter of when. That is incredible since I remember meeting with these guys all the way back in 2015 and even then I still though this was pipe dream. They really have put their money where their mouth is. I hope these guys can become the SpaceX of High Speed rail. A company that proves that the free market can be a real solution just like SpaceX proved we can go to space in a free market manner as well. Just think of the implications if they are able to succeed. It doesn't just have implications for intercity travel, but also possibly travel within cities as governments can invest in companies to provide better alternatives with the governments guidance. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmac Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 It remains a silly idea that will end up failing financially, and the billionaires behind it will come begging for a bailout. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcal Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 3 hours ago, Luminare said: At this point its not a matter of if anymore, but a matter of when. You don't have any concerns about them not having the cash? They need like $17 billion, right? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougarpad Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 51 minutes ago, wilcal said: You don't have any concerns about them not having the cash? They need like $17 billion, right? You do realize that the partner Japanese company behind this has other lines built and running around the world? It is not like this is some start up company building their first rail. The builders have plenty of financial backing. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 24 minutes ago, cougarpad said: You do realize that the partner Japanese company behind this has other lines built and running around the world? It is not like this is some start up company building their first rail. The builders have plenty of financial backing. Not to mention if the company itself does fail I'm sure the Japanese will not want to have a line which they invested in and has their name on it sit and collect dust. If anything I would assume the Japanese would just buy out the company outright and run it themselves. That is a major worst case scenario that I don't foresee happening at all, but that would be the likely scenario in that case with the trains and a good chunk of funding coming from Japan. Essentially TCR is nothing but an operator and a facilitator for this tech getting and running in the US. I would even be surprised is TCR becomes an outright subsidiary of the Japanese train company outright. In fact that would be a smart move to continue an infusion of finances and construction of new lines in the future. 1 hour ago, gmac said: It remains a silly idea that will end up failing financially, and the billionaires behind it will come begging for a bailout. I've never heard of a company that is essentially the only competitor in a market place failing in the way you are describing and then asking for a bailout. That never happens. A company asks for a bailout when they fail to adjust to changing market place and normally in the case of banks or cars it was to maintain american brands in a global market place which is why the government even considered bailing them out in the first place. If that worry wasn't there then they would have left them go bankrupt. Bailouts were merely a means to protect our own homegrown industries...which sucked that it had to be done in the first place, and I'm still against it, but it was an unprecedented circumstance in those cases. As for TCR, not only are they using another companies patented tech, but are getting funding from them as well. I've never understood this argument in the first place, and it all sounds like resentment and nihilism. Think about it, when this line gets built it will literally be the only game in town in regards to train travel between the two cities. If you have 100% of the entire market, chances are you are going to do just fine. Now how much they will profit remains to be seen. Is it going to be a razor thin margin like we see with air travel? Nobody knows. Is it going to be enormous profit margins like railroads of the 19th century? Nobody knows. But what can be assured is that your scenario is predicated on the fact that travel by air, train, or car is an apples to apples comparison meaning they compete for the same kind of travel and that is completely wrong. There is a market here, how much profit can be had in that market remains to be seen. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmac Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 We'll see, and we'll just have to disagree. I probably won't live long enough to see this thing started/completed, but I think it is a useless project that adds nothing. I have no skin in the game, just hate to see people lose their land for a vanity project. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cougarpad Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 15 minutes ago, gmac said: We'll see, and we'll just have to disagree. I probably won't live long enough to see this thing started/completed, but I think it is a useless project that adds nothing. I have no skin in the game, just hate to see people lose their land for a vanity project. A big chunk of the land is in a utility corridor on people's property that already is owned by a power company. Also how is it a vanity project? All these investors are not putting money on the line if they did not think the ridership was there. The line is no where near as big of a footprint as TXDOT is taking out of properties across the Texas to build highways. The company is paying the property owners for the land as well. It is not like they are just walking up and taking the property without compensation. 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADCS Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 I don't know why people are crying for investors' potential losses when the worst case scenario is the state getting a fully-built piece of high-capital infrastructure for pennies on the dollar. Certainly those investors are not crying for you when their gains come at your expense, and there's no public good left behind as a result. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 26 minutes ago, cougarpad said: A big chunk of the land is in a utility corridor on people's property that already is owned by a power company. Also how is it a vanity project? All these investors are not putting money on the line if they did not think the ridership was there. The line is no where near as big of a footprint as TXDOT is taking out of properties across the Texas to build highways. The company is paying the property owners for the land as well. It is not like they are just walking up and taking the property without compensation. Heck even if it was a vanity project people have no idea how much ego plays a part in building our world and providing products to the market. This is especially the case with architecture, engineering, and construction. People want to prove they can do something and show what they can do with their money. The thing you want is for ones ego/self-interests to also align with what can benefit others and society at large. Not only is this company building a railroad and spending a lot of capital to do so, but it also just so happens that it can turn into a public good for a lot of people who want alternative options for transit. Its been amazing how all the people criticizing highway expansion haven't made a peep about this project or levied full support, and the only conclusion that I can render is that it is again resentment and nihilism. They want the government to do this, and they resent that a private company would even dare try this. Its really astounding. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cspwal Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 Also if the line is such a big failure that it goes bankrupt, why would the state bail them out? And if the state did bail them out, it means the HSR line was so useful and important that it's worth whatever the bailout cost was, which means that it was worth the disruption of some people's property to benefit a lot of other people 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcal Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 22 hours ago, cougarpad said: You do realize that the partner Japanese company behind this has other lines built and running around the world? It is not like this is some start up company building their first rail. The builders have plenty of financial backing. That's basically exactly what this is. Yes, they've hired a bunch of experts to help them, but this is a startup company. When you say "partner Japanese company" are you referencing JR Central, the company that operates the Shinkansen trains (in Japan, exclusively) or Hitachi/Kinki Sharyo who manufacture the trains? Yes, they are licensing the tech from a Japanese company, but that company isn't funding the construction of this project. The bulk of the funding so far for Texas Central is from the nation of Japan via the Japan Overseas Infrastructure Investment Corp. for Transport & Urban Development and the Japan Bank for International Cooperation who have provided a $300 million loan (about 2% of what they need). Texas Central has on their own website that they will be using private investors, but they have not announced anything more than the $300 million loan from the nation of Japan and and some initial funding of less than $100 million. Dallas Morning News reported that the $300 million loan from Japan (and again, I'm talking about the country) is the amount necessary to take them to the point where they can start construction. The nation of Japan could provide more funding, but no one has stated that publicly. I really wish that I'm wrong, but I have not seen a single piece of information anywhere that suggests that they have more than $500 million in funding from any source, and certainly not enough funding to complete the project, so if you can provide any information in regards to that I would actually be really overjoyed. Edit: I'll put this edit to say that yes, some Japanese corporation or the Japanese government, or who knows could have already agreed to fund this project behind closed doors. Nothing, to my knowledge, is public about any potential multi-billion dollar funding. Edited September 18, 2019 by wilcal 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 34 minutes ago, wilcal said: That's basically exactly what this is. Yes, they've hired a bunch of experts to help them, but this is a startup company. When you say "partner Japanese company" are you referencing JR Central, the company that operates the Shinkansen trains (in Japan, exclusively) or Hitachi/Kinki Sharyo who manufacture the trains? Yes, they are licensing the tech from a Japanese company, but that company isn't funding the construction of this project. The bulk of the funding so far for Texas Central is from the nation of Japan via the Japan Overseas Infrastructure Investment Corp. for Transport & Urban Development and the Japan Bank for International Cooperation who have provided a $300 million loan (about 2% of what they need). Texas Central has on their own website that they will be using private investors, but they have not announced anything more than the $300 million loan from the nation of Japan and and some initial funding of less than $100 million. Dallas Morning News reported that the $300 million loan from Japan (and again, I'm talking about the country) is the amount necessary to take them to the point where they can start construction. The nation of Japan could provide more funding, but no one has stated that publicly. I really wish that I'm wrong, but I have not seen a single piece of information anywhere that suggests that they have more than $500 million in funding from any source, and certainly not enough funding to complete the project, so if you can provide any information in regards to that I would actually be really overjoyed. Who owns Texas Central? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcal Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 29 minutes ago, Houston19514 said: Who owns Texas Central? Texas Central Partners, LLC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 1 hour ago, wilcal said: That's basically exactly what this is. Yes, they've hired a bunch of experts to help them, but this is a startup company. When you say "partner Japanese company" are you referencing JR Central, the company that operates the Shinkansen trains (in Japan, exclusively) or Hitachi/Kinki Sharyo who manufacture the trains? Yes, they are licensing the tech from a Japanese company, but that company isn't funding the construction of this project. The bulk of the funding so far for Texas Central is from the nation of Japan via the Japan Overseas Infrastructure Investment Corp. for Transport & Urban Development and the Japan Bank for International Cooperation who have provided a $300 million loan (about 2% of what they need). Texas Central has on their own website that they will be using private investors, but they have not announced anything more than the $300 million loan from the nation of Japan and and some initial funding of less than $100 million. Dallas Morning News reported that the $300 million loan from Japan (and again, I'm talking about the country) is the amount necessary to take them to the point where they can start construction. The nation of Japan could provide more funding, but no one has stated that publicly. I really wish that I'm wrong, but I have not seen a single piece of information anywhere that suggests that they have more than $500 million in funding from any source, and certainly not enough funding to complete the project, so if you can provide any information in regards to that I would actually be really overjoyed. As someone who is in the industry this is very typical and not out of the norm from a private side standpoint. Its atypical in regards to infrastructure because normally the government are the ones involved in order to get projects fully approved and begun in the first place they have to have all the funding all in one go, and typically they will only get it from a few sources. Normally this is through bonds, loans, or taxes (or all of the above). They also have to do this because they are beholden by the public to make sure that the money they get (which is typically from tax payers in some form) goes to the right place and is allocated correctly. A private company does not have to do this, and in a normal construction project they can begin the process, either with all funds available or by gathering funds as they go along. It really is a pay as you go process. I've actually been part of a project that is going to be 100% funded by donations, but even now it isn't fully funded yet, but the funds which have been collected have been used to start the process, develop drawings, work with consultants, and get various permits approved etc... The only money they still need is the necessary funds to begin construction and that is being collected right now. Your jobs on the residential side, especially single family homes, in which a family goes to an architect to design a home, is done in the same fashion. Again this is only atypical because this is infrastructure and projects in that arena, typically done by the government, are done in lump sums or all at once, but that is because they are legally bound to do so, and to make sure they are not overspending or going overbudget and anger the public, have to do so. Everything here from an industry insider checks out as far as the money that they have appropriated to get the process going thus far. A project this massive that gets through all the hops and loops to get to the point of construction will ring bells immediately to many investors to invest in a project like this because a project that can get to that point is a project that will work. No investor is going to immediately fork over billions of dollars for a project that isn't there yet. This one isn't there yet, but a project with the Final Environment Study, various regulations needed, land aquired necessary to start, designs on the boards, and team on board...will be ready for that kind of investment. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 44 minutes ago, wilcal said: Texas Central Partners, LLC. Yes, and who owns Texas Central Partners, LLC, if you know? And I'm curious how you know that JR Central is not providing any funding for the project. Edited September 18, 2019 by Houston19514 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcal Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, Luminare said: As someone who is in the industry this is very typical and not out of the norm from a private side standpoint. Its atypical in regards to infrastructure because normally the government are the ones involved in order to get projects fully approved and begun in the first place they have to have all the funding all in one go, and typically they will only get it from a few sources. Normally this is through bonds, loans, or taxes (or all of the above). They also have to do this because they are beholden by the public to make sure that the money they get (which is typically from tax payers in some form) goes to the right place and is allocated correctly. A private company does not have to do this, and in a normal construction project they can begin the process, either with all funds available or by gathering funds as they go along. It really is a pay as you go process. I've actually been part of a project that is going to be 100% funded by donations, but even now it isn't fully funded yet, but the funds which have been collected have been used to start the process, develop drawings, work with consultants, and get various permits approved etc... The only money they still need is the necessary funds to begin construction and that is being collected right now. Your jobs on the residential side, especially single family homes, in which a family goes to an architect to design a home, is done in the same fashion. Again this is only atypical because this is infrastructure and projects in that arena, typically done by the government, are done in lump sums or all at once, but that is because they are legally bound to do so, and to make sure they are not overspending or going overbudget and anger the public, have to do so. Everything here from an industry insider checks out as far as the money that they have appropriated to get the process going thus far. A project this massive that gets through all the hops and loops to get to the point of construction will ring bells immediately to many investors to invest in a project like this because a project that can get to that point is a project that will work. No investor is going to immediately fork over billions of dollars for a project that isn't there yet. This one isn't there yet, but a project with the Final Environment Study, various regulations needed, land aquired necessary to start, designs on the boards, and team on board...will be ready for that kind of investment. I think this is 1000000% fair, and of course you would never be expected to have all funds in place at the beginning of a 5ish year build. And you're right, they do have the right to a veil of secrecy. I guess we'll find out for sure in March when the environmental study is done and they can start construction. They've made a pretty big deal about the previous loans they received, and I would assume that they would want to trumpet any other significant investment. Imho, if their strategy is to wait, that would be a bold play. 2 minutes ago, Houston19514 said: Yes, and who owns Texas Central Partners, LLC? It's my understanding that the information is not public, but I do not know for certain. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, wilcal said: I think this is 1000000% fair, and of course you would never be expected to have all funds in place at the beginning of a 5ish year build. And you're right, they do have the right to a veil of secrecy. I guess we'll find out for sure in March when the environmental study is done and they can start construction. They've made a pretty big deal about the previous loans they received, and I would assume that they would want to trumpet any other significant investment. Imho, if their strategy is to wait, that would be a bold play. Its not even bold...its literally everyday business practices haha. Now if they were getting Bonds, Loans, and Taxes for this job then you bet they better reveal that and they would, but they haven't taken anything from those three thus far and so they don't have to disclose anything. Again its weird and gets into the realm of conspiracies for some because its an infrastructure job which normally is funded via the prior three stated, and so the intention by many is to ask...where where is the money you said this project needs, but its not a public project and so they don't need to disclose that info or even have that funding right away. I even mentioned before that in 2015 I still thought this was a pipe dream. Now imagine what investors might have thought. I'm sure investors thought the same for private space companies in the beginning as well. Now its getting more likely this will happen by the day, and if they have everything approved and say they are ready to build then, if I had money, I would invest in something like this. This is a 6 year long job with potential for return over 25 years. That is the best possible investment in regards to real estate and construction. They just have to get there first and its clear that is their aim. Edited September 18, 2019 by Luminare 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston19514 Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 8 minutes ago, wilcal said: It's my understanding that the information is not public, but I do not know for certain. So, it's possible that JR Central or other Japanese entities are the owners or at least partial owners of Texas Central. I'm curious how how know that JR Central is not providing any construction funding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminare Posted September 18, 2019 Share Posted September 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Houston19514 said: So, it's possible that JR Central or other Japanese entities are the owners or at least partial owners of Texas Central. I'm curious how how know that JR Central is not providing any construction funding. I'm pretty sure they do and was stipulation for the initial funding. They would be idiots if they didn't. Putting that kind of skin into the game early is risky and asking for partial ownership or ownership stakes is one way to insure the project will be successful. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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