Walmart Supercenter At 111 Yale St.

[s3mh]

Don't count your traffic chickens before they have hatched. Walmart has only been open for less than three months. The rest of the development only has about a quarter of the pads open (although Orr's strip mall is mostly open). If the development fills up with tenants, people actually go to the Walmart and SJ Stone, the Trammell Crow apartment, the apartment between Yale and Heights south of the strip malls and a rumored development on the NW corner of Yale and the feeder get done, the traffic in the area could be Galleria-esque. I have seen Yale north bound back up to the rail bridge during PM rush hour and south bound backs up past 6th street during am rush. Mostly feeder traffic at this point. But that was the point all along. When you take a road system that is already failing and add more traffic, you can get grid lock. Yale can already stack up to the rail bridge. Add more traffic and it will stack up to Washington and screw up that intersection.

While you all may like the fact that the goods you want to buy and the stores you like are now closer, the fact is that Fiesta on 14th is gone (no coincidence--why would Fiesta stick around to try to compete with Walmart). Kroger is in the cat bird seat with no competition from HEB and minimal competition from Walmart and Target's cruddy little food sections. Kroger is now really the only non-Whole Foods main stream grocer in the Heights now with almost no options for another grocer to move in.

[RedScare]

moo, save the exaggeration. The Galleria has a 2.5 million square foot mall, numerous highrises, hotels and condo towers. A Walmart, apartment building and strip centers will never cause Galleria style traffic. Besides, I only go to that area once every couple of weeks, so I am not concerned about a bit of traffic on a Saturday. I have more important things to complain about than whether a traffic signal may or may not cycle on me before I can get through. I'll leave that heavy lifting to the professional complainers.

As for Kroger, that's HEB's fault. If they wanted in the neighborhood, they'd have bought some land. They clearly did not. Not that I am concerned. HEB is overrated. Kind of like Target. Only the hatred of Kroger (or Walmart) makes people claim HEB is all that...or maybe some strange allegiance to them because they are based in Texas. If they had built on Studewood, I would have shopped them. They did not, so I do not. No skin off my back. They all sell the same brands, and they all push their store brands.

[JJxvi]

Maybe I'm just easy going, but the only time there is any real frustrating traffic in the Heights area south of I-10 its almost always related to rail traffic, not what retail stores are in the area. The only other times that cause frustration are within parking lots if I happen to end up at the store at a busy time.

[JJxvi]

Traffic isnt even bad over on Sawyer except that the layout is and directions are a bit stressful over there. Yale is just a breeze by comparison.

[barracuda]

If rush-hour traffic has increased on Yale and Heights Blvd, I would suspect much of it is due to folks shifting their driving pattern to avoid Studemont. But I haven't noticed any notable traffic problems in the area, other than the occasional train blocking Heights Blvd and a few construction-related lane closures.

[SilverJK]

While you all may like the fact that the goods you want to buy and the stores you like are now closer, the fact is that Fiesta on 14th is gone (no coincidence--why would Fiesta stick around to try to compete with Walmart).

I think the wal-mart is completely coincedence since I heard rumors that the fiesta wasn't long for this world around 5 years ago... you weren't here so maybe you don't remember when we thought it was happening back then... If you really wanted to blame another store, stick to Kroger. The 11th Street Kroger improvements probably hurt business a lot more than Walmart ever did, not that it matters, the property owners have been looking to cash in on that land for a while now.

I suppose Party Kroger's new gas station is the reason the gas station on white oak and studewood is closing too huh?

S3mh being S3mh.

[RedScare]

I think the wal-mart is completely coincedence since I heard rumors that the fiesta wasn't long for this world around 5 years ago... you weren't here so maybe you don't remember when we thought it was happening back then... If you really wanted to blame another store, stick to Kroger. The 11th Street Kroger improvements probably hurt business a lot more than Walmart ever did, not that it matters, the property owners have been looking to cash in on that land for a while now.

I suppose Party Kroger's new gas station is the reason the gas station on white oak and studewood is closing too huh?

S3mh being S3mh.

Yeah, this may be a complete fabrication. Fiesta never owned that property on 14th Street. Weingarten Realty did. When Weingarten decided to sell, Fiesta was told that the lease would not be renewed. So, yes, it actually WAS a coincidence that Fiesta closed about the time Walmart opened.

But, us Heights oldtimers already knew that.

[s3mh]

Yeah, this may be a complete fabrication. Fiesta never owned that property on 14th Street. Weingarten Realty did. When Weingarten decided to sell, Fiesta was told that the lease would not be renewed. So, yes, it actually WAS a coincidence that Fiesta closed about the time Walmart opened.

But, us Heights oldtimers already knew that.

And Fiesta is incapable of buying land? Fiesta has been ditching inside the loop because they are no longer able to compete with all the giant Krogers, HEBs and Walmarts with their older and smaller stores. And ultimately, they would never consider buying the land to keep their store when they are going to have to compete with a giant new Walmart and Kroger. Fiesta is a small local chain that does not have the capital to upgrade the stores inside the loop to be able to compete with the oversized HEBs, Krogers and Walmarts. While Weingarten and the owner of the land in Montrose were ultimately the ones that sent Fiesta packing, the fact that new Krogers, Walmarts and HEBs were sprouting up around them made the decision to just close up shop a no brainer for Fiesta.

[s3mh]

moo, save the exaggeration. The Galleria has a 2.5 million square foot mall, numerous highrises, hotels and condo towers. A Walmart, apartment building and strip centers will never cause Galleria style traffic. Besides, I only go to that area once every couple of weeks, so I am not concerned about a bit of traffic on a Saturday. I have more important things to complain about than whether a traffic signal may or may not cycle on me before I can get through. I'll leave that heavy lifting to the professional complainers.

As for Kroger, that's HEB's fault. If they wanted in the neighborhood, they'd have bought some land. They clearly did not. Not that I am concerned. HEB is overrated. Kind of like Target. Only the hatred of Kroger (or Walmart) makes people claim HEB is all that...or maybe some strange allegiance to them because they are based in Texas. If they had built on Studewood, I would have shopped them. They did not, so I do not. No skin off my back. They all sell the same brands, and they all push their store brands.

In the Heights, we have four lanes on Yale, two lanes north of I-10 and four south of I-10 on Heights to get exiting traffic from one of the busiest stretches of highway in Texas, a Walmart, several strip malls, at least 500 units of apartments yet to be built, possibly more and additional strip malls if SJ Stone decides to sell. That will put additional traffic onto a grid that is already rated an F at Yale. Add to that the fact that the city is growing rapidly, and you are going to end up with serious traffic problems on the scale of the Galleria simply because the grid is already close to being max-ed out with existing traffic and has no room to put it or to expand.

I am not saying that HEB is the answer to grocery shopping. But, it is the only real competitor in the area to Kroger's monster stores at Studewood and Shep. Capitalism tends to work well when there is competition. Capitalism tends to not work so well when competition is lacking.

[JJxvi]

Even assuming you are correct and Fiesta is having problems in the Heights then its is most likely down to the fact that Fiesta's approach and marketing is hispanic oriented and since 1990 the Hispanic population of 77008 (and probably even more extreme within the actual Heights) has dropped by 46% (17920 persons/55% of total as of 1990 census AND 9672 persons/32% of total as of 2010 census) rather than competition. The fact that more mainstream/majority grocers are having more success than the minority catering grocer is that the area has become less of a minority center than it was 20 years ago.

Edited January 14, 2013 by JJxvi

[JJxvi]

The decline in 77007 is even more extreme as it dropped from 55% hispanic in 2000 (as opposed to 1990 in 008) to 30% in 2010, declining roughly the same percentage in only 10 years.

[RedScare]

And Fiesta is incapable of buying land? Fiesta has been ditching inside the loop because they are no longer able to compete with all the giant Krogers, HEBs and Walmarts with their older and smaller stores. And ultimately, they would never consider buying the land to keep their store when they are going to have to compete with a giant new Walmart and Kroger. Fiesta is a small local chain that does not have the capital to upgrade the stores inside the loop to be able to compete with the oversized HEBs, Krogers and Walmarts. While Weingarten and the owner of the land in Montrose were ultimately the ones that sent Fiesta packing, the fact that new Krogers, Walmarts and HEBs were sprouting up around them made the decision to just close up shop a no brainer for Fiesta.

Oh, you poor thing! Little Fiesta is not a small local chain. It has 50 stores in Texas and almost 20 huge liquor stores. But, the kicker is that Fiesta is owned by Grocers Supply, the largest wholesale grocery supplier in the Southwest (according to Wikipedia).It did $3.2 Billion in business last year, making it the 5th biggest private company in Houston. If they really wanted to remain in the Heights, they could have purchased a lot further south on Studewood...right across the street from their warehouse. But, they didn't, so Kroger did.

The reality is likely that since the Heights demographic is changing away from Fiesta's target demographic, and business has been slow at that location, they decided to direct their efforts elsewhere. The Heights Census block is the only one in Houston to not only not grow in hispanic population, but to actually grow in Anglo population. There are better , more profitable locations for Fiesta.

EDIT: Great minds think alike. I see JJxvi was posting the same thing while I was typing.

Edited January 14, 2013 by RedScare

[west20th]

, the fact is that Fiesta on 14th is gone (no coincidence--why would Fiesta stick around to try to compete with Walmart).

The Fiesta on 14th is gone because Weingarten had a more profitable use for that property. Usually the simplest explanation is the correct one.

[samagon]

Don't count your traffic chickens before they have hatched. Walmart has only been open for less than three months. The rest of the development only has about a quarter of the pads open

That's close to disingenuous. Including Walmart, what's the percentage of total square footage vs leased?

[RedScare]

That's close to disingenuous. Including Walmart, what's the percentage of total square footage vs leased?

Actually, it is completely disingenuous. Recall that this poster has railed early and often at Walmart and Ainbinder for building a "suburban style" development. What he, and RUDH, proposed instead was a "mixed use" development, which would involve even more square footage of retail, with thousands of apartments sitting atop the retail. While the few thousand residents may be able to walk to the stores below, traffic from surrounding neighborhoods would still clog the streets. Added to that traffic of course, would be the residents of the apartments who would drive to work elsewhere.

And, he didn't stop there. In this thread...

http://www.houstonar...ariance-notice/

...he expresses his preference for more mixed use, with hundreds of apartments atop a retail ground floor. Again, this would draw more traffic to Yale Street, a consequence he claims to abhor. Either he is using imagined traffic nightmares in his argument (still) against the already completed Walmart,while simultaneously ignoring his own proposed traffic armageddon, or he really isn't that concerned about traffic on a four lane thoroughfare at all. My guess is that he, like I, isn't that worried about traffic on Yale.

Edited January 15, 2013 by RedScare

[fwki]

The general traffic pattern in the Heights changed due to population shifts, not business locations, and of course the obvious infrastructure changes. Ten years ago and earlier, we had a sleepy little neighborhood that didn't even wake up until noon on weekends. During the week we had moderate traffic and some hustle and bustle, but on weekends my then-little kids owned the streets on bikes and skateboards, it was peaceful. Football and softball in the streets went barely interrupted. When I visited freinds in the burbs I noted the complete opposite pattern. Now the weekends are crazier than the weekdays with tourists driving about lost and newcomers excited to do their suburban thing shopping and going out for coffee and lunch. The Great Influx occurred when suburbia emptied its bowels into the Heights, and that's what changed the traffic, not business locations.

[SilverJK]

I thought this walmart was just to hurt target, and wasn't actually needed... but now it draws a huge crowd?

I know that none of us (Aside from MarkSMU, he risks it often) are bothered by the increase of traffic on Yale, because we are too afraid to risk our family's lives on the bridge of death.

[s3mh]

I thought this walmart was just to hurt target, and wasn't actually needed... but now it draws a huge crowd?

I have already admitted that, so far, I am surprised at how weak the crowds are at Walmart. I have scoped out the parking lot several times on weekends and evenings when it should be packed and have seen about the same number of cars I would see at Whole Foods or Kroger and generally less than I see at Target. But, as I also said previously, it has just been open for barely two months and few of the other pads are open. Things could change. But, if this is as much business as this Walmart is going to get, it will take over a decade for them to break even over the huge pile of money they paid for the land. Given the lukewarm response to the store so far and the extreme need for multifamily properties inside the loop, it is definitely fair to say that the 6 mil spent on this was money wasted and just went to help Walmart dillute Target's market share. I would not be surprised if Houstonians were referred to as "suckers" in Bentonville when discussing this Walmart and the tax deal.

[JJxvi]

Ainbender is in Bentonville?

[RedScare]

He never gives up, does he? And, he wonders why we mock him so.

[TGM]

I have already admitted that, so far, I am surprised at how weak the crowds are at Walmart. I have scoped out the parking lot several times on weekends and evenings when it should be packed and have seen about the same number of cars I would see at Whole Foods or Kroger and generally less than I see at Target.

Bollocks. I have a hard time believing that you are performing recon in the Wal-Mart parking lot. I will now have keep an eye out for a fellow with a pair of Bushnell bi-nocs parked way out in employee parking land.

My last visit to the Heights Wal-Mart had me waiting for a primo space up front for over 2 minutes while bubba searched for his lighter to light one up before backing out. On the way out the parking lot 3/4 full.

So much for tales of tumbleweeds blowing around at Heights Wal-Mart.

[fwki]

And at midnite on the last day of the month, it's packed with rescue dog parents who also have to pay for antiquities maintenance.

[RedScare]

You know, when you spend 2 years predicting gridlock and traffic armageddon, what do you say when it does not materialize? Well, you claim the crowds are weak, of course. The Walmart parking lot looks to be as full as any other. It's simply hard for some people to admit that their imagined traffic gridlock does not occur in real life. Now that the gridlock has not materialized at Walmart, the frightened masses have moved on to the condos off of White Oak and the apartments on Yale. They will be wrong there as well...and the City traffic engineers know this...but that will not stop the hue and cry.

[fwki]

Don't forget their favorite red herring:

The chicken little cries of bridge collapse armageddon are way overblown. Everyone knows that plastic crap from China doesn't weigh much. That's why it is so cheap. Those Walmart semis are not exceeding the weight limit because Chinese crap doesn't weigh enough. School buses with elementary school children on the other hand...

[Leonard]

The City approved a Traffic Impact Analysis for the development with "F" intersections - not sure what the City traffic engineers "know".

The Yale Street Bridge's extreme restrictions might have had an impact on the amount of traffic on Yale.

We, as citizens, should request that the City pay off Ainbiner via the installment plan in the 380. We will be able to request the amounts paid and can compare the acutal sales and property tax generated by the whole development to those projected instead of judging how well the Walmart is doing by how long someone is willing to wait for an up front space.

[samagon]

Bollocks. I have a hard time believing that you are performing recon in the Wal-Mart parking lot. I will now have keep an eye out for a fellow with a pair of Bushnell bi-nocs parked way out in employee parking land.

My last visit to the Heights Wal-Mart had me waiting for a primo space up front for over 2 minutes while bubba searched for his lighter to light one up before backing out. On the way out the parking lot 3/4 full.

So much for tales of tumbleweeds blowing around at Heights Wal-Mart.

I think it's a double blind.

The traffic problems and other issues that haven't materialized as the rudh had screamed about is bad. Now they can't say "see!!! traffic!!! murders!!! dead puppies!!!" so they and their cronies are being tricky. They know the heart of a man likes to shop somewhere that there isn't a lot of commotion, they can park a few steps away from the entrance, go in, grab their goods, stand in a short line and leave quickly. So they are trying to fulfill a prophecy. If you tell people the place is empty, more people will show up.

This should show you how desperate they are, that they are willing to watch their arch enemy succeed, just so they can try to score a smugness victory.

[RedScare]

The City approved a Traffic Impact Analysis for the development with "F" intersections - not sure what the City traffic engineers "know".

The Yale Street Bridge's extreme restrictions might have had an impact on the amount of traffic on Yale.

The traffic engineers approved the intersections, and no traffic problems occurred. I think that shows they know plenty. As for the Yale Bridge of Death restrictions, I seem to recall RUDH giddily posting photos showing that people were ignoring the restrictions. Therefore, it likely had no impact on traffic. Besides, if the restrictions DID have an impact, doesn't that show that the restrictions worked? Recalling that RUDH claimed that nothing short of cancelling the development would save us from traffic gridlock and dead children on school buses, today's reality shows that all of RUDH's claims were wrong. All of them.

[Leonard]

Some people are following the restrictions, some are not. Not sure why you think it would be all or nothing on this particular law. I think most people realize that some people follow laws and some don't. You'd think a defense attorney would be able to figure that one out.

[RedScare]

So, you are conceding that RUDH's ridiculously draconian solution of canceling the Ainbinder and Walmart development was unnecessary? Since your restrictions worked, everything is OK, right?

[fwki]

Walmart is following the restrictions but I have no idea how they keep stocking those shelves since we all know those trucks have no other route.