Turnberry Galleria Luxury High-Rise At 5048 Hidalgo St.

[TheNiche]

Also, is your quote a joke: "Vote for John McCain. You don't have to like him, respect him, or really have any expectation that he's going to be a good president (I certainly don't). The important thing is that he isn't a classist scumbag. He is not Barack Obama. And that is sufficient."

Maybe TheNiche isn't omniscient after all. Cue the flame war.

It is not a joke. I passionately dislike both candidates, but Obama's economic policy errors are aggregious; the long-term implications dwarf any other active policy discussions. If we're going to talk about this subject, though, lets do so in a more appropriate thread.

[AJB857]

I am not a marketing expert but I am an empty-nester living in River Oaks so I guess I'm part of the market they were targeting

Yet the print advertisement I saw for the project showed a hot 40's ish blonde covered in jewelry and elegant clothes. In other words, a second trophy wife

I'm pretty sure my wife and most of the first marriage empty nest wives in River Oaks and Tanglewood don't want to live in a building full of young second wives with their gym

suits and their jewelry. So I found the marketing approach to be inconsistent with the conventional wisdom as to the project's theoretical target market.

[JJVilla]

Without repeating the obvious (slowing economy, etc) I am not a suprise that this failed. I am not a marketing expert but it probably had something to do with their cheesy, stereotyipcal ads which didn't align with the fancy showroom and high-end clientel. Overall this project just didn't have it together for their high-end target.

With regard to the location comments or at least the one of it being on the "wrong side" of Westheimer - this is funny at best. I could agree with it (since I live north of the street nearby ) but think for this area it doesn't fit.

[sarahiki]

I think the real culprit is that the project had such a silly name. "Turnberry Tower." Who would want to live there? It sounds like a new kind of Captain Crunch cereal.

[jmancuso]

i'm just wondering what they are going to do with that sales center. the turnberry tower was over the top...$8 million dollar views of the southwest freeway, a mall and a parking garage?

[jc281]

i'm just wondering what they are going to do with that sales center. the turnberry tower was over the top...$8 million dollar views of the southwest freeway, a mall and a parking garage?

what else is there to see in Houston?

[TheNiche]

I am not a marketing expert but I am an empty-nester living in River Oaks so I guess I'm part of the market they were targeting

Yet the print advertisement I saw for the project showed a hot 40's ish blonde covered in jewelry and elegant clothes. In other words, a second trophy wife

I'm pretty sure my wife and most of the first marriage empty nest wives in River Oaks and Tanglewood don't want to live in a building full of young second wives with their gym suits and their jewelry. So I found the marketing approach to be inconsistent with the conventional wisdom as to the project's theoretical target market.

Highrise condominiums are inconsistent with reality, so the ads made sense. ...no, seriously! Mosaic targeted hip young professionals with their ads and drew in doctors wanting an urban pad to stay at during the week, empty nesters, and international buyers. The youngsters were nowhere to be found.

[AJB857]

Highrise condominiums are inconsistent with reality, so the ads made sense. ...no, seriously! Mosaic targeted hip young professionals with their ads and drew in doctors wanting an urban pad to stay at during the week, empty nesters, and international buyers. The youngsters were nowhere to be found.

Maybe that's why so many of them don't get built.

[Vertigo58]

I'm pretty sure my wife and most of the first marriage empty nest wives in River Oaks and Tanglewood don't want to live in a building full of young second wives with their gym

suits and their jewelry. So I found the marketing approach to be inconsistent with the conventional wisdom as to the project's theoretical target market.

All of this makes perfect sense. Midtown seems to be mostly focused on a "Friend's or Greg & Darma" crowd. The Galleria has historically been known to attract a Zsa Zsa Gabor type crowd, used to anyway.

Maybe they should have called this Faulty Towers and with a mostly British clientele. lol

PS, I want to take home that little model Travelguy mentioned as a souvenir too.

[Pumapayam]

That plot won't stay empty for long. Even with the crappy economy, the location is too good to pass on, and I bet they is already a developer waiting to snatch it up. Hopefully something grand will come out of it.

[TheNiche]

That plot won't stay empty for long. Even with the crappy economy, the location is too good to pass on, and I bet they is already a developer waiting to snatch it up. Hopefully something grand will come out of it.

Don't hold your breath.

[LTAWACS]

what else is there to see in Houston?

Nothing really. Maybe traffic.

Cookie cutter homes. But that's it.

Oh and check cashing places and strip centers too.

Don't forget oddities such as busts of presidents who's location escapes even the locals or are so out-of-the-way that they are a great inconvenience to reach and if you do happen to find them are extremely underwhelming.

"Heads of presidents... great"

[totheskies]

Hey, the way I see it losing Turnberry isn't great, but Houston was fortunate to get lots of fantastic projects off of the ground. I'll cry about this today, and console myself with OPP, Mosaic II, 2727, and the stuff on Allen Pkwy tomorrow.

[sevfiv]

HBJ article out:

Turnberry Ltd. confirmed this week that it no longer plans to build a 34-story luxury condo tower by the Galleria Mall that had been in the works for more than three years.

The 184 proposed condo units, priced from $1 million to more than $3.5 million, were to be located west of Post Oak Boulevard, between Hidalgo and W. Alabama.

Buyers were notified of the developer

[Vertigo58]

Glad we slammed down that chilled vino at the Open House event, at least that wasn't wasted.

Now we can start a topic on "What was to be, but never amounted to do, do"

Houston once again it's cry wolf...Rat's! and all we got was a rock.

[Pumapayam]

The sales center closed last week, and the developer has not decided what it will do with the property.

Sidewalk cafe. . . or massage parlor!

[houston-development]

That plot won't stay empty for long. Even with the crappy economy, the location is too good to pass on, and I bet they is already a developer waiting to snatch it up. Hopefully something grand will come out of it.

nothing is going to happen anytime soon, regardless of how "irreplaceable" a site may be. no developer wants to put up 30 - 40%, extremely tough underwriting, and take full recourse on a loan...

sad thing is that's best case if they can find one.

[KinkaidAlum]

HBJ article out:

Turnberry Ltd. confirmed this week that it no longer plans to build a 34-story luxury condo tower by the Galleria Mall that had been in the works for more than three years.

The 184 proposed condo units, priced from $1 million to more than $3.5 million, were to be located west of Post Oak Boulevard, between Hidalgo and W. Alabama.

http://www.bizjournals.com/houston/stories...63&ana=e_du

And this is why I disagree with the Niche. This project has been marketed for years... models in the Galleria, full sized replica model on-site, ads in Continental's magazine, the NY Times, etc...It's not like the Turnberry was announced two weeks before the markets blew up. In fact, sales efforts were underway when Houston was flying HIGH. $140+ oil prices and a booming local job market. The high end residential real estate market in Houston, especially in town, was flat out booming. When this didn't get off the ground in 2007, it was as good as D-E-A-D. Blaming the current credit crisis is a convenient way out for the FLOP that was the Turnberry Tower Galleria.

The simple fact is people aren't going to spend $1 million for a "starter unit" in Houston, especially in that location. Laugh all you want, but rich folks in Houston don't want to live next to an office park (Lakes on Post Oak) and share "public space" (the Water Wall) with everyone else. They also don't care about walking to Nordstrom's or The Fox Sports Grill. What they want is easy access to private clubs (ROCC, HCC, Houstonian) and privacy (gated/guard accessed, in-ground pools, manicured grounds).

[TheNiche]

And this is why I disagree with the Niche. This project has been marketed for years... models in the Galleria, full sized replica model on-site, ads in Continental's magazine, the NY Times, etc...It's not like the Turnberry was announced two weeks before the markets blew up. In fact, sales efforts were underway when Houston was flying HIGH. $140+ oil prices and a booming local job market. The high end residential real estate market in Houston, especially in town, was flat out booming. When this didn't get off the ground in 2007, it was as good as D-E-A-D. Blaming the current credit crisis is a convenient way out for the FLOP that was the Turnberry Tower Galleria.

The simple fact is people aren't going to spend $1 million for a "starter unit" in Houston, especially in that location. Laugh all you want, but rich folks in Houston don't want to live next to an office park (Lakes on Post Oak) and share "public space" (the Water Wall) with everyone else. They also don't care about walking to Nordstrom's or The Fox Sports Grill. What they want is easy access to private clubs (ROCC, HCC, Houstonian) and privacy (gated/guard accessed, in-ground pools, manicured grounds).

I don't think that we are in disagreement per se, although I've tried to provide a much more robust post mortem. Without being privy to Turnberry's general and project-specific financial situations, it is very difficult to say what was the straw that broke the camel's back or whether it had been good judgement on their part to keep the project as a going concern for as long as it was.

[houstonmacbro]

Maybe that's why so many of them don't get built.

I honestly think the price points are off. I mean, I guess there are people that can afford $300,000 plus 1 bedroom condos with enormous monthly maintenance fees, but honestly I don't know very many of them. I suspect this was a spec project that simply didn't pan out when the numbers were added up.

[TheNiche]

I honestly think the price points are off. I mean, I guess there are people that can afford $300,000 plus 1 bedroom condos with enormous monthly maintenance fees, but honestly I don't know very many of them. I suspect this was a spec project that simply didn't pan out when the numbers were added up.

Favorable exchange rates make highrise condos look very attractive to foreign buyers. But those have really backed off lately.

[Pumapayam]

The land is for sale now, anyone interested in buying?

There is no asking price attached to the property, but Creech says it will likely sell for $100 to $200 per square foot, or $13 million to $26 million. The site is most suitable for a residential property, retail space, office building or hotel, Creech says.

A multimillion-dollar model home and office space used to market Turnberry

[treblelino]

I am glad that ugly boxy building is cancelled. Just what Houston needs - another dull, cookie-cutter, beige box.

Turnberry Tower Residences at the Galleria has been cancelled. The Buyers have been notified and employees have been released. I believe this occurred on Wednesday, October 23rd.

[liammclaren]

I am glad that ugly boxy building is cancelled. Just what Houston needs - another dull, cookie-cutter, beige box.

Totally agree.

[sanman]

And this is why I disagree with the Niche. This project has been marketed for years... models in the Galleria, full sized replica model on-site, ads in Continental's magazine, the NY Times, etc...It's not like the Turnberry was announced two weeks before the markets blew up. In fact, sales efforts were underway when Houston was flying HIGH. $140+ oil prices and a booming local job market. The high end residential real estate market in Houston, especially in town, was flat out booming. When this didn't get off the ground in 2007, it was as good as D-E-A-D. Blaming the current credit crisis is a convenient way out for the FLOP that was the Turnberry Tower Galleria.

The simple fact is people aren't going to spend $1 million for a "starter unit" in Houston, especially in that location. Laugh all you want, but rich folks in Houston don't want to live next to an office park (Lakes on Post Oak) and share "public space" (the Water Wall) with everyone else. They also don't care about walking to Nordstrom's or The Fox Sports Grill. What they want is easy access to private clubs (ROCC, HCC, Houstonian) and privacy (gated/guard accessed, in-ground pools, manicured grounds).

At the end of the day - the location was the killer on this project. Period. AND - Turnberry obviously did not do their homework when drawing up the plans for the building. That location, at those prices, would NEVER have supported 182 or 184 units. Turnberry was not flexible in the Houston market, either, and insisted on delivering a decorator ready unit (no finished floors with primed rather than finished/painted walls) rather than a finished product. At those prices, in that location, the business model simply was not going to fly in this town and Turnberry was not nimble and did not adapt.

The buildings in this city that do well in the 7 figure market are those with fewer than 100 units in a more prestigious location. That is the formula that the Houston market has shown that it can and will support. Turnberry got way off into the deep water early on this deal and it simply could not stay afloat, regardless of the economic conditions.

Edited February 8, 2009 by sanman