Pumapayam Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Amazon Discussion GuidelinesHow feasable and useful would this be to HAIF forums.What if I find an inappropriate post, or one that detracts from the discussion?If you find a post that you feel is obscene, threatening, pornographic, another person's words, or otherwise violates Amazon.com's guidelines outlined here or in the Conditions of Use, please click "Report abuse" and submit the report.If you think that a post just doesn't help further the discussion, vote "No" on the right edge of the post. On the other hand, if you believe that a post, whether you agree with it or not, contributes well to a constructive conversation, you can vote "Yes" on the right edge of the post. When the customers voting on a post collectively don't think it adds to the discussion, the post may be hidden by default. You can still view these posts by clicking "Show post anyway."It would be a essentially a middle road between a moderator's complete removal of a post, such as what we have seen with digression or obsenity and one that is relevant and adds value to the discussion.I apologize to musicman, BryanS, and HtownWxboy up front, as they were the first ones for me to find examples for, I am just as guilty and have them too. Don't take is personally please as I hope this is a suggestion to improve the site and not offend anyone, including these 3, who contribute good content to the forum.So I focus on responses that don't get removed from threads, like:Random photos that try to be funny or sarcasticOne word that simply reaffirm the previous commentEmotion response like LOL.They simply add fluff to the topic, but not considered offensive or a digression.We have some threads that are padded so much that it is impossible to engage in the discussion, that if a rating system like Amazon was implemented we could minimize the responses to only the good ones.And if the moderator did not remove something that HAIF-ers think is useless, we can rate the post, and eventually it gets hidden rather than deleted to maintain the true evolution of the discussion. If someone is absolutely is curious to see the all of the posts, then they can click show and it will reveal them. Other than that, the rest of us can read the abridged version of the topic more effeciently.What do you all think, is it possible? Would anyone else want it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
memebag Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Would anyone else want it?No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crunchtastic Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 An emphatic no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marmer Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Looks like the answer to a question no one asked. Leave well enough alone, I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subdude Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Still, it is a valid point that posts should contribute to a discussion. Posting dross for the sake of posting or because you think it may be somehow humorous isn't considered good forum manners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Nein. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 This is called "meta-moderation" and is popular on some other web sites like Digg and Slashdot.I believe it is going to be a feature in the next big release of the forum software scheduled for 2008Q4.We have something similar right now. You can rate many discussion threads with one to five stars and your vote is aggregated with others. The feature is not active in this particular section, but should work on most of the rest of HAIF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumapayam Posted July 1, 2008 Author Share Posted July 1, 2008 I believe it is going to be a feature in the next big release of the forum software scheduled for 2008Q4.Just in time for spring cleaning. Should be interesting to see quality versus quantity of responses trend out thereafter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crunchtastic Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Just in time for spring cleaning. Should be interesting to see quality versus quantity of responses trend out thereafter.Yes, it will be interesting to see who in this community appoint themselves as Quality Police. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumapayam Posted July 1, 2008 Author Share Posted July 1, 2008 Yes, it will be interesting to see who in this community appoint themselves as Quality Police. It is more of a collective decision of several members. One member will not change the structure of the thread like a moderator could, but say 10 people who vote down a response could cause a response to be hidden. Regardless, a post would not be deleted, just hidden. Essentially no change if someone wants to read a bunch of " " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Yes, it will be interesting to see who in this community appoint themselves as Quality Police. Ooooh! Oooh! Me! Me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vertigo58 Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 I often wondered where the lol's and such started? From other sites I am sure. I only used it (rarely) to insure the person knows I am kidding and not be a smart azz. Not everyone is going to read everyones personal profiles so they do not know what kind of personality that person has. If you start to zap out and lol's, IMO, emiticon's, etc; heck whats left? Plain 24 hours arguments and become a sounding board like Chron. Personaly I would not complain at all. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skyphen Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Another no vote here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkieEric Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Another no vote here.Ditto... I hope the new feature is something that can be kept disabled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 I often wondered where the lol's and such started?America Online. And it's considered bad form to post only an emoticon, or "me, too!"Those of you who joined the internet after 1994ish should Google "The September That Never Ended" for a little history on how the internet went to Hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BryanS Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 The underlying assumption is that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumapayam Posted July 1, 2008 Author Share Posted July 1, 2008 I don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkieEric Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 You are missing a key point, the response won't be deleted, just hidden. If it is treated the same way as Amazon, you have the option to reveal them and continue reading as normal. Most of the ones that are hidden on Amazon I agree with. Many of them are caused by internet trolls that like to post to get a reaction from other users.People who flag posts because they don't agree with the subject probably should just avoid the topic and engage in another discussion if they can't add value to it without hiding someones good effort.If you agree with most of the hidden ones at Amazon, you must be reading them - then what's the point of all of this? I agree that this is most useful against trolls and spam, but those don't seem like much of a problem here at HAIF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BryanS Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 You are missing a key point, the response won't be deleted, just hidden. If it is treated the same way as Amazon, you have the option to reveal them and continue reading as normal. Most of the ones that are hidden on Amazon I agree with. Many of them are caused by internet trolls that like to post to get a reaction from other users.People who flag posts because they don't agree with the subject probably should just avoid the topic and engage in another discussion if they can't add value to it without hiding someones good effort.And that is what can happen, on here, especially with controversial topics, or even controversial people (or people you don't like) who post in non-controversial areas. Basically, it would become a popularity contest... and by your recent track record... you might find that all of your posts suddenly become "hidden"... and that would not be right. Everyone needs an equal voice and equal presentation of their view point. EDIT: equal presentation of their view point, regardless of its composition (one word, line, whatever). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumapayam Posted July 1, 2008 Author Share Posted July 1, 2008 Basically, it would become a popularity contest... and by your recent track record... you might find that all of your posts suddenly become "hidden"... and that would not be right. Everyone needs an equal voice and equal presentation of their view point. I truley enjoy a good debate with people, without someone on the opposite side of the issue, the thread would get stale. If someone hids all those, then the adjust thread looks like a one way argument. Those that look at the HAIF community as a popularity contest likely need to get out of the house more often. I do have people I click with very well on here and I don't worry about my posts getting flagged. It's very junior high if people abuse the system that way. If I am that important that users would seek out every post I create in an effort to hid them, I am flattered that I am worth the attention when they could be doing other things with their free time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Of course, if there are people you don't want to debate with, it's much easier to just set them to "ignore" than to vote down all of their posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 People who flag posts because they don't agree with the subject probably should just avoid the topic and engage in another discussion if they can't add value to it without hiding someones good effort.the issue is that one person may think it is good effort while the remainder of the board thinks otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 the issue is that one person may think it is good effort while the remainder of the board thinks otherwise.Isn't that called "the tyranny of the masses?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumapayam Posted July 1, 2008 Author Share Posted July 1, 2008 the issue is that one person may think it is good effort while the remainder of the board thinks otherwise.Good effort defined in the sense that it is remotely on topic, longer than a couple of words, and responds to another user's post or adds to the topic of discussion.It is more about the overall effort of the post, rather than the reaction from the post.People should take a stance, that does not mean the quality of the response is any less.But if someone simply replies, "No, Yes, Ditto, LOL", or something similar to what I mentioned in the first post with no other content, no offense, but it does not add value to the response, and acts more useful as a "topic bump" or a "post count" increase in my opinion and causes the thread to have fillers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
memebag Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Good effort defined in the sense that it is remotely on topic, longer than a couple of words, and responds to another user's post or adds to the topic of discussion.It is more about the overall effort of the post, rather than the reaction from the post.People should take a stance, that does not mean the quality of the response is any less.But if someone simply replies, "No, Yes, Ditto, LOL", or something similar to what I mentioned in the first post with no other content, no offense, but it does not add value to the response, and acts more useful as a "topic bump" or a "post count" increase in my opinion and causes the thread to have fillers.Would you have voted against Shakespeare? He's the one who said "...brevity is the soul of wit". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumapayam Posted July 1, 2008 Author Share Posted July 1, 2008 Would you have voted against Shakespeare? He's the one who said "...brevity is the soul of wit".Shakespeare is a quality writer, but only because he quotes "that a small phrase shows wit", does not mean we need a ton of silly one word/emotion/image zingers on HAIF.Shakespeare was before the creation of the forum trolls, topic bumper, and lazy post count worthy responders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricco67 Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Shakespeare is a quality writer, but only because he quotes "that a small phrase shows wit", does not mean we need a ton of silly one word/emotion/image zingers on HAIF.Shakespeare was before the creation of the forum trolls, topic bumper, and lazy post count worthy responders. Really? I always try not to respond if someone else makes makes a post that covers what I want to say or goes along with my general feelings on the subject. Otherwise, I give the occasional fluff post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 Good effort defined in the sense that it is remotely on topic, longer than a couple of words, and responds to another user's post or adds to the topic of discussion.It is more about the overall effort of the post, rather than the reaction from the post.Yes and no can be very effective answers in many instances. If you want long windedness, that's fine but it sure doesn't improve quality.People should take a stance, that does not mean the quality of the response is any less.But if someone simply replies, "No, Yes, Ditto, LOL", or something similar to what I mentioned in the first post with no other content, no offense, but it does not add value to the response, and acts more useful as a "topic bump" or a "post count" increase in my opinion and causes the thread to have fillers.So the numerous people in this thread who've replied no to your question aren't showing overall effort and add no value? IMO their response is VERY CLEAR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crunchtastic Posted July 1, 2008 Share Posted July 1, 2008 forum trolls, topic bumper, and lazy post count worthy responders.Maybe I filter a lot of posts without realizing it, but I just don't see trolls, topic bumps, emoticon abuse and the like as frequent problems on the HAIF. Considering that the internet sunk to its lowest common denominator years ago, I think the HAIF is a great example of a forum that hasn't needed to resort to voting people off the island to keep the level of discourse high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumapayam Posted July 1, 2008 Author Share Posted July 1, 2008 So the numerous people in this thread who've replied no to your question aren't showing overall effort and add no value? IMO their response is VERY CLEAR.You should provide something in addition to support your reason.Instead of "No" use "No, because. . . "That's being effective, the other way is not constructive, and rather lazy. It does not provide any support for the reason you took a stance on.I think the HAIF is a great example of a forum that hasn't needed to resort to voting people off the island to keep the level of discourse high.You still get a stray response every so often. Nothing is perfect, but for the most part HAIFer are high quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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