editor Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Today I replaced the standard HAIF logo with a "Have a Haify Christmas!" logo. I know it's a little early, but I really really like Christmas. People like me are the reason the radio stations change formats this time of year. I'll listen to every sappy song with a reindeer or an elf or Santa or whatever in it over and over and over again and not get bored. Even the Chipmunks. Even Elvis.So, a few hours after I put up the Christmas logo, I got a message of concern advising me that there are other people on the forum who may not observe Christmas. I'm aware of that. Because of the large number of people on the forum, statistically, there are probably half a dozen or more religions represented.And that was the reason for my seeming insensitivity: representation.I was in the post office yesterday and saw the poster with the new holiday stamps on it. There's a "Happy Hanukkah" stamp, and a "Kwanzaa" stamp, and even an "Eid Greetings" stamp. But no stamp that says "Merry Christmas." Upon closer inspection, there is a stamp labeled "Madonna and Child" with the word "Christmas" in very small letters in almost the same color as the stamp, so that it is almost blended out of existance. But the stamp on the poster wasn't labeled "Christmas." It was labeled "Madonna and Child."Why is that? Is there some reason we're not allowed to say "Christmas" anymore? Am I supposed to be ashamed of Christmas? The Postal Service is perfectly OK printing "Hanukkah" and "Eid" -- both of which are religious holidays. Why isn't my religious holiday represented anymore? Why have I been marginalized in the name of political correctness? Why can't we call the stamp what it is: "Merry Christmas?"My first instinct was to complain to the guy behind the desk. I told him that I know he doesn't make the policy, but I wanted to vent at him. I did, and he agreed. In fact, he even got a little angry about it, too. My second thought was to complain to my elected representatives. But they're too busy having lunch with Oprah Winfrey and Steven Speilberg rather than listening to people who are actually eligible to vote for them.So, this is my form of protest. It's far from balance, but it's what little I can do. I'm proud of Christmas. It's my favorite holiday. My government seems to think I should be ashamed of it and embrace a culture other than the one of which I am a part. I'm not interested. My culture has been celebrating Christmas for thousands of years, and I'm not going to let the Postal Service change that. If anyone is offended by the "Have a Haify Christmas" logo with the Christmas tree and Houston City Hall, I'm not worried. I have no problem with the guy two cubicles down who decorates for Kwanzaa. I have no problem with the guy two apartments down who decorates for Hanukkah. I accept them. And I expect to be accepted for decorating my web site for my favorite holiday. If you're offended, then send me an e-mail and I'll write back to you in January letting you know when it's safe to visit this web site again. If you think a 68-pixel high graphic is a threat to your sense of religion and well-being, then you have much deeper issues than I can explore here. If not, just enjoy it or gloss over it, or ignore it like I do with Eid, Kwanzaa, Ramadan, and Hanukkah. "Celebrate diversity" means celebrating ALL cultures. As I told the guy at the post office, "It's things like this that make people vote Republican." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Unlike you, I can't stand Christmas music. I also don't appreciate the stores starting it up on Nov. 1, so that they can further over-commercialize what, at one time, a long time ago, was a religious holiday. However, I respect your right to decorate your website the way you choose. IF it offended me, I know what day the decorations come down. I have two opinions about government and corporate Christmas displays...or lack thereof. The government is simple. It is none of the government's business and they shouldn't put them up...for ANY religion. WE are not a theocracy, and we should resist attempts by certain members of the majority religion to co-opt the government for their purposes. Now corporations, on the other hand, can do what they want. They are not a government. Their reluctance to put up Christmas displays is guided by their frantic attempts to please everyone and offend no one. I find this hilarious. It is the only part of Christmas I enjoy, watching the stores contort themselves into unrecognizable shapes in their insatiable quest for the dollar. The end result offends virtually everyone. Watching the threats of boycotts by Christian groups because Target banned Salvation Army kettles or someone else says "Happy Holidays" is priceless. Where is the boycott for turning the Birth of Christ into a capitalist free for all? So, esteemed editor, enjoy your Christmas tunes, and especially, your Christmas HAIF. I doubt anyone, of whatever religion, if any, is offended.....at least until HAIF becomes a democracy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProHouston Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I'd like to agree with the editor and vent a bit of my own. I noticed in this season's Lowe's "Holiday" mailer that the word "Christmas" was mentioned no where. This isn't new you say. I agree that many retailers and companies have been de-Christianizing things for the last several years, however what was odd about the Lowe's mailer is that it DID have sections for Kwanzaa and Hanukkah. What? Yep, Lowe's purposely removed the word "Christmas" from their ads but found it ok to include other religions. They went so far as to refer to Christmas trees as "Holiday Trees!" Who has ever heard of a Holiday Tree?Anyhow, there is my rant. I can reluctantly accept a generic "Holiday" mailer but when Christmas is removed and other religions added in? I'm boycotting for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted November 23, 2005 Author Share Posted November 23, 2005 The commercialization doesn't bother me. I think becasuse my mind sees it as two separate holidays.One is the Christmas with the religious significance and Advent calendars and church and such, and the other holiday is the one with Santa and presents and Rudolph and crackers and all that. I think my brain processes it as two holidays that just happen to be at the same time.And as for that Lowe's thing: yeah, that's exactly what I'm talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeebus Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Who cares if the word Christmas is there? This type of complaint is about as asinine as white people getting upset that they can't have white peoples' clubs & organizations. In a politically correct world, the majority will always be pushed to the brink of obscurity in an effort for minorities to feel included. Caucasian, Christianity, Conservative, Capitalism.. these are all weary words to minorities. Besides, if it takes visual cues of the word Christmas to remind you what holiday it is, then you're a.. I'll quickly digress. My opinion Editor? Tell the next complainer to get bent and go start his own Houston Architectural Forum to complain in. Oh, and City Hall is leaning a little too much to the left. Merry Christmas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevfiv Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 (edited) "christmas" in the mainstream is quite secular besides, who knows how many of the offended are actually C-E-O christians... Edited November 23, 2005 by sevfiv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmainguy Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 (edited) Today I replaced the standard HAIF logo with a "Have a Haify Christmas!" logo. I know it's a little early, but I really really like Christmas. People like me are the reason the radio stations change formats this time of year. I'll listen to every sappy song with a reindeer or an elf or Santa or whatever in it over and over and over again and not get bored. Even the Chipmunks. Even Elvis.So, a few hours after I put up the Christmas logo, I got a message of concern advising me that there are other people on the forum who may not observe Christmas. I'm aware of that. Because of the large number of people on the forum, statistically, there are probably half a dozen or more religions represented. And that was the reason for my seeming insensitivity: representation. I was in the post office yesterday and saw the poster with the new holiday stamps on it. There's a "Happy Hanukkah" stamp, and a "Kwanzaa" stamp, and even an "Eid Greetings" stamp. But no stamp that says "Merry Christmas." Upon closer inspection, there is a stamp labeled "Madonna and Child" with the word "Christmas" in very small letters in almost the same color as the stamp, so that it is almost blended out of existance. But the stamp on the poster wasn't labeled "Christmas." It was labeled "Madonna and Child." Why is that? Is there some reason we're not allowed to say "Christmas" anymore? Am I supposed to be ashamed of Christmas? The Postal Service is perfectly OK printing "Hanukkah" and "Eid" -- both of which are religious holidays. Why isn't my religious holiday represented anymore? Why have I been marginalized in the name of political correctness? Why can't we call the stamp what it is: "Merry Christmas?" My first instinct was to complain to the guy behind the desk. I told him that I know he doesn't make the policy, but I wanted to vent at him. I did, and he agreed. In fact, he even got a little angry about it, too. My second thought was to complain to my elected representatives. But they're too busy having lunch with Oprah Winfrey and Steven Speilberg rather than listening to people who are actually eligible to vote for them. So, this is my form of protest. It's far from balance, but it's what little I can do. I'm proud of Christmas. It's my favorite holiday. My government seems to think I should be ashamed of it and embrace a culture other than the one of which I am a part. I'm not interested. My culture has been celebrating Christmas for thousands of years, and I'm not going to let the Postal Service change that. If anyone is offended by the "Have a Haify Christmas" logo with the Christmas tree and Houston City Hall, I'm not worried. I have no problem with the guy two cubicles down who decorates for Kwanzaa. I have no problem with the guy two apartments down who decorates for Hanukkah. I accept them. And I expect to be accepted for decorating my web site for my favorite holiday. If you're offended, then send me an e-mail and I'll write back to you in January letting you know when it's safe to visit this web site again. If you think a 68-pixel high graphic is a threat to your sense of religion and well-being, then you have much deeper issues than I can explore here. If not, just enjoy it or gloss over it, or ignore it like I do with Eid, Kwanzaa, Ramadan, and Hanukkah. "Celebrate diversity" means celebrating ALL cultures. As I told the guy at the post office, "It's things like this that make people vote Republican." I like Christmas time. I like the songs. I like having all my nieces and nephews crawling all over me for the excessive amount of presents they know they are going to get. I like falling asleep in a stunned stupor on the floor by the tree after we have all opened presents, gorged on ham, turkey and everything else in sight. I like seeing the joy in the eyes of the grandparents as they sit back and watch all the kids and grandkids get into the spirit and into one another. It's the only time of the year I get to have ALL of my family around me. I revel in it. So editor, you go right on and have a Haify Christmas on me. My only dig would be-as usual-keep the government outta the way when it comes to my celebrations and I'll continue to pay my taxes like a good citizen...don't need any far right wing-nut politician to tell me where and when to pray and how to celebrate any season I see fit to observe. Edited November 23, 2005 by nmainguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montrose1100 Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 So? You run the site, its your practice, they can't deal with it? tuff... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 (edited) Truth be told, I was the one who PM'd editor to show concern for him and his site. I pointed out that he didn't include the "other" holidays, I could care less, if he had only represented "Festivus for the Rest of Us !", and had a banner with the decorative aluminum pole shining brightly, I still wouldn't have minded. I was just trying to prepare editor for all the snivelers that are so friggin PC. I love editor's explanation as too why. He is always one step ahead of the game. Just to clear the record, I had no "complaint" merely concern for any backlash editor might endure, but I will continue to stand behind him and his decisions on how to run his own site. I believe it to be one of the best things about the internet. Edited November 23, 2005 by TJones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidtownCoog Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Don't worry about the other religions.They can handle it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Looking at the US Postal Service website indicates that there are several "Holiday" stamps for sale.http://shop.usps.com/cgi-bin/vsbv/postal_s...Subject/HolidayThere is one each commemorating the religious holidays of the Birth of Jesus, EID and Kanzaa and Hanukkah, plus Four different non-religious American Christmas stamps, such as snowmen and Christmas tree ornaments.One stamp in honor of the religious celebration of each of the four major religions, plus FOUR secular Christmas stamps doesn't sound like anyone is embarrassed by Christmas to me. In fact, a stamp dedicated to the religious nature of Christmas, in addition to the secular versions sounds like an increased sensitivity to Christians who believe that Christmas has been over-commercialized.I suppose one can find an insult anywhere if one looks hard enough, though. Maybe there are not enough Christian stamps for the population. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subdude Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Good for you Editor. The whole idea that there is something offensive about saying "Christmas" instead of a generic "holidays" is something that bugs me. I have had a running argument about this with a friend for several years. She is one of those who is careful never to say "Christmas", on the reasoning that not everyone is Christian and might therefore find it offensive. The problem isn't just people being too sensitive, it is assuming that the world is full of other people who are overly sensitive and who will be offended at the mention of a religion-specific holiday. I'm not Jewish or Muslim, but I wouldn't be offended if someone wished me happy Yom Kippur or Ramadan, so I don't really think non-Christians are truly offended at the mention of Christmas. (Just to annoy my friend, I always go to the trouble of sending her a "Christmas" card, none of that "Happy Holidays" business ) One odd effect I've heard of this insistence on lumping "the holidays" together is that Hanukkah is a lot bigger deal than it traditionally was. Apparently at one point it was considered a minor Jewish festival, but now it gets a lot of publicity because of its proximity to Christmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 (edited) Subdude, I don't know about you, but I would probably get a chuckle out of it if someone did say "Happy Hanukah" to me. I wouldn't laugh in their face and correct them, I would just say thanks and move on, then when i got around the corner, I would giggle. Edited November 23, 2005 by TJones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 (edited) "One odd effect I've heard of this insistence on lumping "the holidays" together is that Hanukkah is a lot bigger deal than it traditionally was. Apparently at one point it was considered a minor Jewish festival, but now it gets a lot of publicity because of its proximity to Christmas." You're exactly right, Subdude. My office partner gets a kick out of the Hanukkah thing (he is Jewish). It is still a minor holiday to Jews. The same applies to the others. Rammadan is a far bigger event in Islam, and frankly, I don't know any African-Americans who celebrate the harvest much anymore. Come to think of it, the only complaints I ever hear are those who complain of companies and/or governments perverting the entire season, similar to those complaints posted here. And, it seems to me, the complaints should be directed to the ones who pervert the season, the retail companies. But, then again, they are just trying to boost sales by adding more celebrations, so I suppose we should ignore the things that don't apply to us, just as the Jews, Muslims and agnostics ignore those things that don't apply to them. Besides, Christmas as celebrated today is not even a religious holiday. I don't understand the uproar anyway. Maybe that's why I like Thanksgiving better. It is an American holiday declared by Abe Lincoln during the Civil War, and has no religious attachment, and has resisted attempts to expand it beyond the family feast that it is. Even the NFL refuses to capitalize on it by only allowing the Detroit Lions to play on that day, keeping the TV audience to a minimum. EDIT: Here's The Motley Fool's suggestion. http://www.fool.com/news/commentary/2005/c...ary05111813.htm Edited November 23, 2005 by RedScare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarthaG Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Editor, I appreciate your "Have a Haify Christmas!" logo. I'm also proud of your "rant" as I agree on all points. And I do care if the word Christmas is included. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTx Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I would comment too but Editor said all that needs to be said IMO!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UrbaNerd Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Amen, Editor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmancuso Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 i'm not that religious but i agree as well. haify christmas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonia Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 I love everything about Christmas and the holiday season! The family get togethers (well, until they drive me nuts!), the weather, the crazy holiday shopping, presents and decorations, food and celebrations, etc. etc.... Like every year, the law firm I work for has it's "holiday party" in December (this year it's on the 3rd). What irks me is that because we have a few JW's that work at the firm we are not able to decorate around the office or even call our Christmas party a Christmas party when in fact everyone knows that's exactly what it is. Obviously the JW's I work with know it's a Christmas party anyway - they never even show up for the event. I guess just because we are a law firm we have to be extra PC. I also don't understand why Christmas is the only holiday we at the firm don't really recognize. JW's do not celebrate any holiday or even their own birthday (that I know of - I'm not a JW so I am not sure) BUT our company has a costume contest every Halloween and we go to lunch and have a party with cake and ice cream on everyone's birthday. The funny part is the JW girls are usually first in line for cake and always looking for seconds!! Anyways, it sucks that Christmas always gets picked on.(and before anyone comments, no, I do not have anything against JW's or any other religious group. I am always willing to embrace different cultures and ethnic groups along with their principles, values and beliefs....blah blah blah.... Just let me hang my Christmas crap up damn it!!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmainguy Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 I love everything about Christmas and the holiday season! The family get togethers (well, until they drive me nuts!), the weather, the crazy holiday shopping, presents and decorations, food and celebrations, etc. etc.... Like every year, the law firm I work for has it's "holiday party" in December (this year it's on the 3rd). What irks me is that because we have a few JW's that work at the firm we are not able to decorate around the office or even call our Christmas party a Christmas party when in fact everyone knows that's exactly what it is. Obviously the JW's I work with know it's a Christmas party anyway - they never even show up for the event. I guess just because we are a law firm we have to be extra PC. I also don't understand why Christmas is the only holiday we at the firm don't really recognize. JW's do not celebrate any holiday or even their own birthday (that I know of - I'm not a JW so I am not sure) BUT our company has a costume contest every Halloween and we go to lunch and have a party with cake and ice cream on everyone's birthday. The funny part is the JW girls are usually first in line for cake and always looking for seconds!! Anyways, it sucks that Christmas always gets picked on. (and before anyone comments, no, I do not have anything against JW's or any other religious group. I am always willing to embrace different cultures and ethnic groups along with their principles, values and beliefs....blah blah blah.... Just let me hang my Christmas crap up damn it!!) OK...tell me I'm just stupid-but what is a JW? I know they apparently like cake-lots of it it seems... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bachanon Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 jehova's witness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarthaG Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 The firm I work for does not give Good Friday off because it is a "religious" holiday. Are they going to take away Christmas next? I once worked for a Jewish family. It was cool, we got off both the Christian and the Jewish holidays! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 OK...tell me I'm just stupid-but what is a JW? I know they apparently like cake-lots of it it seems... That is Boozehound code for Johnny Walker. You are either a Red label or Black label fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.A.S.O.N. Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 Haify Christmas ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted November 26, 2005 Author Share Posted November 26, 2005 Looking at the US Postal Service website indicates that there are several "Holiday" stamps for sale.http://shop.usps.com/cgi-bin/vsbv/postal_s...Subject/Holiday There is one each commemorating the religious holidays of the Birth of Jesus, EID and Kanzaa and Hanukkah, plus Four different non-religious American Christmas stamps, such as snowmen and Christmas tree ornaments. One stamp in honor of the religious celebration of each of the four major religions, plus FOUR secular Christmas stamps doesn't sound like anyone is embarrassed by Christmas to me. In fact, a stamp dedicated to the religious nature of Christmas, in addition to the secular versions sounds like an increased sensitivity to Christians who believe that Christmas has been over-commercialized. I suppose one can find an insult anywhere if one looks hard enough, though. Maybe there are not enough Christian stamps for the population. You are correct that the Postal Service web site shows three religious holidays, plus Kwanzaa. I checked the web site as soon as I got to work that day. My gripe is with the poster. A week later it looks like I went overboard over a poster, but maybe not. The firm I work for does not give Good Friday off because it is a "religious" holiday. Are they going to take away Christmas next? In my company neither Christmas Eve nor Christmas day are company holidays, and I have to work both. Other religious holidays from other religions are company holidays, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmainguy Posted November 26, 2005 Share Posted November 26, 2005 Wow...poor Sonia. Sounds like as far as holidays goes, she is totally out of luck. No Christmas, Thanksgiving, Easter, birthdays-unless it is someone else's birthday and involves ice cream and cake. It does appear, however they celebrate Disfellowshipping-a holiday for any day! Here's a quote from those party animal's website http://www.towerwatch.com/Witnesses/Belief...eir_beliefs.htm : "Jehovah’s Witnesses can be disfellowshipped for a number of rule violations: premarital or extramarital sex, using alcohol excessively, using tobacco products, celebrating Christmas, reciting the pledge of allegiance, lying, stealing, joining the military, speaking to a disfellowshipped Witness, reading religious material not published by the governing body, or running for political office just to name a few. Fellow members are then required to shun him/her completely, having no contact even if the disfellowshipped person is a family member." With the shining love of a crowd like this, don't you think maybe a few of you zealots are going a tad bit over board with your petty complaints about how and when to celebrate the pagen holidays of Christmas and Easter? BTW, I know for a fact, many of you celebrated Thanksgiving yesterday. I know who you are. I know where to find you. Prepare to be shunted!!!!...er, I mean "Disfellowshiped". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbigtex56 Posted November 26, 2005 Share Posted November 26, 2005 I, too, am disappointed that Christmas isn't represented by the current crop of holiday stamps. And that brings me to another point; where's the Feast of The Circumcision stamps when you need them?Happy New Year's doesn't cut it with me.**This was a joke. The Feast of The Circumcision is a Catholic holiday, celebrated on January 1st. When I said it doesn't 'cut' it with me, it's in reference to the act of circumcision, i.e., the cutting of the foreskin. Don't you wish you hadn't asked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted November 26, 2005 Share Posted November 26, 2005 You are correct that the Postal Service web site shows three religious holidays, plus Kwanzaa. I checked the web site as soon as I got to work that day. My gripe is with the poster. A week later it looks like I went overboard over a poster, but maybe not. I missed the part about your gripe being the poster, not the stamps. My bad. Obviously, that poster was advertising all of the USPS "religious" stamps, as opposed to the secular Christmas stamps (Frosty, Christmas trees, etc.) Nothing personal, but I still don't see a conspiracy here. "Madonna and Child" is a work of art, so defacing it with the word "Christmas" would not be appropriate. I DO understand that there are some people out there (not you) that have so forgotten what Christmas represents that they might have to be reminded. The hijacking of Christmas was by commercial interests, not PCers. If one is not offended by the crass commercialization of a religious holiday in the first place, I fail to see the uproar over those same commercial interests expanding their consumer base by trying to ruin other religious holidays, too. I delight in watching the annual parade of pundits demanding boycotts of retailers who have diminished the commercialization of Christmas by commercializing other religious holidays, too. The outrage! As for workplace Christmas displays, I can only say that it is a workplace, not a church. I understand if the argument is that Christmas has been so commercialized that it has lost all religious meaning, but by mentioning the Jehovah's Witnesses, clearly that was not the argument. To insist that a workplace throw a party that some employees are forced, because of their beliefs, not to attend, seems to be the height of selfishness...kind of like a party full of strippers would be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted November 26, 2005 Share Posted November 26, 2005 (edited) ...I think maybe the poster was just a bad printing, the stamp shows the word CHRISTMAS in very ledgable black ink. Don't let it ruin your Christmas editor. I think we're gonna be OK. Edited November 26, 2005 by TJones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted November 26, 2005 Author Share Posted November 26, 2005 Nothing personal, but I still don't see a conspiracy here. "Madonna and Child" is a work of art, so defacing it with the word "Christmas" would not be appropriate. I DO understand that there are some people out there (not you) that have so forgotten what Christmas represents that they might have to be reminded. The hijacking of Christmas was by commercial interests, not PCers. If one is not offended by the crass commercialization of a religious holiday in the first place, I fail to see the uproar over those same commercial interests expanding their consumer base by trying to ruin other religious holidays, too.While I agree that the season of Christmas has become very commericalized, I still maintain that it feels like a dual holiday to me -- one secular and one religious. As long as it's Santa Claus and not a baby Jesus piloting the sleigh filled with presents, I'm OK with it. Same with Easter. It's not Jesus bringing children candy and eggs, it's a rabbit. For me that's enough of a separation to make me comfortable. YMMV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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