Texasota Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 (edited) That would be terrible for pedestrians. Roundabouts aren't perfect (and obviously it would be more expensive) but it would be a much better balance. Edited October 30, 2020 by Texasota 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBTX Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 9 minutes ago, Texasota said: That would be terrible for pedestrians. That is something you have to consider. A lot of pedestrian and bike traffic in the area. And again, soon to be even more once Forth is complete (and presumably even more once The Mill is underway/finished). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronTiger Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 I didn't draw in pedestrian crosswalks in my little mockup, the idea was to "improve the intersection without completely throwing it out". If such an idea was under consideration, it would have some sort of additional crossings for the corner cut there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texasota Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 (edited) Those corner-cut slip lanes are inherently bad for pedestrians, exactly because they add unnecessary crossings and cars have little reason to slow down (or stop) through them. If we're trying to fix the intersection with minimal changes, then I would actually argue for filling in the slip lane. Pedestrian safety should be the primary consideration, as un-American as that may sound. Edited October 30, 2020 by Texasota 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLWM8609 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Here's my proposal. Fill in the slip lanes, get rid of the island in the middle for a traffic light and mount them at the corners with long mast arms, and realign/extend sidewalks as needed. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Ewert Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 I'd like to see more roundabouts if only because they are opportunities for public art/monuments, which Houston could always use more of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hindesky Posted October 31, 2020 Share Posted October 31, 2020 https://www.iihs.org/topics/roundabouts According IIHS roundabouts are safer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronTiger Posted October 31, 2020 Share Posted October 31, 2020 On 10/30/2020 at 2:35 PM, Texasota said: Those corner-cut slip lanes are inherently bad for pedestrians, exactly because they add unnecessary crossings and cars have little reason to slow down (or stop) through them. If we're trying to fix the intersection with minimal changes, then I would actually argue for filling in the slip lane. Pedestrian safety should be the primary consideration, as un-American as that may sound. Enh, I think that the "slip lanes are bad" rhetoric comes from the same "transit blogs" that hate private automobiles and work everything around that theory, even skewing data they don't like to promote their opinions. One thing to note about "pedestrian safety" in their world is that bicycles are never seen as a threat to pedestrians, despite the fact that a fast-moving road bicycle with considerable mass could injure someone, yet the only people who advocate for bicycle speed limits are governments with a seeming contempt for actual citizens, like Toronto. Besides, corner-cut slip lanes eliminate the idea that a car could not see a pedestrian waiting at the corner and cut them off in a right turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texasota Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 (edited) That argument would be a lot more convincing if people on bikes killed tens of thousands of people per year (like people in cars do). Besides, what would you set the bike speed limit at? How fast do you think people on road bikes are going? I would think maybe 18-25mph realistically which is slower than the car speed limit in most cases and definitely slower than how fast drivers are actually going. Slip lanes allow drivers to maintain speed. Even if they see someone crossing, if they're still going 30 mph they don't have time to stop. Overall I think the roundabout is the correct choice for this intersection though. It's just weird and big enough to benefit from it. Edited November 1, 2020 by Texasota 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samagon Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 (edited) On 11/1/2020 at 5:48 AM, Texasota said: That argument would be a lot more convincing if people on bikes killed tens of thousands of people per year (like people in cars do). Besides, what would you set the bike speed limit at? How fast do you think people on road bikes are going? I would think maybe 18-25mph realistically which is slower than the car speed limit in most cases and definitely slower than how fast drivers are actually going. Slip lanes allow drivers to maintain speed. Even if they see someone crossing, if they're still going 30 mph they don't have time to stop. Overall I think the roundabout is the correct choice for this intersection though. It's just weird and big enough to benefit from it. your average person is probably going to average 10mph, depending on wind direction and speed. in Houston, we don't have many hills, but we do have plenty of false flats, which can impact a rider as well. people who are riding for fitness are probably going to average around 15-18mph, depending on fitness level, of course, if they are riding in a group, that might be higher. in the near future where people have easy access to electric assist bikes that will enable them to go 20mph with as much effort as they have going 10mph, but they are still infinitely safer than a car going 20mph. anyway, as stated, roundabouts are safer. as a driver, you are forced to slow down, that is number 1 reason for being safer. there is no possible scenario where a driver is doing a left turn into oncoming traffic, so no chance for a head-on collision. you have to slow down, so does everyone else, which makes it safer too. even from a fuel saving standpoint, they are better, you don't have to sit waiting for an empty intersection, and only as someone comes on the cross street does the light change and they have to stop so you can go, does the light change. it's like some guy is sitting in a room watching and changes the lights at the least effective time. anyway, yeah, you get to save fuel as well as having a faster trip. other than the fact that a roundabout is a foreign idea, and change, I don't see why roundabouts are so vehemently opposed? I mean, Westheimer and Post Oak levels of traffic intersections will never merit a roundabout, but this intersection is perfect for it. Edited November 2, 2020 by samagon 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texasota Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Yeah, 25mph is definitely pushing it as a sustained speed on a bike, but if you use "bikes" to mean everything including electric bikes, scooters, etc, it seems like a reasonable top end to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samagon Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 in context, Iron Tiger said bicycle, so that's why I assumed when you said bike you were referencing bicycles. anyway, neither here nor there. the number of low cost (relative term) e-bikes, scooters, and mopeds that are starting to become available is astonishing (if you're ok with ordering online, rather than getting from a LBS). for Houston, with a fast growing network of safe bike lanes, add an electric assist bike to help keep from sweating too hard in the summer, the capacity is there for a shift. all that's really missing is a way to keep them from being such an easy target for thieves. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hindesky Posted November 22, 2020 Share Posted November 22, 2020 New paving from the roundabout to the Jensen St bridge is completed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaDolivin Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 wondering if anyone has an update on plans for a roundabout at this intersection? Those stoplights are horribly long and unnecessary for portions of the day. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcal Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 Last I heard was that they just needed funding. Maybe they were going to apply for H-GAC funds or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sapo2367 Posted September 17, 2021 Share Posted September 17, 2021 Presentation from this past January, has anyone heard anything more about this project? https://www.eastenddistrict.com/wp-content/uploads/2021-01-28-Navigation.pdf 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBTX Posted September 17, 2021 Share Posted September 17, 2021 I've seen crews come out and survey it on occasions. Many times, actually. But aside from that, I haven't heard/seen any updates. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I'm Not a Robot Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 Quote 30. ORDINANCE appropriating $117,002.15 out of Water & Sewer System Consolidated Construction Fund; approving and authorizing Advance Funding Agreement between City of Houston and TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION for Roundabout Construction at the intersection of Navigation Boulevard at Jensen Drive and Runnels Street; providing funding for CIP Cost Recovery relating to construction of facilities financed by the Water & Sewer System Consolidated Construction Fund - DISTRICT H - CISNEROS https://houstondaily.com/stories/619616637-city-of-houston-city-council-met-jan-25-26 Work has been done on the water system near the bayou on Jensen, I'm not sure if it's related to this but they are still doing work along Jensen. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBTX Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 I wonder if it's related to that water pipe leak that I keep reporting to 311 that leaves a constant river down Navigation, hence Water and Sewer fund. Eitherway, glad to see "for roundabout construction" in City docs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post hindesky Posted April 1, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted April 1, 2022 Get ready for the construction. Plan for delays and alternate routes. Architect/Plan Engineers- https://gaugeengineering.com 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naviguessor Posted April 1, 2022 Share Posted April 1, 2022 I already plan to be delayed when I use this intersection (daily). This is wonderful news. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBTX Posted April 1, 2022 Share Posted April 1, 2022 2 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sapo2367 Posted April 2, 2022 Share Posted April 2, 2022 Heyooooo :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samagon Posted April 4, 2022 Share Posted April 4, 2022 sweet. for some reason, I thought this was tied to the NHHIP, but this is going to be good news when it opens in a year or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I'm Not a Robot Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 A lot of work is being started at this intersection, probably in conjunction with the construction at The Mill. It's so strange to see all of this happening at once between the Mill, this intersection and East River. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXK Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 Can't wait for this to be done, hopefully this works as intended and we can get some more roundabouts at some of the other annoying/unsafe intersections out there. Looking at you, Main/Studewood/Cavalcade. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 11 hours ago, TXK said: Can't wait for this to be done, hopefully this works as intended and we can get some more roundabouts at some of the other annoying/unsafe intersections out there. Looking at you, Main/Studewood/Cavalcade. I was surprised to learn recently that there are more than 900 roundabouts in the United States. In the 70's i remember New Jersey had three massive ones all in a row on Route 23. They were maybe four or five lanes wide. Eventually they were replaced by full overpasses. But i always find it strange that people on the internet claim there are no roundabouts in America. I guess they never leave their mom's basements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texasota Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 people can be allowed some hyperbole. 900 across 50 states is not very many, especially considering they're more concentrated in some areas than others. Easy enough to go years between seeing them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EaDo Lou Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 According to the source below, there are approximately 8,800 roundabouts in USA, with about 396 of these in Texas. Florida has the most with 589. About 500 new roundabouts are built every year. https://roundabouts.kittelson.com/pdf/Rodegerdts - Status of Roundabouts in North America 2022.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hindesky Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 I know of 4 in the greater Houston area. 1. Main St. at Montrose Blvd. 2. Washington Ave. at Wescott St. 3. South side of the Washburn Tunnel. 4. North side of the Washburn Tunnel. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.