Uh Oh, this doesnt seem to be politically correct

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

Texas town OKs anti-immigration measures By ANABELLE GARAY, Associated Press Writer

FARMERS BRANCH, Texas - Leaders of this Dallas suburb unanimously approved tough new anti-immigration measures Monday evening, including one that makes English the official language.

In a series of 6-0 votes, the city council without discussion approved fines for landlords that deal with illegal immigrants, and decided to allow local authorities to screen suspects in police custody to see whether they are in the country illegally.

With the votes, the city became the first municipality in Texas to enact such strong anti-immigrant laws. Such ordinances have troubled many people in the state, where many Latino families can trace their roots to the era before statehood.

More than 50 municipalities nationwide have considered, passed or rejected similar laws.

In a packed room in City Hall, people clapped as the votes were tallied in favor of the measures. In a parking lot outside, hundreds of protesters against the rules waved U.S. flags and recited the Pledge of Allegiance in English before the votes were taken.

The vote came in a public meeting after council members emerged from an all-day closed meeting with the city attorney, in which they discussed the legal ramifications of the proposals. Opponents submitted an 80-signature petition to the mayor's office Monday.

"It's very much against the very fiber of this nation," said Mike Ghouse, a homebuilder with a group called Foundation for Pluralism.

Council member Bill Moses blamed what he called inadequate federal enforcement of immigration laws for forcing their vote.

"I'm just sorry that the federal government has put us in this position," he said.

Attorneys with the Mexican American Legal Defense and Educational Fund told city council members during a public meeting earlier Monday that the proposals could violate federal law.

The rules could force untrained business owners and landlords to evaluate a wide array of immigration documents to determine whether the person carrying them is legally in the country, said Marisol Perez, a staff attorney for the group.

"You're putting them in the shoes of an immigration officer," she said she told council members.

The local debate over illegal immigration began in August and spawned demonstrations by both sides........

more here http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061114/ap_on_...migration_texas

[gwilson]

The title of the article itself is journalistically dishonest.

It isn't an anti-immigration law, it is anti ILLEGAL immigration law. That makes all the difference in the world.

There seems to be a very deliberate logical disconnect between the terms. Any effort to slow down or stop ILLEGAL immigration or fix issues stemming from ILLEGAL immigration, is immediately renamed anti-immigration or racist. And this is both dishonest and moronic.

The majority of people who support his law are not anti-immigration. They are anti-ILLEGAL immigration. There is a HUGE difference. If you want to immigrate to the US, GREAT, but do it the right way, legally. That is not too much to ask.

[Heights2Bastrop]

"It's very much against the very fiber of this nation," said Mike Ghouse, a homebuilder with a group called Foundation for Pluralism.

Hmmmm, I wonder just how many plantation owners used that same argument regarding abolition before the Civil War?

[editor]

Remember that a few years ago a Texas town near the border made Spanish its official language and all municipal business must be conducted in Spanish.

Insteresting how only the people in Farmer's Branch are being painted as racists (not specifically in this article, but in others I read yesterday).

[DJ V Lawrence]

Remember that a few years ago a Texas town near the border made Spanish its official language and all municipal business must be conducted in Spanish.

Insteresting how only the people in Farmer's Branch are being painted as racists (not specifically in this article, but in others I read yesterday).

Of all places, why Farmer's Branch? Has illegal immigration affected that town more than any other town in Texas? If someone were illegally crossing the border, would the first place they'd wanna live at be Farmer's Branch?

And why would ANY town or city in America want to have any language be the official one (English or Spanish). Every language in the world is spoken in our country. I thought that was supposed to be one of the best things about being an American; being diverse.

Illegal immigration laws like punishing business owners who hire undocumented workers and not allowing the undocumented to purchase land isn't racist at all. But the language thing us pretty prejudice, yo. Farmer's Branch would not look like a racist town to me if the language ban were left out.

I hope our national government does something to ban towns or cities from having an official language, religion, race, etc. Everyone with the proper documentation should be allowed to live in any town in America while being an individual, yo.

[musicman]

Of all places, why Farmer's Branch? Has illegal immigration affected that town more than any other town in Texas? If someone were illegally crossing the border, would the first place they'd wanna live at be Farmer's Branch?

And why would ANY town or city in America want to have any language be the official one (English or Spanish). Every language in the world is spoken in our country. I thought that was supposed to be one of the best things about being an American; being diverse.

Illegal immigration laws like punishing business owners who hire undocumented workers and not allowing the undocumented to purchase land isn't racist at all. But the language thing us pretty prejudice, yo. Farmer's Branch would not look like a racist town to me if the language ban were left out.

I hope our national government does something to ban towns or cities from having an official language, religion, race, etc. Everyone with the proper documentation should be allowed to live in any town in America while being an individual, yo.

Why Farmer's Branch. don't laugh, they are actually somewhat progressive. They have actually refunded property taxes when they took too much in. what town/city would do that?

as for punishing business owners who hire undocumented workers, how is a business who only hires legals able to compete with one who hires illegals and doesn't pay taxes? seems like the illegal business would be at an advantage.

as for the English only, for business purposes, i respect that the town wants to document what language that business should be done in. They aren't saying you can't speak spanish, they are saying that business should be done in english. i don't like that elections here are held in english/spanish/vietnamese. it is just a matter of time when people will be wanting mandarin, etc. Many of the people who immigrated legally here are expected to learn some English during the naturalization process. i know quite a few naturalized citizens who agree that English should be spoken for business transactions. some people here aren't hired because they don't speak spanish and english. it is an advantage to speak two languages yes and many companies reward you with additional salary if both languages are spoken. i know the city of houston sure does. But punishment because you don't speak spanish? is that racist?

[RedScare]

some people here aren't hired because they don't speak spanish and english. it is an advantage to speak two languages yes and many companies reward you with additional salary if both languages are spoken. i know the city of houston sure does. But punishment because you don't speak spanish? is that racist?

Hmm, I don't know. Let's ask TheNiche. Hey, Niche, if I know TWICE as much as you, is it fair that I get paid more than you, or would it be racist to pay me based on my superior knowledge?

[Heights2Bastrop]

There is an aspect of this case that I see as definately racist. How can you go after illegals as well as their landlords, and let employers go unpunished, and even avoid being charged.

City Council members unanimously approved fines for landlords who rent to illegal immigrants, making English the city's official language and allowing local authorities to screen suspects in police custody to check their immigration status.

The council made the series of 6-0 votes without discussion Monday night and took comment from the public afterward. A proposal to penalize businesses that employ undocumented workers was not voted on during the meeting.

The first step in curbing illegal immigration is to cut off their source of income. But, nobody has the casabas to take that action.

[dbigtex56]

The first step in curbing illegal immigration is to cut off their source of income. But, nobody has the casabas to take that action.

No casabas?!

Have they all had mastectomies?

[Mark F. Barnes]

Dennis Miller said it best as he partially quoted Emma Lazarus:

"Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! Just for God's sake please sign the guest book on the way in." This great country was founded by immigrants, we can't just continue to keep allowing the influx of illegal aliens. The numbers are staggering, and that's just the ones we know about.

[musicman]

Hmm, I don't know. Let's ask TheNiche. Hey, Niche, if I know TWICE as much as you, is it fair that I get paid more than you, or would it be racist to pay me based on my superior knowledge?

play nice red....

[RedScare]

The title of the article itself is journalistically dishonest.

It isn't an anti-immigration law, it is anti ILLEGAL immigration law. That makes all the difference in the world.

There seems to be a very deliberate logical disconnect between the terms. Any effort to slow down or stop ILLEGAL immigration or fix issues stemming from ILLEGAL immigration, is immediately renamed anti-immigration or racist. And this is both dishonest and moronic.

The majority of people who support his law are not anti-immigration. They are anti-ILLEGAL immigration. There is a HUGE difference. If you want to immigrate to the US, GREAT, but do it the right way, legally. That is not too much to ask.

Perhaps the reason there is disconnect is because there is no such legal term of "illegal immigration". In fact, many of the immigrants that Farmer's Branch intends to kick out may not be "illegal" at all. It is not a crime to be in the US without documentation. It is illegal to ENTER without documentation. Does Farmer's Branch intend to do the necessary investigation to prove the difference? Have they even defined "illegal", which means nothing, legally? (Ironic, I know.)

And, why is Farmer's Branch giving a free pass to "illegal employers"? Why do the restaurant owners, home builders, landscapers and others not get penalized as co-conspirators? Aren't these cretins just as un-American, or un-Farmer's Branchian as the undocumented workers they employ? What part of ILLEGAL do they not understand?

The answer to the question of whether this ordinance and town is racist can be found in the answer to those last questions.

[Heights2Bastrop]

And, why is Farmer's Branch giving a free pass to "illegal employers"? Why do the restaurant owners, home builders, landscapers and others not get penalized as co-conspirators? Aren't these cretins just as un-American, or un-Farmer's Branchian as the undocumented workers they employ? What part of ILLEGAL do they not understand?

Actually, Red, the employers don't get off Scott Free. The city issues every one of them both a wink and a nod.

That'll show 'em!

[musicman]

Does Farmer's Branch intend to do the necessary investigation to prove the difference? Have they even defined "illegal", which means nothing, legally? (Ironic, I know.)

And, why is Farmer's Branch giving a free pass to "illegal employers"? Why do the restaurant owners, home builders, landscapers and others not get penalized as co-conspirators? Aren't these cretins just as un-American, or un-Farmer's Branchian as the undocumented workers they employ? What part of ILLEGAL do they not understand?

The answer to the question of whether this ordinance and town is racist can be found in the answer to those last questions.

it is my understanding that yes they will investigate

from what i read, they ARE going after illegal employers as well as those who rent to the undocumented.

i'm not sure of their police force size but it should be interesting to say the least. i'm sure there won't be anymore property tax rebates.

[gwilson]

Of all places, why Farmer's Branch? Has illegal immigration affected that town more than any other town in Texas? If someone were illegally crossing the border, would the first place they'd wanna live at be Farmer's Branch?

And why would ANY town or city in America want to have any language be the official one (English or Spanish). Every language in the world is spoken in our country. I thought that was supposed to be one of the best things about being an American; being diverse.

Illegal immigration laws like punishing business owners who hire undocumented workers and not allowing the undocumented to purchase land isn't racist at all. But the language thing us pretty prejudice, yo. Farmer's Branch would not look like a racist town to me if the language ban were left out.

I hope our national government does something to ban towns or cities from having an official language, religion, race, etc. Everyone with the proper documentation should be allowed to live in any town in America while being an individual, yo.

Since when has language had anything to do with race? Is the fact that to move to Mexico, I'd better learn Spanish racist? No. It is common sense.

[musicman]

Since when has language had anything to do with race? Is the fact that to move to Mexico, I'd better learn Spanish racist? No. It is common sense.

speaking of common sense, you can move to Mexico and not be able to buy a house....but an illegal can come here and buy one.

[gwilson]

There is an aspect of this case that I see as definately racist. How can you go after illegals as well as their landlords, and let employers go unpunished, and even avoid being charged.

The first step in curbing illegal immigration is to cut off their source of income. But, nobody has the casabas to take that action.

It doesn't surprise me that this was left out considering the tone of the article, but it has been made illegal to deal with illegals at all, including employers.

And even if it weren't, that wouldn't be racist. Allowing landlords to rent to LEGAL hispanic aliens, but not to ILLEGAL hispanic aliens does not have a single racial implication.

[Parrothead]

The title of the article itself is journalistically dishonest.

It isn't an anti-immigration law, it is anti ILLEGAL immigration law. That makes all the difference in the world.

There seems to be a very deliberate logical disconnect between the terms. Any effort to slow down or stop ILLEGAL immigration or fix issues stemming from ILLEGAL immigration, is immediately renamed anti-immigration or racist. And this is both dishonest and moronic.

The majority of people who support his law are not anti-immigration. They are anti-ILLEGAL immigration. There is a HUGE difference. If you want to immigrate to the US, GREAT, but do it the right way, legally. That is not too much to ask.

Agreed 100%.

Dennis Miller said it best as he partially quoted Emma Lazarus:

"Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! Just for God's sake please sign the guest book on the way in."

I love Dennis Miller.

[dbigtex56]

Yes, people who enter (and remain in) our country should do so legally. Having known a few people who have gone through the process, that's much more easily said than done. Imagine your worst Department of Public Safety experience multiplied by a thousand and dragging on for years. Imagine gambling your life savings and career on the whims of some faceless bureaucrat. Imagine being told that all of your affairs are in order, only to be told a couple of months later that they're not.

To negotiate the process takes extraordinary persistence and determination - and sometimes deception. In at least a couple of cases of which I'm personally familiar, sham marriages provided the only viable means to remain legally in this country. And these are people who have been working and paying taxes here for years.

The first step in any meaningful immigration reform would be a restructuring of the bureaucracy. But so long as the rich and powerful continue to exploit illegal aliens for profit, that's not going to happen anytime soon.

[RedScare]

It doesn't surprise me that this was left out considering the tone of the article, but it has been made illegal to deal with illegals at all, including employers.

You probably should reread the article. They specifically did NOT address ILLEGAL employers.

[musicman]

You probably should reread the article. They specifically did NOT address ILLEGAL employers.

that specific article did not but the program as a whole did address illegal employers from another one i saw.

my bad red

EDIT: the clause regarding illegal employers was removed from the vote.

[gwilson]

You probably should reread the article. They specifically did NOT address ILLEGAL employers.

I don't need to re read the article. I acknowledged the article left it out. To my knowledge from various other sources, there is action against employers and users of illegal labor as well.

[dbigtex56]

I don't need to re read the article. I acknowledged the article left it out. To my knowledge from various other sources, there is action against employers and users of illegal labor as well.

"A proposal to penalize businesses that employ undocumented workers was not voted on during the meeting."

To clarify 'they', city council tabled that part of the proposal. It was addressed in the article.

[Mark F. Barnes]

[RedScare]

that specific article did not but the program as a whole did address illegal employers from another one i saw.

my bad red

EDIT: the clause regarding illegal employers was removed.

To be fair, the Dallas Morning News stated that while the employer sanctions were removed, they are being studied for possible implementation in the future. My guess is that city council was trying to decide just how many lawsuits they could defend at one time.

Also, a closer reading (again, in the DMN) of the article states that the tennant must show proof of citizenship or residency. I seem to have misplaced my official proof of citizenship of The Republic of America. Any of you guys got one?

[DJ V Lawrence]

Since when has language had anything to do with race? Is the fact that to move to Mexico, I'd better learn Spanish racist? No. It is common sense.

You don't have to know the language to live in a foriegn country to live there or make a deal. How does restricting all languages but one not restrict other cultures but one? Why should people not be allowed to use other languages for business or comfort?

Not too far from my house, we have street signs in English and Manderin. Is that wrong? Or when another business establishment has a name that's of another language, is that offensive or anti-American? I can't ever imagine wanting to live in a city that had an official language.

[musicman]

I seem to have misplaced my official proof of citizenship of The Republic of America. Any of you guys got one?

i can think of at least 2 sources. What's your address again?

Why should people not be allowed to use other languages for business or comfort?

what if you didn't know the other language and as a result be let go from your job? is that ok?

[Mark F. Barnes]

To be fair, the Dallas Morning News stated that while the employer sanctions were removed, they are being studied for possible implementation in the future. My guess is that city council was trying to decide just how many lawsuits they could defend at one time.

Also, a closer reading (again, in the DMN) of the article states that the tennant must show proof of citizenship or residency. I seem to have misplaced my official proof of citizenship of The Republic of America. Any of you guys got one?

You may prove U.S. Citizenship with any one of the following:

1. U.S. Passport (mutilated, altered, or damaged passports are not acceptable as evidence of U.S. citizenship.)
   
2. Certified birth certificate issued by the city, county or state
   
3. Consular Report of Birth Abroad or Certification of Birth
   
4. Naturalization Certificate
   
5. Certificate of Citizenship
   

NOTE: A certified birth certificate has a registrar's raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar

[RedScare]

As more cities across the US rush to memorialize their xenophobia in law, we will continue to see an increase in articles like this one.

Decline in International Visitors Worries Travel Executives

Although global travel is on the rise, international travel to the U.S. is headed in the opposite direction.

That's bad news for airlines, hotels, restaurants, and others who depend upon foreign tourism.

A report from the London-based World Travel & Tourism Council (WTTC) shows worldwide travel up by 17 per cent over the past five years but travel to the U.S. down by 4 per cent over the same period. The reasons seem obvious:

[DJ V Lawrence]

what if you didn't know the other language and as a result be let go from your job? is that ok?

Can you clarify the question or give a senario example? I wanna make sure I understand for sure b4 I answer...