MAPQUEST names Houston hardest to navagate!

[desirous]

And I'm so sick of the media rehashing the "US 59 is also the Southwest Freeway/Eastex Freeway" crap every six months.

Exactly.

Besides, we're the only city that names its freeways INTUITIVELY. The Southwest Freeway goes... southwest! That must be intellectually challenging. The Katy Freeway goes to Katy, Gulf Freeway towards the Gulf, etc. Look at all the other cities; they name freeways after random people.

[ssullivan]

People who get lost in their own hometown/city should get out more often and see the world.

If you want to see places that are truly hard for visitors to navigate, get out of the US to Europe. Our name changing streets are nothing compared to those of places like London, most of our cities have some sort of grid system to their non-suburban areas, and street signs in the US usually exist and are placed in easy to read places, as opposed to being stuck up on buildings at some intersections, down near the ground at others, and sometimes in locations where you might have to turn around and look backwards over your shoulder to see them. That is if there are street signs at all.

I tend to agree. There is nothing more painful than trying to give a native Katy resident (or Woodlands, Sugarland, etc) directions to an out of the way restuarant in town. Typically the cell phone better be on, because these people get lost very very easily.

What's even better is when you hear these people gripe about not being able to navigate downtown. WTF? Unlike their suburban havens with streets that all look the same, have similar sounding names (every one including words like brook, cove, forest, branch, creek, grove, and lake), curve all over the place, have no grid system, and lots of dead ends, Houston's downtown is a breeze to get around. The streets are on a perfect grid, the one-way streets keep traffic flowing, and you just remember that every other block goes the opposite direction. It's not hard at all, but it seems to bring some surburbanites to the point of being paralyzed with fear if they have to deal with a very logical street system as opposed to a suburban system with no logic at all.

[Trophy Property]

People who get lost in their own hometown/city should get out more often and see the world.

If you want to see places that are truly hard for visitors to navigate, get out of the US to Europe.

I once spent 2 hours walking in circles (with a map in hand) in Seville Spain. Granted I had a few drinks with my tapas and it was dark out, but that town is total maze. I also spent some time in Morrocco and those old towns (Medinas) are crazy mazes. Lucklily I had a guide ($12 USD for 4 of us and all day.. Not bad).

Houston is cake walk compared to many European cities. I guess if you lived there though you would have it wired. Unless you were from Katy, France and then Paris would be a maze to you too.

[musicman]

Houston's downtown is a breeze to get around. The streets are on a perfect grid, the one-way streets keep traffic flowing, and you just remember that every other block goes the opposite direction. It's not hard at all, but it seems to bring some surburbanites to the point of being paralyzed with fear if they have to deal with a very logical street system as opposed to a suburban system with no logic at all.

Well the closing of 3 blocks of Main for the rail station was dumb. My mom, who grew up downtown but rarely goes there now says that was the one street that was always the landmark in case she got lost. We went recently and was REALLY griping quite a bit. This street's closed or now this is TWO way? etc.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

Can you imagine being a first-time tourist to Houston with a rent-a-car and a place to go?

Yes. Even Ray Charles would be able to navigate Houston roads and highways with ease...........

[Trophy Property]

Yes. Even Ray Charles would be able to navigate Houston roads and highways with ease...........

OK, that is pushing it.

[musicman]

Yeah that joke doesn't quite work as well since he has passed. Guess Stevie Wonder will be our new token blind man.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

Pittsburgh makes any Texas city look like a piece of cake. You can't even use a map in Pittsburgh because you have no idea if the two streets cross. You could be high on the side of a cliff looking down at the road you wanted to connect to.

Also, the townships mess everything up. Everyone goes by townships but many maps don't even bother putting them on. Local signs tend to be only for cities so that doesn't help. Then many places have pittsburgh addresses but for whatever reason they're not in Pittsburgh. This makes even using a GPS a pain unless your GPS can search for addresses without cities like so do. In Houston or Dallas I can use a GPS to find anything perfectly, but in Pittsburgh there are so many streets clumped next to each other that often the GPS can't react fast enough. Texas cities tend to be laid out on a grid and this solves most of those problems but you can't have a grid when everyone lives on the side of a hill.

Jason

Pittsburgh is an example of an unplanned city. Theres only one way to get from one point to another. The twnships are a whole other story........I lived in Robinson TWP...going into the city from there was great, unless the Ft.Pitt tunnel was closed, then watch the hell out!!!!

[XLR8]

Houston is mostly a NSEW grid with the exception of downtown which is at a 45 degree angle. Simple to figure out.

We have the luxury of feeders along our freeways. Drive the freeways of most other cities and you will get frustrated when you see something you want to get to but just can't seem to figure out how to get there.

We are the progressive city. A good majority of what you want to go to is typically along the freeway feeders. Very efficient. A few other modern cities are starting to model our design.

[Heights2Bastrop]

Austin streets drive me crazy.

[editor]

I think a lot of people are missing a big point of the article. Everyone's jumping in pointing out how east Houston's freeways are to navigate. But I think a big point the article was trying to make isn't about the freeways, but about the hundreds (thousands?) of cul-de-sacs and other neighborhood roads that developers back against each other. Finding downtown from the Southwest Freeway isn't any great accomplishment. But I can't count the number of times I've been invited to a party in Sugar Land and had a hard time finding my way out on my own after dropping the directions somewhere.

[Heights2Bastrop]

On second thought, I nominate Bastrop as the worst place to navigate!

There is an area in Bastrop on the south side of Hyw 71 called Tahitian Village. Most of the subdivision is built on land full of washouts and ravines making many of the roads seem like being on a roller coaster. In fact, the main entrance, Tahitian Drive, can be downright frightening to some with its severe ups and downs.

The streets are laid out to conform to the landscape making the map of the area to resemble a bowl of spaghetti. The

[dp2]

Hey Heightst2Bastrop, nothing personal, but could you please tone down your signature line?

Most persons consider it rude to post in all caps online, the equivalent to shouting. A sig statement in giant red letters is even more abrupt and obnoxious, a huge scream every time you post. Sorta a text Tourette's Syndrome, but 100% preventable.

I think further upthread Jeebus gives a good example of using color in a sig to stand out without it being overwhelming. By slightly shrinking the font size he (she?) seem to strike a reasonable balance.

Thanks for your assistance regarding this. OBTW, I enjoyed your stories about the old Weingarten's store in another thread.

Edited May 20, 2006 by dp2

[Heights2Bastrop]

dp2, I hadn't really noticed it before, but I swear those letters weren't that large when I did that originally.

[TheNiche]

I almost get the sense that the title of this ranking should have been "Hardest Place to Code into Mapping Software".

I could very easily see how frustrated various GIS programmers could get over various oddities that are very common on a micro-level in the Houston area. Cul-de-sacs and name-changes are probably pretty easy, but keeping track and adding as many of them as there are is probably a pain in the ass for some computer techie. Can you imagine trying to program the system not to connect one of those odd cul-de-sacs that has part of it butting right up against an adjacent street? Its gotta suck.

So I think that this ranking system is probably a way for MapQuest's management to allow its programming staff to vent a little, if nothing else.

[Heights2Bastrop]

I believe it is easier to find an address on Bingle/Voss/Hillcroft than one on South Gessner/Gessner/North Gessner, especially when Key Map is so unclear which is which.

[dp2]

dp2, I hadn't really noticed it before, but I swear those letters weren't that large when I did that originally.

Yeah, sometimes odd technical things happen on these internet boards that I can never quite figure out, and my post ends up looking different than I intended. BTW, I hope you don't feel that I was trying to run off your signature, I was really just commenting on size. Thanks for responding.

[totheskies]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metrop...an/3871490.html

I guess I never thought of how difficult it was to navagate around Houston 'til I read this article. I can't think of anything that can be done about it now, but according to the article...

From the Chronicle:

Old cities such as New York were built on a grid system, explained Bob Abbott, vice president of production at Key Map.

But newer cities like Houston, with its hundreds of master-planned communities, are increasingly adding confusingly winding roads to create a sense of privacy.

Add to that quick growth, new streets and roads that change names multiple times, and Houston becomes harder to get around in than cities with geographically fixed borders.

Houston's grid is jumbled and inconsistent. In the Heights, streets are numbered, but without reason numbers turn to letters. In downtown, street names change without clear definition. Gray and Alabama turn into West Gray and West Alabama. East Gray is nowhere to be found.

Or try to explain why Elgin turns into Westheimer or the difference between the Southwest Freeway and U.S. 59, or the Gulf Freeway and Interstate 45.

Just curious, why do so many streets in Houston change their names in an area, like Westheimer/Elgin, etc.?

Haha, it's called nominative zoning. Lockwood goes through the Hispanic neighborhood (5th ward?), Elgin runs through 3rd ward, and Westheimer is for trendy stuff like Montrose, River Oaks, and the Galleria (you know, the important people)

[Captain Impossible]

I've been turned around enough times in Houston to say that yes, I agree. I honestly never get lost, and it's the only city in which I have ever actually been lost.

[TAK]

houston isn't hard to navigate, per se... there is just a LOT of Houston to navigate...

i agree - Boston is damn near impossible... i've been going to Boston once or twice a year for about 8 years, and i can still get lost in the city... the big dig really screwed that place up for several years...

iirc, DC was purposely designed to be difficult to navigate... success.

[Montrose1100]

Montrose Blvd. turns into Studemont.

[ssullivan]

iirc, DC was purposely designed to be difficult to navigate... success.

Am I the only person in the world who doesn't think this? I have always thought DC was very easy to figure out. It has one of the most logical street grids of any city, with lettered streets running west-east and numbered streets running north-south. The quadrant system (NW, NE, SE, SW) always lets you know what quadrant of the city you're in. The Capitol building sits at the "center" of the grid. The higher the letter of a street, the farther west of east of the Capitol you are; the higher the number of a street, the farther north or south of the Capitol you are. And the avenues run diagonally to string it all together. These basically radiate from the Capitol, White House, and several prominent squares or circles around the city.

Maybe I am in the minority, but I've always found it a rather easy city to find my way from one place to another.

Montrose Blvd. turns into Studemont.

Which then quickly becomes Studewood for some odd reason.

[KinkaidAlum]

In defense of Boston, the streets weren't laid out for car traffic. Much of the "road" footprint in Beacon Hill, North End, and Financial District were laid out in the late 1600s!

Boston is difficult to navigate by car. I've lived here 10 years and still get lost in the car. However, it is the most WALKABLE city in the U.S. It's a pleasure to explore on foot.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

However, it is the most WALKABLE city in the U.S. It's a pleasure to explore on foot.

very pleasurable by foot in the winter im sure..............

[DJ V Lawrence]

Here's my test on city navigation:

If you travel to a city for the first time ever, the more confused you are about how to get from point A to point B, the harder it is to navagate. Accurate?

--I've already been lost NUMEROUS times since coming back to Houston. I had to go from Downtown to Greenspoint (which was easy to me. Straight down 1-45N), but I got lost going to the INS center, then got lost again trying to find the post-office in Greenspoint, then got lost again going down the feeder on 1-45N 'cause traffic was jammed-packed on the freeway, and the feeder stopped at LEAST 3 times BEFORE getting downtown, then construction by downtown made it more funky before stumbling my way to Westheimer. Saw some badass lofts in that area though (I think Milam?)

--This past weekend, we got lost going to a house party in WaterSide Estates not too far from Richmond, Texas, and ended up at the END of HWY 99 past Katy at one point before having a Katy native escort us to the house.

--I also notice that Midtown is kinda difficult to navagate because of the inconsistant one-way roads there. Downtown also has a lot on one-way roads, but there's many signs on the roads that point out where major locations are. I had to go to a meeting at Toyota Center last week, and noticed it was VERY easy to get to through Downtown's streets.

I haven't tried Metro yet, but to anyone here that uses it, do they list their destinations by street name, neighborhood, or famous places here?

[sevfiv]

i must admit, i have gotten turned around on the southside (taking main st. south - which doesn't go due south i failed to remember ) because of diagonal streets

but - all roads i take somehow lead me to something recognizable.

i love getting lost in houston - it's the only way i find my way around!

and, i love one-way streets

Edited May 31, 2006 by sevfiv

[desirous]

very pleasurable by foot in the winter im sure..............

More pleasurable than in a car, no matter how cold it gets. Have you tried driving through that much snow and ice?

[ssullivan]

very pleasurable by foot in the winter im sure..............

It's no worse than walking around downtown Houston in July or August. At least in cold weather you can bundle up with a heavy coat, hat, scarf, and gloves, and the right shoes, and be pretty comfortable. In our summer heat and humidity, even if you walk around naked (which really isn't feasible anyway) you're still going to be drenched in sweat, and there's no relief from the heat except to get indoors.

[TAK]

Am I the only person in the world who doesn't think this? I have always thought DC was very easy to figure out. It has one of the most logical street grids of any city, with lettered streets running west-east and numbered streets running north-south. The quadrant system (NW, NE, SE, SW) always lets you know what quadrant of the city you're in. The Capitol building sits at the "center" of the grid. The higher the letter of a street, the farther west of east of the Capitol you are; the higher the number of a street, the farther north or south of the Capitol you are. And the avenues run diagonally to string it all together. These basically radiate from the Capitol, White House, and several prominent squares or circles around the city.

Maybe I am in the minority, but I've always found it a rather easy city to find my way from one place to another.

maybe it's because i come out of the metro station and have no idea where in the world i'm going from there....

dc isn't bad if you're walking/taking metro... it can tend to suck in a car...

downtown houston is much easier than downtown DC, because downtown houston is smaller than downtown dc... (i think of all of dc as 'downtown')

but i do believe dc was designed to be tricky... gotta protect the capital / capitol.

[ssullivan]

I haven't tried Metro yet, but to anyone here that uses it, do they list their destinations by street name, neighborhood, or famous places here?

If you're referring to MetroRail, about half the stations are identified by street name. The rest (Hermann Park/Rice U, Museum District, TMC Transit Center, Reliant Park, Memorial Hermann Hospital/Houston Zoo, Fannin South) are based off destinations near the station, or the neighborhood name.

For bus routes, they are almost all named after streets. However, the route maps/schedules you can download from the Metro website in PDF form do include major destinations along the route. The online route planner for the bus routes on the Metro website also has major destinations, including malls, schools, hospitals, and government buildings, which you can use as your origin or destination when planning a route. The automated announcement system on busses does call out some destinations such as hospitals and government buildings when you are at the stop that services those places.