Will San Antonio Take Place Over Dallas For Good.

[Guest OutOfTheRacesAndOntoTheTracks]

Like I said, can't we all just hate on California?

[sinatra]

WILL SAN ANTONIO TAKE PLACE OF BEING THE SECOND LARGEST CITY IN TEXAS

Well Dallas is still actually second today with now over 1,200,000 people but San Antonio still has over 1,140,000 people in their town. Dallas has a much larger metro area with Fort Worth and sized like Houston. San Antonio is sized like the cities of Austin, Kansas City, St Louis, Pittsburgh, and Jacksonville but not like others with urban population over million citizens.

Dallas is the financail cneter of Texas but beyond that it is not a pretty or interesting city. Ft Worth has more character and Dallas seems very plastic. Houston and San Antonio are diverse and very interesting cities to visit.

[ProHouston]

I wouldn't call San Antonio diverse, but it is a great city.

[sinatra]

I wouldn't call San Antonio diverse, but it is a great city.

San Antonio is a mix of German, Polish, ASian and Hispanics. San Antonio is diverse becasue of the many military base there and people from all over the world settleing there

[ProHouston]

I would say the demographic makeup of SA is approximately 55% hispanic, 35% white, 5% black, and 5% other. To me, 2 demographic groups above 5% is not diverse.

[Houstonian in Iraq]

San Antonio is a mix of German, Polish, ASian and Hispanics. San Antonio is diverse becasue of the many military base there and people from all over the world settleing there

Speaking for the Army base there, Ft. Sam Houston is tiny(compared to other bases). Most of what they do is train medical personal. After their training is done they move on to their next destination. Not as many perminent party personal to add to their population like other places. As for other branches, can't say what their presence there is.

San Antonio is A great neighbor to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there.

[NewMND]

Well the Air Force is the largest military presence in San Antonio, but I believe the Air Force is also the least diverse branch of the military.

[zaphod]

if you want diverse, go 200 miles north to fort hood/killeen area. with fort hood, you got people from everywhere constantly moving in and out of that town

[JDawgATX]

San Antonio is a mix of German, Polish, ASian and Hispanics. San Antonio is diverse becasue of the many military base there and people from all over the world settleing there

San Antonio is not that diverse. Austin is much more diverse ethnically than San Antonio. We have a larger Asian population than San Antonio. Our Middle Eastern and Indian Population is larger than SA's. What makes People from all over the world moving to San Antonio really have to do anything when the same can be said about Houston or Dallas, probably in greater numbers as well.

[Houstonian in Iraq]

if you want diverse, go 200 miles north to fort hood/killeen area. with fort hood, you got people from everywhere constantly moving in and out of that town

It's like that around many military towns. That is the general make up of the military. People from everywhere getting posted everywhere. Ft Hood is the largest Military installation so you see way more diversity.

[houstonfella]

San Antonio is a cultural wasteland.

[2112]

There may be a few Houston posters who enjoy pointing out Dallas' faults. Hell, even I enjoy pointing out the warts of a city that boasts that it is so much better than anything and everything else.

However, with the exception of banking214, EVERY Dallas area poster on this board seems to jump on the Dallas v. Houston bandwagon. So, if we're just going by percentages, you Dallas area guys got us beat. You seem to be much more wound up about it.

I also notice that most Houston posters only seem to bash the uppity FOS aspects of Dallas, not the regular people, and certainly not Ft Worth. There is a lot to be said for the notion that Houstonians do not bash Dallas so much as the assholes who live there.

Agreed. I know I wouldn

[Subdude]

Let's not start another Houston-Dallas thing here. It's already been beat to death. If you want to indulge in Houston vs Dallas wars, this isn't the right forum.

Sheessh..

[Mom22Blessings]

Well there would only be 2 ISDs I would ever consider putting my kids in. (And I graduated from one of them! NSISD and NEISD. The others are a total waste.

[Willy1]

Agreed. I know I wouldn

[Gary]

I agree that there are some two-way jabs between Dallas and Houston, although I don't know where the animosity started. The Dallas and FW rivalry has a historical basis that started in 1873 when a writer for the Dallas Daily Herald noted that FW was such a drousy town that he'd seen a panther sleeping in the streets. Yet another article in 1875 stated that "high water in the Trinity over-flowed... and drove out a panther, who wandered at his own sweet will during the night". FW was even given the monikier "Panther City" from that jab...

I still feel - just my opinion - that there are more anti-Dallas remarks made by Houstonians, than anti-Houston remarks made by Dallasites. In fact, I wrote a freelance article for Fort Worth Texas magazine that was inspired by an article in the Houston Chronicle. I was hired to write an article about why FW is better than Dallas. When they gave me the assignment they handed me a copy of the Houston Chronicle article and said, write something that is just as mean-spirited as this article... try to get a response from D Magazine. The HC article took all sorts of ruthless potshots at Dallas. FW Mag article was later watered down. Anyway, both articles were intended to pick a fight with D Magazine and Dallas in general. To my knowledge, Dallas never responded to FW or Houston. Although, the Dallas Morning News did name Houston as its person of the year last year for Houstons awesome response to Katrina.

Boy this really puts a damper on the the guys who say that FT Worth and Dallas are one in the same city.

[Subdude]

Boy, some people on this board are just determined to drag every topic back to Dallas vs Houston.

Try reading the posts above.

[RedScare]

I agree that there are some two-way jabs between Dallas and Houston, although I don't know where the animosity started. The Dallas and FW rivalry has a historical basis that started in 1873 when a writer for the Dallas Daily Herald noted that FW was such a drousy town that he'd seen a panther sleeping in the streets. Yet another article in 1875 stated that "high water in the Trinity over-flowed... and drove out a panther, who wandered at his own sweet will during the night". FW was even given the monikier "Panther City" from that jab...

I still feel - just my opinion - that there are more anti-Dallas remarks made by Houstonians, than anti-Houston remarks made by Dallasites. In fact, I wrote a freelance article for Fort Worth Texas magazine that was inspired by an article in the Houston Chronicle. I was hired to write an article about why FW is better than Dallas. When they gave me the assignment they handed me a copy of the Houston Chronicle article and said, write something that is just as mean-spirited as this article... try to get a response from D Magazine. The HC article took all sorts of ruthless potshots at Dallas. FW Mag article was later watered down. Anyway, both articles were intended to pick a fight with D Magazine and Dallas in general. To my knowledge, Dallas never responded to FW or Houston. Although, the Dallas Morning News did name Houston as its person of the year last year for Houstons awesome response to Katrina.

Anyway, I hear a lot of people say that Dallas "proclaims itself superior" to other places/cities... Yet, I have never actually heard anyone from Dallas make such remarks, nor have I actually ever read anything in print from a Dallas source that made such proclaimations - other than the ones against Dallas' age-old rival, FW. It always seems to me that this claim is made about Dallas by Dallas outsiders... I haven't heard Dallas govt. or people in Dallas for that matter ever really compare Dallas to other "superior" cities such as NYC or Chicago... I have read online posts by people in places like FW and Houston claiming that the reason they dislike Dallas is because of such Dallas-made claims. It just seems to me that there is a reputation of "being superior" that is projected on to Dallas and that it seems to be the main source of resentment from people in other places; like Houston and FW. Just out of curiosity, does anyone on this thread or forum have any quotes they can back this claim up with? And, I don't mean heresay remarks that you've overheard, or remarks made by other forum members or members of the Dallas Urban Forum... I'm talking about things published in papers or magazines, etc. Something other than "well one time in 2003 so-and-so in the Dallas urban forum said Houston is ugly". I'm looking for something that would actually substantiate the claim that Dallas actually does "self proclaim" itself as being better than Houston, slams Houston, or any other city... Not just forum bashing sessions because what happens in these forums isn't a true representation of what is happening city-wide in any of these cities....

I'll make you a sweet deal. You explain to me what this long-winded post has to do with the topic of this thread, and THEN I'll answer your question. Otherwise, I'll just chalk it up to another Dallasite obsessed with Houston.

[Willy1]

I'll make you a sweet deal. You explain to me what this long-winded post has to do with the topic of this thread, and THEN I'll answer your question. Otherwise, I'll just chalk it up to another Dallasite obsessed with Houston.

LOL.... First of all, I am not a Dallasite, so that blows your theory that I'm a "Dallasite obsessed with Houston"! I am a rare and nearly extinct breed - I actually like both cities! Secondly, I was responding to someone else's post which focused on the rivalry between Dallas v. Houston, not trying to turn the tide myself. But, you're right... none of this is really related to the topic of "Will San Antonio Take Place over Dallas for Good".

I was simply - and sincerely - interested in finding out what is behind the whole notion that "Dallas self-proclaims itself as a superior city". I hear Dallas being blamed for that a lot, but have never actually read or experienced anything firsthand to support that claim.

But, I totally appreciate you making false assumptions about me and blasting me for actually supporting some of my statements about why the FW/Dallas rivalry exists with actual facts, not just my own slanted personal opinions. And, since you feel I was long winded... I'm sorry that it took me more than one sentence to express myself clearly and that my post didn't include any personal attacks on other forum members. Heaven forbid anyone actually say something that is backed by fact in a public forum. Besides, since when did "staying on topic" start taking priority over Dallas-bashing in this forum? I thought that this entire site was dedicated to the sole purpose of pointing out all the faults with Dallas. My bad.

[RedScare]

Willy, I know where you are from. That doesn't change the fact that you are off topic, even if someone else started it. FWIW, Houston and Dallas have been economic rivals for over 100 years. It is only natural that citizens of one city would brag of its superiority over the other. Dallas' insistence in the early years of being an "East Coast city", more than a Texas city no doubt added to the rivalry, and is probably the start of its "superiority complex".

Now, back to the topic. San Antonio's ability to annex, versus Dallas' more or less set city limits, likely will make Dallas forever smaller in population. However, if Dallas' plans to redevelop its incorporated area bear fruit, then Dallas likely will continue to be the far more densely populated city.

[Willy1]

Willy, I know where you are from. That doesn't change the fact that you are off topic, even if someone else started it. FWIW, Houston and Dallas have been economic rivals for over 100 years. It is only natural that citizens of one city would brag of its superiority over the other. Dallas' insistence in the early years of being an "East Coast city", more than a Texas city no doubt added to the rivalry, and is probably the start of its "superiority complex".

Now, back to the topic. San Antonio's ability to annex, versus Dallas' more or less set city limits, likely will make Dallas forever smaller in population. However, if Dallas' plans to redevelop its incorporated area bear fruit, then Dallas likely will continue to be the far more densely populated city.

Thank you... a respectful reply to why Dallas is blamed for such self-proclaimations was what I was looking for. I didn't mean to sway off topic, but rather was merely following other posts down the line of conversation. I was unaware of Dallas saying it was an "east coast city more than a Texas", which makes absolutely NO sense to me. I do see where the economic rivalry could stem from since both cities have big historical oil-based economies that developed into much more - Dallas became a business/banking center, Houston has Nasa and the Johnson Space Center, etc. I get that.

Back to the topic as well... I think San Antonio will be the larger city for a while at least given current growth trends. Dallas, as you said, will always be the more densely populated city. I think Dallas will have to overhaul its city govt and school systems before massive populations growth will happen within Dallas City Limits again. The suburbs surrounding Dallas just are more attractive interms of schools and govt. when compared to the ridiculous chaos of Dallas City Hall and DISD. But, the jobs and businesses will remain in Dallas. Look at FW, even FW depends heavily on Dallas for jobs and business. As much as I love FW and the population boom that's going on here, it's got a long way to go to compete with Dallas on a business level. I predict that FW will be somewhat like San Jose. It will eventually outgrow Dallas the way San Jose has outgrown San Fran, but will never match Dallas when stepping on the business and job scales. Dallas and Houston will always be the state's heavy weights in those areas.

Happy 4th of July to the HAIF... Anyone want to discuss Dallas or Houston has bigger fireworks? LOL Just Kidding!

[RedScare]

One last response to the off-topic part before we go. I've never been able to find in writing the 'East Coast city' statement. It was explained to me while I lived in DFW. It was said in a matter of fact manner by someone who seemed well versed in Dallas history. But, I've never found it online, including a few minutes ago, when I was trying to back up what I've been told.

I can say this, though. The 'America's Team' years of the Dallas Cowboys is what turned me against the city.

Sorry to stay off-topic. Back to SA-Dallas.

[wakester]

Houston Texans : 19

Dallas Cowboys : 10

[ProHouston]

Forget SA over Dallas, that's old news! San Antonio has now surpassed San Diego.

San Antonio up to seventh on list of largest U.S. cities

[312]

San Antonio rocks.

[MexAmerican_Moose]

San Antonio is not as important as Dallas...so no, it will probably never take place over Dallas for good

[ProHouston]

San Antonio is not as important as Dallas...so no, it will probably never take place over Dallas for good

Not as important in what? The city of Dallas has nowhere left to grow while SA has decades of growth ahead of it. Not to mention that they keep gaining in jobs, corporations, and property values. I'd be looking in my rear view mirror if I was Dallas city govt.

[Trae]

I wouldn't. It won't catch up. Just look:

'Smart Growth' not yet part of S.A. landscape

Jennifer Hiller

Express-News Business Writer

There's \"Smart Growth\" and then there's San Antonio.

Smart Growth is the idealistic concept of walkable neighborhoods with easy access to public transportation. San Antonio, however, is where explosive suburban development is defined by gated communities, a lack of sidewalks and an abundance of cul-de-sacs that discourage pedestrian and bike traffic.

At the city's fifth annual Housing Summit, participants and audience members in a panel discussion about Smart Growth concepts seemed to love the ideas, even if they're difficult or impossible to put into action in the middle of housing-boom San Antonio.

\"People are just plowing into this town,\" said Monica Faulkenbery, assistant director of communications with Northside Independent School District, which will add 4,000 students this year and open four new schools.

With much of the home construction happening outside city limits and beyond the reach of zoning ordinances, Jesus Garza, city planning manager, said there's only so much San Antonio can control.

Most of the neighborhood plans the city does receive are \"cookie-cutter-like,\" Garza said, and designed so residents will have to rely on cars to get anywhere.

San Antonio's suburban developments average about 3.4 units per acre

[Montrose1100]

San Antonio will not own this spot on the population list for too long. While San Antonio is growing, it only annexed what land it could to gain numbers.

It seems like a Houston approach, But out motives are different. Houston annexes to not let the suburbs gain any bit of "Surperior" over the city, making Houston the focal point of the Houston-Galveston Metro. In a way, it would seem Houston didn't want what happened to Dallas. (Not insulting Dallas or its suburbs in anyway). But for instence, Many of Dallas' attractions/business centers can be found outside of the city limits.

While Dallas still has room to grow (particularly to the south), it may choose only to densify its center core. Something San Antonio will not achieve as easily. This results in awesome projects and major construction in Uptown Dallas, connecting the skylines to Downtown (The W Hotel, etc.). Dallas' population will continue to skyrocket as every Texas city. And if Dallas so chooses to annex any in the future, it could easily pass up San Antonio in a second.

To me, it seems San Antonio is trying to attain any glory they can for the time being, because what will be left to annex after the 1,880,000 metro they have? San Antonio is already the center of the metro... They can only grow so fast. I'm not sure on percentages, but isn't Dallas growing faster then San Antonio? At any rate, Dallas will surpass San Antonio again, but more then likely not till the next census in 2010.

[Montrose1100]

San Antonio may remain the larger city, but I think it safe to say that DFW will always be a larger metro area. Dallas is pretty much surrounded by suburbs, so its population cannot grow because of annexation--it can, however, become more densely populated.

I think San Antonio's biggest obstacle to growth is its limited water supply. The Edwards Aquifer can supply only so many people. Austin, with several nearby reservoirs, has a better water supply and is, in this respect, better positioned for growth. San Antonio has a better network of roads than Austin, however.

Well, I was trying to make that case in point .

So Dallas, (as said to San Francisco), since you cannot go out, its time to go up.