The Roger Clemens Implosion

[RedScare]

The age of consent is 18 in Florida.

794.05 Unlawful sexual activity with certain minors.--

(1) A person 24 years of age or older who engages in sexual activity with a person 16 or 17 years of age commits a felony of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084. As used in this section, "sexual activity" means oral, anal, or vaginal penetration by, or union with, the sexual organ of another; however, sexual activity does not include an act done for a bona fide medical purpose.

Regardless whether any sexual relations occurred prior to age 18, the creepiness factor of a 28 year old married father of 2, making millions as a star baseball player, waiting 2 and a half years for it to be "legal", cannot be discounted.

[Highway6]

Regardless whether any sexual relations occurred prior to age 18, the creepiness factor of a 28 year old married father of 2, making millions as a star baseball player, waiting 2 and a half years for it to be "legal", cannot be discounted.

Whats the statute of limitation on rape... even it were proved she was not of consenting age, it's been 18 yrs... is it too late for there to me criminal charges ?

[JLWM8609]

Lockmat and TJones....Pretty ridiculous, but It's good to hear Obama's Pastor tell the truth and it's funny to hear the whiteman (not all whitemen, but most of our culture) go into denial. How was Pastor Wright preaching hate, when he was simply telling the truth? The truth hurts..Just ask the Native Americans, funny how we don't hear about that and yet we celebrate Columbus Day and Abe Lincoln had slaves...what does that say? I hope that Mr. Wright continues to tell the truth for all of the non-whites out there...preach on!

Look here:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20j5iDfg_p8Part I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sjBu0jNIPEPart II

Father Pfleger doesn't have a problem with Rev. Wright, and he's GASP!!!!! white!!!

It's not truth for non-whites, it's Truth for all of God's children, like the old song says, red and yellow black and white, all precious in His sight.

Now, something that's on topic...

That "No We Don't" billboard would be hilarious. Just got to make sure that it's erected directly behind "Sir Wall's" billboard.

[musicman]

Perhaps she was willing to overlook the, uh, shortcomings that go along with steriod use.

it's always about the sausage with you isn't it? LOL

We are supposed to believe Rusty Hardin/Clemens/McCready that nothing inappropriate happened.

screw you rusty!

[TJones]

Lockmat and TJones....Pretty ridiculous, but It's good to hear Obama's Pastor tell the truth and it's funny to hear the whiteman (not all whitemen, but most of our culture) go into denial. How was Pastor Wright preaching hate, when he was simply telling the truth? The truth hurts..Just ask the Native Americans, funny how we don't hear about that and yet we celebrate Columbus Day and Abe Lincoln had slaves...what does that say? I hope that Mr. Wright continues to tell the truth for all of the non-whites out there...preach on!

If you really want to go there..........I guess you, as a whiteman fighting for the cause of your black brothers sowanome, you must now feel that Obama is a "sell out" and a "house (insert Nword here)" because even he thought Rev.Wright has lost his everlovin' mind, and denounced his sorry @$$ ! AMEN TO THAT !! Preach on Preach Onnnnnnnnnnn !!! Sorry to go off topic, but to be called out for ME telling the truth ? Well, that just will not do. Sowanome, try a little role reversal and have Joel Osteen, say the same speech inserting white for black and keeping the GD America part, and how long do you think it would take before Lakewood Church would go up on the auction block ? WAKE UP CHIEF ! Racism is a two way street.

I deny NOTHING, I call like I see it, and what MOST clear thinking people see but are afraid to say in order NOT to offend. If I am wrong, I apologize and hope we can all move on.

[houstonmacbro]

Lockmat and TJones....Pretty ridiculous, but It's good to hear Obama's Pastor tell the truth and it's funny to hear the whiteman (not all whitemen, but most of our culture) go into denial. How was Pastor Wright preaching hate, when he was simply telling the truth? The truth hurts..Just ask the Native Americans, funny how we don't hear about that and yet we celebrate Columbus Day and Abe Lincoln had slaves...what does that say? I hope that Mr. Wright continues to tell the truth for all of the non-whites out there...preach on!

Can I ask an indelicate question? Houston is a big melting pot and this board is a pretty big tent. But I have never heard (I don't think?) viewpoints from an American Indian or even an Asian perspective ... why is that?

Or are there posters on this board that are, but they just dont discuss issues related to their heritage, race, or ethnicity?

I'm not defending Roger. Obviously I wasn't there. But I heard that this singer as both a new CD coming out as well as a reality series.

Ah, the old reality show ... that will do it every time.

[lockmat]

even he thought Rev.Wright has lost his everlovin' mind, and denounced his sorry @$$ !

I think two things happened there. One, Obama is finally realizing the that Wright is killing his campaign so he's being PC (Wright even called that one), and two, Obama may have been a "member" of his church, but I bet he hardly even went anyway.

Who knows, but I'm almost for sure the former is true. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Obama believed those same things Wright preaches, but he can't say that if he's running for president. Heck, Wright is somewhat in line with his wife. To believe Obama is in the same boat is not a stretch.

[TJones]

I think two things happened there. One, Obama is finally realizing the that Wright is killing his campaign so he's being PC (Wright even called that one), and two, Obama may have been a "member" of his church, but I bet he hardly even went anyway.

Who knows, but I'm almost for sure the former is true. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Obama believed those same things Wright preaches, but he can't say that if he's running for president. Heck, Wright is somewhat in line with his wife. To believe Obama is in the same boat is not a stretch.

Lockmat, Obama had BOTH his children Baptised there, Obama is NO stranger to Rev. Wright or his church, at all.

Macbro, my friend, the term is Native American, there are alot of us on this forum who I am sure will claim they have 1/32 blood of some obscure tribe in BlackHills of N.Dakota. I myself have Choctaw and Creek blood, but nonetheless, I look like a pasty-faced, mostly Welsh, whiteboy. America's largest Pow-Wow was this past weekend in New Mexico. I was offered to go, but had a carshow that took priority for me.

Now, what I have noticed is a serious lack of Indian(hindi speaking peoples) and Middle-Eastern(farsi speaking peoples) on this board. We had a few at one time, perhaps we ran them off, i sure hope that isn't the case.

[sifuwong]

Let see here, A 28yr old guy befriends a 15yr old gal. Forget whether the sex happened later on at 18 or when she was 15. How many 28yr old guys go look and start a friendship with 15yr old females? If this isn't strange enough.

[BryanS]

Let see here, A 28yr old guy befriends a 15yr old gal. Forget whether the sex happened later on at 18 or when she was 15. How many 28yr old guys go look and start a friendship with 15yr old females? If this isn't strange enough.

I don't think it is any more strange than a 50 year old, going after a 25 year old, someone half his age. The desired end result is the same: to nail someone, half your age. Yea!!! Anyone in this triage (Hardin/Clemens/McCready) that claims no sex before 18 (and having to wait 2.5, 3 years)... I find that hard to believe. Kinda like driving 60 mph on the freeway... You can only do that for so long, and then it's time to get on with it, in the fast lane, 80+.

The FL statue does have some sensible "Romeo and Juliet" provisions; however... at age 28... what he did - or could have done (innocent until proven guilty) - statutory rape... Baseball just isn't what it used to be. Bonds. Clemens. I could go on.

[sifuwong]

I don't think it is any more strange than a 50 year old, going after a 25 year old, someone half his age. The desired end result is the same: to nail someone, half your age. Yea!!! Anyone in this triage (Hardin/Clemens/McCready) that claims no sex before 18 (and having to wait 2.5, 3 years)... I find that hard to believe. Kinda like driving 60 mph on the freeway... You can only do that for so long, and then it's time to get on with it, in the fast lane, 80+.

The FL statue does have some sensible "Romeo and Juliet" provisions; however... at age 28... what he did - or could have done (innocent until proven guilty) - statutory rape... Baseball just isn't what it used to be. Bonds. Clemens. I could go on.

You don't think there is any difference between a 28yr old/15yr old vs. 50yr old/25yr old? So what you're saying is that a 15yr old female has the same maturity level as a 25yr old for the most part... think about it again and let me know

[N Judah]

What nonsense. As long as he waited for her to get to statutory age, none of this is our business.

[RedScare]

What nonsense. As long as he waited for her to get to statutory age, none of this is our business.

Well, a guy that goes to great lengths to convince the public that he is a loving, dedicated family man probably does not get to complain when he is exposed as a fraud. Those who seek public's attention must take the bad with the good. He demanded the publicity, and he's getting it. Your claim that this is none of our business is faulty.

[CDeb]

Well, a guy that goes to great lengths to convince the public that he is a loving, dedicated family man probably does not get to complain when he is exposed as a fraud. Those who seek public's attention must take the bad with the good. He demanded the publicity, and he's getting it. Your claim that this is none of our business is faulty.

Exactly. The whole basis of his roids defense is how much of a "character guy" and "family man" he is.

He's the one who made his character an issue.

[TJones]

Now , our beloved Roger has been linked to John Daly's ex-wife. Apparently he arranged flights and tickets for her to come watch him play against, (and here is the irony) The Angels !

[N Judah]

If that really is his 'roids defense I guess I can understand the outrage. But if that is his defense, as you say it is, then I don't see how that is much of a defense.

[crunchtastic]

Now , our beloved Roger has been linked to John Daly's ex-wife. Apparently he arranged flights and tickets for her to come watch him play against, (and here is the irony) The Angels !

You mean John -For The Love of God Put Your Shirt Back On- Daly?

Boy, does she know how to pick'em.

[TJones]

I agree with John, he is definately in shape, a CIRCLE is definately a SHAPE !

[20thStDad]

Clemens is a complete idiot for wasting all of our time and his money on this. He is not going to prove or disprove anything. If he had just come out and said yes, it happened a couple times, I'm sorry, and then lied about how much it happened, they we'd all have moved on by now. I don't know who convinced him it was worth it to go this route, but they are an idiot.

[CDeb]

Clemens is a complete idiot for wasting all of our time and his money on this. He is not going to prove or disprove anything. If he had just come out and said yes, it happened a couple times, I'm sorry, and then lied about how much it happened, they we'd all have moved on by now. I don't know who convinced him it was worth it to go this route, but they are an idiot.

And even the accusations in the Mitchell Report don't paint him as a serial user of Bondsian magnitude. I remember that it was basically a few times a year over a few years.

[BryanS]

You don't think there is any difference between a 28yr old/15yr old vs. 50yr old/25yr old? So what you're saying is that a 15yr old female has the same maturity level as a 25yr old for the most part... think about it again and let me know

There's plenty of difference between those two age groups... There's a group of men out there, that like'm young (relative to a man's age), real young. It happens (the fact that she was 15 is not a bigger shocker to me). The bigger issue, as has been stated here, is that Roger, the family man, the all-American guy that has/can do no wrong, appears to be one of those rather creepy guys, chasing/nailing girls half his age, and not exactly what he, and his supporters, claim that he is... his case is a little more complicated because she was 15... maybe, in his mind, she was a "mature 15" ... or however it is rationalized...

[sifuwong]

There's plenty of difference between those two age groups... There's a group of men out there, that like'm young (relative to a man's age), real young. It happens (the fact that she was 15 is not a bigger shocker to me). The bigger issue, as has been stated here, is that Roger, the family man, the all-American guy that has/can do no wrong, appears to be one of those rather creepy guys, chasing/nailing girls half his age, and not exactly what he, and his supporters, claim that he is... his case is a little more complicated because she was 15... maybe, in his mind, she was a "mature 15" ... or however it is rationalized...

My point was that any 28yr old that wants to be friends with a 15yr old is just creepy. Doesn't matter if he had sex with her or not at that time. Yes, this was brought up probably by McNamee's camp to discredit Roger's character in order to have that defamation suit thrown out of court.

[TJones]

My point was that any 28yr old that wants to be friends with a 15yr old is just creepy. Doesn't matter if he had sex with her or not at that time. Yes, this was brought up probably by McNamee's camp to discredit Roger's character in order to have that defamation suit thrown out of court.

Sex or no sex, the question is..........What could 28 yr. old married father of 2 POSSIBLY have in common with a 15yr. old Karaoke singer in order for them to become fast friends ? I blame HER parents as being just as guilty for not acting on the red flags !!! Unless they are retards, are they retards ?

[crunchtastic]

Sex or no sex, the question is..........What could 28 yr. old married father of 2 POSSIBLY have in common with a 15yr. old Karaoke singer in order for them to become fast friends ? I blame HER parents as being just as guilty for not acting on the red flags !!! Unless they are retards, are they retards ?

What they have in common is that they were both attention-desperate, wanna-be celebrity entertainers. She just got an early start.

[TJones]

What they have in common is that they were both attention-desperate, wanna-be celebrity entertainers. She just got an early start.

by "celebrity entertainer", you mean entertaining Roger on his private jet ?

[N Judah]

And even the accusations in the Mitchell Report don't paint him as a serial user of Bondsian magnitude. I remember that it was basically a few times a year over a few years.

And those are just the accusations. Jose Canseco, who seems to know everything about this, even said he did not know Roger Clemens to use steroids.

[RedScare]

And those are just the accusations. Jose Canseco, who seems to know everything about this, even said he did not know Roger Clemens to use steroids.

Actually, if you look at what Canseco says about Clemens versus what has apparently been "proven" (I use the term very loosely), Canseco seems to be covering for Clemens....poorly. He swears Clemens was not at his house, yet Clemens' nanny, McNamee, and the kid with the photo all say he was there. There are a few other similar inconsistencies as well, and they only relate to Clemens.

Don't know why he would be covering for Clemens, but but Canseco's credibility when it comes to Clemens is shaky at best.

[sifuwong]

Just heard that he hooked up with John Daly's ex-wife and the wife of former wrestler "Brutus Beefcake" back in the day. The saga continues.

I can tell you that i personally have seen Roger back in late 80s and early 90s on a few occasions at Bayou Mamas and Ocean Club . He had lots of women hanging around him, so it doesn't surprise me a bit at all.

[20thStDad]

So I've come to the conclusion that it must be all about the hall of fame for him. Why else bother with it to this extent? He wants some exoneration, but since there are no official charges the defamation suit was his only means. I could be wrong, but assuming that's the case, do you think he would be better off if he had just confirmed what was in the Mitchell report (and conveniently claimed those were the ONLY times it ever happened), apologized, and moved on - would he have gotten in the hall of fame? Will he now? I think not.

[sifuwong]

So I've come to the conclusion that it must be all about the hall of fame for him. Why else bother with it to this extent? He wants some exoneration, but since there are no official charges the defamation suit was his only means. I could be wrong, but assuming that's the case, do you think he would be better off if he had just confirmed what was in the Mitchell report (and conveniently claimed those were the ONLY times it ever happened), apologized, and moved on - would he have gotten in the hall of fame? Will he now? I think not.

I think he would've still gotten into the Hall of fame. I believe he deserves to get in, though i would drop him down a tier...not in the same class as Nolan Ryan or Sandy Koufax, Steve Carlton, or Randy Johnson.