How can gays have children?

[Montrose1100]

since when does technology & world travel equal a better childhood? puma, you've lost it.

[Pumapayam]

since when does technology & world travel equal a better childhood? puma, you've lost it.

For technology, my parents would not get a decent computer until I was halfway through school, no internet, mind you technology is more important now than it was in the 90's. Most kids now have mobile phones, cars have GPS, kids hobbies can now include digital photography/videography. . .

And, I have never been overseas and experienced life in other countries. I would have loved to witness first hand and see foreign landmarks and experience other cultures. I have such a small sampling of the world and it was because the vacation we took, as fun as they were, were road trips from one state to the other.

[nmainguy]

since when does technology & world travel equal a better childhood? puma, you've lost it.

Technology and world travel betters a childhood as well as an adulthood. It offers up experience and knowledge that otherwise is limited in a parochial setting. Granted not everyone can afford the physical experience but everyone can experience the knowledge by way of books and other media if they so choose. Many times that leads to a better education thus leading to a better income thus leading to the ability to travel the world to advance your education.

[musicman]

having (2) men gives you more money to provide a better life and more opportunities for your kids than (2) women could. per puma

Yes, two men with more money can provide more opportunities and a better life than two women with lesser funds. Since it's not an exclusive idea, why do you and others argue the fact?

i think everyone agrees money helps. but to attempt to argue that money is the most important factor in raising a child is not sound. to do it from a sexist point doesn't help either.

[musicman]

For technology, my parents would not get a decent computer until I was halfway through school, no internet, mind you technology is more important now than it was in the 90's. Most kids now have mobile phones, cars have GPS, kids hobbies can now include digital photography/videography. . .

And, I have never been overseas and experienced life in other countries. I would have loved to witness first hand and see foreign landmarks and experience other cultures. I have such a small sampling of the world and it was because the vacation we took, as fun as they were, were road trips from one state to the other.

so you felt left out because you didn't have a cell phone, digi camera and their car didn't have GPS? i guess priorities are different for some of us.

you can experience many different cultures without leaving houston. i look at travel as a bonus, if it happens and i enjoy it great, otherwise, life is too short to feel like you weren't a priviliged child.

enrolling your children in music lessons provides more culture than a vacation would IMO.

[Pumapayam]

so you felt left out because you didn't have a cell phone, digi camera and their car didn't have GPS? i guess priorities are different for some of us.

Those were not around when I was a child growing up, I was refering to all the things now, and I am sure I am just scratching the surface.

And even still, a child would not feel left out, they would miss out.

to do it from a sexist point doesn't help either.

Then all of corporate america is, because the majority of the high income earners are men, why is that such an issue, it is the truth, sexist or not.

[nmainguy]

i think everyone agrees money helps. but to attempt to argue that money is the most important factor in raising a child is not sound. to do it from a sexist point doesn't help either.

You seeem to be the only one arguing about it. Puma merely stated a fact and didn't place a priority on it. You did.

[musicman]

You seeem to be the only one arguing about it. Puma merely stated a fact and didn't place a priority on it. You did.

it was the basis for his comments

[TJones]

You forget fast or you are trying to change directions and make up something I didn't even mention?

Let me bring you back. Only five posts down you said, 'That is his whole basis though webdude. Puma equates making more money, makes them a better parent.' As already pointed out with example post#43 , that is not what puma's stance is. Are you going to acknowledge you made that up or not?

Puma's post directly above the one of yours that I have quoted, shows exactly what Puma's point is, his point is Money will allow you to raise a better child. That is just not true. Case in point, Paris Hilton.

Music, it is futile to argue with these knuckleheads, they are gonna protect their own no matter if they are wrong or right. I don't know where webdude is going that I am "making stuff up." puma has written it numerous times in this thread, and webdude just keeps his blinders on. Oh well.

[webdude]

Puma's post directly above the one of yours that I have quoted, shows exactly what Puma's point is, his point is Money will allow you to raise a better child. That is just not true. Case in point, Paris Hilton.

Music, it is futile to argue with these knuckleheads, they are gonna protect their own no matter if they are wrong or right. I don't know where webdude is going that I am "making stuff up." puma has written it numerous times in this thread, and webdude just keeps his blinders on. Oh well.

pot calling the now kettle huh?

already pointed out what puma's stance is since post #43 and you still want to deny it?! The stance has always been money enables more opportunities, you are the one jumping the gun, assuming that providing more opportunities is the only factor or automatically makes a better parent and you still want to deny it! And now making up more of things puma never said 'money will allow you to raise a better child'? As stated many times, it provides more opportunities for a better life, does not automatically mean one will become a good child or good parent, so don't make the latter part up any more.

Don't get upset for getting caught.

[Pumapayam]

If money was not an issue, why do adoption agencies want to know your income. . .

The adoption process requires all adoption agencies to prepare families for adoption through education, training, a series of background checks and interviews. All prospective adoptive parents are required to attend training sessions where they learn about the effects of neglect, abuse and the life long impact that adoption may have on children. In addition, the parents are presented with parenting suggestions. Adoptive parents must complete the home study process. A certified adoption assessor who is employed by an agency will conduct face to face interviews with the parents. Documentation is also obtained about the general health, financial stability and background checks of the adoptive parents. All adoption agencies require prospective adoptive parents to provide this information prior to obtaining approval to adopt.

Quite dragging this one Musicman, even they require that parents have enough money. They think it is one of the factors (along with love, hugs, kisses, mushy stuff. . .etc.)

And Paris Hilton is a spoiled kid.

[nmainguy]

it was the basis for his comments

2 moms likely are more loving, but my be overprotective, but gay men are usually more affluent and can provide more for their kids.

That was his original statement. He merely stated some gay men CAN provide more. He didn't prioritize it. He also didn't offer it up as an absolute. How much more does it need to be dumb-downed for you to catch a hint?

[musicman]

If money was not an issue, why do adoption agencies want to know your income. . .

Quite dragging this one Musicman, even they require that parents have enough money. They think it is one of the factors (along with love, hugs, kisses, mushy stuff. . .etc.)

And Paris Hilton is a spoiled kid.

noone ever said that money wasn't important, just that it isn't the main factor in being a good parent. to say that two men would be better than two women BECAUSE "in general they made more money" is sexist IMO. if two women, or a m/f couple want to adopt, I say more power to them! IMO they are just as likely to be successful in raising the adoptive children than the 2 gay men would. because two people have more money doesn't mean they will be better parents.

[Pumapayam]

noone ever said that money wasn't important, just that it isn't the main factor in being a good parent. to say that two men would be better than two women BECAUSE "in general they made more money" is sexist IMO. if two women, or a m/f couple want to adopt, I say more power to them! IMO they are just as likely to be successful in raising the adoptive children than the 2 gay men would. because two people have more money doesn't mean they will be better parents.

All of them are good parents, (2) women, a man and woman, and (2) men.

I just combined the fact that "in general" men make for money than women, so if you have (2) men, compared to a man and a woman, and (2) woman, if love is equal among genders, (2) men have the advantage for providing all the needs for their kids. . .

I like repeating myself. . can you tell.

It makes sense and it is true.

[webdude]

it was the basis for his comments

No, it was the basis for your comments

[Parrothead]

or women. I think deceive might not be the best word. In some instances it is deception but probably not most. i know a lesbian couple who wanted children and they ended up getting together with a gay guy. they split and the guy now shares joint custody with one of the lesbians.

Yeah, that's not selfish at all. Hopefully that kid won't be too screwed up.

[musicman]

All of them are good parents, (2) women, a man and woman, and (2) men.

I just combined the fact that "in general" men make for money than women, so if you have (2) men, compared to a man and a woman, and (2) woman, if love is equal among genders, (2) men have the advantage for providing all the needs for their kids. . .

I like repeating myself. . can you tell.

It makes sense and it is true.

if raising children only comes down to money (which appears to be what you're narrowing it down to), i'll agree with you. IMO it doesn't.

[Pumapayam]

if raising children only comes down to money (which appears to be what you're narrowing it down to), i'll agree with you. IMO it doesn't.

Having money makes life easier, you can provide more for you kids, do more activities with your kids, have your kids do more activites on their own, heck, you can probably afford to spend more time with them.

Another stupid example, you could afford to buy 100% organic meats and fruits, most people just buy regular food that has been treated with pesticides.

There are lots of "little" things that can imrove the quality of life with more money.

[CDeb]

Another stupid example, you could afford to buy 100% organic meats and fruits, most people just buy regular food that has been treated with pesticides.

[Pumapayam]

I said it was dumb, but yet it is something that middle income people probably avoid. I heard that eventually we'd all get some sort of horrible cancer with all the pesticides, herbicides and hormones in our foods.

Eating organic is one thing we can do to improve our health.

To be a good parent you don't provide organic food for your kids, most of America does not eat 100% organic. But this would not be a non issue for a higher income family. Again, it is just a way of enchancing what a parent can do to improve the life of their kids.

So keep rolling your eyes.

[millennica]

Having money makes life easier, you can provide more for you kids, do more activities with your kids, have your kids do more activites on their own, heck, you can probably afford to spend more time with them.

Another stupid example, you could afford to buy 100% organic meats and fruits, most people just buy regular food that has been treated with pesticides.

There are lots of "little" things that can imrove the quality of life with more money.

You can do activities with your kids even without having money and it often the activities that don't cost anything--like having children make presents instead of purchasing them, making Halloween costumes instead of buying them ready-made, reading and recording children's stories for younger children, working together with them on a Habitat for Humanity house and many other things that develop their character and often end up being more meaningful for both the parent and children. Ditto with the produce, why not just plant a garden with children and grow vegetables organically. Not only can you grow vegetables without using pesticides, but it is also a wonderful activity to do with children. I am the mother of an adult son and many of the things we did together were low cost activities, partly because when he was born and growing up, my spouse I earned much less money than we currently earn. Had our earning power been what it is now back when we were raising our child, we might have been able to buy our child more things but I am not sure we would have given him a better, happier childhood. What we did give him were what children need: time, love, acceptance, support from family--nuclear and extended, encouragement, developing the dispositions necessary to help him navigate life. I am sure we were successful. In a card he sent us recently, he spoke about how his childhood really helped him not only develop into the man and spouse he is today, but helped him pursue and become successful in his career, which I think is what most parents want for their children. My fifteen cents' worth.

[Howard]

If I were gay the last thing I'd want is kids.

I'd be driving my Audi TT convertible with Scissor Sisters blasting on the radio, going to the gym every day, doing lots of shopping, dressing sharp and wiggin my butt off every weekend in the Monstrose.

A sterotype, I know, but if you're gonna be gay you might as well go for it! Why weigh yourself down with rug rats?

Be free! Be gai!

Gay guys have style. That Audi TT coupe is HAWT!

Cant say the same about a flannel wearing, Harley riding, pickup driving, gay lady. LOL

If you are going to be stereotypical.

[musicman]

You can do activities with your kids even without having money and it often the activities that don't cost anything--like having children make presents instead of purchasing them, making Halloween costumes instead of buying them ready-made, reading and recording children's stories for younger children, working together with them on a Habitat for Humanity house and many other things that develop their character and often end up being more meaningful for both the parent and children. Ditto with the produce, why not just plant a garden with children and grow vegetables organically. Not only can you grow vegetables without using pesticides, but it is also a wonderful activity to do with children. I am the mother of an adult son and many of the things we did together were low cost activities, partly because when he was born and growing up, my spouse I earned much less money than we currently earn. Had our earning power been what it is now back when we were raising our child, we might have been able to buy our child more things but I am not sure we would have given him a better, happier childhood. What we did give him were what children need: time, love, acceptance, support from family--nuclear and extended, encouragement, developing the dispositions necessary to help him navigate life. I am sure we were successful. In a card he sent us recently, he spoke about how his childhood really helped him not only develop into the man and spouse he is today, but helped him pursue and become successful in his career, which I think is what most parents want for their children. My fifteen cents' worth.

My hat's off to you millennica!

[MidtownCoog]

Looks like the gay maifa has started to delete replies to this thread.

[Subdude]

I'm sure everyone realizes derogatory terms don't belong on HAIF. We're trying to run a classy joint here!

[MidtownCoog]

you know it was FUNNY!

[Pumapayam]

You can do activities with your kids even without having money and it often the activities that don't cost anything--like having children make presents instead of purchasing them, making Halloween costumes instead of buying them ready-made, reading and recording children's stories for younger children, working together with them on a Habitat for Humanity house and many other things that develop their character and often end up being more meaningful for both the parent and children. Ditto with the produce, why not just plant a garden with children and grow vegetables organically. Not only can you grow vegetables without using pesticides, but it is also a wonderful activity to do with children. I am the mother of an adult son and many of the things we did together were low cost activities, partly because when he was born and growing up, my spouse I earned much less money than we currently earn. Had our earning power been what it is now back when we were raising our child, we might have been able to buy our child more things but I am not sure we would have given him a better, happier childhood. What we did give him were what children need: time, love, acceptance, support from family--nuclear and extended, encouragement, developing the dispositions necessary to help him navigate life. I am sure we were successful. In a card he sent us recently, he spoke about how his childhood really helped him not only develop into the man and spouse he is today, but helped him pursue and become successful in his career, which I think is what most parents want for their children. My fifteen cents' worth.

And all of that is validating and are great examples. There are always goods things you can share with kids that don't cost anything. People with high incomes can do those as well. I just mention, yet again, you can do even more with money, enhance your kids childhood.

[musicman]

And all of that is validating and are great examples. There are always goods things you can share with kids that don't cost anything. People with high incomes can do those as well.

with your organic veggie example. she's growing her own veggies with her children while you're buying yours since you can afford to. i think her children are benefitting more and will have more character. yours will care less.

[nmainguy]

with your organic veggie example. she's growing her own veggies with her children while you're buying yours since you can afford to. i think her children are benefitting more and will have more character. yours will care less.

Wow. What a sweeping unsubstantiated statement.

[Pumapayam]

she's growing her own veggies with her children while you're buying yours since you can afford to.

Yes, because everyone wants to live in an "Amish like community".

Gardening is a nice idea, but again, wealthy people can garden too.

What ever a low income person can do, so can a rich person.

I repeat, people of higher income can do more than the average person and enhance their parenting skills.

Men usually make more money, thus (2) men are at an advantage.

I can go on all day like this a repeat it over and over. . .

What are you trying to prove, anything you dish out that the average family does, a wealthy family can do too. . .