Decision 2008: McCain/Obama

[RedScare]

Sure thing bro.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ibd/081002/issues.html?.v=1

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1219103035...=googlenews_wsj

Thanks for proving my point. Virtually all of those proposals are aimed at the working poor, sometimes known as the middle class. From the article...

For one of those credits, dependent and child care, you don't even have to have a job. You can simply be looking for one. Taking college courses (and agreeing to 100 hours of community service) qualifies you for the "American opportunity credit."

Even that credit requires one to be actively seeking employment. In other words, like the welfare reform that cut over 60% of recipients from the rolls, people must be attempting to improve their economic situation to receive benefits. Likewise, the $4,000 college tuition credit gives benefits to those seeking to educate themselves out of poverty.

Are those not the people we should be assisting? Isn't the goal to push the chronically poor into self-sufficiency through education and employment? Wasn't that the whole point of the Republican led welfare reform that Clinton claimed as his idea?

[TJones]

The college tuition credit isn't supposed to be designed for those who DON'T put into the system Red, and Obama's plan does just that, you know this. Those currently on welfare will keep doing what they have always been doing, having more and more kids just to take advantage of the system. The college credit thing is good in theory, but the ones who don't work aren't going to VOLUNTEER 100 hours of community service, get real. The whole point of the Republican tax reform, was to take away the abuse of the system and force alot more welfare roaches to get off the porch and go get a job.

[editor]

Uh HUH, and I just sent you a message about that. LOL! Make me a Ron Paul one, please.

Ron Paul's not on your ballot. You can choose the generic "I Voted" if you write him in.

[HtownWxBoy]

I voted today... Obama!!

[RedScare]

The college tuition credit isn't supposed to be designed for those who DON'T put into the system Red, and Obama's plan does just that, you know this. Those currently on welfare will keep doing what they have always been doing, having more and more kids just to take advantage of the system. The college credit thing is good in theory, but the ones who don't work aren't going to VOLUNTEER 100 hours of community service, get real. The whole point of the Republican tax reform, was to take away the abuse of the system and force alot more welfare roaches to get off the porch and go get a job.

No, I do not know this. Can you point out the legislation or law that says the tuition credit must be as you say it must be? Can you point me to the "welfare" law. Can you document how you know that those on this "welfare" will keep on doing what they have always been doing? In other words, talk is cheap. Can you point to an actual study or survey or legislation that proves what you claim as fact?

It seems to me that if the goal is to make non-productive citizens productive, we should make self-improvement part of any program. If the goal is to punish poor people for being poor, then I recommend throwing them a few crumbs...just enough to subsist...so that we may continue to complain about what a drag on society they are. I am convinced that there are many citizens who actually prefer this approach.

I am glad that you believe that a college tuition credit is good in theory, though. That suggests that there may be merit to this plan, if your other concerns can be addressed.

[editor]

I voted today... Obama!!

Go add your HAIF voter tag.

[HtownWxBoy]

Go add your HAIF voter tag.

Done.

[KinkaidAlum]

I didn't realize people were STILL blaming welfare mothers in 2008.

Seriously? In the very same month we bailed out Wall Street by over a TRILLION dollars? On the very same day that GREENSPAN admitted he was wrong about deregulation? When we're spending 10 billion a month in Iraq?

Absurd.

I am simply amazed that white men (largely) have this notion of women of color (largely) popping out kids infront of their flatscreens while their baby daddy of the month goes and collects the welfare check so they can buy spinners for their Escalade.

As a former social worker who helped young mothers with WIC programs, I can tell you that isn't even close to how it works no matter how many times some millionaire on talk radio tells you it's so.

[RedScare]

I've asked several times for statistics on the number of people on the welfare rolls from posters who still live in 1996. Not because I haven't seen them, but because I have. Some people do not want to know what is going on outside their neighborhood. It is much easier to gripe if you can dehumanize the opponent. Hopefully, for one election cycle at least, they are in the minority.

[Porkchop Jr]

If the goal is to punish poor people for being poor, then I recommend throwing them a few crumbs...just enough to subsist...so that we may continue to complain about what a drag on society they are. I am convinced that there are many citizens who actually prefer this approach.

By "poor" are you talking about those who make less than $250k/yr? Admittedly, I have quite a few friends who think this way. Yeah they might be douches, but what can ya do?

[RedScare]

By "poor" are you talking about those who make less than $250k/yr? Admittedly, I have quite a few friends who think this way. Yeah they might be douches, but what can ya do?

I suppose that you could start by confronting them every time they make crass generalizations, such as "welfare", a social program that does not even exist in the United States. We have programs that allow unemployed mothers to buy food for themselves and their minor children, such as AFDC. Do our friends want to let children starve? Sure, we can blame the absentee dads, and moms who dropped out of school, and therefore have few marketable skills, but at the end of the day, do we want to walk by children on the sidewalk with bloated stomachs waiting to die?

We have programs that provide health care for those poor children. Would it be better to have them crowd our emergency rooms where it costs even more, and that cost is borne by local property owners? We also have programs for old people's healthcare. Do we want our parents laying in parks dying because they cannot afford to see a doctor?

None of these programs is named "welfare", yet all of them are included in the budget that some people call "welfare". There are countries where these programs do not exist. I wonder if those who complain feverishly about "welfare" have REALLY thought about it and decided that they would prefer to live in a country with old people and children lying on the sidewalks near death from disease and starvation. I wonder if they want to contend with the drastic increase in burglary and robbery from those so desparate to eat that they resort to violence? How many fiscal conservatives think that the $24,000 per year per inmate cost to house prisoners is more economical than the $600 per month that we give an entire family for food in AFDC?

Imagine all of the HAIF homeless threads then. Instead of complaints about crazy men begging for change, they could also contain complaints of bloated children begging for food scraps, and how annoying they are. Why don't the police enforce civility ordinances against those damned starving children!

At least HAIF would be a livelier place, huh?

[Trae]

The last candidate to be down this much, this late in the election, was Bob Dole in 1996. We know how that turned out.

Obama: 375

McCain: 157

Ties: 6

http://electoral-vote.com/

[RedScare]

Has anyone been following this story?

McCain Volunteer Claims Mugging By Obama Supporter

This girl, a College Station resident, claims she was robbed at an ATM in Pittsburg by a big dark Black man. She claims that when he noticed her McCain bumper sticker, he became enraged and carved a 'B' onto her face. But, inconsistencies abound. The police have asked her to take a polygraf. The whole thing is bizarre.

[editor]

Has anyone been following this story?

McCain Volunteer Claims Mugging By Obama Supporter

This girl, a College Station resident, claims she was robbed at an ATM in Pittsburg by a big dark Black man. She claims that when he noticed her McCain bumper sticker, he became enraged and carved a 'B' onto her face. But, inconsistencies abound. The police have asked her to take a polygraf. The whole thing is bizarre.

I'll believe it if it's still the same story in three weeks. I don't know what the deal is with college girls these days. In the last month we've had three in the Chicago area claim to have been attacked (kidnapped, carjacked, assaulted, APB, sketches of "persons of interest") only to find out later that they made it up to get attention.

When I was in college girls starved themselves to death or cut their wrists if they didn't think daddy loved them -- nice and neat and private. Now they get the police involved in their make believe dramas. And if a TV station doesn't splash their "plight" all across the news, then suddenly it's a racial thing and the protestors show up at the front door.

[westguy76]

It seems to me that if the goal is to make non-productive citizens productive, we should make self-improvement part of any program. If the goal is to punish poor people for being poor, then I recommend throwing them a few crumbs...just enough to subsist...so that we may continue to complain about what a drag on society they are. I am convinced that there are many citizens who actually prefer this approach.

The thing is a lot of us out here don't want this to be goal of the federal government. I have known a lot of non-productive citizens in my life, hell I have a few in my immediate family, I am sure most of us do.

No one wants to punish the poor. There is plenty enough encouragment for people to get off their duffs and be a productive member of society for themselves, their families, and their communities. In my experiance and in my opinion if someone does not have the internals (brain, heart, sense of pride, honor, responsibility) to stand up for themselves, they sure are not going to do it for breadcrumbs or even by the encouragement and help from family members. They more often than not leach off the help they are provided be it misguided government or family members and then start the woe is me crap... I'm poor, disadvantaged, ignored, and unfortunately continue the cycle for themselves and their families.

I'm rambling but the point is "self improvement programs" are usually more succesful when they are actually Self inspired or realized and a misappropriation of federal funds IMO.

[Porchman]

Has anyone been following this story?

McCain Volunteer Claims Mugging By Obama Supporter

This girl, a College Station resident, claims she was robbed at an ATM in Pittsburg by a big dark Black man. She claims that when he noticed her McCain bumper sticker, he became enraged and carved a 'B' onto her face. But, inconsistencies abound. The police have asked her to take a polygraf. The whole thing is bizarre.

If this should be true, it might be a nursery rhyme fanatic. In that case, she'd be lucky that he stopped with rolling her and marking her with 'B'.

[west20th]

Has anyone been following this story?

McCain Volunteer Claims Mugging By Obama Supporter

This girl, a College Station resident, claims she was robbed at an ATM in Pittsburg by a big dark Black man. She claims that when he noticed her McCain bumper sticker, he became enraged and carved a 'B' onto her face. But, inconsistencies abound. The police have asked her to take a polygraf. The whole thing is bizarre.

If you see the "B" on her face it seems to point to her story being a hoax. The "B" is very evenly scratched into her face. If someone is holding you down and carving a "B" onto your face I doubt that the wounds would be so even. Also, the "B" is backwords, pointing to the possibility that it was carved while looking in the mirror?

Edit: I tried this in the mirror at work (no not actually on my face but with a pen and paper) and the "B" would be backwords. However, a co-worker did point out that if the attacker was cutting her from behind the "B" would be backword. I still think the cuts are too shallow and even to have come from an attacker.

[KinkaidAlum]

Has anyone been following this story?

McCain Volunteer Claims Mugging By Obama Supporter

This girl, a College Station resident, claims she was robbed at an ATM in Pittsburg by a big dark Black man. She claims that when he noticed her McCain bumper sticker, he became enraged and carved a 'B' onto her face. But, inconsistencies abound. The police have asked her to take a polygraf. The whole thing is bizarre.

This doesn't even pass Malkin's smell test!

I guess the "B" stands for Bloomfield, the Pittsburgh hood where this attack happened. Bloomfield is a busy hood known as Little Italy! A 6'4" dark-skinned black man would stick out like Yao Ming. I've been to bars on Liberty Avenue. At 9 pm on a thursday night, the place would be quite busy. Yet, there are no witnesses? Plus, the Citizen's Bank there doesn't even have a drive-thru!!! and yet, the robber, "walked" back to her to carve her face up after he robbed her because of her bumper sticker?

This will become another bad aggie joke in 3...2...1...

Oh, and guess what is right across the street from the Citizen's Bank on the corner of Liberty @ Pearl? The West Penn Hospital!

[sarahiki]

This doesn't even pass Malkin's smell test!

I guess the "B" stands for Bloomfield, the Pittsburgh hood where this attack happened. Bloomfield is a busy hood known as Little Italy! A 6'4" dark-skinned black man would stick out like Yao Ming. I've been to bars on Liberty Avenue. At 9 pm on a thursday night, the place would be quite busy. Yet, there are no witnesses? Plus, the Citizen's Bank there doesn't even have a drive-thru!!! and yet, the robber, "walked" back to her to carve her face up after he robbed her because of her bumper sticker?

This will become another bad aggie joke in 3...2...1...

Oh, and guess what is right across the street from the Citizen's Bank on the corner of Liberty @ Pearl? The West Penn Hospital!

What's sad is that even if this is a hoax, SOME people will believe the story and it will just feed their racist notions of what scary, black, Obama supporters really want to do to them. And certain radio personalities will probably feed into that.

[20thStDad]

Has anyone been following this story?

McCain Volunteer Claims Mugging By Obama Supporter

This girl, a College Station resident, claims she was robbed at an ATM in Pittsburg by a big dark Black man. She claims that when he noticed her McCain bumper sticker, he became enraged and carved a 'B' onto her face. But, inconsistencies abound. The police have asked her to take a polygraf. The whole thing is bizarre.

Aggies...so weird and awkward. We don't even help them along, they do it themselves!!

[west20th]

What's sad is that even if this is a hoax, SOME people will believe the story and it will just feed their racist notions of what scary, black, Obama supporters really want to do to them. And certain radio personalities will probably feed into that.

And they have been. Once a story has been made public people will believe it and spread it even after it has been proven false. A good example is Ed Hendy and Pat gray this AM. The are still peddling that story about Michelle Obama ordering Lobster and Iranian caviar at the Waldorf in New York. The source of that story admitted their source was incorrect and that she didn't even stay at the Waldorf. But that didn't stop those two 700 AM goofs from still spreading the story and and expressing their "outrage". "The hypocrisy!". "See, they are nothing but elitists!".

[editor]

I never developed a taste for caviar. But here's a picture:

[Mark F. Barnes]

Aggies...so weird and awkward. We don't even help them along, they do it themselves!!

She's NOT AN AGGIE, so give it a rest. She attends Blinn Jr. College.

[Mark F. Barnes]

Just announced on Fox that it was a Hoax. She may be facng charges for filing a false report.

[west20th]

Aggies...so weird and awkward. We don't even help them along, they do it themselves!!

Aw they're OK. From personal experience, at least their engineers are. Most of our engineers are Aggies and they are all quite competent and don't really fit the geeky "dibert" engineers mold. We've got some UH engineers also who are quite good. Don't want to upset any Coogs out there. And they really aren't too sensitive to the "aggie" stereotypes. I usually get my best Aggie jokes from Aggies.

[Mark F. Barnes]

Yeah a good Aggie joke is one thing, I've been hearing them for 40 years. But this idiot girl is no laughing matter. There is a level of society that is a virtual tender box over this election, and to portray this hoax out on the main stream media, only adds unnecessary tension, in an already volatile situation. They should throw the book at her ass, and her sit out this election in the clink. Stupid people push my buttons pretty quick. Mom and Dad should have thought the poor baby a little more about respect, and wore that ass out a little more often.

Aggie Joke of the Day: What do you call an Aggie after they graduate?

[Fringe]

I can't believe you guys are suggesting that not everything we read on the internet is true!

[Mark F. Barnes]

Answer: Boss

[sevfiv]

Link to the attack story:

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/24/mc...ed-attack-hoax/

A 20-year-old John McCain campaign volunteer has admitted to lying about being mugged and attacked by a man who carved a "B" into her cheek after seeing a McCain bumper sticker on her car, Pittsburgh police announced Friday

Ashley Todd, 20, will face charges for filing a false police report. Police said they had found several "inconsistencies" in her statements in which she claimed she was robbed at knifepoint at a Citizens Bank ATM in Bloomfield.

[infinite_jim]

From John Moody, the executive VP of Fox News

John Moody wrote:

If the incident turns out to be a hoax, Senator McCain’s quest for the presidency is over, forever linked to race-baiting.

(foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/10/23/jmoody_1023/)

some comic relief on a glorious friday afternoon

Myspace GOLD

hillary in the youtube comments as well

http://www.youtube.com/user/crncny

remember folks, your never anonymous of on TEH INNERNETZ (ALL YOUR BASE BELONGS TO US)

CRUNCH CRUNCH CRUNCH

2ndedit: and I voted today, hope i don't regret it later like Bush

get out the vote and smell the fresh air