5 Years later.... what do you think about 9/11 now?

[MarthaG]

There have been many TV shows, videos, and internet stuff on the subject. I'm wondering what others are thinking about how our government handled the situation before, during, and after the tragedy?

My 15yr old son is a strong believer in the "conspiracy" theory. At first I would argue with him. But he is very skeptical of everything. I am not one to cram my beliefs down my kids

[Guest Marty]

Yes the government fail'ed Before, during and there failing now with the border wide open!

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

NEW YORK - ABC made several editing changes to the first part of its miniseries "The Path to 9/11" following furious protests by Clinton administration officials that it fabricated scenes about their actions prior to the terrorist attacks.

But the network resisted calls to cancel the $40 million miniseries, airing commercial-free over two nights. Part two is scheduled for Monday, with an interruption for President Bush's address to the nation.

Several scenes were cut or changed from the movie that aired Sunday and finished 20 minutes shy of its three-hour time slot. ABC has called it a dramatization, not a documentary.

One scene, in a copy of the movie given to television critics a few weeks ago, indicated President Clinton's preoccupation with his potential impeachment may have hurt the effort to go after Osama bin Laden......

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060911/ap_en_...DRrBHNlYwM3NjI-

[DJ V Lawrence]

Today was my first time seeing the attacks the way you all saw it on the Today Show (shown as-aired on MSNBC). It gave me an idea as to the sense of confusion that America watched that day. I still remember my bus passing by the Pentagon one month after the attack, which was the first that I saw of any of the events.

Two things caught my eye while watching . They were showing the Palestinians dancing in the streets an hour after the attack, and I can imagine the anger envoked after those images. Also, the sense of disbelief from Matt Lauer when the first tower collapsed, as if only a part of the tower collapsed instead of the whole. I didn't believe any of the buildings collapsed either until I saw the pictures a month later.

In Houston, how much news coverage that day was local and how much was national? And how long was it until Americans went to work again as usual?

[TJones]

Matha, I hope you plan on watching the second half tonight of "The Path to 9/11." If you watched last night, it was very interesting, and I learned a few NEW things about what happened between '93 and '99. Tonight's half will detail the planning of 9/11. I'm sure it will be just as interesting as last night's portion.

I don't think there is or was ANY conspiracy behind it, just ALOT of politics, because everyone wants the credit when things go right, but if it becomes a "clustef**k", then no one wants a part of it.

[Heights2Bastrop]

The question was asked how our government handled the situation before, during and after the attacks. Something crossed my mind last night that would apply here.

Consider this scenario. The US had fairly reliable intelligence that plans were being made to hijack some commercial airliners, and then fly them into public and government buildings.

Reports begin to come in about particular flights being hijacked. The military acts accordingly and deploys jet fighters to intercept the suspected hijackers, and, when the pilots fail to respond to the jets

[uncertaintraveler]

Why in the world is Bin Laden still alive? It makes us look like fools!

Anyway, what are your opinions? I

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

I learned a few NEW things about what happened between '93 and '99.

If you only knew the things that happened under Mr. Clinton, military and intelligence wise, it would cause your head to explode.

I dont believe in all the conspiracy theories, i know better than that. I dont believe we know where bin laden is and just arent going after him because of political reasons. No one on the Earth will convince me that the troops in the field will refrain from capturing public enemy number 1 in order to achieve some twisted political agenda, especially when thier lives are on the line. People that believe in that sort of stuff perhaps have never been in a combat situation. Politics DO NOT EXIST when you are in a foxhole.

I'm not going to get into the other issues you raised, nor discuss the Path to 9/11 make-believe-a-mentary.

However, as to the Osama issue, I firmly believe that he continues to "elude" capture because it is in the U.S.'s interest that he not be captured. Here's my simplified theory: Osama is probably somewhere inside the Pakistani border, and the US government, as well as Pakistan's government, probably knows exactly where he is. However, Pakistan is teetering on the brink of a fundamental-islamic coup, and Musharef (spelling?) cannot be seen from within his nation as being too pro-US (which, he arguably would be if Osama is captured inside Pakistan's borders). Therefore, in order to prevent a political destabilization in Pakistan (as well as the possibility of having a nuclear-armed islamo-fascist regime pointing missles at both India and the US), and a further destablization of the greater middle-east, the US simply lets Osama remain "uncaptured," because capturing the guy would lead to way more problems than leaving him alone does.

[sevfiv]

I dont believe in all the conspiracy theories, i know better than that.

i think for some, though, there are just too many loopholes and unanswered questions about the attacks. taking information straight form the government's collective mouth just doesn't cover it...

[uncertaintraveler]

I dont believe we know where bin laden is and just arent going after him because of political reasons. No one on the Earth will convince me that the troops in the field will refrain from capturing public enemy number 1 in order to achieve some twisted political agenda, especially when thier lives are on the line.

So, um....you don't think troops are ever used as political pawns?

Personally, I think it is interesting that certain people believe a certain president used US troops as a diversion from certain issues (oh, say, domestic problems), yet the same people are generally blind to the idea that another president could be using the same troops for the same type of diversion (oh, say, domestic problems).

And, for whatever it is worth, how is it so hard to believe that troops won't refrain from capturing a certain person? How many times in US history have troops been ordered to do something in order to achieve a political agenda, regardless of whether the "something" or the reason for it was truly valid or not? I mean, good grief, the US captures, or fails to capture, certain individuals all the time simply for political and national security reasons.

[Trae]

I just can't believe there are people out in Pennsylvania from a Baptist church from Kansas portesting saying 9/11 was good and that the troops are dying because God is punishing us. Just crazy.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

So, um....you don't think troops are ever used as political pawns?

Again, politics DO NOT EXIST when you are in a foxhole faced with life threaten circumstances

[TJones]

I heard a hilarious "conspiracy theory" today. Get this, George Bush had the WTC wired with explosives a few months prior, so that the building would definately "IMPLODE" on itself, so that there would be minimal damage to the surrounding buildings. How do they explain Flight 93 and The Pentagon ?

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

I heard a hilarious "conspiracy theory" today. Get this, George Bush had the WTC wired with explosives a few months prior, so that the building would definately "IMPLODE" on itself, so that there would be minimal damage to the surrounding buildings.

You are witnessing the product of a TV camera society..............

[TJones]

I just can't believe there are people out in Pennsylvania from a Baptist church from Kansas portesting saying 9/11 was good and that the troops are dying because God is punishing us. Just crazy.

These are the same idiots that go to soldiers funerals, and act like jackasses.

[Trae]

These are the same idiots that go to soldiers funerals, and act like jackasses.

I saw I Nightline story about that, and it was disgusting. Those people should not be there. Good thing their were some anti-protesters who showed up and sang American patriotic songs. Go them.

[sevfiv]

I heard a hilarious "conspiracy theory" today. Get this, George Bush had the WTC wired with explosives a few months prior, so that the building would definately "IMPLODE" on itself, so that there would be minimal damage to the surrounding buildings. How do they explain Flight 93 and The Pentagon ?

just from a demolition perspective, it did look very orchestrated...

[RedScare]

So, um....you don't think troops are ever used as political pawns?

Personally, I think it is interesting that certain people believe a certain president used US troops as a diversion from certain issues (oh, say, domestic problems), yet the same people are generally blind to the idea that another president could be using the same troops for the same type of diversion (oh, say, domestic problems).

And, for whatever it is worth, how is it so hard to believe that troops won't refrain from capturing a certain person? How many times in US history have troops been ordered to do something in order to achieve a political agenda, regardless of whether the "something" or the reason for it was truly valid or not? I mean, good grief, the US captures, or fails to capture, certain individuals all the time simply for political and national security reasons.

If I am not mistaken, ABC is portraying this very situation as we speak. Why do you people believe it when DISNEY says so, but refuse to believe it when it makes diplomatic sense?

[nmainguy]

There have been many TV shows, videos, and internet stuff on the subject. I'm wondering what others are thinking about how our government handled the situation before, during, and after the tragedy?

My 15yr old son is a strong believer in the "conspiracy" theory. At first I would argue with him. But he is very skeptical of everything. I am not one to cram my beliefs down my kids

[RedScare]

As far as what I think about 9.11 now...I think Cheney and Bush bungled a once in a millennium opportunity to catch Osama. We had the world eating out of our hands but that gang choose to go after someone who had nothing to do with 9.11.

While the conspiracy theorists leave way too many questions unanswered to take them seriously, it IS inexplicable that the president of the United States would stop searching for the mastermind of the most notorious crime ever committed on US soil, allowing these theories to gain traction. Why DID we stop looking for bin Laden? Does the prez just have a serious case of ADHD, or is there more to the story? Maybe there is some credence to uncertain traveller's theory.

[Guest Marty]

Osama is in Iran hanging out with the new Hitler, Ahmadinejad.

[TheNiche]

While the conspiracy theorists leave way too many questions unanswered to take them seriously, it IS inexplicable that the president of the United States would stop searching for the mastermind of the most notorious crime ever committed on US soil, allowing these theories to gain traction. Why DID we stop looking for bin Laden? Does the prez just have a serious case of ADHD, or is there more to the story? Maybe there is some credence to uncertain traveller's theory.

The really odd thing about it was that it was officially acknowledged by the CIA. As much of a PR problem as it is, somehow I'll bet that it's a lie meant to make Bin Laden less cautious in his movements or some such thing. I honestly don't know...but at this level of the political realm, apparent dumbassery often has hidden purposes. I just can't wait for this stuff to all be declassified in 50 years.

[MarthaG]

Martha,

As far as what hit the Pentagon, it was a plane that carried Barbara (Brasher) Olson, Waltrip class of 72 and wife of United States Solicitor General Ted Olson. If it didn't, then she and 63 other people are playing a pretty good game of hide-and-seek.

What my son believes (mind you I'm not saying I agree with him) is that the the plane was unloaded somewhere else and the passengers (including Barbara) are now living new lives in the witness proctection program, or some other program created by the gov.

Have you seen the Loose Change, Edition 2 documentary? (Again, I'm not buying their report), but I am curious about the entry point of the plane that hit the pentagon. Maybe it was some very creative work with photo shop, but in what they show, there is only 1 hole....no evidence that the wings entered the building (as we can clearly see in the TWC entry points) and there were no wings laying on the ground which would be the case if they "came off" during entry. What happened to the engines? Again, I was not there, and I do not remember seeing this in the news as I was in such shock in what I was seeing about the WTC. I guess my mind just could not comprehend any more.

As far as what I think about 9.11 now...I think Cheney and Bush bungled a once in a millennium opportunity to catch Osama. We had the world eating out of our hands but that gang choose to go after someone who had nothing to do with 9.11. Now we're fighting in a civil war fortified by terrorists who would never have been there if we had continued to contain Saddam-and the price for us is 2600 of our own dead and counting.

I totally agree, but in the spirit of keeping the Clinton monkey on my back...he had more than his fair share of opportunites to take care of Osama. Which at the time he was spending his time worring about his own reputation.

[nmm]

just from a demolition perspective, it did look very orchestrated...

Are you a demolitionist?

As far as these theories go, i know personally a family friend who was in the second tower when the first tower hit. He luckily got out within 10 minutes, because he was on the 27th floor (i believe). He said his colleagues thought an earthquake hit NYC when they heard a loud *boom* and everything began to shake.

As for Flight 93, ive heard it was found in pieces. Some people who have claimed to witness it go down say some sort of missile hit it to bring it down. According to this school of conspiracy thought, the government manufactured the whole Flight 93 thing, because they didnt want the public to know they had to take one plane down via missile.

Anywho, with these strange things, you will always have doubts. I mean, 2 commercial airliners flying above the financial Mecca of the World's Superpower, utterly destroying a symbol of American Power is already such an unconventionally strange thing. No one in their wildest imaginations could have thought of such an attack, nor the best way to stop such an attack on such short notice.

Anywho, if it is a conspiracy, itll be filed in history with the likes of the JFK Assasination, the Iran-Contra Affair, the Aristide-US Affair, and the Assasination of Vince Young (or whoever that dude was in the Clinton Administration).

[Guest Marty]

just from a demolition perspective, it did look very orchestrated...

With all the media leak's don't you think that the story would be out there by now. By the way those were planes that hit on 911. But on the other hand you will never know?

[nmm]

On another note, i personally dont trust Bush. He lies, his administration lies, they are a bunch of liars.

They lie to control public opinion and whatnot. Blahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!

With all the media leak's don't you think that the story would be out there by now. By the way those were planes that hit on 911. But on the other hand you will never know?

Actually, have you guys been reading about those University Professors who have claimed it was a demolition?

Ive talked to some engineers who said it was a simple matter of Physics, and others who said it was an unexplainable coincidence.

One party believes that the sheer magnitude of the intial explosion arising from leaking fuel engine + the weight of the rubble of the top few floors that exploded into pieces from the explosion, sent the tower spiraling downwards.

Another party believes, and i find this to make the most sense, is that the way it fell so simply and so calculatedly (one set after another in a matter of seconds, starting from the very first floor) seems as if it was a demolition job. Secondly, when something explodes, the rubble should explode outward, as in: <<<*>>> instead of fall together on a heap upon the tower. This would mean there is no extra weight pushing down on the tower if the cluster exploded outwards. Its hard to put into words, youd just have to visualize an explosion.

Anyways, here is what a controlled demolition looks like. The Seatlle Kingdom.

[Guest Marty]

On another note, i personally dont trust Bush. He lies, his administration lies, they are a bunch of liars.

They lie to control public opinion and whatnot. Blahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!

Actually, have you guys been reading about those University Professors who have claimed it was a demolition?

Ive talked to some engineers who said it was a simple matter of Physics, and others who said it was an unexplainable coincidence.

One party believes that the sheer magnitude of the intial explosion arising from leaking fuel engine + the weight of the rubble of the top few floors that exploded into pieces from the explosion, sent the tower spiraling downwards.

Another party believes, and i find this to make the most sense, is that the way it fell so simply and so calculatedly (one set after another in a matter of seconds, starting from the very first floor) seems as if it was a demolition job. Secondly, when something explodes, the rubble should explode outward, as in: <<<*>>> instead of fall together on a heap upon the tower. This would mean there is no extra weight pushing down on the tower if the cluster exploded outwards. Its hard to put into words, youd just have to visualize an explosion.

Anyways, here is what a controlled demolition looks like. The Seatlle Kingdom.

I thought about the way the tower fell that day. I thought the tower would tumble down head over heal. Do you think the goverment would risk it ." NWO" I think not.

[sevfiv]

wow - dome demolitions are neat. and so...different.

and of course i am not a "demolitionist." complete opposite (which could probably be gathered from other threads around here).