musicman Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 It's not about how the congestion is, it's about how much more congested it would be without the light rail.the majority of growth in houston is happening where rail doesn't exist. therefore personal transportation (or other public transit) is necessary for most. with houston's density, to say LRT is the solution is just not true. the money can be used in better ways to serve more people, more efficiently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
713 To 214 Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 how's congestion in dallas? looks like the light rail isn't helping in dallas.Your logic is flawed. Dallas adds about 140,000 people per year. Imagine if there were no rail at all. Rail is never meant to be the one and only solution to any city's transportation needs. It's just another tool in the tool kit along with HOV, bus, well designed roads, bike lanes, etc. that make any city's transportation system the best it can be. Are Houstonians going to have to pay for their many years of procrastination on the issue of rail? Of course they are. . .and you know what. . .the price is only going to go up every day the citizens continue to wait to implement these alternatives. I have no doubt, and I think you'll agree with me, that the City of Houston WILL eventually have a meaningful rail component as a part of its overall transportation system. The only question is whether the City going to pay for it now, ten years from now, or twenty five years from now. Again, I submit that the costs, both direct (i.e. construction) and indirect (i.e. diminishing quality of life) will only be compounded every day Houstonians wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicMan Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 IMO Commuter rail needs to be established ASAP.If METRO should not handle commuter rail, who should form and fund the agency that forms the rail lines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
713 To 214 Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 the majority of growth in houston is happening where rail doesn't exist. . ..and you think this statement helps your argument? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 i'm very happy with the 40000 daily riders here, i'd prefer that to the 70000 dallas has....particularly when you factor in the costs of building the existing systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jax Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 the majority of growth in houston is happening where rail doesn't exist. therefore personal transportation (or other public transit) is necessary for most. with houston's density, to say LRT is the solution is just not true. the money can be used in better ways to serve more people, more efficiently.LRT may be not the end-all solution, but it's a start. There might be a cheap quick fix (add more lanes to existing roads) but that isn't going to work in the long run. What do you think the "solution" is, Musicman? Add more busses? Or build a commuter rail line that leads to one destination but doesn't allow people to get around once they are in the city? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 . ..and you think this statement helps your argument? sure does! if these new people can't be served by a system then congestion results. looks like the dept of tranportation agrees, WRT dallas and the other 8 congested cities We Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trae Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 Musicman is just content with buses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
713 To 214 Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 sure does! if these new people can't be served by a system then congestion results. looks like the dept of tranportation agrees, WRT dallas and the other 8 congested cities We Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 Musicman is just content with buses.if you're going to attempt to quote me, at least be accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 That didn't even make sense. Your comments are becoming more and more incomprehensible, and your attempts to find logical arguments where there are none, just make you come across as some anti-rail zealot who would oppose even the most reasonable/effective plan.i will not support a plan that causes additional congestion. For cities to be on the dept of transportation's plan because of congestion......it's usually not a positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDeb Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 IMO Commuter rail needs to be established ASAP.If METRO should not handle commuter rail, who should form and fund the agency that forms the rail lines?I believe I read somewhere that the county is also looking into it...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicMan Posted September 11, 2007 Share Posted September 11, 2007 As for suggestions for routes and station designs, who should I send them to?Each community should pick the d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trae Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 if you're going to attempt to quote me, at least be accurate.My bad, BRT (which is a bus). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 My bad, BRT (which is a bus).i never said that either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailOnWestheimer Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 i will not support a plan that causes additional congestion. What exactly do you mean by "additional congestion?" The whole point of rail is that if people are riding the rails, they're not in their cars. What we're looking for is overall less congestion, or greater mobility -- but this is tricky, because if you build rail on Richmond, you will increase overall congestion, whereas Westheimer is already completely congested (and frankly, almost undrivable between Shepherd and Bagby.) Since Richmond (as it is now) is very effective at moving car and trucking traffic, that capacity will be lost if rail is put there. But Lower Westheimer does not effectively move car and truck traffic, and so overall car and truck traffic will not be severely impacted. Yet another reason why Rail On Westheimer... just fits! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 (edited) westheimer is almost undriveable? i used it a couple of days ago and had no problem.putting rail at street level increases congestion, particularly at intersections where no attempt has been to separate LRT and vehicle interactions. closing streets also results in more traffic on others. Edited September 12, 2007 by musicman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicMan Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 Richmond is not as much of an artery as Westheimer, so Richmond is a better choice for rail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailOnWestheimer Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 Richmond is not as much of an artery as Westheimer, so Richmond is a better choice for rail.I interpret your comment to reflect the fact that Richmond is not the commerce and retail center that Westheimer is, therefore it will get less ridership than a Westheimer streetcar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetroMogul Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 I, for one, liked the 2003 option for rail on both Richmond and Westheimer and I'm assuming running down Sage/Rice to Westpark to connect to the transit center. I guess they figured it'd be too much of a fight for both corridors so they opted for Richmond. As far as Westheimer taking the place of Richmond in the present, I don't know. Westheimer is extremely narrow from Smith on to Montrose. Buses and cars can barely coexist comfortably along that stretch so you'd have to close that segment altogether. I doubt seriously anyone would like that. The best alignment, IMO, was the one where the line would start on the eastern end of the UH campus at Calhoun and traverse Wheeler/Richmond to Chimney Rock and connect to Hillcroft TC from there. But, we all know what happened to THAT plan. Now, I wonder if TxDot would have been thwarted if they wanted to run a toll road through there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfre81 Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 Now, I wonder if TxDot would have been thwarted if they wanted to run a toll road through there? Nope, unless they wanted to build it right through Afton Oaks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetroMogul Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 Ha, I bet; Afton Oaks would be a service road and some lucky person's former residence a toll booth. Metro is a weak punching bag, and it's unfortunate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicMan Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 (edited) Musicman, do you feel that Houston will be ready for circular rail routes (i.e. rail routes that connect centers of employment located outside of the central core of Houston?)Tokyo has the Yamanote Line (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamanote_Line) that travels in both directions in a circular route. Perhaps some of Houston's centers of employment outside of 610 and/or outside of Beltway 8 can be connected by a circular route. I am not sure which areas should be connected, though. Edited September 13, 2007 by VicMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 (edited) Musicman, do you feel that Houston will be ready for circular rail routes (i.e. rail routes that connect centers of employment located outside of the central core of Houston?)no for geographical reasons. cheaper means to the centers of employment would be appreciated if implemented appropriately. the van pool setup has been successful for some. i know someone who rides from meyerland to clr lake regularly and another who goes from clr lake to med center. definitely takes planning but they say it is worth it. Edited September 13, 2007 by musicman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jax Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trae Posted September 16, 2007 Share Posted September 16, 2007 (edited) Is that a hill, or just my eyes? Look at the building on the left. Edited September 16, 2007 by Trae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChannelTwoNews Posted September 16, 2007 Share Posted September 16, 2007 Is that a hill, or just my eyes? Look at the building on the left.Not a hill, but it is a slight incline at the intersection of Main & Commerce. The level increases once more as the train heads over the bridge across the bayou toward the UH Campus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trae Posted September 16, 2007 Share Posted September 16, 2007 So I guess the land is all sloping down to the Buffalo Bayou. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Original Timmy Chan's Posted September 16, 2007 Share Posted September 16, 2007 So I guess the land is all sloping down to the Buffalo Bayou. Quick hydraulics lesson: water runs downhill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted December 17, 2007 Share Posted December 17, 2007 OpEd by Culberson on his take for commuter rail.http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editor...ok/5381466.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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