State Highway 290 Expansion

[jfre81]

Huh, I didn't even realize that they had outbound service in the mornings.

Really. Learn something new every day.

have you priced P&R in the last yr?

Regretfully, no. I live near and use the existing rail line that supposedly nobody rides So pardon if I post something ignorant regarding P&R.

[RedScare]

nowhere did i say everyone was driving. i will say though that my manager and another that were taking P&R no longer do because it is cheaper for each of them to drive.

EDIT: i definitely will get the prices she quoted me on tues. the amount of the increase was very surprising.

If every person commuting from Cypress to Clear Lake chose to drive, I think METRO would survive.

[TheNiche]

Regretfully, no. I live near and use the existing rail line that supposedly nobody rides

I hadn't noticed this earlier, but you and I are neighbors.

I've used the light rail twice to get downtown. It was worth a shot, but neither time worked out well for me. It was considerably slower than driving and probably cost just as much as the fuel. Plus, I've never had a regular job that was even inside the loop, much less within walking distance of light rail.

[musicman]

If every person commuting from Cypress to Clear Lake chose to drive, I think METRO would survive.

yep most of em drive now.

[jfre81]

I hadn't noticed this earlier, but you and I are neighbors.

I live off South Main just south of 610.

I've used the light rail twice to get downtown. It was worth a shot, but neither time worked out well for me. It was considerably slower than driving and probably cost just as much as the fuel. Plus, I've never had a regular job that was even inside the loop, much less within walking distance of light rail.

You're forgetting about one thing - parking. I don't like parking or driving downtown. I do own a car and I drive when venturing anywhere too far outside the loop, but use METRO when I can. A lot of times the car is as much a hindrance to me as anything. I don't feel the need to pay $5 for the privilege of driving and parking downtown. Also, I don't know about you but I go places for purposes other than work. Because of the rail, I can still get to MMP n 30-ish minutes for an Astros game and walk no further than I'd have to if I wanted to park for anything less than $10. Just an example. I doubt a bus running the same route, which will probably be stopping every other block, would make as good a time. I say this having rode METRO buses plenty.

Sure, it can take a little longer, but it also frees me up to do things people should not be doing while driving. Like reading. And I'd rather sit on a train or at a train station than in a traffic jam anyday. Even in summer. But that's just me.

[TheNiche]

I live off South Main just south of 610.

...ok, so we're distant neighbors. I'm closer to light rail than you are and I still won't take it because it takes too damned long.

You're forgetting about one thing - parking. I don't like parking or driving downtown. I do own a car and I drive when venturing anywhere too far outside the loop, but use METRO when I can. A lot of times the car is as much a hindrance to me as anything. I don't feel the need to pay $5 for the privilege of driving and parking downtown. Also, I don't know about you but I go places for purposes other than work. Because of the rail, I can still get to MMP n 30-ish minutes for an Astros game and walk no further than I'd have to if I wanted to park for anything less than $10. Just an example. I doubt a bus running the same route, which will probably be stopping every other block, would make as good a time. I say this having rode METRO buses plenty.

Sure, it can take a little longer, but it also frees me up to do things people should not be doing while driving. Like reading. And I'd rather sit on a train or at a train station than in a traffic jam anyday. Even in summer. But that's just me.

No, I'm not forgetting about parking. As I said, I've never held a job inside the loop, much less within walking distance of light rail. That means that I only go downtown during non-rush-hours when on-street parking is readily available and free. And don't get me wrong, I'm not averse to walking significant distances (which makes me a better candidate than most for mass transit, provided that it is efficient). For instance, I'd rather park near the county courthouse than bother with a $10 payment to park nearer to MMP.

[jfre81]

OK.....so it doesn't work for you because it takes too long. That's one person. It seems to work enough for others living near the rail because I see them riding every time I go out.

You see, I like driving - when I'm out on a road trip, far away from this city, exploring the country. In the city, I despise it. Not so much that I hate driving itself, but the people around me. Seriously, when I see people weaving in and out of lanes carelessly with a cellphone tied to their hands, texting, applying makeup - let's just say I don't carry a weapon in the car because it'd probably put me in prison or death row after I forcibly remove one such moron from the gene pool. I have limitless disdain, if not outright hatred, for them. So I've decided I'd rather deal with them on a train than on the highway, because they're not behind the wheel themselves threatening everyone around them. Maybe it even keeps me sane.

[TheNiche]

OK.....so it doesn't work for you because it takes too long. That's one person. It seems to work enough for others living near the rail because I see them riding every time I go out.

It's not that it doesn't work for others. Some others, not all. Not even most. I would point out that out of all the stations, boarding volumes are lowest at the Astrodome station, which is adjacent to the densest concentration of residences anywhere along the Red Line. And this is especially strange in many respects given that such a large percentage of residents in that area work for Texas Medical Center institutions.

To be perfectly clear, I have never said that "nobody rides it." I know that the folks on the chron.com forums that are also critical of light rail use that phrase all the time, and they're just plain wrong. Please do not confuse me with one of them.

[totheskies]

The first question needs to be more specific. By "along the corridor", do you mean within walking distance, within a mile, within a few miles, or generally speaking that they live closer to 290 than any of the other spoke freeways that lead into the central city?

The second question is missing an option from the multiple choices. There ought to be the option for "lane expansion with the incorporation of HOT lanes and commuter rail. If there is commuter rail which links in to the Northwest Transit Center and to the downtown area, then I fail to see the benefit in duplicating service with P&R services. The two ought to be considered mutually exclusive alternatives. And that also begs the question, what can commuter rail do that P&R cannot? In fact, might P&R be superior to commuter rail in a number of ways--including not only the quality of service, but also cost?

For both of these addenda, it's a matter of preference. "along the corridor" simply means all of the people that ASSOCIATE themselves with the 290 corridor, and use it as their preferred commuting route. So "within walking distance, within a mile, within a few miles, or generally speaking that they live closer to 290" would all apply.

Some people are never going to set foot onto a commuter train... just a fact of life. Others though, may never take their car to work again once it's built. Obviously a "best case scenario" for the commuter rail would be for one to go directly into downtown, one directly to the Med Center, one to the Galleria, one and one to the Energy Corridor. That's just not going to happen though. The Northwest transit center will at least be able to connect to the local bus and MetroRail system, so IMO it's better than what 290 currently has.

[TheNiche]

For both of these addenda, it's a matter of preference. "along the corridor" simply means all of the people that ASSOCIATE themselves with the 290 corridor, and use it as their preferred commuting route. So "within walking distance, within a mile, within a few miles, or generally speaking that they live closer to 290" would all apply.

In that case, there is not an answer to the question. If you want to pay me a big chunk of money, I can determine a reasonable approximation of the number of people that associate themselves with the 290 corridor. Otherwise you're going to have to settle for defined spatial boundaries.

The Northwest transit center will at least be able to connect to the local bus and MetroRail system, so IMO it's better than what 290 currently has.

How would it be better?

[samagon]

Perhaps I missed this in between all the Culberson bashing (not a bad thing, but I stopped reading halfway through page 2)...

Where will the commuter train go once it reaches 610?

The best assumption I can make is that it will go south on 610 and stop at the Metro thingy at 610/I-10, riders would get off and hop on a bus for the rest of the trek downtown, or hop on the galleria (err, uptown) light rail.

Is this far off the mark?

[jfre81]

Well, we're supposed to have a University Line that would be connecting you from Uptown to the rest of the inner city LRT system, but the NIMBYs are having none of it.

I understand, yes, we need commuter rail (this is a highly generic term that can mean heavy rail, for the people who are going "OMG HEAVY RAIL") But you also need something that is for shorter hauls with more stops (albeit fewer than on a bus). That's where LRT comes in.

[TheNiche]

Where will the commuter train go once it reaches 610?

The best assumption I can make is that it will go south on 610 and stop at the Metro thingy at 610/I-10, riders would get off and hop on a bus for the rest of the trek downtown, or hop on the galleria (err, uptown) light rail.

Is this far off the mark?

The original plans call for a commuter rail stop at the Northwest Transit Center and another at the Downtown Intermodal Center. However, the Northwest Transit Center (the terminus for the Uptown Line) is about a mile away from any existing freight rail trackage where commuter rail could possibly go. I would imagine that METRO will end up springing more funds to construct an extension of the Uptown Line at some point in the future so as to reach the Northwest Mall via N. Post Oak; the alternative would be a highly-inconvenient shuttle service or an extremely expensive rail spur for the commuter rail.

Needless to say, there are plenty of details that haven't yet been formalized. One of those, as near as I can tell, is whether UP is willing to give METRO permission to use their tracks or rights of way.

[RedScare]

The original plans call for a commuter rail stop at the Northwest Transit Center and another at the Downtown Intermodal Center. However, the Northwest Transit Center (the terminus for the Uptown Line) is about a mile away from any existing freight rail trackage where commuter rail could possibly go. I would imagine that METRO will end up springing more funds to construct an extension of the Uptown Line at some point in the future so as to reach the Northwest Mall via N. Post Oak; the alternative would be a highly-inconvenient shuttle service or an extremely expensive rail spur for the commuter rail.

Needless to say, there are plenty of details that haven't yet been formalized. One of those, as near as I can tell, is whether UP is willing to give METRO permission to use their tracks or rights of way.

Actually, the ROW of Old Katy Road is large enough to accomodate a train if they needed it to. The future light rail is planned for this corridor. In response to your spur suggestion, I seem to recall a planned future extension of the Uptown line to Northwest Mall. If someone can find those maps that METRO created while studying alllignment options, I believe it was in one of those.

[musicman]

EDIT: i definitely will get the prices she quoted me on tues. the amount of the increase was very surprising.

her price went from $5 to $9.

[musicman]

Actually, the ROW of Old Katy Road is large enough to accomodate a train if they needed it to. The future light rail is planned for this corridor. In response to your spur suggestion, I seem to recall a planned future extension of the Uptown line to Northwest Mall. If someone can find those maps that METRO created while studying alllignment options, I believe it was in one of those.

here's a smaller version

and one from hgac which is larger.

[Trae]

Actually, the ROW of Old Katy Road is large enough to accommodate a train if they needed it to. The future light rail is planned for this corridor. In response to your spur suggestion, I seem to recall a planned future extension of the Uptown line to Northwest Mall. If someone can find those maps that METRO created while studying alignment options, I believe it was in one of those.

I know the maps you are talking about. I have seen them. As for now, this is the closest I could find:

[TheNiche]

Actually, the ROW of Old Katy Road is large enough to accomodate a train if they needed it to.

Not very effectively. In order to access the Northwest Transit Center along existing railroad rights of way, a commuter train would have to execute something like a three-point turn...and that's still only after installing about a mile worth of new trackage and tearing out and rebuilding the new section of Old Katy Road which now occupies the former MKT right of way.

The future light rail is planned for this corridor. In response to your spur suggestion, I seem to recall a planned future extension of the Uptown line to Northwest Mall. If someone can find those maps that METRO created while studying alllignment options, I believe it was in one of those.

I don't recall that, but it's possible. There was a lot of discussion before alignments were formalized. And I do know that the extension is not presently part of the formalized alignment, nor is it "under study" like the segment connecting from Scott Street to the Eastwood Transit Center.

[Marcus Allen]

Are the current construction areas on 290 part of the master plan? TxDot has great conceptual pix and vids regarding the 290 expansion; including light rail and the Hempstead Tollway. I am not for sure if the current construction is part of that master plan or just some sort of patch it up scheme. I ask because, like many, I witnessed the I10 expansion and it obviously was apparent a large overhaul was taking place. Any thoughts?

[JLWM8609]

The current construction is just step 1 in the master plan for the 290 corridor.