Robert E. Lee High School At 6529 Beverly Hill Ln.

[VicMan]

In HISD, the schools that send us the best students are Health Professions High School, Lamar, Law Enforcement High school, Waltrip High school, Bellaire High, Reagan, and Davis. Some of these schools may be a surprise to you. We researched our graduates over the last 20 years to see what high schools were sending us students who were graduating from college within 4 years and we found that students from these HISD schools had the highest college graduation rates for our university. All of this research was done to help figure out a way to improve our graduation rates. Believe it or not, the best students in the survey were Home Schooled students. They out perform everyone, even the elite private school students.

I was not surprised by Bellaire, Lamar (My sister attended Lamar), Law Enforcement, and Waltrip (even though its IB program has been discontinued). Reagan surprised me a bit and Davis totally surprised me.

I have a feeling that Westside may be driven to the ground by the apartments clogging the Briar Forest area.

Do you feel like the North Forest ISD schools do worse than the worst HISD schools? Or do you feel like some or many of the HISD schools are worse than the NFISD schools?

Edited January 27, 2007 by VicMan

[KinkaidAlum]

I would have thought HSPVA would have been on that list.

Davis and Reagan don't surprise me as much because I would imagine that they start with a MUCH smaller base of students going to college. It's likely that the kids that aren't cut out for college aren't even attempting because they simply cannot afford it.

[jtr]

Do you feel like the North Forest ISD schools do worse than the worst HISD schools? Or do you feel like some or many of the HISD schools are worse than the NFISD schools?

North Forest is the worst school district in the area. We rarely enroll students from that district. The last time we received a student from that district was in 1999. North Forest has potential because the students seem eager to learn and they have family support, but the administration and the teaching staff seem to be totally unqualified. The district should be taken over by the state.

[VicMan]

North Forest is the worst school district in the area. We rarely enroll students from that district. The last time we received a student from that district was in 1999. North Forest has potential because the students seem eager to learn and they have family support, but the administration and the teaching staff seem to be totally unqualified. The district should be taken over by the state.

We need to create a movement to annex the district into HISD or Aldine ISD - The kids will then have the option of attending superior magnet schools.

[Gank]

Newsweek rated Westside #196 in the top high schools in America list. They must be doing something right.

Westside

Edited February 8, 2007 by Gank

[VicMan]

Westside has a large AP program.

2/3rds of all of the passing AP scores in HISD were either from Bellaire or Westside, two large comprehensives with large AP programs. In addition, Bellaire and Lamar have IB programs.

[jtr]

I have attended many higher ed professional conferences in the last 5 years and all of them spent much time talking about how useless AP is now. There was a time when AP was for the top students. Now it seems AP is for everyone and the program has been watered down. Some of the top universities in the U.S. are now not taking AP for college credit. If I'm not mistaken, the representatives from the University of Chicago said they were no longer taking AP courses. There were others who said that their university had done away with it as well.

The main point I was making about Westside is, once their kids get to college, they seem to be average at best. Those students are not any more prepared for college than some of the inner city schools.

If you read the Chronicle of Higher Education, there are many articles about the declining standards at many universities. The main reason they are having to lower their standards is because high school students going to college are not doing well. At my university, the faculty refuse to offer remedial classes, which makes it difficult to keep enrollment up. More and more students are graduating from high school without the basic skills to succeed in college.

It is a sad situation.

[VicMan]

Unless the U of Chicago neglected to update its website, it looks like it still takes AP credit.

http://collegeadmissions.uchicago.edu/level3.asp?id=348

What U Chicago does is it takes scores of 4 or 5. The universities "control quality" by only accepting specific scores. I believe the minimum is a 3. Some universities set the minimum to 4. Maybe a few set it to 5.

By the way, the Chronicle of Higher Education is available here: http://chronicle.com/

JTR: I found one article that may indicate this: "Grade Inflation": http://chronicle.com/weekly/v52/i49/49b01001.htm

Unfortunately only subscribers may see it.

I have attended many higher ed professional conferences in the last 5 years and all of them spent much time talking about how useless AP is now. There was a time when AP was for the top students. Now it seems AP is for everyone and the program has been watered down. Some of the top universities in the U.S. are now not taking AP for college credit. If I'm not mistaken, the representatives from the University of Chicago said they were no longer taking AP courses. There were others who said that their university had done away with it as well.

The main point I was making about Westside is, once their kids get to college, they seem to be average at best. Those students are not any more prepared for college than some of the inner city schools.

If you read the Chronicle of Higher Education, there are many articles about the declining standards at many universities. The main reason they are having to lower their standards is because high school students going to college are not doing well. At my university, the faculty refuse to offer remedial classes, which makes it difficult to keep enrollment up. More and more students are graduating from high school without the basic skills to succeed in college.

It is a sad situation.

Edited February 9, 2007 by VicMan

[Modernceo]

I graduated from Lee in 1994.

It was run down at that time, and had become a school that seemed to be exclusively for children of migrant / day laborer workers at that point. I know its even more so now. I think its because of all of the low rent apartments along westpark/bellaire/gessner area.

Granted, it wasnt one of the worst schools at that point, and there were a good amount of kids that didnt cause trouble, got their work done, and had good morales, but from just looking at the school you might think otherwise.

[plumber2]

Lee and Westbury along with Sterling (I think) were all built at the same time in the mid 60's, all from the same bond election, therefore the same architect, becoming carbon copy foot prints of their time. Westbury and Lee became instant rivals, similar to longtime rivals Lamar & Bellaire. Both Lee and Westbury drew from Lamar & Bellaire's former attendance zones. Curiously, Lee and Westbury adopted similar mascots, Generals & Rebels. Their fight songs were also similar sounding. All football games were held at Delmar stadium back then and both teams cheering crowds waved confederate flags on the way to the games and in the stands. I can remember those Friday nights going up the West Loop & Post Oak with kids hanging out car windows waving flags and shouting at each other.

Those are probably referred to as "those early white years". (No racism intended)

Our family lived down the street from Lee when it was built, but I attended catholic school (Marian in Bellaire), so I knew kids from all 4 schools. There was this westside bond thing among the 4 schools back then. Kind of an "us" against "the rest of the city" thing. I assume that bond eventually went away as Madison, Sharpstown and then Westside came on line.

Note: The only blacks that lived out on the west side of town back then were in Jeanetta, a small little community out Alief Rd. I'm not sure were they went to school? Possibly Alief schools?

[cottonmather0]

HISD did indeed neglect it on purpose. They gave away the funds to CyFair for a new football palace.

BTW, my mom went to Reagan and they have a fine-ass new addition, parking garage and total restoration of the original structure.

http://hs.houstonisd.org/ReaganHS/images/June2006Gallery.htm

Those pictures are incredible. I sure hope they eventually do something about Waltrip, too, before my kids get there.

In response to the OP, the school has definitely gotten worse but I doubt the name had anything to do with it - in fact, I would have argued that the school probably gets special attention (not that it matters) precisely because of PCness with all of the poor ethnic kids there.

I moved to Houston about 10 years ago and am friends now with quite a few guys who are around my age and who graduated from Lee back in the early 90's. They're all pretty opinionated and bothered that it's gone downhill but they tend to blame the kids going to school there now, and thus they indirectly blame the opening of Westside - the same lower income kids from the Gulfton/Southwest Side that are at Lee now were also there 15 years ago, except that before Westside was constructed, Lee's attendance zone extended past the Beltway and in some places went all the way to Highway 6 . It included all of Briar Forest and a lot of far west Westheimer. Many kids who lived just on the other side of the bayou from kids at Stratford, the guys I'm friends with now, instead went all the way to Lee. Now those kids go to Westside and there's nothing left at Lee but the poor immigrant kids.

[VicMan]

I moved to Houston about 10 years ago and am friends now with quite a few guys who are around my age and who graduated from Lee back in the early 90's. They're all pretty opinionated and bothered that it's gone downhill but they tend to blame the kids going to school there now, and thus they indirectly blame the opening of Westside - the same lower income kids from the Gulfton/Southwest Side that are at Lee now were also there 15 years ago, except that before Westside was constructed, Lee's attendance zone extended past the Beltway and in some places went all the way to Highway 6 . It included all of Briar Forest and a lot of far west Westheimer. Many kids who lived just on the other side of the bayou from kids at Stratford, the guys I'm friends with now, instead went all the way to Lee. Now those kids go to Westside and there's nothing left at Lee but the poor immigrant kids.

Let's look at Lee's ethnic breakdown: http://www.schooldigger.com/go/TX/schools/...518/school.aspx

The school was majority Hispanic before Westside opened.

[Pumapayam]

In response to the OP, the school has definitely gotten worse but I doubt the name had anything to do with it - in fact, I would have argued that the school probably gets special attention (not that it matters) precisely because of PCness with all of the poor ethnic kids there.

My old friend from middle school moved from Spring Branch ISD to Houston ISD and went to Lee as part of the graduating class of '98. She was never ghetto before, and I recently met up with her last month and she is G.H.E.T.T.O.

[millennica]

My old friend from middle school moved from Spring Branch ISD to Houston ISD and went to Lee as part of the graduating class of '98. She was never ghetto before, and I recently met up with her last month and she is G.H.E.T.T.O.

I'm the person who asked a poster to explain his use of the term MEXICANIZED, which might explain why I am writing again, this time to ask for an explanation of the term G.H.E.T.T.O. Exactly what does this term mean? Please explain as I need to see the specific details that help me understand how this term is being used.

[millennica]

I have attended many higher ed professional conferences in the last 5 years and all of them spent much time talking about how useless AP is now. There was a time when AP was for the top students. Now it seems AP is for everyone and the program has been watered down. Some of the top universities in the U.S. are now not taking AP for college credit. If I'm not mistaken, the representatives from the University of Chicago said they were no longer taking AP courses. There were others who said that their university had done away with it as well.

The main point I was making about Westside is, once their kids get to college, they seem to be average at best. Those students are not any more prepared for college than some of the inner city schools.

If you read the Chronicle of Higher Education, there are many articles about the declining standards at many universities. The main reason they are having to lower their standards is because high school students going to college are not doing well. At my university, the faculty refuse to offer remedial classes, which makes it difficult to keep enrollment up. More and more students are graduating from high school without the basic skills to succeed in college.

It is a sad situation.

I've been an academic for more than 2 decades who currently teaches in the University of

California system and agree that many students are not prepared to handle college/university level work. But believe me it's not just the students who have attended urban schools. Many students even those who have attended schools that have good reputations are not prepared for the rigors of college work. While many of these students do possess the "basic skills" of literacy, they aren't the "basic skills" needed for success at the university. Too many students aren't able to read difficult texts critically, write coherent, analytical papers, synthesize, summarize, or back up their opinions with strong arguments.

[Pumapayam]

I'm the person who asked a poster to explain his use of the term MEXICANIZED, which might explain why I am writing again, this time to ask for an explanation of the term G.H.E.T.T.O.

She talks like she is a sailor "very thuggish" with slang and curse words, only has a HS degree, currently unemployed and living with mom/dad (at age 26). Just no motivation, very sad, especially for another fellow persian girl.

[VicMan]

She talks like she is a sailor "very thuggish" with slang and curse words, only has a HS degree, currently unemployed and living with mom/dad (at age 26). Just no motivation, very sad, especially for another fellow persian girl.

Pump, why did her parents send her to Lee? Do they regret that decision now?

[cottonmather0]

Let's look at Lee's ethnic breakdown: http://www.schooldigger.com/go/TX/schools/...518/school.aspx

The school was majority Hispanic before Westside opened.

I think this chart actually proves my point. Sure, it was majority hispanic before Westside opened, but it went from 19% white to 8% white and almost all of the white kids who were lost came from the more upper and middle class neighborhoods on the far west side.

[paljr1987]

Was HISD's neglect of the Robert E. Lee campus purposeful? It's a complete dump. Has it been closed yet? I don't believe there are any plans to renovate, am I correct? One would think this is by no accident. Perhaps if it had a different name, HISD might have put forth more effort to save it.

My mother was one of the first graduates of this HS and named the yearbook.

Once Westside H.S opened Lee's fate was sealed. Every decent teacher at Lee left for Westside without a moments notice. With no athletics( football, basketball, baseball) and no good teachers all the students wanting a decent future left for Westside. The brilliant principal at Lee dissolved all athletics not wanting to fight for the same atheletes. How do you like that? A Texas high school with no high school football!

[satriela]

I've been an academic for more than 2 decades who currently teaches in the University of

California system and agree that many students are not prepared to handle college/university level work. But believe me it's not just the students who have attended urban schools. Many students even those who have attended schools that have good reputations are not prepared for the rigors of college work. While many of these students do possess the "basic skills" of literacy, they aren't the "basic skills" needed for success at the university. Too many students aren't able to read difficult texts critically, write coherent, analytical papers, synthesize, summarize, or back up their opinions with strong arguments.

You can blame high stakes testing for that. I work in an HISD school that feeds directly to Lee and what proponents of high stakes testing either don't realize or don't care about is that kids have to be taught how to take a multiple choice test. It is not something inherently learned in any academic area. Sure, great teaching will lead to at least okay test scores, but great test scores come from teaching the test...and great money comes from great test scores...

Just my two cents.

[millennica]

You can blame high stakes testing for that. I work in an HISD school that feeds directly to Lee and what proponents of high stakes testing either don't realize or don't care about is that kids have to be taught how to take a multiple choice test. It is not something inherently learned in any academic area. Sure, great teaching will lead to at least okay test scores, but great test scores come from teaching the test...and great money comes from great test scores...

Just my two cents.

While I agree that high stakes tests are a contributing factor to students not being prepared for the rigors of college level work, they aren't the sole factor. NCLB was not passed until 2002. When I first began teaching in the UC System in the early 1990s, California did not have high stakes testing and even then many students weren't well prepared for college level work. The reasons for students not being prepared are complex. There is no doubt that a singular focus on test scores, particularly if teachers feel compelled to teach to the test, is problematic, but to my way of thinking that isn't the only reason students entering college aren't prepared to do college level work.

[VicMan]

Once Westside H.S opened Lee's fate was sealed. Every decent teacher at Lee left for Westside without a moments notice. With no athletics( football, basketball, baseball) and no good teachers all the students wanting a decent future left for Westside. The brilliant principal at Lee dissolved all athletics not wanting to fight for the same atheletes. How do you like that? A Texas high school with no high school football!

He focused on Golf and Soccer, though. This is explained in this Houston Press article: http://www.houstonpress.com/2003-11-13/news/tee-time/

[satriela]

While I agree that high stakes tests are a contributing factor to students not being prepared for the rigors of college level work, they aren't the sole factor. NCLB was not passed until 2002. When I first began teaching in the UC System in the early 1990s, California did not have high stakes testing and even then many students weren't well prepared for college level work. The reasons for students not being prepared are complex. There is no doubt that a singular focus on test scores, particularly if teachers feel compelled to teach to the test, is problematic, but to my way of thinking that isn't the only reason students entering college aren't prepared to do college level work.

I agree that the reasons are complex; I just think high stakes testing is one thing that lowers the bar and is easily fixed.

[millennica]

I agree that the reasons are complex; I just think high stakes testing is one thing that lowers the bar and is easily fixed.

We agree that high stakes testing is one thing that lowers the bar and is easily fixed. However, I am not hopeful that this easy fix alone will result in students being better prepared for college level work. Too may other factors conspire to keep that from being a reality. Complex situations require multi-pronged solutions and that to solve them we must heed Mencken

[satriela]

We agree that high stakes testing is one thing that lowers the bar and is easily fixed. However, I am not hopeful that this easy fix alone will result in students being better prepared for college level work. Too may other factors conspire to keep that from being a reality. Complex situations require multi-pronged solutions and that to solve them we must heed Mencken's warning, "There is always an easy solution to every human problem that is simple, neat, and wrong."

So what are you saying? If many different things can't be fixed at once, we should leave the whole thing alone? I think the public education system needs an entire overhaul, but barring that, I see nothing wrong with doing something quite easy and quantifiable quickly--like taking out high stakes testing quickly--while in the process of making some of the other changes that need to be made (like stricter standards for teachers and curricula).

[gonein60seconds]

I was in the 9th grade at T.H. Rogers when Theodore Steele killed the Harvey kid, whom I did not know. However, I knew his little brother, John, well. I was stuck in Ms. Robey's classroom after school getting reamed for something when the thing took place right outside the window. Harvey had hit Steele several times with a baseball bat when Larry Bergen (who went on to become Principal at Lee the next year) ran over and tackled him. Steele picked up the bat and kicked Bergen in the face, moving him out of the way, and hit Harvey in the head with the bat. I ran into Steele on the Walls Unit of TDCJ in 1987, He had been released and came back with 75 years for robbery and attempted murder. Just looked him up on the TDCJ web site and he is still there, although he has been elligible for parole since 2005. Don't think he is in any danger of getting out anytime soon.