The Heights Historic District Guidelines & Ordinances

[EMME]

The list is titled "Best Old House Neighborhoods 2009: The South," however one of the neighborhoods listed is in Baltimore, MD. Since when did the South annex Maryland?

Maryland is considered the south by many. It is a point of much debate.

[TheNiche]

Maryland is considered the south by many. It is a point of much debate.

I would no sooner bother to debate whether Maryland is a southern state than I would debate whether there was a government conspiracy behind 9/11. It's ridiculous.

[RedScare]

I would no sooner bother to debate whether Maryland is a southern state than I would debate whether there was a government conspiracy behind 9/11. It's ridiculous.

It should come as no surprise that a lifelong Texan does not know where the Mason Dixon line is.

[TheNiche]

It should come as no surprise that a lifelong Texan does not know where the Mason Dixon line is.

Irrelevant.

[Heightsite]

The article mentions property-tax exemptions are available for restoration work on homes in the neighborhood's city-designated historic districts. Anyone know where I can find more information on this?

[KinkaidAlum]

Maryland is below the Mason-Dixon line and was a slave state during the Civil War, albeit a "neutral" one. That's one of the main reasons people think of it as a "southern" state.

Additionally, before the ACC expanded, Maryland was the northern-most member in a conference that featured Virginia, UNC, NC State, Duke, Wake Forest, Clemson, and Georgia Tech. Those schools (minus the Yankee Dukies) are very Southern.

Now, in fairness to The Niche, I've always said that Baltimore and DC have the best of both worlds as they straddle the line between North and South.

[Evans-Davis]

The article mentions property-tax exemptions are available for restoration work on homes in the neighborhood's city-designated historic districts. Anyone know where I can find more information on this?

Right here. http://www.houstontx.gov/planning/historic...ts_brochure.pdf

[TheNiche]

Maryland is below the Mason-Dixon line and was a slave state during the Civil War, albeit a "neutral" one. That's one of the main reasons people think of it as a "southern" state.

Additionally, before the ACC expanded, Maryland was the northern-most member in a conference that featured Virginia, UNC, NC State, Duke, Wake Forest, Clemson, and Georgia Tech. Those schools (minus the Yankee Dukies) are very Southern.

Now, in fairness to The Niche, I've always said that Baltimore and DC have the best of both worlds as they straddle the line between North and South.

Why does everyone assume that I'm trying to rehash the history of the Civil War era? Events that occurred nearly 150 years ago are irrelevant to what Maryland is today, which is decidedly non-Southern. I'll grant you that it is the black sheep of the North, however.

EDIT: Btw, sorry to go OT so quickly with this thread. I just could not stand for such a glaring error.

[SaintCyr]

Funny, my parents just bought a house in Eureka Springs and are moving back after being gone for 5 years...

Front_Middle.bmp

[Porchman]

Thank you for the post. Congrats on having your pic published with this.

Why does everyone assume that I'm trying to rehash the history of the Civil War era? Events that occurred nearly 150 years ago are irrelevant to what Maryland is today, which is decidedly non-Southern. I'll grant you that it is the black sheep of the North, however.

EDIT: Btw, sorry to go OT so quickly with this thread. I just could not stand for such a glaring error.

What about Wheeling, West Virginia? They're #14 on the list, and it's north of Baltimore.

[jgs1419]

What about Wheeling, West Virginia? They're #14 on the list, and it's north of Baltimore.

WV seems a bit of stretch as a 'southern state' but the majority of the state is below the Mason and Dixon line (Wheeling is in that little pointy part of WV). It was part of Virginia when the Mason/Dixon survey was carried out in 1767.

I have a good deal of family in Maryland and I can attest, at least anecdotally, that if you don't respect the historic standard for 'north' and 'south', you should at least look at it from the anthropological point of view. My family in Maryland is about as redneck as they come. Western Maryland seems the perfect storm of southern laziness and an Appalachian sensibility for corn liquor.

[RedScare]

Since the City, in its infinite wisdom, has decided to tell me how to renovate the other half of my property, I am looking for their guidance on what they will let me do. Old Sixth Ward has a set of design guidelines to give, well, guidance. The Heights used to have design guidelines under the old historic designation. However, the new draconian "historic" ordinane renders the old Heights design guidelines obsolete. Does anyone know if the oligarchy down at Planning has any intention of actually letting us know what they find appropriate, or do they like the thought of making us make repeated trips to the HAHC so that they can just say no?

I'd like to get things presentable so that I can get the hell out of here. I'm sure you true Heights residents would love to be rid of someone as ignorant of good architecture as myself, given my disdain for camelbacks. Well, help me out. Have any of your connections down at the Kremlin on the Bayou said when we might get some guidelines? Anyone? Mr. Searcy, you can chime in if you have heard anything on your hood. Maybe some of you GHPA members have heard something?

Thank you in advance.

[TheNiche]

...or do they like the thought of making us make repeated trips to the HAHC so that they can just say no?

It's a facet of a new stimulus program, no doubt. "Jobs for Snobs"

[RedScare]

It's a facet of a new stimulus program, no doubt. "Jobs for Snobs"

No kidding. You know, there is a new Houston Press article about how Austin has lost its funk, and now is probably less weird and less funky than Houston or Dallas. The article also pointed out how it is far easier to be creative and to do your own thing in Houston or Dallas, due to the Austinites' insistence on telling you how you must think and act. I couldn't help but think of the Houston Heights as I read the article. The parallels are uncanny, from the overwhelming segregation (while claiming to be diverse), to the telling others how one must act (or renovate their home). Just as Austin became too popular for its own good, thus enticing all of the people you ran from to follow you there, so is the Heights becoming crowded with those who know better than we what our houses should look like, what stores should be allowed down the street, and so on. It is the same old generic white people, only living in 90 year old houses with new additions in back, and they voted for Obama.

Here's the article. Tell me you don't see the similarities.

Finding Austin

[samagon]

Here's the article. Tell me you don't see the similarities.

Finding Austin

Good read, I've watched Austin transform from 'smug better than you' to 'smug better than you' for years now, only problem is now they don't realize they aren't so much better any longer.

[s3mh]

The Heights guidelines are still there and have not been rendered "obsolete" by the revised ordinance. http://www.houstontx.gov/planning/HistoricPres/houston_heights_design_guide.html

The Heights guidelines have always just been guidelines.

But that was obviously just a pretext for you to vent now that the historic districts have prevailed. But, I guess you are right. The Heights would be much more funky and hip had the builders and realtors prevailed in smashing all the little bungalows and replacing them with McVics. Nothing says "diversity" like a 3800 sq ft new construction, selling for 890k.

[s3mh]

Oh, and here is a clip from the article. This is from the section praising Oak Cliff in Dallas as being closer to what Austin once was:

"The neighborhood recently scored big when it turfed out bidness-friendly city councilman Dave Neumann and replaced him with Scott Griggs, a liberal who fought to stop a Walmart from going in."

[MOpens]

Oh, and here is a clip from the article. This is from the section praising Oak Cliff in Dallas as being closer to what Austin once was:

"The neighborhood recently scored big when it turfed out bidness-friendly city councilman Dave Neumann and replaced him with Scott Griggs, a liberal who fought to stop a Walmart from going in."

I guess liberal in Oak Cliff is different from liberal in Houston: Oak Cliff got a liberal councilman that stopped Wal-Mart, and we got a liberal mayor who welcomed Wal-Mart.

[MOpens]

Nothing says "diversity" like a 3800 sq ft new construction, selling for 890k.

That's what this is all about - money, right? In your later post you noted the wonders of Oak Cliff. But you did not cite the section of the article that said "Oak Cliff is now hipper, edgier and more affordable than east Austin is." There it is again - money. Give the Heights some time to languish under the weight of the historic ordinance, and I bet it will be "edgier and more affordable" than it is now. Not sure about "hipper."

[SilverJK]

But, I guess you are right. The Heights would be much more funky and hip had the builders and realtors prevailed in smashing all the little bungalows and replacing them with McVics. Nothing says "diversity" like a 3800 sq ft new construction, selling for 890k.

Believe it or not... 3800 sq ft new McVics wouldn't be the only houses in the heights if the developers had their way. A mix of new McVics, McCraftsmens, Moderns, McCamelbacks and old Bungalows with lots of personal flair would all coexist, adding a wealth of diversity to the neighborhood. People were saving bungalows long before your silly power grab historic district ordinance, even in areas outside of what are now historic districts.

This is pretty much my biggest issue with your side, you basically say there are only two possibilities, strict restrictions and being told what to do with your historic home, or all historic homes will be destroyed (probably by walmart). You refuse to agree that there is some middle ground that all could probably accept and you try to strong arm your values on everyone using your political ties (Parker and friends). Your unwillingness to budge to appease the majority's opinions shows how much you really care about the neighborhood and neighbors. None.

[MOpens]

I'd like to get things presentable so that I can get the hell out of here.

You better get it fixed up!!

I just filed my first complaint for demolition by neglect under section 33-254 of the historic district ordinance. I say "file," but since there is no formal process yet (at least not that I am aware of), it was in the form of a very unofficial email. However, as long as we have to live under the weight of this ordinance, I intend to use it as a tool to force repairs in the Heights. Let's get out there and preserve some history!

[samagon]

Believe it or not... 3800 sq ft new McVics wouldn't be the only houses in the heights if the developers had their way. A mix of new McVics, McCraftsmens, Moderns, McCamelbacks and old Bungalows with lots of personal flair would all coexist, adding a wealth of diversity to the neighborhood. People were saving bungalows long before your silly power grab historic district ordinance, even in areas outside of what are now historic districts.

This is pretty much my biggest issue with your side, you basically say there are only two possibilities, strict restrictions and being told what to do with your historic home, or all historic homes will be destroyed (probably by walmart). You refuse to agree that there is some middle ground that all could probably accept and you try to strong arm your values on everyone using your political ties (Parker and friends). Your unwillingness to budge to appease the majority's opinions shows how much you really care about the neighborhood and neighbors. None.

I am exceedingly surprised that there are all the mcvics, mccraftsmans, mccamelbacks, mcmoderns, mcpostmoderns, but never any mcbungalows? what about the mcshotgunhouses, or mctrailerhouses?

[RedScare]

The Heights guidelines are still there and have not been rendered "obsolete" by the revised ordinance. http://www.houstontx.gov/planning/HistoricPres/houston_heights_design_guide.html

The Heights guidelines have always just been guidelines.

I knew when I posted the topic that you'd spout off, but I actually believed you would know what you were talking about. Once again you show why you supported this abomination...you have no idea what you supported. I won't waste my time explaining it to you, as I don't think you will get around to fixing up your place anytime soon.

To those who actually DO know what is required, I'll ask again, since I inadvertantly took my own thread off topic. Does anyone know when the HAHC, in its infinite wisdom, intends to update the Heights design guidelines to conform with the new draconian ordinance? I don't have a working spouse to afford me the luxury of hanging out at the HAHC all day. Frankly, even if I had the time, I wouldn't spend one minute more with those Nazis than I had to. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Note to MOpens: Send me a message and I'll give you my address to complain about my place. Maybe it will get me the information I need.

[RedScare]

I am exceedingly surprised that there are all the mcvics, mccraftsmans, mccamelbacks, mcmoderns, mcpostmoderns, but never any mcbungalows? what about the mcshotgunhouses, or mctrailerhouses?

Actually, they are building a McShotgun down the street from me. I'll see if I can get a pic. As for the McBungalow, I think that is the proper name for a McCamelback or a McCraftsman.

[barracuda]

I went through the HAHC process this past spring, post-ordinance. I went in assuming they were using the new guidelines, but if that's incorrect, perhaps that explains why mine got approved so easily. Or it could be because my thoroughly-renovated property was considered a non-contributing structure, even while my neighbor's dilapidated and generic bungalow across the street is considered contributing.

I did thoroughly review the ordinance restrictions before submitting the proposal to minimize potential issues, and my proposal sailed through their approval process as part of a consent agenda along with the majority. And looking at the meeting minutes from the most recent meeting posted (4/21), all of the proposals were approved that month. It's probably best to get in as soon as possible if the new rules are going to affect your plans (you'll have to submit a proposal at least 15 days prior to the next meeting to get on the agenda). The contacts listed on the CoA form were very helpful in getting through the process.

[RedScare]

Thank you for your response, 'Cuda. That was exactly the kind of guidance I was hoping for, someone who has been through the process.

[SilverJK]

That sounds like a lot of work, especially if you are just going to replace a door and some windows... so rediculous.

[RedScare]

That sounds like a lot of work, especially if you are just going to replace a door and some windows... so rediculous.

Well, that's why I opposed this stupid ordinance. But, now that it's enacted, what can I do? Knowing that there are "neighbors" who would snitch me out to the government, it's not like I could just ignore it.

For those who don't think snitching would occur, it already has.

[MOpens]

For those who don't think snitching would occur, it already has.

I do not know about actual snitching, but I do know that the pro-ordinance folks were out taking pictures of houses. I was told directly that they were taking pictures so it would be easier to show that unapproved changes were made.

[Marksmu]

Well, that's why I opposed this stupid ordinance. But, now that it's enacted, what can I do? Knowing that there are "neighbors" who would snitch me out to the government, it's not like I could just ignore it.

For those who don't think snitching would occur, it already has.

A person can do a surprisingly enormous amount of work on a Sunday....I'm not saying to do your work without a permit on a Sunday, I'm just saying a lot of work can be done on Sunday.