In DC, we need a metro

[mollusk]

The issue with the HOV lanes is that while lots of people use them, METRO was on the hook for construction costs.  Which was close to a billion dollars. 

 

The HOV lanes carry buses that generate about 30,000 riders/day.  I really wish that TxDOT picked up most of the tab for these lanes, as they are utilized well by drivers, but not necessarily P&R buses.  If METRO had constructed a $1 billion commuter rail system that only got around 30,000 daily riders (less than the original Red Line which cost $300 million) there'd be outrage. 

 

Yep.  Because everybody knows that roads > choo choos. 

[IronTiger]

The issue with the HOV lanes is that while lots of people use them, METRO was on the hook for construction costs.  Which was close to a billion dollars. 

 

The HOV lanes carry buses that generate about 30,000 riders/day.  I really wish that TxDOT picked up most of the tab for these lanes, as they are utilized well by drivers, but not necessarily P&R buses.  If METRO had constructed a $1 billion commuter rail system that only got around 30,000 daily riders (less than the original Red Line which cost $300 million) there'd be outrage.

I'll have to look it up again, but I seem to recall that the HOV lanes (at least the originals built along 10, 290, 45, etc.) was underwritten by the feds with transit funds. The $1B price tag, I imagine, was probably including the enormous park and rides built outside the Loop.

[Slick Vik]

Just spent the last week in philly and nyc and wow, it's amazing to spend significant time somewhere where having a car is a disadvantage. Grocery stores within a block, and anything else you need, plus subway to get you around town. Houston is 100 years behind. Another galaxy basically. I'm seriously considering moving to nyc in the near future.

[KinkaidAlum]

Wait, there's a grocery store within every block in Philly and NYC???? and everything else you need????

 

Exaggerate much?

[BigFootsSocks]

I know we like to pick on slick but you're the one who seems to be over exaggerating things...

[Slick Vik]

Wait, there's a grocery store within every block in Philly and NYC???? and everything else you need????

Exaggerate much?

Yes in most neighborhoods you have what you need within a 1-2 block radius. It's great.

[KinkaidAlum]

Yes in most neighborhoods you have what you need within a 1-2 block radius. It's great.

 

I've lived in NYC on the UWS. I've also lived in Boston. You cannot find a single block in NYC or Boston in which everything you need is within a 1-2 block radius. That is a stupid claim. 

 

Additionally, there are few large grocery stores in either city and the stores themselves can be hit or miss. What that means is that you likely have to stop at multiple stores to truly find what you want. 

[Slick Vik]

I've lived in NYC on the UWS. I've also lived in Boston. You cannot find a single block in NYC or Boston in which everything you need is within a 1-2 block radius. That is a stupid claim.

Additionally, there are few large grocery stores in either city and the stores themselves can be hit or miss. What that means is that you likely have to stop at multiple stores to truly find what you want.

Oh really? I'm sitting in an apartment right now in queens where within 2 blocks are 3 grocery stores, 3 corner stores, 2 barber shops, 2 bagel shops, 2 bakeries, a shoe repair shop, a subway station, a gym, some other miscellaneous shops, and numerous bars and restaurants. That would be enough for me and most people that live in the area.

[IronTiger]

Oh really? I'm sitting in an apartment right now in queens where within 2 blocks are 3 grocery stores, 3 corner stores, 2 barber shops, 2 bagel shops, 2 bakeries, a shoe repair shop, a subway station, a gym, some other miscellaneous shops, and numerous bars and restaurants. That would be enough for me and most people that live in the area.

Assuming that you're not lying outright, how does that translate to "most neighborhoods"?

[august948]

Yes in most neighborhoods you have what you need within a 1-2 block radius. It's great.

 

As long as you are willing to live a life limited to what you can get in 2 blocks, that's great.

 

[KinkaidAlum]

Oh really? I'm sitting in an apartment right now in queens where within 2 blocks are 3 grocery stores, 3 corner stores, 2 barber shops, 2 bagel shops, 2 bakeries, a shoe repair shop, a subway station, a gym, some other miscellaneous shops, and numerous bars and restaurants. That would be enough for me and most people that live in the area.

 

Is there a hospital? A doctor's office? A dentist's office? Your place of work? A school? A pharmacy? 

 

If so, then those are the largest blocks I have ever heard of or each building is 50+ stories tall. But, wait. You're in Queens so multiple 50 story towers is out of the question... so I think I am back to viewing you as disingenuous. 

[Slick Vik]

Is there a hospital? A doctor's office? A dentist's office? Your place of work? A school? A pharmacy?

If so, then those are the largest blocks I have ever heard of or each building is 50+ stories tall. But, wait. You're in Queens so multiple 50 story towers is out of the question... so I think I am back to viewing you as disingenuous.

Pharmacy yes, 2 in fact. Doctors office yes. Dentist office yes. Hospital and school no. Place of work Manhattan.

[Slick Vik]

Assuming that you're not lying outright, how does that translate to "most neighborhoods"?

Much of New York is like this. It's what makes its great city.

[Slick Vik]

As long as you are willing to live a life limited to what you can get in 2 blocks, that's great.

Except the subway can take you where you need to go.

[august948]

Except the subway can take you where you need to go.

 

That's interesting.  So can my car.  Or the Westheimer 82.  Or the Richmond 25.  Or my bicycle.

 

[IronTiger]

Pharmacy yes, 2 in fact. Doctors office yes. Dentist office yes. Hospital and school no. Place of work Manhattan.

Amazing how you pulled those answers out of your hat just as they were asked! The only place where I could see that you *might* be telling the truth is if you lived near a large shopping mall (yes, they do exist in NYC).

But I've also been to NYC (gasp!) and I can tell you that's not really true. Now if Starbucks was all you needed to sustain life, then great, I think that actually might be the case. There's plenty of restaurants, too, but not "all that you need in 2-3 blocks" in "most parts of the city". In fact, I could probably pick 5 places in NYC, Manhattan and Queens even just to be fair (not the Bronx or the place where there's actual houses, but in the city) and show that it's not true.

[KinkaidAlum]

3 Grocery Stores. 2 Pharmacies. Multiple corner stores. Medical and dental offices. Numerous bars and restaurants. Two barber shops. A gym. A subway station. Bakeries and bagel shops. Other stores.

 

Stop. Lying.

 

[Slick Vik]

Amazing how you pulled those answers out of your hat just as they were asked! The only place where I could see that you *might* be telling the truth is if you lived near a large shopping mall (yes, they do exist in NYC).

But I've also been to NYC (gasp!) and I can tell you that's not really true. Now if Starbucks was all you needed to sustain life, then great, I think that actually might be the case. There's plenty of restaurants, too, but not "all that you need in 2-3 blocks" in "most parts of the city". In fact, I could probably pick 5 places in NYC, Manhattan and Queens even just to be fair (not the Bronx or the place where there's actual houses, but in the city) and show that it's not true.

Because I'm right here.

[IronTiger]

Because I'm right here.

I'll call your bluff. Where is this mystery spot in NYC, if not your imagination? Cross streets.

[Slick Vik]

3 Grocery Stores. 2 Pharmacies. Multiple corner stores. Medical and dental offices. Numerous bars and restaurants. Two barber shops. A gym. A subway station. Bakeries and bagel shops. Other stores.

Stop. Lying.

Grocery stores

1. C town

2. Trade fair

3. Broadway Natural

Barber shops

1. Modern

2. Andreas

Pharmacies

1. Rite Aid

2. Bonus Drugs

Bagel shops

1. Bake away

2. Lots o bagels

Dentists

1. Love

2. Grigoratos

3. Joy dental

4. Long Island city family dental

5. Clifford

6. Astoria dental group

7. New century smile

8. Healthy smile dental

Restaurants

1. King of falafel and shawarma

2. Chicken souvlaki

3. Antijotos Mexicanos

4. The strand

5. Shabu shabu

6. Pao de quejio

7. Tamashi ramen

8. Carioca grill

9. Sac's

10. Fatima's

11. Osaka

12. Dunkin doughnuts

13. Dino's

Bakeries

1. Parisi bros

2. La gata golasa

Gym is synergy fitness club

Also, 2 florisits whose names I can't think of, one by c town and one across the street, a shoe repair shop, wine store, and 3 corner stores. And a Mexican food truck. Plus Broadway subway station. And 3 bars.

Educate yourself.

[Slick Vik]

That's interesting. So can my car. Or the Westheimer 82. Or the Richmond 25. Or my bicycle.

Does your car have full right of way to the center of the city in 20 minutes at any time day or night?

[KinkaidAlum]

You're in Astoria near Broadway. I've been there numerous times. Unless the location of the grocery stores have moved, they are nowhere near 1-2 blocks from each other. More like 6-8 blocks apart. Additionally, the average Houstonian would think all three of those stores suck. They cannot hold a candle to an HEB or Whole Foods or even a mediocre Kroger.

[Slick Vik]

You're in Astoria near Broadway. I've been there numerous times. Unless the location of the grocery stores have moved, they are nowhere near 1-2 blocks from each other. More like 6-8 blocks apart. Additionally, the average Houstonian would think all three of those stores suck. They cannot hold a candle to an HEB or Whole Foods or even a mediocre Kroger.

What are you talking about? Obviously you haven't been to Astoria in the last 3 years. C town and trade fair are 1 block away from each other. And Broadway natural is a smaller grocery store with natural/organic goods. Those stores are good enough for the people that live there, having a grocery store within a 2-3 minute walk is pretty great. And now comparing size of grocery stores is a straw man argument. I said grocery stores not comparison of square footage.

[KinkaidAlum]

I just wasted five minutes reading yelp/foursquare reviews of the stores you mention.

 

If those are your cup of tea, more power to you!

 

I'll stick with Whole Foods, Central Market, HEB, and Fresh Market. 

 

That said, both of the larger stores you mention, and I use that term loosely, brag about their free parking. Some urban oasis...

 

 

 

[Slick Vik]

I just wasted five minutes reading yelp/foursquare reviews of the stores you mention.

If those are your cup of tea, more power to you!

I'll stick with Whole Foods, Central Market, HEB, and Fresh Market.

That said, both of the larger stores you mention, and I use that term loosely, brag about their free parking. Some urban oasis...

This is called moving the goalposts.

[IronTiger]

The problem is, you're promoting quantity over quality. It would be like saying the suburbs have a great dining scene because of a massive proliferation of chain restaurants. Groceries are another interesting thing. I'm really into supermarket history and stuff (see my posts elsewhere on HAIF for that), and what's really interesting about New York is that it has no supermarkets that I've heard of. Washington DC and San Francisco have Safeway, which is hit-and-miss over there, Boston has Shaw's/Star Market (a part of the greater Albertsons chain, soon to be joined with Safeway), even Stop & Shop doesn't have outposts there. What you end up having is overpriced and underwhelming stores—there's one store that starts with a G, sounds vaguely Italian...can't be bothered to look it up but if you knew NYC you'd know what I was talking about...and the supermarkets I have heard of before end up having lines out the door (like Trader Joe's).

Secondly, you never were able to answer my question of how is this "most neighborhoods". Just for fun, I "went" to 189 Spring Street in Google Maps, which you should be able to identify why this address is significant, and all I found within a few blocks were mostly high fashion outlets ("outlet" in this term being a generic term, not "outlet" as in "outlet mall on the highway") with maybe one convenience store and a smattering of restaurants within 2 blocks (long-ways and short-ways). And of course, a Starbucks.

EDIT: I could probably find more examples, but I do have a life

[Slick Vik]

The problem is, you're promoting quantity over quality. It would be like saying the suburbs have a great dining scene because of a massive proliferation of chain restaurants. Groceries are another interesting thing. I'm really into supermarket history and stuff (see my posts elsewhere on HAIF for that), and what's really interesting about New York is that it has no supermarkets that I've heard of. Washington DC and San Francisco have Safeway, which is hit-and-miss over there, Boston has Shaw's/Star Market (a part of the greater Albertsons chain, soon to be joined with Safeway), even Stop & Shop doesn't have outposts there. What you end up having is overpriced and underwhelming stores—there's one store that starts with a G, sounds vaguely Italian...can't be bothered to look it up but if you knew NYC you'd know what I was talking about...and the supermarkets I have heard of before end up having lines out the door (like Trader Joe's).

Secondly, you never were able to answer my question of how is this "most neighborhoods". Just for fun, I "went" to 189 Spring Street in Google Maps, which you should be able to identify why this address is significant, and all I found within a few blocks were mostly high fashion outlets ("outlet" in this term being a generic term, not "outlet" as in "outlet mall on the highway") with maybe one convenience store and a smattering of restaurants within 2 blocks (long-ways and short-ways). And of course, a Starbucks.

EDIT: I could probably find more examples, but I do have a life

I went to both c town and trade fair in the last few days and while they aren't gargantuan stores they seem to have what most people get: fruit, vegetables, poultry, fish, bread, cereals, frozen foods, milk, yogurt, other miscellaneous things. They maximize the space they have. It's just a matter of expectations. Here people are used to having space so they won't be happy without it. So just because they don't fit your definition of what you're used to doesn't make them illegitimate. Who's the elitist now?

[august948]

Does your car have full right of way to the center of the city in 20 minutes at any time day or night?

 

I rarely need to go into the center of the city because where I'm at we've got full size grocery stores (HEB, Kroger, Randall's, Fiesta, Phoenecia, Hong Kong, My Hoa, Viet Hoa, the list goes on) 2 walmarts, 2 targets, enough restaurants that you can eat in a different one each day and it would take many years to hit them all, a couple of hospitals, too many pharmacies, banks, stores of all nature.  All well within 20 minutes, most within 5 to 10 minutes.

 

As the crow files, it's only about 3 miles from Astoria to Rockefeller Center.  If I lived only 3 miles from the center of the city, I could be there within 20 minutes at any time, day or night, and still have a larger place to live and a far greater selection of necessities and niceties. 

 

[august948]

I went to both c town and trade fair in the last few days and while they aren't gargantuan stores they seem to have what most people get: fruit, vegetables, poultry, fish, bread, cereals, frozen foods, milk, yogurt, other miscellaneous things. They maximize the space they have. It's just a matter of expectations. Here people are used to having space so they won't be happy without it. So just because they don't fit your definition of what you're used to doesn't make them illegitimate. Who's the elitist now?

 

That sounds like an Aldi's.  Not bad if all you want are the basics in life.  No wonder New York and New Jersey rank number 2 and number 1, respectively, in states people move away from.

 

[The Pragmatist]

I was in Long Island City last year. The hotel I was at was a 15 minute walk to a subway station, 5-7 minute walk to some restaurants, and there was not much else around. The nearest grocery store had to be at least 20 minutes by walking from where I was. Just a bunch of row houses otherwise. I was looking right at the Queensboro Bridge and Manhattan. I don't know how you translate your fantasy land to all of NYC, but don't be dishonest, Slick. That said, just because that appeals to you doesn't mean it appeals to everyone. Perhaps Houston can develop in its way whilst New York develops in its own way. It's called variety. That old saying "different strokes for different folks" comes to mind.