Greg Abbott

[august948]

22 hours ago, mattyt36 said:

Well by this point I have been conditioned not to expect any careful consideration of any of the points being made.  At least I got an acknowledgment, "Well I see it, too," so I suppose that is an improvement.

The divergence seems to be that what I am seeing is a "dog and pony show," as if it is some cycle in American politics that we've seen before and somehow have "grown out of."  If that's the case, then please provide me with some modern examples of similar scale . . . I'm all ears!  Maybe the John Birch Society?  Don't think they were anywhere near this successful, not to mention they were disowned and exiled by the Republican Party.  I will stipulate they were equally bonkers and cruel, though.

It's either that "none of this is real" or the "real" problem is "yellow journalism," which you keep on bringing up, Lord knows why.  (Is Will Hurd, a former CIA officer and congressman and current Republican a victim of this “yellow journalism” that seems to explain it all to you?) The implication being, what?  That it's not really a problem that congressional candidates are talking about the possibility of legislating the practice of killing women for getting an abortion per se, but rather that the media reports on it?  I guess linked with the "dog and pony show" reference, I should surmise that your view is that (1) people have been making such comments in the background for a long period of time; (2) in the past the media just ignored it; and (3) it was just a bunch of people "shooting the shart" so to say that didn't really mean anything.

I suppose that is possible.  Sounds pretty naive if you ask me.  Even if you believed that, you'd have to agree that the circumstances have totally changed with this stuff all out in the open and amplified.  Why would one default to a position that what happened in the past when the circumstances were different will happen again?

As far as misunderstandings go, I also think it's possible that you've misunderstood the entirety of my point.  Or you do, but still choose to throw out straw men.  Nowhere in any of the above am I arguing that if people really do have a moral argument against abortion or transgender people or gay wedding cakes do they have an obligation to vote for a party that contradicts their position on those issues.  I have not proposed anyone be thrown in any sort of Gulag, or held that the right of free speech only applies to "woke" positions.  Or that guns should go in closets or by beds or in the kitchen or not at all . . . your fixation on it has been duly noted.  I am saying we should all be worried when it's a common turn of phrase in the context of "Well we may disagree on this issue, but I want to remind you that only one side has all the guns . . . hehehehe LOLz"  (Incidentally, I'm not sure why all you gun owners think that any situation in which everyday Americans are using guns each other is going to be "controlled" enough in any way where the "good guys" win . . . I mean that sounds pretty self-evidently ridiculous on its face, if you ask me, but best of luck to you, Augie, in the crossfire.)

I'm saying that what constitutes normal, run-of-the-mill Republicanism these days--and acceptable political discourse on that side--is crazy and runs fully counter to the ideals this country was built upon.  Why?  Because the endgame appears to be to shove all of the Republican superstitions about sex, race, gender, the "role of government," etc. down the throats of those they disagree with, with any appreciation of the "freedoms" guaranteed by the constitution be damned.  "If my religion thinks abortion is wrong, well no one can have one, and don't be surprised when we kill you for it."  "If I don't think the country is racist, I'm going to ban every institution of the state from teaching otherwise."  "If I don't get gender dysphoria, well I'm still going to force little Timmy to wear some jeans and a jock strap."  "If I think Trump won, well the rest of the country is going to have to recognize it!"  I know the "whatabout" instinct is that the left is also trying to jam this down the throat of the country, but nowhere are there parallel and central policy positions like there are in conservative whack-a-doodle land.  Maybe a "don't discriminate," but nothing like any sort of movement to "Don't say God" in the classroom.  

I mean, come on! It's why the "mainstream" Republican intelligentsia (e.g., the Claremont Institute) and prominent enough Republican sociopolitical figures (e.g., Rod Dreher) are now openly integralists and calling for an entirely new political system fused with religion, and (I would qualify the following with "until recently," but I really don't think their position has changed) exactly why they idolize Vladimir Putin--and entirely unironically, mind you.  The Russian economy has for a long time been absolute crap and there are no universally enforced freedoms . . . it's just political patronage.  Why in the hell would anyone in the United States of America want to emulate Russia?  Or Pinochet's Chile?  Or Franco's Spain?  All of these are political systems antithetical to our own.  Again, this is not good for any average voter--Republican or Democrat.  It is a recipe for a suicide of the American experiment and our leading position in the world--and all for the sake of a bunch of nutjobs to have even more power?

Do you not think it's good (and conservative) advice to take people at their word?

You're welcome to take anything anyone ever says seriously and paint everyone else with a broad brush if you'd like, but I don't think that reflects reality.  Personally, I'm not inclined to go down every rabbit hole, track down every nutjob and analyze every word they say.  As I've said before, our current media environment encourages and rewards the magnification of the extreme.  What is said and what is done are frequently two very different things, especially in politics.  What, for instance, would constitute "legislating the practice of killing women for getting an abortion", as you said above?  Is there a bill on the floor of the House or Senate that's being considered?  Do you really, truly believe that a bill that proscribes the death penalty for abortion would pass Congress, be signed into law by the President and be upheld by the Supreme Court?  You can play that game 24/7/365 with all kinds of imaginary legislation.  As I recall, there was in the past year or so a call from some people to deny medical treatment to anyone not vaccinated against covid.  To let them die in the streets.  Should we take that seriously as well?  To dial it back a few years, when Obama was elected president there was a flurry of horseflurf about how the America we know and love would be destroyed forever, how America was about to become a socialist country.  Guess what, America is still here and still much the same as it was prior.  I'm sure you also remember the dire predictions from Democratic party operatives upon Trump's election in 2016.  How it was the Weimar republic all over again and the nazi's were taking over.  And yet we're all still here.

 

 

[august948]

On 3/28/2022 at 9:17 AM, mattyt36 said:

Well, we've got August's vote . . . there's absolutely nothing to see here when politicians talk about killing women from availing themselves of a procedure that was entirely legal one hot minute ago.  Or the former National Security Advisor taking oaths to a cult centered around child sex trafficking.  Or having elected officials talk about Civil War.  Or having the cult-susceptible wife of a Supreme Court justice and a high-profile, longtime Republican activist trying to impose her YouTube-inspired fever dreams on the government of the United States cuz that's how she feelz and that's what she "hopes is true" (her own words, multiple times, from wet ballots to Trump rounding up elected officials and sending them to Guantanamo).  

I can't say I admire your glibness and cynicism, but I will at least say I sincerely hope you're right and I'm wrong.  I just don't have the same faith in the red proletariat that you do.  You get people this riled up, they're going to demand catharsis somehow.  Always great when they are hoarding guns, too.  (Not keeping "guns in the closet," Augie, ha ha ha, total LOLz, but talking about their stash of guns in the context of an inevitable Civil War, Part Deux, The Elimination of the Woke.)  See Sixth, January, 2021.  In case you don't believe me, why not ask Gretchen Whitmer to give you a rundown of her first-hand experience?

Maybe, at the end of the day, you're seeing everything I'm seeing and the truth of the matter is you just like it.  Cuz, seriously, it really doesn't take much to say, "Now that you mention it, some of those things are pretty kooky and I can at least see the argument that they could spin out of control.  I don't personally believe it, mind you, but I'd give it, say, a 0.1% chance."  Or, let's step back a couple messages . . . how about answering this simple question . . . "Would you trade the Texas Republican Party of today for the Texas Republican Party of yore?"  Hell, not even yore, let's just go with 2017!  If the answer is yes, well that's certainly saying something!

(Do you really think you're saying anything with this reflexive whataboutism, incidentally?  Someone mentions MTG and all you have to do is mention AOC and the left-wing media in some sort of ritual, and it somehow cancels everything out?  (Nevermind it's not even a valid comparison . . . see how AOC has been managed by the party versus MTG . . . there's a big difference, and I'm not talking about the obvious fact that once again is the real point here . . . AOC isn't out saying batflurf crazy things on the daily . . . you may disagree with her policy positions, but she isn't giving a limp shrug at the possibility of Americans killing other Americans while clapping and yelling "WOO-HOO!")  Or that you can say, "the reality is that neither one is all that important in the grand scheme of things" as if it is some incontrovertible truth and is really saying anything at the end of the day.  How about replacing "The reality is that . . . " with "I think that," which is an entirely more accurate statement (have you ever considered you may be wrong?).  I suspect it is because such word choice would obligate you to express at least some scintilla of reasoning as to why you are so convinced.  I mean, I get the condescending tone, the advisory about "rabbit holes" (no "rabbit holes" there, Augie . . . nothing I cited is the output of "yellow journalism," all of it actually happened) . . . surely someone who so happily condescends would actually engage on the merits?)

 

I feel sorry for poor Jen Psaki having to constantly deal with her boss going off script. 

To borrow from your post...

Has Nancy Pelosi demanded yet that he give up the nuclear codes like she did with Trump?  It might be a good idea for her to do so considering Biden's ongoing gaffes.  He might push Putin into thinking he's being backed into a corner. 

Or do you suppose her demand at the time was political theater?  Hmmm...I wonder...

[mattyt36]

I think Will Hurd summed it best: America has a proportionality problem.  And this conversation is a great example.

Edited March 30, 2022 by mattyt36

[mattyt36]

Oh yippee, Gov Hot Wheelz wants to ban instruction of undocumented immigrants. How totally Christian of him. What could possibly go wrong with a bunch of uneducated poor kids who can’t get a job? Obviously another cog in his brilliant crimefighting strategy. Either that or maybe Hot Wheelz visited Managua recently and liked what he saw. Or the most likely scenario, that he’s jealous of all the attention Governor “Gin Blossom” DeSantis is getting and wants to make sure he can poll at least 2% in the 2024 presidential primary. Regardless, one thing’s for sure … he’s not doing what’s in the interest of the State of Texas.

What an odious excuse of a human being, a man who doesn’t even know what the words “good governance” means and a total embarrassment to boot.

Edited May 7, 2022 by mattyt36

[august948]

7 hours ago, mattyt36 said:

Oh yippee, Gov Hot Wheelz wants to ban instruction of undocumented immigrants. How totally Christian of him. What could possibly go wrong with a bunch of uneducated poor kids who can’t get a job? Obviously another cog in his brilliant crimefighting strategy. Either that or maybe Hot Wheelz visited Managua recently and liked what he saw. Or the most likely scenario, that he’s jealous of all the attention Governor “Gin Blossom” DeSantis is getting and wants to make sure he can poll at least 2% in the 2024 presidential primary. Regardless, one thing’s for sure … he’s not doing what’s in the interest of the State of Texas.

What an odious excuse of a human being, a man who doesn’t even know what the words “good governance” means and a total embarrassment to boot.

I thought we were going to bus them all to Delaware so those taxpayers can pay for it.

[mattyt36]

On 5/7/2022 at 8:36 PM, august948 said:

I thought we were going to bus them all to Delaware so those taxpayers can pay for it.

No FOX News outlet there, although maybe if Tucker does a "road show" at the Hunter Biden laptop repair shop (what a story!), maybe Greg from Gregg Co will phone a friend (Rebekah Mercer?) for some cash to bus them up there.

[editor]

On 5/7/2022 at 8:36 PM, august948 said:

I thought we were going to bus them all to Delaware so those taxpayers can pay for it.

Some were, but it backfired.  There was an article and photo in the newspaper showing the immigrants being welcomed with open arms by various relocation groups.

Many cities and states are happy to have immigrants (that's why so many sign up for refugees from overseas).  More immigrants = more federal money. 

[mollusk]

1 hour ago, editor said:

Some were, but it backfired.  There was an article and photo in the newspaper showing the immigrants being welcomed with open arms by various relocation groups.

Many cities and states are happy to have immigrants (that's why so many sign up for refugees from overseas).  More immigrants = more federal money. 

Some of us are old enough to remember when welcoming refugees (regardless of the reason for displacement) and helping them resettle was considered a very American thing to do.

[Ross]

8 minutes ago, mollusk said:

Some of us are old enough to remember when welcoming refugees (regardless of the reason for displacement) and helping them resettle was considered a very American thing to do.

Like the refugees from Viet Nam, Cambodia, etc that were welcomed here in the 70's and 80's.

[august948]

2 hours ago, Ross said:

Like the refugees from Viet Nam, Cambodia, etc that were welcomed here in the 70's and 80's.

There's a big difference between refugees from war zones, particularly those from allied countries and those who worked with our government and military, and whom the federal government deliberately welcomed as legal immigrants and economic migrants who cross our borders illegally in hopes of gaming our system and being allowed to stay.

[august948]

4 hours ago, editor said:

Some were, but it backfired.  There was an article and photo in the newspaper showing the immigrants being welcomed with open arms by various relocation groups.

Many cities and states are happy to have immigrants (that's why so many sign up for refugees from overseas).  More immigrants = more federal money. 

Is Texas getting more federal money to directly offset the additional costs to state and local governments?  That seems to be Abbots point in this (besides the political spectacle)

[mattyt36]

19 hours ago, august948 said:

Is Texas getting more federal money to directly offset the additional costs to state and local governments?  That seems to be Abbots point in this (besides the political spectacle)

But that's not really what he's doing, is it?  He has announced he is suing to overturn Pyler v Doe, which would end the federal mandate to school all children.  He is not seeking increased funding, and if he wins, there won't be any increased funding.  Just a bunch of school-age undocumented immigrants--most of them here through no fault of their own--with nothing to do all day.  Again, what could possibly go wrong?

Anyway, there's not an ounce of strategy or real policy "chops" in Texas Republican Party politics--just the political spectacle.  These people are all now so high on their own supply (criminalizing parents of transgender children and turning neighbor against neighbor when it comes to abortions), they have to get even more of a rush by taking the culture wars even farther--to the absolute detriment of Texans.  The minimum requirement for a governor should be that the person is actually interested in governance, not stoking culture wars, or what's more likely, coming in 10th in the 2024 Republican presidential primary.  What a waste, and we're just along for the ride.

[editor]

20 hours ago, august948 said:

Is Texas getting more federal money to directly offset the additional costs to state and local governments?  That seems to be Abbots point in this (besides the political spectacle)

The federal money I was talking about was the kind cities and states get for residents.  School funding, and things like that. 

[august948]

Saw this and just couldn't help myself...

[mattyt36]

37 minutes ago, august948 said:

Saw this and just couldn't help myself...

Well, Augie, you do have a little 5 year old boy in you, I mean with the toy gun fetish and all. So I’m not surprised that the above reference to a 30-year old hot sauce commercial gives you the gigglies. After all, it’s the second time you’ve indirectly referenced it today. 

What I am surprised about, however, is that the meme creator spelled surprise with the first “R,” which puts them a rung or two above the average Republican these days. They can’t spell O’Rourke correctly, though, which is totally ironic given the “I’m not surprised” comment. So I place the education somewhere around the 7th-8th grade level. (Or maybe homeschooled?) Regardless, definitely seems qualified to write for one of @Blue Dogs favorite political tabloids. Color me … not surprised. “Stupid is as stupid does,” I believe is a contemporary enough turn of phrase for “Get a rope.”

Edited May 25, 2022 by mattyt36

[Reefmonkey]

On 3/15/2022 at 5:20 PM, Blue Dogs said:

Like I've said before: Abbott's getting reelected in a massive landslide victory on November 8th:

It's interesting what happens when you put the above map of party preference by county next to the below map of population density (ie, where all the people live) by county.

 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Reefmonkey

[mattyt36]

11 hours ago, Reefmonkey said:

It's interesting what happens when you put the above map of party preference by county next to the below map of population density (ie, where all the people live) by county.

 

Now there’s the systems thinking I was expecting! 👍 But kind of mean, there, @Reefmonkey showing the population densities in shades of red and Harris County being solid red. It’s definitely going to confuse the poor chap! 🤣

In, other news, our illustrious Governor Hot Wheels, in a typical display of true crisis leadership, said today “On any given weekend more people get killed in Chicago than we have schools in Texas, so therefore gun control is not an option.”

I mean, I guess if Dubya said it I guess it would’ve been entertaining, but it’s almost like Wheelz is being just a tad bit disingenuous? And why is it always Chicago? Hmmmm …

Edited May 26, 2022 by mattyt36

[august948]

8 hours ago, mattyt36 said:

Now there’s the systems thinking I was expecting! 👍 But kind of mean, there, @Reefmonkey showing the population densities in shades of red and Harris County being solid red. It’s definitely going to confuse the poor chap! 🤣

In, other news, our illustrious Governor Hot Wheels, in a typical display of true crisis leadership, said today “On any given weekend more people get killed in Chicago than we have schools in Texas, so therefore gun control is not an option.”

I mean, I guess if Dubya said it I guess it would’ve been entertaining, but it’s almost like Wheelz is being just a tad bit disingenuous? And why is it always Chicago? Hmmmm …

Not sure what is disingenuous about opposition to gun control by the governor (Hot Wheelz?)  I'm quite sure he doesn't consider gun controls an option.  As for Chicago, that has been the go-to example for failed liberal leadership in recent years.  Chicago has gun controls and yet they aren't any safer.  You can make the argument that part of that is because criminals ignore the laws and law-abiding citizens obey them.  Imposing gun controls has the effect disarming the good guys while not disarming the bad guys, and perhaps encouraging them.  Thus it is not a real option.

[mattyt36]

1 hour ago, august948 said:

Not sure what is disingenuous about opposition to gun control by the governor (Hot Wheelz?)  I'm quite sure he doesn't consider gun controls an option.  As for Chicago, that has been the go-to example for failed liberal leadership in recent years.  Chicago has gun controls and yet they aren't any safer.  You can make the argument that part of that is because criminals ignore the laws and law-abiding citizens obey them.  Imposing gun controls has the effect disarming the good guys while not disarming the bad guys, and perhaps encouraging them.  Thus it is not a real option.

You see, Augie, I don’t agree with your logic, but at least you presented some. It’s why I think, even though we disagree on a lot politically, you are a sensible and thoughtful guy, not full on whack-o like others. The Guv just race-baited, plain and simple. Only the latest in the long list of disqualifiers.

[Reefmonkey]

I am no fan of Abbott by any means, but can we please maintain a standard in this forum that we don’t make derogatory comments about someone that target their disability (ie. calling Abbott “Governor Hotwheelz”)? Even when directed at one particular person, such comments demean all people with disabilities. @editor

[mattyt36]

15 minutes ago, Reefmonkey said:

I am no fan of Abbott by any means, but can we please maintain a standard in this forum that we don’t make derogatory comments about someone that target their disability (ie. calling Abbott “Governor Hotwheelz”)? Even when directed at one particular person, such comments demean all people with disabilities. @editor

People who have consistently shown they have zero empathy are deserving of the same.

(And we both know where this is coming from … those damned bruises… 🙄)

Edited May 26, 2022 by mattyt36

[Reefmonkey]

I made a general statement so as not to call you out specifically, with the hope that a non confrontational appeal to decency and consideration for other disabled people not named Greg Abbott might appeal to your better angels. But yes, people who habitually fire off personal insults and derogatory comments usually do it because they have a lot of bruises; I’m trying to be compassionate  about yours. 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Reefmonkey

[mattyt36]

“Everybody’s gotta have a job”

 

[mattyt36]

From the files of batflurf crazy . . . @august948 and I have talked back and forth on other threads about the risks involved to the economy if the state government continues to take such radical turns.  (In short, he doesn't think it's a real problem.)  I just don't see how something like this would be conducive to Texas continuing to be a place where businesses overwhelmingly choose to relocate.  It should be no surprise who'd be running the state in the fever dream of these manchild AR15-toting revolutionaries (spoiler alert--it's themselves . . . shocker!), and I challenge anyone to describe the circumstances under which being under such leadership would result in anything positive for the vast majority of Texans.  Seriously, what message does this send to the rest of the country or, better yet, the world?  Sadly, I fear the GOP has fully opened Pandora's Box by giving the time of day to these nutcases.

Texas secession from the U.S. — GOP wants Texans to vote on it (houstonchronicle.com)

Edited June 20, 2022 by mattyt36

[mattyt36]

I hope these Mothers Against Greg Abbott produce another 50 of these highly appropriate ads.

Greg Abbott's Anti-Abortion Stance Attacked in Powerful Satirical Advert (newsweek.com)

[mattyt36]

“Best Governor in Texas History” as I have heard on here

or

”It Could Have Been Worse”?

Hopefully people wake up and realize that the current Oppositional Defiant Disorder (i.e., “Lib Owning”) style of politics is not a path to anything greater or grander, and could very well be a path to disaster. Hello Mississippi!