Air India Airlines

[KimberlySayWhat]

Delhi, this is Houston: come, fly to us

Fourth largest US city competes with Dallas as

[ricco67]

[unpc]

[sing]

"Who needs the quickie mart?...."

[/sing]

[/unpc]

Cool! I hope they pick Houston, lord knows there is enough of a community to support them here to begin with.

What is the asian indian population in Dallas/FT Worth V. Houston?

[HOUCAJUN]

It seems like a no brainer to choose houston.

[Talbot]

I really hope they choose Houston as well. I will be disappointed if it goes to Dallas.

[tamtagon]

I found this India Tribune article link, reiterating much of the Indian Express article, but with additional demographic info:

http://www.indiatribune.com/popuparticle.aspx?Article_ID=92

A few highlights:

-John Massey, manager of Air-India

[RedScare]

This is a repeat of a previous thread. As in that thread, I found it humorous that the Indians in Dallas swear that their population has increased over 30,000 in 4 years. They are as guilty of naked boosterism as some of their American counterparts.

[tamtagon]

This is a repeat of a previous thread.  As in that thread, I found it humorous that the Indians in Dallas swear that their population has increased over 30,000 in 4 years.  They are as guilty of naked boosterism as some of their American counterparts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If you can disprove the population growth, please do.

Considering that the Metroplex population has increased by more than 150,000 every year for the past five years, I can believe than 7,500 of the new residents are from India. To me, the most significant datum is that an Indian population of 80,000 in 2004 would be a 60% increase of that dempgraphic. However, knowing that many tens of thousands of Indians have immigrated to the U.S. every year for the past five years, it is very reasonable, even logical, than 7,500 would have found their way to the Metroplex each year. Being on average a very educated demographic, the employment markets in Dallas are well suited to Indians; additionally the high occurance of Indians in medical and technical research industries, one would naturally expect a large number of Indians being drawn to Dallas' educational institutions, UT-Southwestern and UT-Dallas, two of the world's foremost research universities.

[houstonsemipro]

It's Houston hands down. Why should they fly to Dallas, and Houston more international?

[Casual Observer]

Dallas sucks! Metroplex sucks! Fort Worth is cool..

(Vain attempt to start a flame-war and pointlessly shut down another thread..)

[RedScare]

tamtagon,

Given the US government's general inhospitable attitude toward immigration since 2001, and given that the US has limited employee Visas to try to protect american workers, I seriously doubt the increase of 60%, especially considering the predominant location for asian indian immigration is California. But, if it works for you, that's fine.

Interestingly, you mention medical and technical research as two reasons that Asian Indians would migrate to Dallas. Houston has the largest medical research complex in the world in the Texas Medical Center. Also, while Dallas is home to many fine industries, Houston is the Petrochemical capital, which is a very engineering intensive industry.

Given these truths, and the fact that Houston's 2000 Asian Indian population was 120,000, one could suppose Houston's Asian Indian population is now 60% higher as well, at 192,000, or more.

I doubt it, but using your logic, it is possible.

[tamtagon]

It's Houston hands down. Why should they fly to Dallas, and Houston more international?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Air India will probably chose the airport which makes them the most money. Either way, there will be a healthy number of connecting flights between Houston and Dallas, so whatever. I would also imagine that as the state's Asian populations growth occurs primarily in Houston and the Metroplex, both Intercontinental and DFW will have end up with direct Air India service - they just bought 50 of those giant Boeing airplanes.

Despite the larger Indian population in Houston, I'm inclined to say DFW is the better choice for Air India's entry into the Southcentral US. Better domestic connectivity through DFW may allow Air India to serve the greatest number of Indian-Americans through DFW rather then Intercontinential; one vital question would be, how many Indians live in West Texas, New Mexico, Colorado, Nebraska, Kansas, Oklahoma and Arkansas? My preference would be the airport which most benefits the state, all the city-specific cheerleaders must recognize that cooperative efforts from Houston and Dallas in the world marketplace will advance the quality of life throughout the state better than individual efforts.

I certainly like the idea that Air India increases Houston's International face value, but I like just as much the idea that Air India increases DFW's air traffic market share. Since the Port of Houston's inland annex (aka Dallas Agile Port) is mounting intrest among Chinese air carrier service through DFW, perhaps Houston can be the first with new flights to India and Dallas can be the first with new flights to China, big whoop-tee-do for the drill team and pep squad. The real question is what best advances Texas as a stand alone trading partener to the rest of the world.

[tamtagon]

Vain attempts to start a flame-war and pointlessly shut down another thread sucks more than Dallas and Houston combined. Let the grown-ups talk, mkay?

I seriously doubt the increase of 60%, especially considering the predominant location for asian indian immigration is California. But, if it works for you, that's fine.

Given these truths, and the fact that Houston's 2000 Asian Indian population was 120,000, one could suppose Houston's Asian Indian population is now 60% higher as well, at 192,000, or more.

I doubt it, but using your logic, it is possible.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, just to be clear, 60% population increase is an observation, not deduction of logic. Between the prominent research facilities and the well established industry leaders found in Dallas and Houston, the I-45 corridor can be very attractive to just about everyone. I think it would be cool if Houston's Indian population was closer to 200,000, at that level, the people could develop a self-sustaining Indian subset of the greater American culture. Although, the cultural variation in India is greater than that in America, and I have no idea of the break-out of similarly raised Indians within the Texas Indian population.

Doesnt the Census estimates for 2004 come out sometime in July???? I'm on the edge of my seat for those data for several reasons, and I kinda hope the Census data are available before Air India announces the airport choice. It will be fun to speculate on Air India's airport decision based on Indian population trends in the two biggest population centers in Texas.

California is the predominant entry point for the bulk of Asian immigration, correct, but the high cost of living is an even more compelling reason among immigrants to leave CA than it is for Americans. With each passing day, Texas (Houston and Dallas in particular) becomes more welcoming to immigrants as culture shock is reduced by the growing immigrant population.

I dont know - hopefully for Asians of all ethnicities, Texas with Houston and Dallas will provide higher quality of life than California with San Francisco and Los Angeles. It's clear to me that the influence of Texan Culture will eventually lead relationships and interactions between American and Latin American populations since elementary schools in Texas will soon teach the ABC's in English and Spanish. CA and FL both missed the boat with a restrictive and devicive English-only educational approach.

Others will follow Air India, so I'm sure this general topic will occur again. Nonstop flights between European and Texas cities may represent greater growth potential than with Asian cities. Continental and American both despirately need increased international-to-domestic connection activity at their respective homebases.

[Casual Observer]

Vain attempts to start a flame-war and pointlessly shut down another thread sucks more than Dallas and Houston combined.  Let the grown-ups talk, mkay?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ha! This is coming from someone arguing about where Air India is going to land. I have to ask though, unless you're Indian, fly to India, or work for either Airport or any of their subsidiaries, then why would you care??

Who cares where they land?

[RedScare]

Others will follow Air India, so I'm sure this general topic will occur again.  Nonstop flights between European and Texas cities may represent greater growth potential than with Asian cities.  Continental and American both despirately need increased international-to-domestic connection activity at their respective homebases.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I disagree on this point. Continental is pushing hard into South America, trying to make IAH the south American gateway. And Chinese and Indian growth prospects dwarf Europe. Asia is relatively underserved, compared to Europe. I think you'll see both airports agressively pursue both SA and Asian destinations and airlines. Air India, regardless of which airport gets them, is an example of the aggressive pursuit.

[CincoRanch-HoustonResident]

I hope we get Air India. Either way it will boost the Texas economy.

[VicMan]

"I disagree on this point. Continental is pushing hard into South America, trying to make IAH the south American gateway. And Chinese and Indian growth prospects dwarf Europe. Asia is relatively underserved, compared to Europe. I think you'll see both airports agressively pursue both SA and Asian destinations and airlines. Air India, regardless of which airport gets them, is an example of the aggressive pursuit.

"

Europe is underserved from IAH. There is only service to London Gatwick, London Heathrow (British Airways via Chicago), Paris, Amsterdam, and Frankfurt.

I believe service to Madrid, Rome, Frankfurt (on Continental), and Zurich would work for Continental, while Alitalia should serve Milan..

Dallas has service to Gatwick, Paris, Zurich, and Frankfurt.

[CaptAWACS]

Air India will not serve both DFW and IAH. Jet Airways could come into the airport that does not get AI service, but one nonstop service is plenty to serve the O&D market of Texas and the South Central US. At the moment the servive is Houston's to lose. Better alliance connections, a larger Indian O&D population, and contrary to some posts above, better connecting ops to North America from IAH. IAH is already the biggest int'l service airport in Texas and the AI service would be a welcome addition. Next up look for service to Maracaibo, and hopefully Pakistan Int'l Air will be allowed 5th freedom rights to Manchester from IAH. As for students, The Texas Medical Centre already has more and better instituitions than the Dallas ones listed above, making the South Asian connections mute for that sector.

Here is a good link to this discussion at airliners.net

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/gener...d.main/2207162/

edit to fix link

Ciao, and Hook 'em Horns,

Capt-AWACS, Not all pilots are alcoholics, we don't go to meetings

[tamtagon]

Air India will not serve both DFW and IAH. Jet Airways could come into the airport that does not get AI service, but one nonstop service is plenty to serve the O&D market of Texas and the South Central US.

Hopefully in the future Air India & Jet Airways both will have good reason at least to consider servicing both destinations. Over the next decade, the two airports should capture most new international flights into the middle of the country.

How much more traffic can IAH handle? I do think Houston gives a better first Texas experience for foreign travelers.

[MidtownCoog]

Considering Pakistan Airlines flies to IAH, I think we will also see Air India.

It's the one-ups-manship thing.

How much more traffic can IAH handle?

Two new runways are planned that will parallel Jones Rd.

[RedScare]

Jones Road?

[MidtownCoog]

d'OH!

Greens Road

[HeightsGuy]

I think Tamtagon is close to the right answer, but for the wrong reasons. I don't have a prediction, but I think Air India will pick the route that makes the most money, and I think demographics plays a part in this, but I don't think it's the top priority. If you're Indian and need to get to India, you'll get there no matter where the route is. The decision here has more to do with business travel I believe. Lot's of US companies are opening offices in India as the offshoring of technology continues.

[MidtownCoog]

No way they will serve both.

These flight will be at the most, two a week.

[RedScare]

d'OH!

Greens Road

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That makes more sense. Thanks, Coog.

[MidtownCoog]

Yes, and it's going to be nasty.

A couple of subdivisions are going to be bought out on the east side of 59.

[skwatra]

i was actually just talking to my dad about this yesterday, we were in dallas. he has lived in houston for a while now, but used to live in dallas and still has lots of friends there. his guess (we're indian) is no matter how many indians they have in dallas, there are probably twice as many in the houston area. obviously i have nothing to back this up, just his thoughts from spending time in both places, knowing people, attending events, number of stores/restaurants, etc.

it would be great for air india to fly out of here, but it really wouldn't affect us that much as consumers. all flights would still stop in europe, so why would we take air india when we could fly air france or klm, get continental miles and better service for the same price? our biggest wish would have been if continental flew to india from here (through europe), rather then going though newark.

[VicMan]

"No way they will serve both.

These flight will be at the most, two a week."

No, there has to be a higher frequency. That, and business flights are best at least four times a week.

[MidtownCoog]

My point of reference is Pakistan Airlines.

They fly from IAH twice a week. Wednesday and Sunday.

[CaptAWACS]

Hopefully in the future Air India & Jet Airways both will have good reason at least to consider servicing both destinations.  Over the next decade, the two airports should capture most new international flights into the middle of the country.

How much more traffic can IAH handle?  I do think Houston gives a better first Texas experience for foreign travelers.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In no way at least over the next 7-12 years will AI serve both DFW and IAH with seperate metal. A triangle route, or tag on is possible (somewhat like what Lufthansa did in the 90s with their old 747s)

IAH has plenty of room for Int'l gate expansion by both Continental and foreign carriers. COs biggest problem is the bank of flights it has now, and the lack of Airplanes. Houston could get EZE (Buenas Aires) service soon (if hte DOT appoves) but that uses COs last hours on their last 767.

DFW has plenty of room as well, especially with the new term facilities, but the loss of Delta, and AAs protectionist policies hurt (as does the Wright amendment). CO can be protectionist to, just look at how they shooed off Iberia service to Madrid.

THere is a slimchance Jet could come into the other airport that does not get AI, and that would be good for Texas and the South Central US.

"No way they will serve both.

These flight will be at the most, two a week."

No, there has to be a higher frequency. That, and business flights are best at least four times a week.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No way do business flights have to be 4x a week, especially on longrange thin routes. I do not know where you got that info but it it wrong. Two a week would be the most likely, 3x IF there is a 5th freedom tag on allowed to Europe (which PIA does not have to MAN from IAH)

Oh my link was busted above, here is a good one to an Airliners.net post on it

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/gener...d.main/2207162/

Ciao, and Hook 'em Horns,

Capt-AWACS, Seven Continents Down, None to Go

[MidtownCoog]

Cool, capt. I am also a pilot, and a former revenue managment analyst for the Luv Airline. That's how I came up with my two day a week formula '-)

But I don't think you can group Iberia service to Madrid vs. keeping SWA from flying outside of the Wright Amendment states.

Crandell vs. Kelleher was a LUV hate relationship, but AA is looking bad on this one.

Jim Wright is dead, and so is the Wright Amendment.

Just my two cents.