Pipe noises

[Jax]

I live in an apartment building, and ever since I moved in there have been some strange noises coming from the upper wall on one side of my living room/kitchen. The noses are like a clicking / knocking sound and they happen pretty regularly from the time I get to work until I go to bed. Sometimes the noises happen quickly (every second), and sometimes they happen slowly (once every 30 seconds).

Last night I decided to visit the neighbor upstairs and see if that could be the source of the noise. It turns out that when we turned on the hot water in her kitchen sink, the noises downstairs got faster. When she shut off the hot water, the noises started happening less rapidly (every 30 seconds) and eventually stopped completely after a few hours.

I was wondering if anybody had any idea what this could be, and how it could be fixed. The strange thing to me is that the hot water makes the sounds occur at shorter intervals, but when you shut it off, there are still clicking/knocking sounds every 30 seconds for a few hours until it stops completely.

I also noticed that I never hear these sounds in the morning from 5 am until 9 am when I leave the house. I only hear them in the evening. She said she washes her dishes in the evening by hand (not dishwasher) so that is most likely why the sound starts when I get home from work, but why does it continue to make nose even when she is finished using the hot water?

I hope this doesn't mean we will have to put a hole in one of our walls to solve the problem (put some padding between the pipes and the wall?). Does anybody have any other possible ideas / solutions?

[jm1fd]

Sounds like the noise is being caused by the pipes expanding and contracting as they heat and cool.

You could try drilling a small hole in the wall/cieling and injecting expanding foam....it may or may not do the trick.

[Jax]

Sounds like the noise is being caused by the pipes expanding and contracting as they heat and cool.

You could try drilling a small hole in the wall/cieling and injecting expanding foam....it may or may not do the trick.

Thanks I may try that. I guess what I really need to do is located the exact spot where the sound is coming from.

I have bothered me neighbor twice with this issue, but I feel like going back to check once more and see if it could be coming from the hot water heater, or whether it occurs with cold water as well as hot. Do you think that is very likely? Either way, I guess the foam solution could work. Maybe I can see if the maintenance guys would do it for me incase I screw up and have to pay for the repair when I move out... :|

[musicman]

i'd say jm1fd is right about the expansion/contraction. i doubt it occurs with the cold because it is probably at/near the room temperature since the pipes are most likely internal to the building (in the conditioned air space)

Edited August 29, 2007 by musicman

[Jax]

I'm not sure that the space where the pipes run is air conditioned, but its probably insulated from the outside environment enough that the cold water doesn't create much of a problem.

Do you think the expanding foam option could do the trick?

[KatieDidIt]

Banging and knocking when you run the hot water sounds like sediment in the hotwater heater to me. Have management drains whatever hot water heater is near by. If its loose pipes they should take care of it too.

[Jax]

I'm just worried that they won't want to fix the loose pipes because they might not be able to get access to those pipes without knocking a hole in a wall. Maybe they'll have to do that though. I guess I can put in a maintenance request and see what I can do in the meantime.

If you think the hot water heater could be a problem, then I might as well go upstairs to visit tonight and see if the water heater is making any sounds when the hot water is running in the kitchen.

[MidtownCoog]

Per our plumbler this is perfectly normal with plastic pipes. If your pipes were loose you'd know by now. Drip.

And most apartments don't have individual hot water heaters. They use a boiler room for this.

[Jax]

Our apartment has individual water heaters, and none of the other apartments in the building that I have been in have problems with the pipe noises, so it's not totally normal...

[MidtownCoog]

Expand your mind. Call a plumber and get the real deal. How the world are you going to see pipe noises in other apartments?I have to LOL at the notion of "loose pipes"! Maybe a loose bong pipe. And drilling a hole in the wall near pipes is not advised. Think about it!

[sevfiv]

if you don't own, i would highly recommend not doing anything yourself, and tell them (owners/management) what's going on.

how old is the place?

[Jax]

By loose I think they mean the pipes aren't secured properly inside the wall and the water pressure causes them to vibrate and bang together or bang against the inside o the wall. I don't think they mean loose as in leaky (loose connections). What do you mean see pipe noises in other apartments? I know I know I can't hear pipe noises in any of my friends apartments, and there were no noses in the apartment upstairs, that's why I am pretty sure there is some sort of a problem with the pipes in my place. Specifically the pipes that drain water from above.Calling a plumber might be a good idea. The main problem with the building's maintenance staff is they are never there when I am home. Only 9-5 weekdays.

The building is fairly new.. maybe 90s.

Edited August 29, 2007 by Jax

[sevfiv]

hmm - well, if you call a plumber, make sure you will be reimbursed or that the plumber can directly bill them

[MidtownCoog]

Where is Plumber2 when you need him?

90s on the pipes are plastic. They expand and contrct and can be noisy by design.

And they pipes are not secured per se. In new construction they just run them through holes in the wood frame as a guide.

[Jax]

I see. Then the solution would probably be some padding between the pipes and the frame in the problem area, unless the spray foam could do the trick. It really sounds like the pipe is hitting something in there, rhythmically, and it's pretty loud. It makes it really hard to read at night in my living room. I might even make a recording of it to prove to the management that it really is a problem.

[Guest Marty]

I heard these work but I never tried them.

[Jax]

I don't think it's "water hammer" because it starts about 5 seconds after the hot water starts flowing and it keeps going after the water stops flowing.

I think water hammer is a single sounds that occurs when the water is shut off. I wish it were that, because this problem I have keeps repeating all evening.

Thanks for the suggestion though!

Edited August 29, 2007 by Jax

[Guest Marty]

I see. Then the solution would probably be some padding between the pipes and the frame in the problem area, unless the spray foam could do the trick.

I would be careful about using the expanding foam because it might bust the Sheetrock.

[Jax]

I got home before 6 today and managed to get my apartment manager to come into my unit and hear the noise. Of course when he got here it was quiet. So I went upstairs, got my neighbor to turn her hot water on, and showed him how bad it could sound. He said that he would see what he could do as far as repairs go. He thought he would have to get somebody to open up the wall and put some kind of padding on the pipes / strap them down to the frame so they wouldn't knock against it. I told him about the foam, but he didn't seem too excited about that idea.

I hope they fix it!

[Guest Marty]

Yeah, you live in a apartment building, I would not recommend doing any thing to it because you can get sued by the next door neighbor if you drill into a water pipe and it ruins his new Plasma TV or by the manager of the building by doing damage to the drywall.

Edited August 30, 2007 by Marty