Cypress Independence?

[MidtownCoog]

What exactly is "Fairbanks". The entire NW side in my mind is the intersection of a bunch of Co. roads. That would make sense why it's not a city.

This is a serious question from a native Houstonian.

[cynative]

The intersection of Fairbanks-North Houston and Little York would probably be the closest to the middle of the Fairbanks area. It was a community in the country. My father in law lived in the Heights as a kid and went there on Sundays to visit his kinfolks. (this would have been in the late 30's, early 40's) He spoke of a pizza joint on Little York at Guhn rd as a favorite place to go. It was it's own school district and later merged with Cypress, thus Cypress-Fairbanks ISD.

He also talked about going to Jersey Village to visit the dairy and get ice cream.

[Avabamse]

Justin - fair enough. I have replied back in the other thread now as well.

The reason that I added the map to this commentary is that the sole reason (originally brought up by mr. foolsball) for the discussion of Cypress as a legal entity was due to the original incorporation. Hence, you really cannot have the incorporation issue re-considered without understanding where the City of Cypress's original borders were. Let's be real here - Cypress will NEVER be re-incorporated so you best hope in this theoretical discussion is to identify the 'WHAT IF' scenario of the original incorporation never ending.

Otherwise, every little place in Houston can play this same game... what if there was a City of Spring or City of Klein or City of Spring Branch. Actually, that last place is a great example. The Spring Branch area was attempted to be incorporated in the 1950's and this failed. Yet, this lead to the creation of the Memorial Villages. [sOURCE - Handbook of Texas Online] You can see the analogy to the Cypress area or any suburb and the multitude of master-planned communities that create taxes (MUDs and HOA fees) and self-govern (i.e. land usage through your HOA, keeping your neighborhood pretty, etc).

And last that I checked, the Memorial Villages have done quite nicely because of location, location, location.

[mrfootball]

Avabamse isn't paying much attention to the changing landscape.

I'm going to assume he's a developer or in that line of work. There's really no reason for him to be making personal attacks and getting vitriolic about what people in Cypress want to do. I could care less what people in unincorporated Katy or Spring or Klein do, more power to them if they should wish to try and organize and incorporate their communities (just as the Woodlands is doing now.) He makes the mistake of thinking this is an anti-Houston movement when its not. It's just a logical evolution of a growing community whose needs have outgrown that which the County can provide.

[Avabamse]

Avabamse, thank you for your worthless commentary.

Why should you get all riled up about what the people in Cypress want? Either you're just an ass or you act as though you have a stake in it.

What's it to you?

As for not being Sugar Land. We don't want to be Sugar Land. They've got their own issues. And The Woodlands? We would've chosen The Woodlands had we wanted to live there. It's the same demographic here as in The Woodlands - only more here. We're pretty happy with Cypress and the variety of choices it offers, we just want to see the good things preserved, have a voice, and local rule. We'll see what happens.

Ahhhhh, mr. foolsball has now had his feelings hurt so he's lashing out with the "you must be an ass" argument that he always does. Well, 'mr. no-credibility'... I believe that you have generally proven to be the ass and the phony here. For example, I remember how you changed the text of a Houston Chronicle article in the UH buying Compaq land thread to show the expected UH location as to being US 290 (instead of the correct reporting of SH 249) because you believed independently that the Chronicle got the location wrong. Then, you chastised others that surely the big, bad, evil Houston Chronicle could not possible get a single sentence right and so you had to save the day with your masterful editing. Genius!!!

~*~*~*~

Post #26 on the previously linked thread...

Because the Chronicle got their facts wrong (surprise!)...

UH contracted to buy the Compaq facility on 290. HP is still at the main campus on 249, though they have begun subleasing buildings out to ExxonMobil.

~*~*~*~

So back on topic... I have no direct stake in the fictional, dream of re-incorporating puny little Cypress. Personally, I think many of you are nuts for trying to essentially overlay the Cy-Fair school district's boundaries into your new wish of a city. Yet, I do take a major issue to those who whine and complain about not having self-rule of government, when you were the one who choose to move into the unincorporated part of the county and within the ETJ of Houston. You (collectively, not specifically) are the dumbass for making that decision and then crying about it later. It's no different than those in my neighborhood who built a home next to the railroad tracks or to Hooks airport. I have heard countless times at HOA meetings that someone will say "The salesman said he couldn't hear a train and so I bought my house backing onto the traintracks. Now I can hear the train and want the HOA to do something about it." DUMBASS! You can virtually change the word train to airplane and have the same argument from another section of the neighborhood.

Thus, this is all simple to me - every decision that we make requires responsibility and accountability. You bought a home in a nice neighborhood with a strong HOA and MUD, but this neighborhood happens to be in the unincorporated part of the county that lies in Houston's ETJ path. You have representation on the county level and MUD.

Stop crying and just get over it. Either that or move elsewhere (but do your research next time).

I respect your enthusiasm for your community and area of town. I, too, am excited about the potential of the Cypress Creek Improvement District potential, but I am not foolish to believe this will solve all of my problems. This is why I purchased a home in a master planned community to protect my home value and to maintain a certain quality of life.

Lastly, I would much rather have a strong major city and, hence, metro area than have the city (and tax base) boxed in by self-righteous little bedroom communities. That is one of the biggest weaknesses for Dallas and who wants to be like the city of Dallas?!?

[TheNiche]

Thanks for the informative obsrvations Niche.

JU

In the future, would you mind separating out your comments from my quotes? It just makes it easier to follow.

You made the comments that:

Neutral - Residents are already paying taxes to the MUDs. If the debt were assumed then it is concievable that Utilities Taxes could actually be reduced. By having all the water, sewer, drainage and garbage together and run by the city it would provide transperant accountability to the residents and reduce the cost accociated with duplication of administration. Combining all MUDs and Water districts into a single "COC Utillities" to facilitate development and maintenance would also balance the taxes throughout the city by averaging the cost to all users. (I know what you want to say now, the older subdivisions will get the raw end of this deal. The neighborhood I live in was established over 30 years ago and we still have wter taxes that I consider high to pay for up keep and new development.)

PRO - Sales tax collected by the city could be used to subsidize the utilities.

Lumping a lot of different MUDs together has the opposite effect as what you argue. They are actually pretty efficient when it comes to carrying out their operations, and they typically have direct input from the community in terms of residents that are on the MUD boards. I don't know about you, but I'd prefer this more direct form of representation to allowing a whole city to have input over your level of services. It allows higher-end MUDs to opt to get more services and lower-end MUDs to economize wherever they can. It allows for more choices, and quite frankly better accountability and transparency because results aren't washed out in such a large volume of data as would be produced by a City, and I think that that is good.

And if you think that your MUD taxes are too high in your older subdivision, then look at MUD taxes around you. Many are in excess of $3.00 per $100 of valuation! Older MUDs that had lower capital costs to begin with and have now paid down their debt can go as low as $0.50 per $100 of valuation. If you compare a $200,000 home in one or the other neighborhoods, that's a difference of $5,000 per year! I don't think that a lot of older subdivisions are really going to be all that interested in an averaging arrangement.

You also mentioned sales taxes as being a pro, but the City of Houston still has within its limits the largest commercial concentrations in that part of town, and what is left over doesn't bring in nearly the sales volume and typically isn't a regional draw. What that means is that your neighborhood-oriented retail, which would cater to City of Cypress residents, is for the most part going to charge sales tax to your own citizenry. I just don't see all that much of an advantage, there.

[JustinUther]

Niche, it sounds like you are saying that the only real obstacles to incorporation are the Limited Purposes Annexations (LPA) that are set up in the commercial areas. Would you say then that if LPA's didn't exist, then a city established in an area that is now wholly inside Houston's ETJ could be viable?

I know that by asking that question this is starting to stray into hypothetic land but it may be relevant. (Besides, after reading so many of your posts I respect that you state your opinions logically, tactfully and usually stick to facts. IOW, because of your level headedness I value your opinion.)

Taxes and city services are complex and city limits are sticky subjects. I don't want to jump that far ahead just yet.

JU

[TheNiche]

Niche, it sounds like you are saying that the only real obstacles to incorporation are the Limited Purposes Annexations (LPA) that are set up in the commercial areas. Would you say then that if LPA's didn't exist, then a city established in an area that is now wholly inside Houston's ETJ could be viable?

I know that by asking that question this is starting to stray into hypothetic land but it may be relevant. (Besides, after reading so many of your posts I respect that you state your opinions logically, tactfully and usually stick to facts. IOW, because of your level headedness I value your opinion.)

Taxes and city services are complex and city limits are sticky subjects. I don't want to jump that far ahead just yet.

JU

That's not the only obstacle -- I still think that there'll be some major conflicts of interest between older MUDs and newer MUDs that could derail the process -- but yes, Houston's LPAs could be very problematic, and you shouldn't expect that they'll give them up unless you can either 1) get the state legislature to order them to or 2) you're willing to buy them back from Houston by arranging to pay Houston in a deal similar to The Woodlands' arrangement.

[JustinUther]

I copied this from the "Cypress city limits" [sic] thread. I added the emphisis on what I think are the most important parts.

QUOTE(mrfootball @ Tuesday, April 24th, 2007 @ 4:28pm) Benefits of Incorporation:

1) Community Identity - there are too many benefits here to list.

2) Provide a Voice/Advocate for the Community's interests

a) Transportation issues (Metro, planning, etc)

b ) Education and Investment (i.e. UH's failed NW Harris County campus bid - stronger voice for area interests, with the ability to create incentives to attract investment and other worthwhile things that benefit the community).

c) Quality of Life (i.e. Greenspaces, Parks, Trees, Crime, Pollution, etc), having a stronger voice when it comes to receiving funding/appropriations from a State/Federal level. Having people who are more 'invested' in the area's long term outlook, creating value for the residents.

3) Land Use Issues (i.e. stricter zoning and development controls, enforced landscape regulations - Harris County has them, but they do not enforce...add to that the glut of empty shopping centers, etc.) It's no secret that developers will do the least amount of work necessary to satisfy the lax requirements made of them by Harris County. After awhile it tends to show. Rather than being the 'low-fruit' on the tree, attracting half-ass developers looking to make a quick buck and get out, we can enforce standards and regulations that will ensure the area's long-term value, instituting smarter land use controls. (this is nothing new, this is what most cities & towns do).

4) Signage Issues (i.e. flashing LED signs, billboards, varying heights and setbacks, bandit signs, etc)

5) Accountability. Most people in unincorporated Harris County have no idea how to get anything done at the County level...what's worse, County services aren't designed to be very user-friendly so if you've got a complaint about something, it's rare you'll get much follow through. Harris County is huge, and we've got a Precinct System that is ill-equipped to handle the needs of the communities they serve. Add to that, the disjointed and meandering boundaries of the precincts make no geographic sense. I suppose an alternative to incorporation would be Precincts that represent each sub-region of town (ie. West Houston, Cy-Fair, Spring, Kingwood, etc?) that have ordinance powers...As it is now, they don't. Do they each have to be so big and cumbersome? Having a small local gov't where local citizens are elected and look out for their community is one of the most basic and fundamental forms of gov't - why shouldn't we be allowed to have this?

6) Community Development (things like Libraries, Museums, etc). Cypress lies on the 'split' between Precinct 3 and Precinct 4, so our community voice is watered down on the County Precinct level. Having our own City, means that Cypress looks out for Cypress, ensuring that we get more of our money returned to us in terms of services and amenities.