survey on houston shows crime biggest worry

[musicman]

For the second consecutive year, crime eclipsed traffic and the economy as the perceived greatest problem in the Houston area, the 2007 Houston Area Survey shows.

The survey showed that residents increasingly see immigrants as a threat to American culture, and a strong majority supports further restricting the flow of immigrants into the country.

In the survey's only open-ended question, 38 percent this year ranked crime as the most serious problem, up from 31 percent in 2006. Last year was the first since 1999 that an issue other than traffic had been identified by more respondents than any other as the area's greatest problem.

Two years ago, 13 percent of the respondents rated crime as their top concern.

The homicide rate increased about 5 percent

Edited March 31, 2007 by Subdude
Copyright material

[feufoma]

I agree. Certain parts of the city are essentially poor, decrepit crime pits! We need at least another 500-1,000 officers on the street; and the ones that are already hired to actually be patrolling a beat rather than indulging in donuts.

Seriously, the per capita rate of crime against the person in this city is atrocious. We're dealing with incompetence at every level and the common man is just lumping it. I think that Opie (that would be our mayor) needs to put his 'business acumen' to work and try to find a tenable solution to this sorry state of affairs. (I think Opie is a dismal failure, but that's best left for another thread altogther.) Thoughts??

[Montrose1100]

Crime is getting ridiculous...

[RedScare]

Crime is getting ridiculous...

I nominate this post for Insightful Comment of the Year.

[KimberlySayWhat]

Another article:

http://chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/4676914.html

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

Crime is always bad, but im not so quick to point the finger at immigrants, thats stupid.

[PureAuteur]

Crime is always bad, but im not so quick to point the finger at immigrants, thats stupid.

It would be reasonable, since a large immigration of impoverished people to a city can bring Third World cultural behavior and can lead to children of said immigrants to adopt the behaviors and mentalities of the gang/gun/thug culture already established in the city since the 1980s when they are not raised properly (with plenty of love shown and attention given by parents) or given opportunities to involve themselves in things that are positive to themselves and to the community.

The survey also mentions, separate from crime, that immigration is a problem and worry to many Houstonians who see the changing demographics as a threat to American culture. I think this is important, because someday, many of the institutions, traditions, holidays, pasttimes, and just general aspects of American culture will be gone, forgotten, or changed to the extent that they will never be the same as they once were. We take our American culture for granted, and through our need to be politically correct about everything, we overlook what could easily be gone or permanently affected someday.

[Montrose1100]

I nominate this post for Insightful Comment of the Year.

thanks dalparadise

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

It would be reasonable, since a large immigration of impoverished people to a city can bring Third World cultural behavior and can lead to children of said immigrants to adopt the behaviors and mentalities of the gang/gun/thug culture already established in the city since the 1980s when they are not raised properly (with plenty of love shown and attention given by parents) or given opportunities to involve themselves in things that are positive to themselves and to the community.

The survey also mentions, separate from crime, that immigration is a problem and worry to many Houstonians who see the changing demographics as a threat to American culture. I think this is important, because someday, many of the institutions, traditions, holidays, pasttimes, and just general aspects of American culture will be gone, forgotten, or changed to the extent that they will never be the same as they once were. We take our American culture for granted, and through our need to be politically correct about everything, we overlook what could easily be gone or permanently affected someday.

Take a look at the requirements for legal immigration and let me know if you still believe in what you said.

[RedScare]

It would be reasonable, since a large immigration of impoverished people to a city can bring Third World cultural behavior and can lead to children of said immigrants to adopt the behaviors and mentalities of the gang/gun/thug culture already established in the city since the 1980s when they are not raised properly (with plenty of love shown and attention given by parents) or given opportunities to involve themselves in things that are positive to themselves and to the community.

The survey also mentions, separate from crime, that immigration is a problem and worry to many Houstonians who see the changing demographics as a threat to American culture. I think this is important, because someday, many of the institutions, traditions, holidays, pasttimes, and just general aspects of American culture will be gone, forgotten, or changed to the extent that they will never be the same as they once were. We take our American culture for granted, and through our need to be politically correct about everything, we overlook what could easily be gone or permanently affected someday.

Man, you are on a roll today, aren't you, PA? You throw out these conclusions that are based on nothing. This is a survey of people's THOUGHTS. It is not based on facts. They merely asked what people are thinking. It shows more of what the MEDIA has concentrated on than it does anything else.

Your "gang/gun/thug culture" comment is equally unrelated to reality. In 1981, when Houston had a population of 1.5 million, we had 750 murders. Last year, with 2 million people, we had 376...one half the murders. I don't see how you can draw ANY conclusions about increased murders due to "culture" when the murder rate has dropped....A LOT! I haven't even gotten into the fact that a large percentage of murders are committed by people that know each other.

So, to respond to your first comment, No, it would not be reasonable.

[PureAuteur]

Man, you are on a roll today, aren't you, PA? You throw out these conclusions that are based on nothing. This is a survey of people's THOUGHTS. It is not based on facts. They merely asked what people are thinking. It shows more of what the MEDIA has concentrated on than it does anything else.

Your "gang/gun/thug culture" comment is equally unrelated to reality. In 1981, when Houston had a population of 1.5 million, we had 750 murders. Last year, with 2 million people, we had 376...one half the murders. I don't see how you can draw ANY conclusions about increased murders due to "culture" when the murder rate has dropped....A LOT! I haven't even gotten into the fact that a large percentage of murders are committed by people that know each other.

So, to respond to your first comment, No, it would not be reasonable.

I never said that increased murders were due to a culture shift, however, I did imply it in my first statement, so I guess you got me there. I just wanted to point out that immigration can bring about cultural changes and contribute to the culture of how people in certain parts of the city deal with problems and interpersonal conflict. Yes, I know there were like twice as many murders in 1981 with a much smaller population, but there are some differences that can be attributed IN PART to illegal immigration and mostly to the evolution of culture in the poor parts of Houston as new generations begin to mature. I realize that there were like twice as many murders in 1981 with a smaller population, but Houston generally felt safe all the way up until about 2002. It's only been the last 4 years that it has really started to feel dangerous, where I feel more uneasy when I go out at night than I used to, where I feel more uneasy about going into certain areas, and where I have to be constantly alert at all times, since I never know who could decide to randomly shoot me for no reason. People are just crazy out there now days. I will take back what I said about immigration being a reasonable cause of crime increase. It doesn't cause an increase directly, but it contributes to it in the long run. I don't need to quote empirical research to point out the obviously intuitive correlation. I've read various articles from online news sources about how more (even non-gang) teenagers are carrying guns around, showing them off in public, and using them to resolve conflicts and confrontations than were in previous decades. The articles cited a disturbing trend among youth to reach for their handgun at the first sign of a conflict. There is a higher percentage of hispanic youth throughout Houston and throughout America than there was in the previous decades. I'm not saying that they are the only ones who have a problem with "reaching for the gun", as it is definitely present in black and asian youth culture, and even in white youth culture, but the fact that youth crime is up and percentage of immigrant youth is up cannot be ignored. Immigration contributes to the crime problem by growing the lower class demographic and by introducing Third World mentalities about violence. They're hardly a non-factor when their children are the ones who come of age into "dead-end" violent lifestyles. Are the children of immigrants busy studying for their SAT tests at age 18? Or are they joining and forming Hispanic gangs throughout the city/country? I believe there are dozens of Latino gangs throughout the Houston area. So, while they don't directly cause murder increases, they nonetheless stir things up a bit and heighten the trend of youth violence that is already emerging due to social and moral breakdowns, economic and welfare issues and due to an explosion in the under 25 population in America.

[PureAuteur]

Take a look at the requirements for legal immigration and let me know if you still believe in what you said.

I assume you're referring to what I said about worries that immigration will threaten American culture and not the first part about crime. American culture will not be protected by legalities. Legal requirements cannot stop the loss of American culture. Plus, there are more children of illegal immigrants growing up here than there are of legal immigrants. How are we supposed to assume that the political changes will not affect our traditions, holidays, pasttimes, institutions, and other aspects of culture 30-50 years down the road? Our culture is already changing for the worse for reasons having nothing to do with immigration, for instance, the lack of patriotism and appreciation of freedom, liberty, and constitutional rights amongst today's youth (from what I've noticed). It certainly doesn't help when millions of kids will grow up never learning how to speak English and never getting an education, or at least an acceptable one.

[RedScare]

Well, then, how do you explain the fact that from 1991 to 2004, the murder rate plummetted 70% in Houston? This is the same period when illegal immigration was increasing, yet the murder rate kept dropping. It has only gone up the last 2 years, like it has nationwide.

Further, how do you explain that so far in 2007, the murders appear to be dropping again? Did all of the children of immigrants suddenly leave?

How do you explain that even though murders increased during 2005 and 2006, the overall crime rate DECREASED?

I don't need to quote empirical research to point out the obviously intuitive correlation.

You make this statement, then go on to make unsupported statements about Hispanics, Blacks, Asians and 18-25 year olds. How can you do this when you have no imperical evidence? Statements without evidence are GUESSES.

By the way, the shooter on the bus did not fit into any of these groups. He was a white guy. How do you explain that?

[PureAuteur]

Because the hostile youth and young adults of this current era were still young then and not "out in the real world" yet. Our society was much different up until then, and I can't quite put a finger on exactly why the crime rate has suddenly increased. Maybe there was some kind of natural equilibrium in society that came about after the peak in crime in the early 90s that caused things to gradually settle down. All I know is that things have gotten more chaotic as all these youths and young adults are growing older and trying to merge into the society of the older adults. I'm 25, and I can definitely feel the tension and division along age lines (at least on an intuitive level). I'm sorry that my age gives me a perspective that causes me to say things that don't make sense to some of you older posters on here. I'll try to be more rational and empirical from now on to offset some of my awkward claims.

[PureAuteur]

Well, then, how do you explain the fact that from 1991 to 2004, the murder rate plummetted 70% in Houston? This is the same period when illegal immigration was increasing, yet the murder rate kept dropping. It has only gone up the last 2 years, like it has nationwide.

Further, how do you explain that so far in 2007, the murders appear to be dropping again? Did all of the children of immigrants suddenly leave?

How do you explain that even though murders increased during 2005 and 2006, the overall crime rate DECREASED?

You make this statement, then go on to make unsupported statements about Hispanics, Blacks, Asians and 18-25 year olds. How can you do this when you have no imperical evidence? Statements without evidence are GUESSES.

By the way, the shooter on the bus did not fit into any of these groups. He was a white guy. How do you explain that?

This thread is about the survey results, not the Metro bus incident. I did mention though in my previous post on this thread that the problem of being quick to "reach for the gun" is present also in white youth culture. In the other thread, I made no claims about the race of the individuals; only that they were young Americans.

[editor]

Crime is always bad, but im not so quick to point the finger at immigrants, thats stupid.

When I was in Houston I had my cars vandalized three times by two different people -- both of them self-important elitist 30-something white guys.

That said, let's not allow this thread to degenrate into yet another discussion of race; there are enough of those on the forum already.

[PureAuteur]

When I was in Houston I had my cars vandalized three times by two different people -- both of them self-important elitist 30-something white guys.

That said, let's not allow this thread to degenrate into yet another discussion of race; there are enough of those on the forum already.

Sometimes race can come out of immigration, which should be a legitimate branch of this discussion, since the survey on Houston revealed worries that immigration was destroying American culture.

[nmainguy]

Because the hostile youth and young adults of this current era were still young then and not "out in the real world" yet. Our society was much different up until then, and I can't quite put a finger on exactly why the crime rate has suddenly increased. Maybe there was some kind of natural equilibrium in society that came about after the peak in crime in the early 90s that caused things to gradually settle down. All I know is that things have gotten more chaotic as all these youths and young adults are growing older and trying to merge into the society of the older adults. I'm 25, and I can definitely feel the tension and division along age lines (at least on an intuitive level). I'm sorry that my age gives me a perspective that causes me to say things that don't make sense to some of you older posters on here. I'll try to be more rational and empirical from now on to offset some of my awkward claims.

When I was 25 there had already been a huge influx of VietNamese along the coast. People were so up in arms that "these people have invaded our culture. We'll never be the same again." When my grandfather jumped ship in Boston in the early 1900's people were so up in arms that "these people have invaded our culture. We'll never be the same again." They were right. Our culture was infected with a work ethic that has always been the corner stone of our culture. Am I as an anglo-saxon worried that my hold on control is threatened by people that want nothing more than to be a part of my "gang?" No.

My greater fear is that racist misoginists destroy our culture in order to insill their idea of a "pure" utopia. I choose to believe they go down the path of the Hitlers of of history.

[musicman]

I've read various articles from online news sources about how more (even non-gang) teenagers are carrying guns around, showing them off in public, and using them to resolve conflicts and confrontations than were in previous decades. The articles cited a disturbing trend among youth to reach for their handgun at the first sign of a conflict. There is a higher percentage of hispanic youth throughout Houston and throughout America than there was in the previous decades. I'm not saying that they are the only ones who have a problem with "reaching for the gun", as it is definitely present in black and asian youth culture, and even in white youth culture, but the fact that youth crime is up and percentage of immigrant youth is up cannot be ignored. Immigration contributes to the crime problem by growing the lower class demographic and by introducing Third World mentalities about violence. They're hardly a non-factor when their children are the ones who come of age into "dead-end" violent lifestyles. Are the children of immigrants busy studying for their SAT tests at age 18? Or are they joining and forming Hispanic gangs throughout the city/country? I believe there are dozens of Latino gangs throughout the Houston area. So, while they don't directly cause murder increases, they nonetheless stir things up a bit and heighten the trend of youth violence that is already emerging due to social and moral breakdowns, economic and welfare issues and due to an explosion in the under 25 population in America.

PA sounds like some stereotyping is going on. IMO children are exposed to too much violence which causes desensitization. many unwise parents buy their children video games which IMO are just too violent. i'm 40 and i don't want to play a game where you kill someone or have a car chase. they are so realistic compared to atari (which i still enjoy playing) also it surprises me the movies that children are watching and the parents don't care. maybe i'm old school, ok i am, but having morals is still important IMO. in reality, for many they aren't.

[PureAuteur]

Musicman, you make a very good point. Part of moral breakdown is parental neglect, which is the case when parents provide their children with things they shouldn't, given the child's age. Usually these things are exposure to certain movies, television programs, video games, music, and music videos, etc. When I was growing up in the late 80s and early 90s, these things were still relatively mild and parents of that time were still pretty concerned about what their were exposed to. I don't know what's going on now, but it seems like parents just don't care what their kids do, as they as they stay quiet and "out of the way". If a child is exposed to too much violence at a really young age, it will definitely desensitize them. Maybe that is something that got overlooked in the 90s, and we're just now starting to see the consequences. The other thing is that the youth of today are raised to want instant gratification. They don't understand the idea of patience and appreciation of what you have. They want things handed to them immediately. Add this trait to the desensitizing and you have a big concern.

[Ralo]

.

Edited April 11, 2007 by Ralo

[musicman]

Dude, after reading your first few posts I figured you were in your 50s - at least.

[nmainguy]

Dude, after reading your first few posts I figured you were in your 50s - at least.

"Dude????" I've never heard that used by a senior citizen until now.

[dbigtex56]

It's only been the last 4 years that it has really started to feel dangerous, where I feel more uneasy when I go out at night than I used to, where I feel more uneasy about going into certain areas, and where I have to be constantly alert at all times, since I never know who could decide to randomly shoot me for no reason. People are just crazy out there now days. I will take back what I said about immigration being a reasonable cause of crime increase. It doesn't cause an increase directly, but it contributes to it in the long run. I don't need to quote empirical research to point out the obviously intuitive correlation. I've read various articles from online news sources about how more (even non-gang) teenagers are carrying guns around, showing them off in public, and using them to resolve conflicts and confrontations than were in previous decades.

Maybe there's a correlation between reading "online news sources" and feeling unsafe.

Just because it's on the internet (or on TV or in the newspaper) doesn't mean it's true. All media are prone to sensationalism; it attracts attention more reliably than dry statistics ever can. For some perspective, ask the old-timers about gang activity in Houston in the 1950s. It made today's youth look pretty tame by comparison.

As FDR said, the only thing we have to fear is fear itself. People are more willing to accept sloppy law enforcement and prosecutions, and are more willing to compromise their rights and liberty, if they're afraid - now, that scares me.

[PureAuteur]

I agree that people are more willing to compromise their rights and liberty when they are afraid. I don't want a crime-infested, chaotic society to eventually justify the adoption of a police state. I fear that today's youth will willingly give up their freedom and liberties out of fear more than I fear crime will destroy our city.

On a lighter note, it's rather funny and ironic how you quoted FDR before saying "compromising rights and freedom". Isn't he the president that Libertarians can't stand?

[RedScare]

I fear that today's youth will willingly give up their freedom and liberties out of fear more than I fear crime will destroy our city.

Don't worry about today's youth. Today's ADULTS are the ones that gave away the farm!

[nmainguy]

So after reading the survey, I've concluded that 62% of the respondents don't rank crime as the most serious problem. So why was this thread started? I wonder why musicman didn't add that 62% of the respondents don't rank crime as the most serious problem. Or why 73% aren't "very worried" about personally being a crime victim.

Was it just another lame attempt at sensationalizing figures that don't represent the majority? Did he think no one would look at the other side of the coin? This kind of thing is really getting old on HAIF and in public in general. If all you can do is cut and paste a Chron article and offer no analysis then expect to get the kind of knee-jerk reactions you find in this thread. Hell, I can just turn to talk radio and get the same uninformed feedback.

[musicman]

So after reading the survey, I've concluded that 62% of the respondents don't rank crime as the most serious problem. So why was this thread started? I wonder why musicman didn't add that 62% of the respondents don't rank crime as the most serious problem. Or why 73% aren't "very worried" about personally being a crime victim.

Was it just another lame attempt at sensationalizing figures that don't represent the majority? Did he think no one would look at the other side of the coin? This kind of thing is really getting old on HAIF and in public in general. If all you can do is cut and paste a Chron article and offer no analysis then expect to get the kind of knee-jerk reactions you find in this thread. Hell, I can just turn to talk radio and get the same uninformed feedback.

thank you for atributing the article (and its results) to me, but mike synder from chronicle wrote it. i was simply the messenger

[CDeb]

thank you for atributing the article (and its results) to me, but mike synder from chronicle wrote it. i was simply the messenger

Any stick to beat you with......

[ricco67]

It's amazing that this is an article on the perception that crime is getting worse. From what I've "felt" and from my "perception" I don't have any worries at all.

As Red has mentioned, and I'm more inclined to trust his opinion on this since he has a unique view on the entire matter that few of us can even imagine, is that most of the murders are from people that know each other or "katrina" on "katrina" crime.

A little vigilance no matter where you are as well as your social circle has a huge influence on whether or not you become part of the statistic.