South's Biggest City Economy?

[TexasStar]

According to The Economist...

... it's Dallas-Ft.Worth.

[MidtownCoog]

http://www.pwc.com/extweb/pwcpublications....025728A00543FA9

[TheNiche]

http://www.pwc.com/extweb/pwcpublications....025728A00543FA9

Yeah...and according to them, Detroit's economy is going to grow at an average annual rate of 2.3% (or by 41% by 2020), the same forecasted rate as Chicago or Philly. Uh, no.

Btw, what was the point of the original post?

[TexasStar]

Yeah...and according to them, Detroit's economy is going to grow at an average annual rate of 2.3% (or by 41% by 2020), the same forecasted rate as Chicago or Philly. Uh, no.

Btw, what was the point of the original post?

Why does there have to be a point, Niche?

This is the Dallas/Ft.Worth section of HAIF, isn't it?

Just putting out an interesting tidbit of information about the subject area.

So, why does that annoy you?

[Dallascaper]

Why does there have to be a point, Niche?

This is the Dallas/Ft.Worth section of HAIF, isn't it?

Just putting out an interesting tidbit of information about the subject area.

So, why does that annoy you?

HAIF etiquette:

Bragging about Houston or the dissemination of any news that puts Houston in a positive light is encouraged.

Bragging about Dallas or the dissemination of any news that puts Dallas in a positive light is to be met with ridicule, scorn or suspicion.

Didn

[MidtownCoog]

Oh please. I had to finish TexasStars' 1/2 arse attempt at making a post.

At least I provided the link the the actual story.

A picutre of a horse and a chart is a waste of bandwidth.

And it's not even according to the Economist. It's according to PwC.

[musicman]

is it official that dallas-ft. worth is now one city?

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

I didnt realize the cities of Dallas and Ft Worth have merged again. This seems to be an on again off again thing

[MidtownCoog]

It takes two to make a Metroplex.

[TheNiche]

Why does there have to be a point, Niche?

Because you wouldn't post if you had no motivation to post.

So, why does that annoy you?

Because by saying "south's biggest city economy" in the title, you're making an explicit comparison between Dallas and other cities, and by posting it on the Houston-AIF, the target of the comparison is narrowed and presented to a Houston-dominant audience. That is cause enough for suspicion.

Considering that the information presented by PWC and The Economist is global in nature, with no particular focus on either Dallas or Houston, and that you focus your attention on these areas without adding anything whatsoever to the information, you refocus the meaning of the information. What would have belonged most in our "Rest of the World" subforum gets placed in the Dallas subforum. Given comparisons between Dallas and Houston are all too often made by certain Dallasites (yet strangely, by no residents of other cities) in an attempt to elicit a flamewar, I call your motives into question.

ATTENTION HAIFERS: Just say no to trolls.

...and that includes the pathetic question about whether Dallas and Fort Worth are one economic unit or not. Don't get into it. Don't feed them. They thrive on the response.

[TexasStar]

Because you wouldn't post if you had no motivation to post.

Because by saying "south's biggest city economy" in the title, you're making an explicit comparison between Dallas and other cities, and by posting it on the Houston-AIF, the target of the comparison is narrowed and presented to a Houston-dominant audience. That is cause enough for suspicion.

Considering that the information presented by PWC and The Economist is global in nature, with no particular focus on either Dallas or Houston, and that you focus your attention on these areas without adding anything whatsoever to the information, you refocus the meaning of the information. What would have belonged most in our "Rest of the World" subforum gets placed in the Dallas subforum. Given comparisons between Dallas and Houston are all too often made by certain Dallasites (yet strangely, by no residents of other cities) in an attempt to elicit a flamewar, I call your motives into question.

ATTENTION HAIFERS: Just say no to trolls.

...and that includes the pathetic question about whether Dallas and Fort Worth are one economic unit or not. Don't get into it. Don't feed them. They thrive on the response.

This post had NOTHING to do with Houston. If you don't want to read any information about DALLAS/FT.WORTH in the Metroplex section of this board, then it's easy to avoid it.

Here's how. Where you see Dallas/Fort Worth/Metroplex, don't click that.

By the way, HAIF is not restricted to Houston residents. Everyone is allowed to join, read and post.

That makes me a HAIFER, genius. And I would be saying no to you.

[Houston19514]

Hmmmm.... the south's largest metropolitan area has the south's largest economy. Go figure. Pretty much a dog-bites-man non-story.

Thanks for the link to the interesting stuff, Midtown. I'm curious, though, how Atlanta's economy counts up to a larger GDP than Houston's

[citykid09]

Atlanta got a larger GDP than Houston? How Its a smaller city? Even the metro is a little smaller than Houston's.

[C2H]

I think its dumb to always accuse someone of flaming just becuase they post some information about their city. Some people on this forum need to get off it!

BTW, that is interesting how Atlanta's GDP is higher than Houston's and they aren't larger than Houston (YET). The chart did say that was just for 2005 though!

[2112]

Guys. Remember who we are dealing with. I have tried again and again, on this and other forums, to explain a concept I thought a 5th grader would understand. That is, that there is a city called Fort worth, and there is a city called Dallas. They are different cities. If you are in one, then by induction you are not in the other. Yet, there is this bizzare thing that people from Dallas do, which is to "pretend" that Fort Worth and Dallas are the same city. Everytime I would hear this, I was always tempted to hit my head, because it would hurt when I tried to apply logic here. So Dallas "claims" Fort Worth, much to the annoyance of our fellow Fort Worthians mind you, when Dallas wants to pretty themselves up and pretend they are more than they are. Yet, if you read the posts over in thier own forum, magically, they treat Fort Worth like a totally different city. You find posts that compare the two cities, and make very clear distinctions in thier conversation. So in short, Dallas will claim Fort Worth to the outside world simply to perform this magical "proping up" of thier stature to outsiders, yet treat F.W as an outsider within thier own community. But hey, maybe it's some kinda' new math or something. Heck, I dont know.

[musicman]

I think its dumb to always accuse someone of flaming just becuase they post some information about their city. Some people on this forum need to get off it!

the article appears to have numerous cities not just dallas. one would think it would be posted in the rest of the world section. there it would be benign.

[2112]

Remember one of the posts on "The Port of Dallas" thread, where a Dallas writer tries to say that when the (ahem) "Port of Dallas" is built, it will be:

"..as if the boats pull up to Houston, but the longshormen will be in Dallas"

That statement should paint a clear picture of the extent of how an imaginary image is more important to Dallas than reality. Why, in the name of Sam Houston, is it so important to "pretent" that there is a "Port" complete with "longhsoremen" in a city that is 250 miles away from a body of water? Is there an image Dallas is trying to paint about iteself that drives such a bizzare statement? It's a freak'n wierd!

[bachanon]

i wonder what the new york/new jersey metroplex gdp is, or how about the san antonio/austin metroplex.

[JasonDFW]

i wonder what the new york/new jersey metroplex gdp is, or how about the san antonio/austin metroplex.

You need to check the list, because the New York/New Jersey metro IS on this list. It is number 2. It would be comparatively useless to rate just New York City itself, as its economy and business is closely tied to that of the metro's economy. Houston is no different, they add in all the suburbs of the entire metro, as they should.

Jason

[JasonDFW]

I think its dumb to always accuse someone of flaming just becuase they post some information about their city. Some people on this forum need to get off it!

BTW, that is interesting how Atlanta's GDP is higher than Houston's and they aren't larger than Houston (YET). The chart did say that was just for 2005 though!

Atlanta is a powerhouse, I wouldn't be surprised if by 2020 they took off and had the largest GDP in the south.

Jason

[Trae]

Atlanta is also the capital of Georgia and the main economic drive for Georgia. The Atlanta region is sprawling so much (more so than Houston if you don't look at how large the counties are), that now it is being called "North Georgia".

Houston is only one point, number, whatever behind Atlanta. This was in 2005, too.

[TheNiche]

This post had NOTHING to do with Houston. If you don't want to read any information about DALLAS/FT.WORTH in the Metroplex section of this board, then it's easy to avoid it.

Here's how. Where you see Dallas/Fort Worth/Metroplex, don't click that.

By the way, HAIF is not restricted to Houston residents. Everyone is allowed to join, read and post.

That makes me a HAIFER, genius. And I would be saying no to you.

I'm currently counting a total of nine posts (not counting yours, mine, or my critics) on this thread that add nothing to HAIF or this discussion and that are basically flame-like. Whether it was your intention or not to flamebait, mission accomplished.

There have been useful comments, but that is because the data are truely interesting, not because it has anything to do with DFW in particular.

[TexasStar]

Funny, I published the exact same post at SkyscraperPage and SkyscraperCity and got some intelligent discourse on the list data.

Flame post count = zero.

(Which is what I would expect.)

[TexasStar]

Guys. Remember who we are dealing with. I have tried again and again, on this and other forums, to explain a concept I thought a 5th grader would understand. That is, that there is a city called Fort worth, and there is a city called Dallas. They are different cities. If you are in one, then by induction you are not in the other. Yet, there is this bizzare thing that people from Dallas do, which is to "pretend" that Fort Worth and Dallas are the same city. Everytime I would hear this, I was always tempted to hit my head, because it would hurt when I tried to apply logic here. So Dallas "claims" Fort Worth, much to the annoyance of our fellow Fort Worthians mind you, when Dallas wants to pretty themselves up and pretend they are more than they are. Yet, if you read the posts over in thier own forum, magically, they treat Fort Worth like a totally different city. You find posts that compare the two cities, and make very clear distinctions in thier conversation. So in short, Dallas will claim Fort Worth to the outside world simply to perform this magical "proping up" of thier stature to outsiders, yet treat F.W as an outsider within thier own community. But hey, maybe it's some kinda' new math or something. Heck, I dont know.

Everybody knows that Dallas and Ft. Worth are two different cities. But, they are in the SAME METRO. You may hate that, but that's the way it is.

In this case, when comparing GDP, I doubt the numbers mean much unless you measure it at the metro level.

And please stop hitting your head.

Remember, the damage to higher congnitive functions from concussions is cumulative.

[TheNiche]

Funny, I published the exact same post at SkyscraperPage and SkyscraperCity and got some intelligent discourse on the list data.

Flame post count = zero.

(Which is what I would expect.)

You'll notice that neither of those sites is called Houston SkyscraperPage or Houston SkyscraperCity. Whether you do it intentionally or not, posting it on this forum with a heading such as yours sends a different message than if you post it on a more general architecture forum. ...and naturally, it will elicit a different kind of response.

Flame post count = nine.

(Which is what I would expect. Why didn't you?)

[Dallascaper]

You'll notice that neither of those sites is called Houston SkyscraperPage or Houston SkyscraperCity. Whether you do it intentionally or not, posting it on this forum with a heading such as yours sends a different message than if you post it on a more general architecture forum. ...and naturally, it will elicit a different kind of response.

Flame post count = nine.

(Which is what I would expect. Why didn't you?)

So you are saying that us troublemaking Dallasites know how to push Houstonian buttons? It's easy: Simply post a statistic/opinion that ranks Dallas or DFW ahead of Houston and watch the show.

I would suggest that you shouldn't be so easily manipulated, but I find myself being sucked into the moment as well. Dallasites and Houstonians are very passionate defenders of their cities.

[musicman]

So you are saying that us troublemaking Dallasites know how to push Houstonian buttons? It's easy: Simply post a statistic/opinion that ranks Dallas or DFW ahead of Houston and watch the show.

DFW-ite since that is the city mentioned in the article.

[Trae]

Funny, I published the exact same post at SkyscraperPage and SkyscraperCity and got some intelligent discourse on the list data.

Flame post count = zero.

(Which is what I would expect.)

Yo have gotten two replies in SSP with that thread (me with one of them). I agree with the responses at SSC, though. You need to look at CSA's, not MSA's with this type of stuff. A post from there:

http://usmayors.org/metroeconomies/0107/GMPreport.pdf

A much more accurate report can be read there for 2005, the newest data available from the US Economic Census.

Using the CSA definition, which is the only realistic way to measure a metro's economic size (since CSAs are designated by commuter patterns - or economic activity - to begin with), here are the top economies in the US in terms of gross metropolitan product:

1. New York City CSA: $1.103 T

2. Los Angeles/Long Beach/Riverside CSA: $770.6 B

3. Washington/Baltimore CSA: $436 B

4. Chicago CSA: $429.6 B

5. Boston/Providence CSA: $364.6 B

6. San Francisco/Oakland/San Jose CSA: $357.8 B

7. Philadelphia/Reading CSA: $286.1 B

8. Dallas/Fort Worth CSA: $284.5 B

9. Houston/Beaumont CSA: $244.4 B

10. Atlanta/Sandy Springs/Marietta MSA: $212.4 B

I think it's safe to assume that by 2007, Dallas/Forth Worth has surpassed Philly, but is still nowhere near SF and Boston.

And yes, BalWash, the GDP of metropolitan Osaka was $720 billion in 2006. Metro Osaka includes Kyoto; there is simply no way to exclude Kyoto, which is closer to Osaka than portions of suburban North Jersey are to NYC and has uncut Japanese-levels of urban density connecting connecting the two, from Osaka.

Tokyo's GDP is on the order of $1.7 trillion as well. Does anyone here honestly believe that metro Tokyo, with 35+ million people, has an economy less than 10% larger than that of metro New York, a place with over 10 million less people? This is Japan we are talking about, not China.

Also, the chart you posted TexasStar is a projected list for 2020.

[TexasStar]

... Also, the chart you posted TexasStar is a projected list for 2020.

The 2005 rankings are on the chart also, on the far right.

[TheNiche]

So you are saying that us troublemaking Dallasites know how to push Houstonian buttons? It's easy: Simply post a statistic/opinion that ranks Dallas or DFW ahead of Houston and watch the show.

I would suggest that you shouldn't be so easily manipulated, but I find myself being sucked into the moment as well. Dallasites and Houstonians are very passionate defenders of their cities.

Yep, it really is that easy, and no, I don't like it. That's why I tried to call out this thread from the start. It's interesting information, but the way that its presented, the general response will add nothing to the forum.