musicman Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 That post I made was trash. I shouldn't have submitted it. I didn't mean to call Islam a cult. I was just saying, if any belief fits the definition, it is one. And it's just calling it what it is.i think you just did it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Therefore there is more than one god.I agree it is silly but like I say, one nut begets another.Christianity believes there is one God. The God described in the Bible is not the same God described in the Koran.I could believe that the leg of a chair is god, but it's not. So just because someone believes that someone or something else is god, doesn't mean that there is in actuality more than one God. A Muslim might say that they worship the same god, even some Christians might say it's the same god, but a conservative Christian who studies the Bible closely will not say Muslims and Christians worship the same god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevfiv Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Christianity believes there is one God. The God described in the Bible is not the same God described in the Koran.I could believe that the leg of a chair is god, but it's not. So just because someone believes that someone or something else is god, doesn't mean that there is in actuality more than one God. A Muslim might say that they worship the same god, even some Christians might say it's the same god, but a conservative Christian who studies the Bible closely will not say Muslims and Christians worship the same god.the thing is, no one will ever know any of this.after a gazillion years of debates, i'm sure it gets tiring, though!again, censorship=bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 the thing is, no one will ever know any of this.after a gazillion years of debates, i'm sure it gets tiring, though!again, censorship=badeveryone will know at the point of death.For our knowledge, why do you think censorhip is bad? Any kind of censorship? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston1stWordOnTheMoon Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Christianity believes there is one God. The God described in the Bible is not the same God described in the Koran.That is correct.everyone will know at the point of death.This is also correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travelguy_73 Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Maybe I missed something in all the ranting above, but did anyone actually post the real story? http://www.cnn.com/2007/SHOWBIZ/Movies/01/...d.ap/index.htmlOverzealous censor edits 'God' out of 'Queen'Even in these politically correct times, censoring references to God in the film was not a statement of some kind. Rather, it was the mistake of an overzealous and inexperienced employee for a California company that edits movies selected for onboard entertainment.And no, the airlines don't necessarily review every tape that is passed to them from the Inflight production studios, which is why the problem movie appeared on multiple carriers at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Maybe I missed something in all the ranting above, but did anyone actually post the real story? http://www.cnn.com/2007/SHOWBIZ/Movies/01/...d.ap/index.htmlOverzealous censor edits 'God' out of 'Queen'Even in these politically correct times, censoring references to God in the film was not a statement of some kind. Rather, it was the mistake of an overzealous and inexperienced employee for a California company that edits movies selected for onboard entertainment.And no, the airlines don't necessarily review every tape that is passed to them from the Inflight production studios, which is why the problem movie appeared on multiple carriers at the same time.Wow, sources really do help. Shame on us, really.I just can't believe someone actually complained, as if they were offended that it was not said, even if "God bless you" was left out. I just would have shrugged, thought that was weird, and lived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmainguy Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Go read about Ishmael in the Book of Genesis. Then go read about Ishmael in the Qur'an. Then go read about Ishmael in the Torah. Read about his father Abraham and Ishmael's mother who was the slave of Abraham's wife. Read about Issac. Read about this adultorous and disfunctional family that ultimatly bred Islam. You may find out that all three religions worship the same god.Then we can have an intelligent discussion. Perhaps CDeb, music and parrot can band together and form The Cult of the Uninformed.BTW, as I stated before Cdeb so ineloquently made his snarky post, religion is a choice-sexual orientation is not. If stating the facts is my S.O.P.-I accept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevfiv Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 The censor was told to edit out all profanities -- including any blasphemy -- for the version of the movie distributed to Atlanta-based Delta Air Lines, Air New Zealand, and other carriers.So the new censor mistakenly bleeped out each time a character said "God," instead of just when it was used as part of a profanity, said Jeff Klein, president of Jaguar Distribution, the company that distributed the movie to airlines this month. oh lordy!everyone will know at the point of death.For our knowledge, why do you think censorhip is bad? Any kind of censorship? and how do you know everyone will know? and for the sake of censorship in general, i believe it is bad in regards to our first amendment rights - freedom of expression, thought, and so on, and the open exchange of ideas of course, that really has nothing to do with this case of the "overzealous censor" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston1stWordOnTheMoon Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 I cant believe someone complained because in this day and age Christians seem to be afraid to speak up for Christianity. Theres a daily assault against Christianity and its followers in the media and everyday life and you hardly ever hear complaints from Christians. This is yet more proof Islam and Christianty are way diff. If the same were to happen with Islam, the Muslims would be up in arms and burning and chopping the heads off of some these disrespectful people. Im curious to know if the person or persons that spoke up were British? The British are a proud people. G-D save the Queen has a deep meaning for them as a present day traditional saying that has been carried on from centuries past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Go read about Ishmael in the Book of Genesis. Then go read about Ishmael in the Qur'an. Then go read about Ishmael in the Torah. Read about his father Abraham and Ishmael's mother who was the slave of Abraham's wife. Read about Issac. Read about this adultorous and disfunctional family that ultimatly bred Islam. You may find out that all three religions worship the same god.Then we can have an intelligent discussion. Perhaps CDeb, music and parrot can band together and form The Cult of the Uninformed.BTW, as I stated before Cdeb so ineloquently made his snarky post, religion is a choice-sexual orientation is not. If stating the facts is my S.O.P.-I accept.I understand the Ishmael/Abraham/Issac argument. At some point in the teachings of the two different books, they go two separate ways. The Bible doesn't and no Bible scholar would ever teach that once one gets to heaven that a man will have 60 or however many virgins the Qur'an promises will be there for him to enjoy eternally. So when you look at the teachings in more detail, you see they worship two different gods. After all, one god can not contradict himself and teach two separate things. Like Islam only believes that Jesus was a prophet, a good man. While Christians believe He is God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston1stWordOnTheMoon Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Ishmael didnt start Islam. Anyone who believes that is mistaken. Anyone that tells you the religions are similar is very much mistaken and they probably do not know that Islam didnt come onto the world scene until 630+ years after Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfwcre8tive Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Here's the article:http://www.cnn.com/2007/SHOWBIZ/Movies/01/...d.ap/index.htmlATLANTA, Georgia (AP) -- So much for God and country, at least during some in-flight showings of the Oscar-nominated movie "The Queen." That's because all mentions of God were bleeped out in a version of the film given to some commercial airlines.Even in these politically correct times, censoring references to God in the film was not a statement of some kind. Rather, it was the mistake of an overzealous and inexperienced employee for a California company that edits movies selected for onboard entertainment.The censor was told to edit out all profanities -- including any blasphemy -- for the version of the movie distributed to Atlanta-based Delta Air Lines, Air New Zealand, and other carriers.So the new censor mistakenly bleeped out each time a character said "God," instead of just when it was used as part of a profanity, said Jeff Klein, president of Jaguar Distribution, the company that distributed the movie to airlines this month."A reference to God is not taboo in any culture that I know of," Klein said. "We excise foul language, excessive violence and nudity."In-flight viewers of the film at one point heard "(Bleep) bless you, ma'am," as one character spoke to the queen. In all, the word "God" is bleeped seven times in the version.Klein discovered the mistake after a London-bound Air New Zealand passenger complained earlier this month and the airline apologized for showing "the incorrect version of the film."... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Go read about Ishmael in the Book of Genesis. Then go read about Ishmael in the Qur'an. Then go read about Ishmael in the Torah. Read about his father Abraham and Ishmael's mother who was the slave of Abraham's wife. Read about Issac. Read about this adultorous and disfunctional family that ultimatly bred Islam. You may find out that all three religions worship the same god.Then we can have an intelligent discussion. Perhaps CDeb, music and parrot can band together and form The Cult of the Uninformed. BTW, as I stated before Cdeb so ineloquently made his snarky post, religion is a choice-sexual orientation is not. If stating the facts is my S.O.P.-I accept. It's funny, nmainguy, because you think you are such an intellectual. Most intellectuals, unfortunately, are not intelligent, which makes the term rather misleading, but hey, there it is. Please don't talk about the Bible unless you REALLY want to talk about the Bible....because you do not know what you are talking about, quite obviously. Fortunately, I don't have to go too far to prove my point--you can do the rest on your own quite well! Religion is a choice, and so is sexual orientation. They are, for the most part, as different as day and night, but in that, they are the same. Fortunately for you, God made it so. After you die, you'll have to deal with the consequences of your actions. Please don't feed me crap about genetics; remember, I live with a geneticist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houstonmacbro Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 It's funny, nmainguy, because you think you are such an intellectual. Most intellectuals, unfortunately, are not intelligent, which makes the term rather misleading, but hey, there it is. Please don't talk about the Bible unless you REALLY want to talk about the Bible....because you do not know what you are talking about, quite obviously. Fortunately, I don't have to go too far to prove my point--you can do the rest on your own quite well! Religion is a choice, and so is sexual orientation. They are, for the most part, as different as day and night, but in that, they are the same. Fortunately for you, God made it so. After you die, you'll have to deal with the consequences of your actions. Please don't feed me crap about genetics; remember, I live with a geneticist. Sexual orientation is a choice? So if you are presumably 'straight' then it is a choice? You mean to tell me you CHOOSE to be straight? No ... I doubt it ... it's just the way you are. C'mon now... I don't know if by defenition the Muslim Religion is a cult, but if it fits the definition, it is what it is. It's not being judgmental or belittling it.Answers.com: A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader. The followers of such a religion or sect. A cult is also described as this: A sect is a small religious group that has branched off of a larger established religion. Sects have many beliefs and practices in common with the religion that they have broken off from, but are differentiated by a number of doctrinal differences. In contrast, a denomination is a large, well established religious group. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sect So by that definition the original Episcopalians (Church of England or Anglicans) if you will were simply a cult that grew into a major religious denominations. Just like so many other cults that are now mainstream 'religions'. That is correct.This is also correct. How do you KNOW this? You don't KNOW it you BELIEVE it ... there is a world of difference. (**for the record I believe it too ... but for the sake of this argument and what we KNOW ... we only BELIEVE it.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston1stWordOnTheMoon Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Sexual orientation is a choice? So if you are presumably 'straight' then it is a choice?You mean to tell me you CHOOSE to be straight? No ... I doubt it ... it's just the way you are. C'mon now...A cult is also described as this:A sect is a small religious group that has branched off of a larger established religion. Sects have many beliefs and practices in common with the religion that they have broken off from, but are differentiated by a number of doctrinal differences. In contrast, a denomination is a large, well established religious group.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SectSo by that definition the original Episcopalians (Church of England or Anglicans) if you will were simply a cult that grew into a major religious denominations. Just like so many other cults that are now mainstream 'religions'.How do you KNOW this? You don't KNOW it you BELIEVE it ... there is a world of difference.(**for the record I believe it too ... but for the sake of this argument and what we KNOW ... we only BELIEVE it.)I stand by what i said. It is non-negotiable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houstonmacbro Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I stand by what i said. It is non-negotiable.No one is asking you to negotiate. But, if what you are saying is TRUE, then straight people also CHOOSE to be straight; they could also just as easily CHOOSE to be gay. I don't accept that argument and in your heart I don't think you do either. But since I cannot speak for you, I can only go on what you write. And therefore you could just as easily choose to be gay also.Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editor Posted February 15, 2007 Author Share Posted February 15, 2007 I know I'm waaaaay too late to corral this discussion, but I'm going to try anyway.This thread was not intended to be a discussion of Christianity vs. Islam. Or whether Islam is a cult or not. Or Biblical history. It's about overzealous editing of an airline film.Please try to steer your conversation back on topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmancuso Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 i'm atheist/ agnostic/ non-religious/ un-churched or whatever the hell you call it but i find removing god from the in-flight movies pointless and insulting. also, aren't these airlines hurting financially? wise thing would not be to alienate biggest potential customer base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webdude Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 It's funny, nmainguy, because you think you are such an intellectual. Most intellectuals, unfortunately, are not intelligent, which makes the term rather misleading, but hey, there it is. Please don't talk about the Bible unless you REALLY want to talk about the Bible....because you do not know what you are talking about, quite obviously. Fortunately, I don't have to go too far to prove my point--you can do the rest on your own quite well! Religion is a choice, and so is sexual orientation. They are, for the most part, as different as day and night, but in that, they are the same. Fortunately for you, God made it so. After you die, you'll have to deal with the consequences of your actions. Please don't feed me crap about genetics; remember, I live with a geneticist. Being a righteous ass is a choice, so is not being one. They are, for the most part, opposite of each other, but in that, they are both choices. Fortunately for some, god made it so. Please don't feed any one the righteous crap; remember no one speaks for god, they only think they are. As far as getting back on post, maybe god doesn't want himself/herself mentioned in any movies, and sent a secret message to the censor dude. Doesn't seem far fetch when you compare that to how some of you can actually read god's mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmainguy Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Religion is a choice, and so is sexual orientation. They are, for the most part, as different as day and night, but in that, they are the same. When did you choose your sexual orientation? Can you give me the exact day and time you decided to be a heterosexual? Perhaps you could ask the "geneticist" you live with to clarify how involuntary sexual orientation is the same as voluntary acceptance of religion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmainguy Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I understand the Ishmael/Abraham/Issac argument. At some point in the teachings of the two different books, they go two separate ways. The Bible doesn't and no Bible scholar would ever teach that once one gets to heaven that a man will have 60 or however many virgins the Qur'an promises will be there for him to enjoy eternally. So when you look at the teachings in more detail, you see they worship two different gods. After all, one god can not contradict himself and teach two separate things. Like Islam only believes that Jesus was a prophet, a good man. While Christians believe He is God.You can read all THREE books: the bible, the torah and the qur'an and find instances that would make you reel. Did your mother ever wear a garment composed of cotton and wool? Did you kill her for that? Did you ever touch a pigskin football? Tell me so I can send Parrot to kill you in the name of her "god".The Christian Jesus is the son of God-he is not God according to the Bible. While the Jews respect Jesus they do not recognize him as the son of God.Islam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDeb Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Go read about Ishmael in the Book of Genesis. Then go read about Ishmael in the Qur'an. Then go read about Ishmael in the Torah. Read about his father Abraham and Ishmael's mother who was the slave of Abraham's wife. Read about Issac. Read about this adultorous and disfunctional family that ultimatly bred Islam. You may find out that all three religions worship the same god.Then we can have an intelligent discussion. Perhaps CDeb, music and parrot can band together and form The Cult of the Uninformed.BTW, as I stated before Cdeb so ineloquently made his snarky post, religion is a choice-sexual orientation is not. If stating the facts is my S.O.P.-I accept.Ummm, I never said anything about the relative "ownership" (for lack of a better term) of the three prominent monotheistic religions. I happen to agree with the section of your post that I bolded above.As far as your S.O.P., stating facts is NOT your strong front. Demonizing people who don't agree with you with overheated rhetoric (such as calling religions that, collectively, claim more than one-third of the earth's inhabitants as adherents "cults"), and lumping such people into your neat little boxes of spite (such as the second half of your post) unfortunately, is your pattern of posting woven throughout numerous threads on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 When did you choose your sexual orientation? Can you give me the exact day and time you decided to be a heterosexual? Perhaps you could ask the "geneticist" you live with to clarify how involuntary sexual orientation is the same as voluntary acceptance of religion?I have actually had several times where I could choose, and I chose to be heterosexual. Period. I'll chat with my geneticist today and get back with you on why sexual orientation is voluntary, and perhaps we can have a topic devoted to it since the admin has graciously asked us all to keep this topic off this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Have they also edited out "Allah" ? Let's be fair about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockmat Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 The Christian Jesus is the son of God-he is not God according to the Bible. While the Jews respect Jesus they do not recognize him as the son of God.Islam's hold Jesus as a prophet yet reject the Christian claim he is the savior son of God.Please explain the triple contradictions of Jews, Christians and Muslims who worship the same God yet so willingly kill one another in the name of the same?The Torah is part of the Bible. It's the first five books of the Bible if I'm not mistaken.Studied and read carefully, the Bible indirectly says Jesus is God. I don't have the references memorized, but I'm more than willing to look them up when I'm not at work and bring them back tomorrow. Yes He is the Son of God, but He is also God. He's not God the Father, but the Bible teaches a triune God. The word Trinity is not in the Bible, but it doesn't have to be for it to be taught. If Jesus was not God, then his death to save all sinners from their sin is worthless and all Christians who put their faith in Him do not have a savior for their sins which condemn them to hell.And you're correct, Jews do not see Jesus as the Savior; they're still waiting for the Messiah to come. The Jews living when Jesus walked the earth were looking for a a king with a heavy hand who would rule the earth and all their enemies (which he will when he returns). Jesus and most of the Jews were not, "on the same page," and therefore they crucified him. Although they knew their Old Testament scriptures very well, they did not understand them. Had they understood them, they would have accepted Him. But then again, the Bible teaches a sovereign God and had they believed, they would not have crucified Him, and nobody would have redemption from their sins.A cult is also described as this:A sect is a small religious group that has branched off of a larger established religion. Sects have many beliefs and practices in common with the religion that they have broken off from, but are differentiated by a number of doctrinal differences. In contrast, a denomination is a large, well established religious group.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SectSo by that definition the original Episcopalians (Church of England or Anglicans) if you will were simply a cult that grew into a major religious denominations. Just like so many other cults that are now mainstream 'religions'.In response to musicman, I said it was a bad post. I did not intend to call Islam or any other religion a cult. And just for the record, even if my faith were technically described as a cult, so be it. It's just a label; just as religion is. I don't believe in a religion, I believe in a person and a faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webdude Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I have actually had several times where I could choose, and I chose to be heterosexual. Period. I'll chat with my geneticist today and get back with you on why sexual orientation is voluntary, and perhaps we can have a topic devoted to it since the admin has graciously asked us all to keep this topic off this thread.I wonder whether being a righteous ass who needs condemn another's sexuality is also voluntary. Perhaps you can ask the geneticist that too. Of course, devote another new thread to it, because we don't want to upset the admin, but its ok to upset a whole other group of people with alternative lifestyle cause they are beneath us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 Are you referring to me? I'm just wondering, because I'm not the one condemning anyone's sexuality. I could care less about "alternative lifestyles". Speaking of righteous asses, why don't you try actually reading a thread through to the end before jumping on the pile and calling people names. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I know, I know. I forgot webdude is a moron. It isn't his fault. Did I just condemn stupid people by saying that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nmainguy Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I know, I know. I forgot webdude is a moron. It isn't his fault. Did I just condemn stupid people by saying that? No. You just revaled once again how one poster has described you: you have the mouth of a truck-stop waitress and the vacancy of a housewife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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