Broken Windows, Malicious Intent

[TheNiche]

Sounds like I might be moving to Eastwood, but not under the circumstances that I'd prefer.

For the past couple days, I and the coowner/tenant of our house have been getting windows broken. The first strike took out just two small panels through which only very thin people could've fit and only tall people could've accessed; although the aqua-colored leaded glass was small in size, it is probably the most valuable. At first, we thought that it was a break-in attempt based upon a clear line of sight through the windows to the television, but further investigation on our part eliminated that as a possibility. The only thing that they could've seen that was of any value were a couple of ceiling fans, new-in-box. Everything else that was potentially visible was dumpy and should've lead to the impression that there wasn't going to be anything worth taking.

The second strike took out three more windows, this time antique leaded glass. The hit on the first floor was on a window with burglar bars on it. Two hits were on the second floor. Weapons used were bricks from on-site and a glass bottle. After the second attack, I determined that the attacks were probably made just for the fun of watching glass break. If I had to guess, it is probably just kids or teenagers that live in a fourplex nearby, although I have no concrete evidence.

The police showed up after the coowner/tenant freaked out when she heard wind blowing through the window early this morning and discovered the fresh breaks. So she called 911 and asked for police to show up because she didn't know whether an intruder might be downstairs. The police came, there was no intruder, they filed a report, and offered no assistance or advice.

The coowner/tenant, a single female, has become fearful for her personal safety (although I doubt that there is good reason at this point) and is willing to renegotiate our agreement such that I'd live there and she'd live in my condo, but that my housing expenses would not increase. It is a good offer, but is inconvenient. Rather than deal with the hassle of a move, I'd prefer to explore any other options that may be available to us to improve security. I've come up with the following options. If anyone has any other suggestions, please let me know.

1) Get a loud dog.

2) Fence and gate the property with black rod iron.

3) Install motion sensors and outdoor lights (although they'll be frequently triggered by stray cats).

4) Install an alarm system to monitor for glass breakage.

5) Install plexiglass windows.

6) Post threatening signage. "If you are seen here tonight, you will be seen here in the morning", "Beware of Dog", "NRA Lifetime Member", etc.

7) Get the coowner/tenant some training, a concealed carry permit, and a titanium S&W .357 revolver.

I'd also be interested in knowing what actions are within my legal rights if I catch someone trespassing and maliciously destroying property. I'd rather not shoot at them, but what can I do? What should I do?

Thanks to all who respond.

[GREASER]

first is talk to the neighbors, if it happened to you, your prob not the first or last. You should have an alarm with motion downstairs...at night the motion can be on,and would detect anyone breaking in...as for the glass breaking, hopefully its not because the tenent was mean to the kids of the area...but once again that can maybe be handled with talking to the neighbors. For someone to hit an upper window, it may have taken a couple of tries, someone had to see something. I would maybe get a cheap day/night video camera from frys...that may show who is doing it, hopefully its not your tennant trying to get out of lease. Oh, and the neighbors with punk kids, you may want to explain WHAT will happen if they are caught damaging your property. You have the right to defend your property and shoot if your life feels threatened. I am not a lawyer, so there may be more to the law, but I think thats it.

[musicman]

get fence....perhaps dog as well.

if you can afford the windows...that will also save you some money on heating/cooling.

as for shooting, don't unless they are IN the house. otherwise drag em inside before the cops come.

[Scharpe St Guy]

Niche,

Sorry to hear about the windows. It feels like a total violation and going home or to your property never quite feels the same after these things happen. I would go with the Dog, camera, and the gun. Quite honestly I don't expect HPD to be all that interested or helpful when it comes to items like that. They respond after the fact and fill out a report that gets filed but never acted upon if you ask me. Frustrates the heck out of me but then you can always go get your CHL and take matters into your own hands.

Good luck Niche,

Scharpe St Guy

[pineda]

KTRK did a story that might be of interest to you. Edited February 3, 2007 by pineda

[RedScare]

Life in the big city. Don't go overboard just yet, as a couple of rock throwers tend to move on to other forms of annoyance. Clean up the yard, so that there are not projectiles within easy reach. If you were already planning to install a fence, you may start sooner, but wrought iron is very expensive. It does tend to keep bored kids out of the yard, though not real burglars. I would consider some form of shatter resistant glass first, as it is less expensive than a fence. Look for the layered kind, with a sheet of plexiglass between two sheets of glass. It does not yellow like regular plexiglass.

Don't get a dog unless you like dogs. It doesn't have to be big or mean, either. Mine barks at strangers, letting me know that someone is around, and that is sufficient.

You gun freaks crack me up! Could one of you Dirty Harrys please explain why Niche or his frightened co-owner needs a concealed handgun license to possess a firearm on THEIR OWN PROPERTY? And, aside from the fact that this vandalism is occurring when no one is home, I won't even get into the time, trouble and expense involved with pointing firearms at unarmed kids. You MIGHT be within your legal rights to do so, but be prepared to pay a lawyer to explain the law to a jury.

BTW, I know musicman was joking, but watch an episode or two of CSI to figure out if the "drag them inside" scam works.

Good luck, and welcome to the thrills of buying in a gentrifying neighborhood.

[Guest Marty]

I would consider some form of shatter resistant glass first, as it is less expensive than a fence. Look for the layered kind, with a sheet of plexiglass between two sheets of glass. It does not yellow like regular plexiglass.

That and i would plug a lamp into a Timer to make it look like someones home.

[TheNiche]

first is talk to the neighbors, if it happened to you, your prob not the first or last. You should have an alarm with motion downstairs...at night the motion can be on,and would detect anyone breaking in...as for the glass breaking, hopefully its not because the tenent was mean to the kids of the area...but once again that can maybe be handled with talking to the neighbors. For someone to hit an upper window, it may have taken a couple of tries, someone had to see something. I would maybe get a cheap day/night video camera from frys...that may show who is doing it, hopefully its not your tennant trying to get out of lease. Oh, and the neighbors with punk kids, you may want to explain WHAT will happen if they are caught damaging your property. You have the right to defend your property and shoot if your life feels threatened. I am not a lawyer, so there may be more to the law, but I think thats it.

Nah, the tenant is a coowner and our terms are presently fair. What she had suggested was that we just trade housing units without changing the terms. I'd prefer to live in the house, and if I'm only paying for a condo, that's fine by me except for the inconvenience of the move.

To my knowledge, she hasn't been mean to the kids. In fact, she's hesitant to believe that it is them and is really far more concerned about this than I am. She firmly believes in smart criminals with an economic or violent motive. In this case, I believe in stupid/immature criminals that entertain themselves by making glass shatter.

I don't have any hard evidence that it was that particular group of kids, so I'm hesitant to single out and threaten them. It may just create another set of criminals that find entertainment in breaking my windows. But I certainly will talk to the heads of households of nearby homes. It'd probably mean a whole lot more if the parents pressure their kids not to break my windows than if I do. My closest neighbor is a real class act. To the extent that he can, I have no doubt that he'll keep an eye out for things.

Life in the big city. Don't go overboard just yet, as a couple of rock throwers tend to move on to other forms of annoyance. Clean up the yard, so that there are not projectiles within easy reach. If you were already planning to install a fence, you may start sooner, but wrought iron is very expensive. It does tend to keep bored kids out of the yard, though not real burglars. I would consider some form of shatter resistant glass first, as it is less expensive than a fence. Look for the layered kind, with a sheet of plexiglass between two sheets of glass. It does not yellow like regular plexiglass.

Don't get a dog unless you like dogs. It doesn't have to be big or mean, either. Mine barks at strangers, letting me know that someone is around, and that is sufficient.

You gun freaks crack me up! Could one of you Dirty Harrys please explain why Niche or his frightened co-owner needs a concealed handgun license to possess a firearm on THEIR OWN PROPERTY? And, aside from the fact that this vandalism is occurring when no one is home, I won't even get into the time, trouble and expense involved with pointing firearms at unarmed kids. You MIGHT be within your legal rights to do so, but be prepared to pay a lawyer to explain the law to a jury.

BTW, I know musicman was joking, but watch an episode or two of CSI to figure out if the "drag them inside" scam works.

Good luck, and welcome to the thrills of buying in a gentrifying neighborhood.

Cleaning up the yard is difficult. There is a huge pile of bricks in the side yard that came with the house. I intend to use them for repairs if necessary, perhaps for bricking up windows that have been sealed off, and anything left over, for landscaping. Moving them inside would be a real hassle, but I suppose it certainly is an option.

We were planning on putting up a wrought iron fence. And it really isn't an avoidable expense, IMO. It is a triangular corner lot, with part of the yard jutting into an intersection. There is a lot of foot traffic in Eastwood, and a fair number of pedestrians cut across the lawn to save time. The triangular lot currently has a chain link fence around the back side of the house that gives the impression of being closed off, but it ends before connecting to the neighbor's fence. There is nothing on the lot that cannot be seen or accessed from the street. There is also no garage. Zero privacy. That also means that if the occupant were to drive up while a crime was in progress, or a personal crime was committed while the occupant was in transit between the car and the locked back door, there would be no opportunity to go inside and grab a weapon, phone for help, or run upstairs and barricade oneself in the bedroom. A gun inside of a purse could come in handy. And you can't carry guns in purses around town without the CHL.

--------------------

Thanks for the input, everyone. I think that what I'll recommend is the shatter-resistant glass windows, motion detectors hooked up to lights, and fake alarm system tags on windows, to be implemented ASAP. Do the fence within a few months, right after the roof and in conjunction with construction of a garage, and then allow the CHL, gun, and dog left to the discretion of the occupant.

If I end up moving in, I'll probably just buy a Remington 870. There's absolutely nothing like that classic pump action to ward off would-be burglars.

That and i would plug a lamp into a Timer to make it look like someones home.

The lights were on, but without a garage, it is pretty easy to determine whether someone is actually home or not. I might try using a timer in conjunction with a loud radio, though. That might be more convincing.

[bachanon]

several years ago, i saw a crime show on tv. the format of the show used experienced criminals/vandals to explain what homes they would avoid and what homes they would choose.

the majority of the experienced criminals would not approach a well lit home. the specific circumstances they avoided were homes with well lit entries (front/back/side) and/or with apparent activity inside. the preferred time of day for burglary is in the morning after people leave for work and school, according to the seasoned criminals.

if you do not have exterior lighting, i would invest in some immediately.

leave front porch and back porch lights on all night.

good luck.

[silverartfox]

Niche, I am sorry that you were the victim of a malicious attack on your property. My guess is that it was a couple of local teenage thugs. You might want to contact Constable Victor Trevino's office. Houston police are spread pretty thin in many areas of the city; I see the Constable's patrol cars in our area more frequently than HPD's.

Since your house is undergoing renovation, have you looked into the possibility of putting up a temporary contractors' "Rent-a-Fence" with a padlocked gate for the duration? A perro malo sign on it would be appropriate. The suggestions about interior lamps on timers (set to go on/off at varying times) and exterior motion-sensor floodlights are good ones.

[musicman]

I think that what I'll recommend is the shatter-resistant glass windows, motion detectors hooked up to lights, and fake alarm system tags on windows, to be implemented ASAP. Do the fence within a few months, right after the roof and in conjunction with construction of a garage, and then allow the CHL, gun, and dog left to the discretion of the occupant.

As for the alarms, there was a good report this week where Ted Oberg interviews imprisoned burglars. He asked them point blank about things that scare them off. it was surprising that the majority said an alarm was not a deterrent in most cases. They knew police reponse in Houston was slow. they said it took 5 mins for the alarm company to call the police and 10 mins for the police to respond so they had 15 mins to get in and out.

They also mentioned that the worst hiding place is near the bed *under or between the matresses" The burglars said they always looked there first.

They said the number one deterrent was a car in the driveway.

[TheNiche]

Niche, I am sorry that you were the victim of a malicious attack on your property. My guess is that it was a couple of local teenage thugs. You might want to contact Constable Victor Trevino's office. Houston police are spread pretty thin in many areas of the city; I see the Constable's patrol cars in our area more frequently than HPD's.

Since your house is undergoing renovation, have you looked into the possibility of putting up a temporary contractors' "Rent-a-Fence" with a padlocked gate for the duration? A perro malo sign on it would be appropriate. The suggestions about interior lamps on timers (set to go on/off at varying times) and exterior motion-sensor floodlights are good ones.

Yep, we're going to price out various fences, and I think that the lights on a motion sensor are definitely the way to go.

I spoke with the neighbor, and it sounds like the kids in the fourplex are responsible. Every spring, when he drains and cleans out his pool, he finds bricks, rocks, and bottles at the bottom. He's cornered the kids a few times and yelled at them, and after a while, they seemed to have backed off.

My approach is going to be pulling over one evening when I see them playing in the street, ask them if they know anything about the broken windows, and comment as though I don't suspect them that "the woman that lives there was so pissed off about it that she bought a .357 magnum and got a concealed handgun license." I'll also tell them that she gets angry really easily and doesn't have a lot of self control. Hopefully that and the upgrades will keep more of the same from happening.

[Guest danax]

Sorry to hear that happened to your friend and really sorry to hear that those old windows were destroyed. So they only went after the stained glass? Maybe the plexiglass as a temporary solution. The stained glass can be replaced with something similar when you're ready to sell.

Sounds like just some local losers, or maybe a hate crime . I'd get a couple of video cameras, if you can afford to, and tape the activities. Great way to see some of the neighbors that you wouldn't normally meet.

[editor]

If you install flood lights, install a few extra facing directly out into the street -- try to get eye level with a potential perp. I think that might be a psychological deterrent.

You could also get a banger computer and webcam and record the street to see if that gives you any clues if it's the kids across the street doing it.

[TheNiche]

If you install flood lights, install a few extra facing directly out into the street -- try to get eye level with a potential perp. I think that might be a psychological deterrent.

You could also get a banger computer and webcam and record the street to see if that gives you any clues if it's the kids across the street doing it.

My only concern there is that they'd steal the floodlights or smash the lightbulb in the socket. Does anyone know whether it is legal, by the way, to shine floodlights directly out onto a major thoroughfare with lots of traffic? I'm a little hesitant about that.

What is a banger computer?

[editor]

My only concern there is that they'd steal the floodlights or smash the lightbulb in the socket. Does anyone know whether it is legal, by the way, to shine floodlights directly out onto a major thoroughfare with lots of traffic? I'm a little hesitant about that.

That's how my parents had their house for years -- it was at the top of a small hill, so illuminating the driveway meant blinding people who looked directly at the house.

As for stealing the floodlights, it wasn't a problem because they were mounted nine feet off the ground -- over the garage door.

What is a banger computer?

Just a cheapie little computer that isn't particularly powerful -- just enough for the job at hand. Like one of those $300 jobs you see sometimes at Fry's.

[Vertigo58]

First thing I did was install a very high chain link fence on the busier side or more heavily walked side of my home. (live on a corner) This would discourage graffitti then I...

placed "Beware of Dog" sings in three places. This would make them think twice about entering my yard even though I dont' have dogs. It works!

If you don't have children, place a few kids toys on the yard (makes them think its a big family).

Single woman or man should when recording your greeting on the phone always state:

"John, me and the kids aren't here but leave us a message and well return asap" or to that effect. Let's a stranger assume you dont live alone. Will encounter more hell if he tries forced entry.

Finally as hard as it may be, don't alieanate anyone because you think they are trouble-makers, because they will retaliate. I always try to smile or just wave if they are near that is for children not adults by the way. Older people may use as opportunity to ask for handouts.

When and if you call the cops always tell them not to give the offenders your name and tell them why. retaliation.

and dont feel too bad I had my house paint-balled because some little losers had nothing better to do. Cracked my windows. They never would have done had I been standing there. These were not kids they were at least 18 years old, real tough at least they think.

[OldHouseLover]

Sounds like I might be moving to Eastwood, but not under the circumstances that I'd prefer.

For the past couple days, I and the coowner/tenant of our house have been getting windows broken. The first strike took out just two small panels through which only very thin people could've fit and only tall people could've accessed; although the aqua-colored leaded glass was small in size, it is probably the most valuable. At first, we thought that it was a break-in attempt based upon a clear line of sight through the windows to the television, but further investigation on our part eliminated that as a possibility. The only thing that they could've seen that was of any value were a couple of ceiling fans, new-in-box. Everything else that was potentially visible was dumpy and should've lead to the impression that there wasn't going to be anything worth taking.

The second strike took out three more windows, this time antique leaded glass. The hit on the first floor was on a window with burglar bars on it. Two hits were on the second floor. Weapons used were bricks from on-site and a glass bottle. After the second attack, I determined that the attacks were probably made just for the fun of watching glass break. If I had to guess, it is probably just kids or teenagers that live in a fourplex nearby, although I have no concrete evidence.

The police showed up after the coowner/tenant freaked out when she heard wind blowing through the window early this morning and discovered the fresh breaks. So she called 911 and asked for police to show up because she didn't know whether an intruder might be downstairs. The police came, there was no intruder, they filed a report, and offered no assistance or advice.

The coowner/tenant, a single female, has become fearful for her personal safety (although I doubt that there is good reason at this point) and is willing to renegotiate our agreement such that I'd live there and she'd live in my condo, but that my housing expenses would not increase. It is a good offer, but is inconvenient. Rather than deal with the hassle of a move, I'd prefer to explore any other options that may be available to us to improve security. I've come up with the following options. If anyone has any other suggestions, please let me know.

1) Get a loud dog.

2) Fence and gate the property with black rod iron.

3) Install motion sensors and outdoor lights (although they'll be frequently triggered by stray cats).

4) Install an alarm system to monitor for glass breakage.

5) Install plexiglass windows.

6) Post threatening signage. "If you are seen here tonight, you will be seen here in the morning", "Beware of Dog", "NRA Lifetime Member", etc.

7) Get the coowner/tenant some training, a concealed carry permit, and a titanium S&W .357 revolver.

I'd also be interested in knowing what actions are within my legal rights if I catch someone trespassing and maliciously destroying property. I'd rather not shoot at them, but what can I do? What should I do?

Thanks to all who respond.

Another suggestion that has worked for me:

Put a "reward" sign on tree or someplace it can be clearly seen: "$500 reward [or however much you wish to offer] for conviction of vandals who ........................." If you don't want to give out phone # on sign, get a pager for the # as you don't want to talk to strangers who come to the front door. The sign serves 2 purposes=lets the neighbors know you've had problems & they will probably be more observant of the neighborhood & the vandals get the idea you are not "scared" of them [although we are] & vandals might be concerned one of their own wants to collect the money.

You also meet neighbors in this manner as people will stop & introduce themselves & chat. If the vandals are young, their parents will see the signs & may ?? have a chat with kids @ getting to know police by doing these acts.

Good luck & I'm sorry you lost the precious glass windows.

p.s.= another thing we've done in East End: Befriend the tough kids in area. Tell them you "know" it wasn't them who did damage. Since they are out & about a lot [especially at night] ask them to call police if they see anything suspicious. Things will probably settle down.

Edited February 14, 2007 by OldHouseLover

[TheNiche]

...two more windows taken out.

That banger computer and webcam is starting to look like a practical solution. Having come out there three seperate times now, HPD is now making it a point to drive by three times a day and shining flashlights all over the place at night.

[musicman]

...two more windows taken out.

That banger computer and webcam is starting to look like a practical solution. Having come out there three seperate times now, HPD is now making it a point to drive by three times a day and shining flashlights all over the place at night.

sorry to hear that. i guess respect isn't really a quality some strive for.

[MexAmerican_Moose]

need new windows? look in the Jobs Section, my dad installs glass

[travelguy_73]

A friend of mine off Navigation and Runnels has had multiple windows taken out. His townhouse backs up to a greenspace and the local thugs like to walk back there and throw anything they can find. After spending $2k (or more) replacing double-pane windows, Bobbitt Glass installed shatter-proof covers over them (removable of course). He hasn't had a problem since.

If the thugs can't cause immediate (and easy) damage as they walk by, they will probably quickly lose interest and move on to the next house.

[Ralo]

.

Edited April 11, 2007 by Ralo

[musicman]

IMHO you absolutely have to have a dog in these parts and I know that requires a fence. The next question is what kind of dog? Rottweilers and Dobermans can be great guard dogs but can also be unpredictable around their very owners and kids. A pit also comes to mind but can be overly aggressive and unpredictable so that could be a liability nightmare.

i will have to defend the Dobermans. My parents have had female dobermans since the 60's. none have been aggressive. they have had one rott who was also non-aggressive. But her size was more of a factor for not getting another one. For me it is how they are raised.

[Ralo]

i will have to defend the Dobermans. My parents have had female dobermans since the 60's. none have been aggressive. they have had one rott who was also non-aggressive. But her size was more of a factor for not getting another one. For me it is how they are raised.

I didn't mean to hate on dobies (after all they are beautiful and athletic) and I based my comments on things I have read and heard but have little experience of my own with them. Regarding the Rottie, I saw one playfully knock over it's male adult owner, and then when the Rottie saw the fear in the man's eyes, she got real jittery real quick but I think it was mostly the size/mass that really made it dangerous. I was able to distract it while the owner made the getaway over the fence. LOL!

You are probably right about the the upbringing factor although I think there may be that 1% where the dog is too timid or too aggressive regardless of conditioning.