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Dobson's Warning


mojeaux131

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There was an op-ed in the New York Times by Focus on the Family's James Dobson.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/04/opinion/...tml?ref=opinion

Basically he's warning that he and all his friends will find an independent candidate if both R and D nominees support abortion. He also mentions the importance of upholding and preserving "conservative" principles like "the institution of marriage" in addition to "the sanctity of life". For the others, he kind of generalizes.

A-nyway, I often find myself opposing this guy and his friends. To me, family values includes being supportive of gay families as well as more commonplace "tab A-slot B" families, and the sanctity of life includes policies that are well, kind or beneficial to people. This would not include Bush's recent veto of the SCHIP expansion bill, which would have cost what we spend in Iraq in half a month and which was much cheaper than the Medicare D expansion he was so gung ho about (and which passed) in 2003.

Another of Dobson's friends, the disgraced Ted Haggard once compared gay pride parades to parades for murderers. Don't ya just love these guys? And look what happened there. A lot of people think that the really nutty homophobes (or perhaps most homophobes actually) turn out to be gay themselves. ha ha ha

Actually, I'm happy that Dobson wrote this. Anything to separate the Republicans from the fundamentalists is useful to the progression of America as a nation.

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There was an op-ed in the New York Times by Focus on the Family's James Dobson.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/04/opinion/...tml?ref=opinion

Basically he's warning that he and all his friends will find an independent candidate if both R and D nominees support abortion. He also mentions the importance of upholding and preserving "conservative" principles like "the institution of marriage" in addition to "the sanctity of life". For the others, he kind of generalizes.

A-nyway, I often find myself opposing this guy and his friends. To me, family values includes being supportive of gay families as well as more commonplace "tab A-slot B" families, and the sanctity of life includes policies that are well, kind or beneficial to people. This would not include Bush's recent veto of the SCHIP expansion bill, which would have cost what we spend in Iraq in half a month and which was much cheaper than the Medicare D expansion he was so gung ho about (and which passed) in 2003.

Another of Dobson's friends, the disgraced Ted Haggard once compared gay pride parades to parades for murderers. Don't ya just love these guys? And look what happened there. A lot of people think that the really nutty homophobes (or perhaps most homophobes actually) turn out to be gay themselves. ha ha ha

Actually, I'm happy that Dobson wrote this. Anything to separate the Republicans from the fundamentalists is useful to the progression of America as a nation.

I love it! :D

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Anything to separate the Republicans from the fundamentalists is useful to the progression of America as a nation.

In one of the first Republican debates this year, the moderator asked if there were any candidates that didn't believe in evolution. Three raised their hand -- Brownback, Huckabee and Tancredo. That was a useful "separator."

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Why bash the man for his beliefs? You have yours, let him have his. As for evolution, thank God someone had the balls to stand up and say they don't believe it. It's a theory, pure and simple, and doesn't have much to go on when you really get down to it. You don't have to believe it to be intelligent and you don't have to be in favor of gay marriage to be a good leader of this country.

But then, why should I be surprised anyone in this thread could offer anything but what has already been said? Sad.

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Why bash the man for his beliefs? You have yours, let him have his.

Because this man's (and others of his ilk) sole purpose is to change this country into a totalitarian x-tian state. Do you like what you see in Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Iran, et. al.?

You can believe in the purple people eater for all I care, but when you espouse hatred and intolerance veiled in religion, and wish to force me to believe as you do (not you specifically, Parrot), I have a problem with it.

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I suggest you do some reading.

Is that all you have? "Do some reading"?

A combination of reading, and learning from people who support both versions, is how I came to my conclusions about Creationism vs. Evolution.

Orikal, I don't want some religious kook taking away people's civil liberties, but I live in fear that mine will be trampled on and thrown in my face every day simply because I'm a Christian conservative.

At what point did we decide that what was once good and true about this country is no longer? When did we all decide that Christian families and leaders were the enemy? Because they're actually saying what they've been saying since the days of Jesus Christ himself? I do not understand the hatred and the misconceptions and overall lack of empathy toward Christians as a whole, when the very community that wishes to have equal treatment placed upon themselves in the Church can't seem to give any of it worth a damn. I will never understand that mentality, and I was knee-deep in the gay culture for years.

People cannot have it both ways. That's life, that's not just Christianity.

Edited by Parrothead
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Orikal, I don't want some religious kook taking away people's civil liberties, but I live in fear that mine will be trampled on and thrown in my face every day simply because I'm a Christian conservative.

I'm geniunely interested in your viewpoint. If you don't mind, I'd like to start a friendly dialogue here:

What civil liberties are you in fear of losing due to your conservative christian stance?

What civil liberties are thrown in your face on a daily basis because of these same beliefs?

How has being a conservative christian negatively affected your ability to exercise your basic civic liberties?

At what point did we decide that what was once good and true about this country is no longer? When did we all decide that Christian families and leaders were the enemy? Because they're actually saying what they've been saying since the days of Jesus Christ himself? I do not understand the hatred and the misconceptions and overall lack of empathy toward Christians as a whole, when the very community that wishes to have equal treatment placed upon themselves in the Church can't seem to give any of it worth a damn. I will never understand that mentality, and I was knee-deep in the gay culture for years.

In an overwhelmingly conservative and christian nation, based on the statements above, I'd like to also like to inquire:

When you talk about "what was good and true in this country," to what are you referencing?

Who is this (again in a conservative/christian nation) majority that persecutes christians?

I'm not quite sure I understand the homosexuality reference; could you clarify?

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I'm geniunely interested in your viewpoint. If you don't mind, I'd like to start a friendly dialogue here:

What civil liberties are you in fear of losing due to your conservative christian stance?

What civil liberties are thrown in your face on a daily basis because of these same beliefs?

How has being a conservative christian negatively affected your ability to exercise your basic civic liberties?

In an overwhelmingly conservative and christian nation, based on the statements above, I'd like to also like to inquire:

When you talk about "what was good and true in this country," to what are you referencing?

Who is this (again in a conservative/christian nation) majority that persecutes christians?

I'm not quite sure I understand the homosexuality reference; could you clarify?

I also would like to hear your answers to these queries. While it appears to me that people (including many who are Christians) are only pushing back at certain people and groups who wish to force their religion on others, you clearly do not see it this way. Rather than merely assume what liberties of yours you believe may be trampled, I'd rather respond to the specific fears you have. Who knows? While it seems unlikely that a 90% Christian nation could oppress its Christian beliefs, maybe it is possible.

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Sorry, but I did too much book reading when I was a youngster, went to church also, the notion that everything just magically appeared one day is misleading.

Does God really exist maybe.

Edited by Marty
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Is that all you have? "Do some reading"?

A combination of reading, and learning from people who support both versions, is how I came to my conclusions about Creationism vs. Evolution.

Orikal, I don't want some religious kook taking away people's civil liberties, but I live in fear that mine will be trampled on and thrown in my face every day simply because I'm a Christian conservative.

At what point did we decide that what was once good and true about this country is no longer? When did we all decide that Christian families and leaders were the enemy? Because they're actually saying what they've been saying since the days of Jesus Christ himself? I do not understand the hatred and the misconceptions and overall lack of empathy toward Christians as a whole, when the very community that wishes to have equal treatment placed upon themselves in the Church can't seem to give any of it worth a damn. I will never understand that mentality, and I was knee-deep in the gay culture for years.

People cannot have it both ways. That's life, that's not just Christianity.

parrothead, you're begging for a dogpile. many people who are extremely anti-christian are so because christians have not practiced what they preach. i've been one of them. i haven't responded to this thread because it was posted, i'm sure, as an attempt to put down or make fun of a christian leader or christians in general.

this is not the place to "stand your ground" (IMHO). i've found that the ministry of christ is in treating others as you would like to be treated. people, these days, want to know your angle when you are kind for no good reason. responding to a thread such is this doesn't serve you or the people who are craving an argument. it is only through relationships and gentile, patient, unconditional acceptance that we can affect our world. we do not have to explain ourselves, we do have to behave with humility, simplicity, patience, consistency, kindness, and never expecting agreement, appreciation or understanding. the political environment and the history of our country is inconsequential, when practicing unconditional love to everyone we come in contact with.

short story: individuals are more important than political systems, school districts, history, having others see your point......no need to explain yourself or state your case. :)

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Since you say don't dog pile on parrothead because we disagree on a theory and then go on to rag people that may have a independent mind is confusing, I am not a Anti Christian I am not a sheepeople either.

Edited by Marty
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parrothead, you're begging for a dogpile. many people who are extremely anti-christian are so because christians have not practiced what they preach

I see your point.

Edited by Marty
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I remember she was trying to pawn her dog on the net. would any loving christian give away her pets to total strangers on the net, NO practice what you preach.

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if you want to argue semantics at this time of night, perhaps you should IM me.

Maybe you should read the forum more often instead of jumping in the middle of the thread, that would help alot.

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Maybe you should read the forum more often instead of jumping in the middle of the thread, that would help alot.

Hey Bach, why don't you knock the dust off of your new moderator wand and take some action.

What are ya? Chicken?

(j/k... sorta.. well, not really :) )

Edited by Jeebus
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