jb4647 Posted October 3, 2007 Share Posted October 3, 2007 I live at The Weslayan Condos off of 59/Weslayan. They are in the process of replacing the roof for the first time since it was constructed ('82-83). They offered us the use of the crane that they will use to lift our AC compressors to install new ones. My compressor is on the roof and is an original unit from 1982. My condo is on the 3rd floor (the highest) and is a 2b2b @ 1263 sq. I had an HVAC contractor come out and he gave me the following quote for $6250: We propose the following scope of work at the above referenced address. Dave Lennox Signature Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 if the condo complex is offering the crane for free, all i can say is you're being raped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Marty Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 You could get a cheaper price if you had to replace a 30 sqft roof on a house and replacing your ac unit at the same time. how tall is this condo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I notice the quote includes replacing the air handler as well. Do you need to replace the interior unit, too, or just want the two units to match?Considering you could have an entire system, including ductwork, installed for this price, I would say this quote is way out of line. You ought to be able to get quotes in the $3000 to $4000 range for a quality install. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb4647 Posted October 4, 2007 Author Share Posted October 4, 2007 You could get a cheaper price if you had to replace a 30 sqft roof on a house and replacing your ac unit at the same time. how tall is this condo?It's a three floor building and I'm on the third floor. I notice the quote includes replacing the air handler as well. Do you need to replace the interior unit, too, or just want the two units to match?Considering you could have an entire system, including ductwork, installed for this price, I would say this quote is way out of line. You ought to be able to get quotes in the $3000 to $4000 range for a quality install.I'm replacing the air handler as the new compressor uses the new refridgerant (R-410a). The old Refridgerant is being phased out and I'm being told that both components need to be changed because of this. Regarding quotes, who should I request them from? Do you have any suggestions? My problem is that there is not a "Blue Book" source of HVAC components such as Compressors, Air Handlers...etc....I have no way to judge is this Lennox XC15 Compressor priced competively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 That sounds high, but every install is different so it is hard to say...it could all be really easy to access and it will just nearly bolt right up or they could have to tear out walls and make all sorts of custom ductwork and whatnot to make the unit fit and work right. That's part of the reason there's no blue book of A/C units.Are they replacing the lineset (copper lines that run between the indoor and outdoor unit)? It is preferable to get a new lineset when switching refrigerants.....the old compressor oil isn't compatible with the new.The quality of the install is more important than the brand of the unit. Most units nowadays are about the same as far as features, reliability and cost go, and actual the cost of the unit really isn't that high in relation to the total bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Since you only have 1200 feet I will concur with Red and Musicman. You keep saying, you are on the third floor, but you are getting the crane for free. You only need about a 3 to 4 ton unit anyways. Perhaps it is the Lennox brand name though and it being 17 seer, that you are paying for. I am supplying a link for you that MAY help you get a lower price.http://www.lennox.com/promotions/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Since you only have 1200 feet I will concur with Red and Musicman. You keep saying, you are on the third floor, but you are getting the crane for free. You only need about a 3 to 4 ton unit anyways. Perhaps it is the Lennox brand name though and it being 17 seer, that you are paying for. I am supplying a link for you that MAY help you get a lower price.http://www.lennox.com/promotions/Tonnage really doesn't impact price that much....the labor for the install is usually the bulk of the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicman Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Tonnage really doesn't impact price that much....the labor for the install is usually the bulk of the bill.and when the complex is supplying the crane to lift the units up, it just makes the quoted price seem excessive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb4647 Posted October 4, 2007 Author Share Posted October 4, 2007 That sounds high, but every install is different so it is hard to say...it could all be really easy to access and it will just nearly bolt right up or they could have to tear out walls and make all sorts of custom ductwork and whatnot to make the unit fit and work right. That's part of the reason there's no blue book of A/C units.Are they replacing the lineset (copper lines that run between the indoor and outdoor unit)? It is preferable to get a new lineset when switching refrigerants.....the old compressor oil isn't compatible with the new.The quality of the install is more important than the brand of the unit. Most units nowadays are about the same as far as features, reliability and cost go, and actual the cost of the unit really isn't that high in relation to the total bill.I would assume they are replacing what needs to be replaced. That is something I'll ask. I don't think any of the duct work needs to be changed out or worked on. The quote is from John Moore so I figured they wen't a fly-by night company. Our Condo had put us in touch with a fellow that we could never get a hold of and had a yahoo.com address. That's when I decided to get my own HVAC person but use their crane.Since you only have 1200 feet I will concur with Red and Musicman. You keep saying, you are on the third floor, but you are getting the crane for free. You only need about a 3 to 4 ton unit anyways. Perhaps it is the Lennox brand name though and it being 17 seer, that you are paying for. I am supplying a link for you that MAY help you get a lower price.http://www.lennox.com/promotions/I've sent them that link and will take advantage of it. Thanks! The Lennox unit in question is a 2.5 ton and is a 15.70 SEER with 30,400 BTU. Are you saying that the $6000k price should include a crane rental? Should I get an itemized price list before I agree to the work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Tonnage really doesn't impact price that much....the labor for the install is usually the bulk of the bill. Yeah, it is only about a $1000 per ? No big difference. I just had a quote done myself not long ago on a 5 ton unit, NOT Lennox. Lennox is VERY proud of that XC15, since it won some reward, blah, blah, blah. I think a 5 ton unit was going for about $7500 installed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgriff Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I just had a 2 ton unit and air handler replaced in my condo. It cost $5500 from Sears. I needed a crane also. The crane rental was $500 of the $5500 bill.A month later I had to replace my other A/C unit. By this time I had found someone else to do the work. This time I did not replace the air handler. He only charged me $1600, $150 of that was for crane rental. Of course I don't get a warranty like I got from Sears but they were going to charge me $5500 for this one also. I figure a warranty is not worth $3900. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedScare Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Seeing how efficient that unit is, and the fact that you are replacing both sides of the system, the price is not as out of line as I thought. Plus, you are using a company, whereas all of my work has been people doing side jobs, so my estimates are slightly skewed. I still think you could get it done in the $5,000 range though.Good luck, and I will check with my buddy to see if he wants to quote you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAK Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Sears will kill you on AC stuff.as to the OP, i'd ask for an itemized quote, because $6500 is about 2x what you'd expect to pay... but yeah, Lennox XC15 is pricey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Man, I have got to start reading more. JB, if you are replacing the condenser AND the interior unit, then $6400 seems like a good deal. Not a steal, and John Moore is reputable. I think witht he unit you are going with and the company you are using, then paying a little extra is worth it. I thought you were only going with the condenser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb4647 Posted October 4, 2007 Author Share Posted October 4, 2007 Man, I have got to start reading more. JB, if you are replacing the condenser AND the interior unit, then $6400 seems like a good deal. Not a steal, and John Moore is reputable. I think witht he unit you are going with and the company you are using, then paying a little extra is worth it. I thought you were only going with the condenser.I was hoping to go with just a Condensor as the reason I'm doing so is to make use of the crane rental by the roofing company. The new refridgerant puts a new wrinkle into the mix and I don't want to make an investment in the old if they are phasing it out. I remember in the early 90's scrambling to find freon for my '82 Buick!I'm surprised the current cendensor on the roof has lasted this long...since '83. I figure by biting the bullet and having it all replaced now, I should be able to save on electric bills. Being on the third floor...heat rises...vaulted ceilings... I also have an attic as well. If I can take advantage of the lennonx promo then I should be able to knock off a grand from the price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Yeah, it is only about a $1000 per ? No big difference.Correct. No big difference.This page shows a 1.5 ton unit as costing ~$850It also shows a 5 ton unit costing ~$1450Similar minimal cost spreads for the other parts of the system.Of course the big issue is that the effort required to install a given system, regardless of capacity system is roughly the same.If your $1k per ton number was accurate then I could get a 1.5 ton system done for $1.5k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I was hoping to go with just a Condensor as the reason I'm doing so is to make use of the crane rental by the roofing company. The new refridgerant puts a new wrinkle into the mix and I don't want to make an investment in the old if they are phasing it out. I remember in the early 90's scrambling to find freon for my '82 Buick!R-12 (freon for your Buick) is still readily available. R-22 will be readily available for YEARS to come....there are WAY too many systems out there that still use it for it to just disappear. Besides...residential systems shoudn't need regular re-charging unless they have a leak, and if they have a leak then it should be properly fixed then recharged. I had an R-22 system put in my house a while back because I KNEW the techs could do R-22 right. I wasn't as confident in their ability to properly install and tune an R-410a system since they haven't been around as long.Bottom line is, get more bids, and wait a month or two for the weather to cool off a bit. You'll get better prices since the HVAC companies have less business when the weather doesn't require heat nor A/C.Central City Air is supposed to do excellent work but is rather pricey. I got a bid from Autumn Air and they seemed like they'd do good work as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJones Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Correct. No big difference.This page shows a 1.5 ton unit as costing ~$850It also shows a 5 ton unit costing ~$1450Similar minimal cost spreads for the other parts of the system.Of course the big issue is that the effort required to install a given system, regardless of capacity system is roughly the same.If your $1k per ton number was accurate then I could get a 1.5 ton system done for $1.5kNice try, now go put in a 17 seer type condenser, and see what the difference is. 16 seer is about $500 per difference for that Goodman unit. Make sure you are comparing apples to apples please. Lennox 17 seer xc15 is the apple in question here. I am also going by what I was quoted not long ago for a 3 ton unit as opposed to a 4 ton, and the difference was roughly $1000 which included installation and NO cranes involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb4647 Posted October 4, 2007 Author Share Posted October 4, 2007 Correct. No big difference.This page shows a 1.5 ton unit as costing ~$850It also shows a 5 ton unit costing ~$1450I went to that page and did the little wizard they had...the specs I put in matching what John Moore is offering comes out to a total of $4600 for just the parts....with me installing it myself...I can't even change my oil!If I do the $1000 discount (and pay of the credit quickly) it would run me about $5200...thus labor costing me about $600I guess this sounds reasonable to me. The good news is that they arn't going to replace the roof in our building until six weeks from now so I've got some time. Also, Moore says they can finish the whole job in 6-8 hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Nice try, now go put in a 17 seer type condenser, and see what the difference is. 16 seer is about $500 per difference for that Goodman unit. Make sure you are comparing apples to apples please. Lennox 17 seer xc15 is the apple in question here. I am also going by what I was quoted not long ago for a 3 ton unit as opposed to a 4 ton, and the difference was roughly $1000 which included installation and NO cranes involved.The 16 seer 5 ton unit on that site is a dual stage unit. The compressor is loads more expenisve, plus it needs more complex controls.The difference between the 2 ton 16 seer unit and the 4 ton 16 seer unit is only $400. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm1fd Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I went to that page and did the little wizard they had...the specs I put in matching what John Moore is offering comes out to a total of $4600 for just the parts....with me installing it myself...I can't even change my oil!That site charges WAY WAY more, about double, what your A/C guy pays down at the warehouse.If I do the $1000 discount (and pay of the credit quickly) it would run me about $5200...thus labor costing me about $600I guess this sounds reasonable to me. The good news is that they arn't going to replace the roof in our building until six weeks from now so I've got some time. Also, Moore says they can finish the whole job in 6-8 hours.If they're saying 6-8 hours then, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, GET MORE QUOTES. They're definetly overcharging. I spent $6k for a new system with a 15 SEER unit and a variable speed ultra high efficiency furnace. Gas furnaces are more than electric, variable speed is a big money option, as is the ultra high eff. The kicker is....they spent 3 days doing the install. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Marty Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 It's a three floor building and I'm on the third floor.Yeah, Three stories will always raise the estimate, I would say 5000 dollars is the max on this job, just make sure they are insured! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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