Houston Misconceptions via Phoenix

[lockmat]

I wrote this in my blogger blog, hoping it would automatically feed into my HAIF blog, but it didn't. Here it is:

About six years ago I was in Phoenix visiting a friend when her dad casually mentioned that Phoenix was bigger than Houston. I kindly corrected him only to recieve a reply of disbelief.

Fast forward to this past weekend and I was spending time with this man's son, again in Phoenix. We were discussing Carmelo Anthony possibly being traded to the Houston Rockets. He was somewhat astonished that I'd think Carmelo would want to go to a smaller market than Denver. I had to kindly correct him as well.

So I am not sure if this perception that Houston is small is just from this family, Phoenix or even nation wide.

Have any of you run into this?

http://lockmat.blogs...is-houston.html

Edited September 13, 2010 by lockmat

[TheNiche]

I wrote this in my blogger blog, hoping it would automatically feed into my HAIF blog, but it didn't. Here it is:

http://lockmat.blogs...is-houston.html

No, never. The Houston area fares well by any ranking (State, MSA, Harris County, City of Houston, height of downtown, square footage of downtown).

Maricopa County will soon displace Harris County for having the 3rd largest population of any county in the nation, but that's mostly just because counties in Arizona are gargantuan in size and encompass entire metropolitan areas.

[lockmat]

No, never. The Houston area fares well by any ranking (State, MSA, Harris County, City of Houston, height of downtown, square footage of downtown).

Maricopa County will soon displace Harris County for having the 3rd largest population of any county in the nation, but that's mostly just because counties in Arizona are gargantuan in size and encompass entire metropolitan areas.

I know Houston has many misconceptions, but I didn't really know being "small" was one of them. Niche, how big do people think it is when you meet someone like that?

[TheNiche]

I know Houston has many misconceptions, but I didn't really know being "small" was one of them. Niche, how big do people think it is when you meet someone like that?

I don't meet people like that. The majority of people complain about it being too big!

[HtownWxBoy]

It's not that I come across people who think Houston is "small"... it's just some don't seem to know it's as big (population-wise) as it is... that it's the 4th largest city in the Nation after Chicago. I think a lot of that has to do w/ Houston not being as much as a tourist destination as other big cities and the fact that it is spread out more so it doesn't seem as populated.

Other misconceptions...

- Houston is very conservative since it's in Texas (we may not be San Francisco but we are definitely not as conservative as people think)

- It's hot and humid all year round

- There are lots of cowboys and cactus

[LegacyTree]

Have you ever looked at Phoenix from google earth? Wow that's kinda boring, I see it's growth configuration like an overgrown west texas town. It at least has the desert backdrop but it's downtown skyline is nothing to write home about, or the fact that it has 1-1/2ish skylines. Houston has 3-4 depending on who you ask.

Edited September 14, 2010 by LegacyTree

[ricco67]

Have you ever looked at Phoenix from google earth? Wow that's kinda boring, I see it's growth configuration like an overgrown west texas town. It at least has the desert backdrop but it's downtown skyline is nothing to write home about, or the fact that it has 1-1/2ish skylines. Houston has 3-4 depending on who you ask.

I think it's about as big as it's going to get. Arizona (and L.A.) have serious issues to contend with as far as water goes. I wouldn't doubt if the population shrinks in Phoenix would start occurring sometime in the 20's. LA might do a bit better, but their infrastructure is going to need a major improvement for water. That is, unless an earthquake or taxes takes them out sometime in the mid century.

[TheNiche]

I think it's about as big as it's going to get. Arizona (and L.A.) have serious issues to contend with as far as water goes. I wouldn't doubt if the population shrinks in Phoenix would start occurring sometime in the 20's. LA might do a bit better, but their infrastructure is going to need a major improvement for water. That is, unless an earthquake or taxes takes them out sometime in the mid century.

People make a big deal out of water for no good reason. There will be a federal program. The federal spending will be financed disproportionately by states that will not receive reciprocal and proportionate federal investments. The problem will go away. The inequity will go unmentioned. This is the way of things.

As for disasters, Ike should have taught us something, that disasters are a mechanism by way of which a massive in-flow of funds from insurance companies and the federal government create a temporary surge in economic activity and inflate expectations of future growth to the extent that it almost becomes self-fulfilling prophecy, interrupted only by the remote (but real) possibility that a depression might intervene.

[/rant]

[TheNiche]

Have you ever looked at Phoenix from google earth? Wow that's kinda boring, I see it's growth configuration like an overgrown west texas town. It at least has the desert backdrop but it's downtown skyline is nothing to write home about, or the fact that it has 1-1/2ish skylines. Houston has 3-4 depending on who you ask.

Welcome to the mountain west.

Phoenix is pretty much a desert version of Tampa. Lots of golf courses, hospitals, and old people. I prefer Phoenix to Albuquerque/Santa Fe, El Paso, or Las Vegas (the Orlando of the west). But I prefer Salt Lake City or Denver to Phoenix.

[lockmat]

Have you ever looked at Phoenix from google earth? Wow that's kinda boring, I see it's growth configuration like an overgrown west texas town. It at least has the desert backdrop but it's downtown skyline is nothing to write home about, or the fact that it has 1-1/2ish skylines. Houston has 3-4 depending on who you ask.

Actually, from what I saw, there are three districts with mid-rises, with one being about a mile or less away from downtown. However, they're all relatively small.

One thing I kinda liked was grid system because it gives you more than just the freeway to get around town. The downside is the predictability. I kinda like the curves of Houston. I guess I could go for a curvy grid system ;P

[JJVilla]

I think it's about as big as it's going to get. Arizona (and L.A.) have serious issues to contend with as far as water goes. I wouldn't doubt if the population shrinks in Phoenix would start occurring sometime in the W's. LA might do a bit better, but their infrastructure is going to need a major improvement for water. That is, unless an earthquake or taxes takes them out sometime in the mid century.

Water and reduced tax base is going to kill them (or least slow their growth) for sure. My wife went to ASU and works for a consulting firm that deals with water so she agrees with/has told me of the water issue they face and the empty neighborhoods. Whole blocks in some subdivisions are empty due to out of state (CA) speculators or people forced to leave them.

I think their misperception of Houston reflects badly on them not us!

Edited September 14, 2010 by JJVilla

[barracuda]

Most folks I meet from around the country through business are aware of Houston and it's size. I'm guessing your friend and his son are just provincial in mindset.

That said, I have had a few non-work experiences like yours, like being asked if Houston was in a treeless desert with lots of horses and sagebrush. Next time I'm just going to agree that we all ride horses to work rather than dispel the illusion.

[lockmat]

Most folks I meet from around the country through business are aware of Houston and it's size. I'm guessing your friend and his son are just provincial in mindset.

That said, I have had a few non-work experiences like yours, like being asked if Houston was in a treeless desert with lots of horses and sagebrush. Next time I'm just going to agree that we all ride horses to work rather than dispel the illusion.

When I went to school in California early in the 00's, i told some people we rode horses to work and stuff on dirt roads and they believed me. You should try it next time.

But yeah, maybe it is the family because a few weeks ago her sister called me while I was fishing in the Gulf and she was surprised to know Houston was so near water. This family isn't stupid, they're all college educated, one is even a lobbyist ;P, but I guess they just are clueless about Houston, haha

[20thStDad]

Houston's common misconceptions are nothing compared to south Louisiana. Yes, my home is on a bayou and everything is exactly like the move The Waterboy. Discovery channel isn't helping with the new show about swamp people.

[Talbot]

Everyone I have ever met out of state know that Houston is a huge city.

[rsb320]

Houston's common misconceptions are nothing compared to south Louisiana. Yes, my home is on a bayou and everything is exactly like the move The Waterboy. Discovery channel isn't helping with the new show about swamp people.

Yes, and you have dark hair and skin and speak with a thick coon-ass accent too, cher.

[editor]

Have you ever looked at Phoenix from google earth? Wow that's kinda boring, I see it's growth configuration like an overgrown west texas town. It at least has the desert backdrop but it's downtown skyline is nothing to write home about, or the fact that it has 1-1/2ish skylines. Houston has 3-4 depending on who you ask.

I've looked at Phoenix from the roof of one of its tallest building, and Google Earth is pretty much spot on. There's an OK little downtown, and a minor secondary skyline to the north, but the rest is just a vast brown suburb, very much like I remember of El Paso and other West Texas places.

I'm surprised people in Phoenix would think that Houston is smaller than Denver, though in terms of cultural awareness, Denver is the capitol of the mountain west, so that might account for some of it if the person you spoke to was a lifer.

Everyone I've ever spoken to about Houston has known it's a very big city. Sometimes they're surprised that it's #4 in the nation, but never have they thought it's small or even mid-sized.

This is going to sound a lot more bitchy than I mean it, but is it possible that your friend's dad is exceptionally stupid, or uninformed? After all, 50% of us are dumber than the rest.

[editor]

I think all the predictions about water stunting the growth of American desert cities like Phoenix is a little overblown.

It would all make sense, if urban planners, ecologists, and engineers ran the world and shaped cities. But they don't. Politicians, real estate speculators, and retirees are the real forces behind the growth of PHX.

The more people move there, the larger the demand for water gets, the louder the electorate gets, the more willing politicians get to spend more money on fatter, longer pipes to bring in water from farther away. In the next 75 years I could see Phoenix having desalination plants on the California coast. Or even cheaper -- in Baja, Mexico.

Money has a way of making the impossible happen.

[lockmat]

I've looked at Phoenix from the roof of one of its tallest building, and Google Earth is pretty much spot on. There's an OK little downtown, and a minor secondary skyline to the north, but the rest is just a vast brown suburb, very much like I remember of El Paso and other West Texas places.

I'm surprised people in Phoenix would think that Houston is smaller than Denver, though in terms of cultural awareness, Denver is the capitol of the mountain west, so that might account for some of it if the person you spoke to was a lifer.

Everyone I've ever spoken to about Houston has known it's a very big city. Sometimes they're surprised that it's #4 in the nation, but never have they thought it's small or even mid-sized.

This is going to sound a lot more bitchy than I mean it, but is it possible that your friend's dad is exceptionally stupid, or uninformed? After all, 50% of us are dumber than the rest.

As a family they've lived in Tacoma, Los Angeles and Portugal and visitied many cities (except Houston I guess).

I hope I didn't put words in their mouth but they never said Houston was SMALL, they just thought Phoenix was bigger, and the son referred to it as a market smaller than Denver.

So maybe they're in the boat of the people you have met, that they knew it was a big city but were surprised that it was bigger than Phoenix and also #4.

Also, there is another "skyline" smaller than the one just north of downtown. It's a little further to the northwest, about 5-10 min drive near the Biltmore area. It's whree the Fashion Square mall and Ritz Carlton are. The son said that's where the pro teams stay when in town.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=camelback+%26+24th&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=W+Camelback+Rd+%26+N+24th+Ave,+Phoenix,+Maricopa,+Arizona+85015&ll=33.508445,-112.028253&spn=0.007836,0.0212&t=h&z=16

Edited September 16, 2010 by lockmat