The Next Slum?

[sidegate]

What's that noise? I think I hear Sugarland breaking ground on their new cathedral. To be surrounded by a mixed-use development called Cathedral Centre. And a giant wall. Perhaps a moat. Could be overkill, but everyone just loves a water feature!

[memebag]

What's that noise? I think I hear Sugarland breaking ground on their new cathedral. To be surrounded by a mixed-use development called Cathedral Centre. And a giant wall. Perhaps a moat. Could be overkill, but everyone just loves a water feature!

Anyone see the list of shops going in at Cathedral Centre? I hope they get some good money changers.

[TheNiche]

My motto, environmental issues aside, has always been live where you want to live, work where you have to.

That's perfectly fine. In fact, it's fully analogous to people that work downtown and move to the suburbs to raise a family, but that would prefer working closer to where they live if that were a reasonable option.

Just so long as you don't prosthletize people for contributing to sprawl or use your urban residence as the basis for smugness, basing a hatred of sprawl in part on energy waste...that's what makes for douchebag status in my book.

[N Judah]

You're accusing me of setting up straw men!?

I didn't cite the blog because it backed me up (or jgriff, actually, who made that statement). I cited it because it has a relevent supplimental opinion that dovetails with my own.

No. You stated that jgriff's statement is true because "This is typically the case among people that actually live in or around small towns" and then said "see below" as if it somehow proved what you were saying.

If I had known you were citing random opinions I would not have bothered to respond to you or taken you seriously. We can fill up thread after thread with links to blogs that agree with us, if that's the direction you want to go. But simply citing random opinion blogs that agree with you doesn't help a discussion, I am sorry to say.

If you think I'm going to quit discussing this topic on the basis that it isn't professionally written, you're wrong. The topic was broached informally, but can be formally attacked.

It can be formally attacked, but it doesn't *have* to be. Anyway, cited articles in well-read journals should be enough for this conversation since that's how it got started. I don't really care whether or not you want to impugn the credibility of journalists you happen to disagree with. But I do hope that anyone else reading this thread appreciated that stat and how it relates to density w/r/t environmentalistm.

[TheNiche]

No. You stated that jgriff's statement is true because "This is typically the case among people that actually live in or around small towns" and then said "see below" as if it somehow proved what you were saying.

If I had known you were citing random opinions I would not have bothered to respond to you or taken you seriously. We can fill up thread after thread with links to blogs that agree with us, if that's the direction you want to go. But simply citing random opinion blogs that agree with you doesn't help a discussion, I am sorry to say.

You misunderstood. I'm sorry that that wasn't made explicitly clear. Moreover I'm sorry that I didn't instead just spend additional time paraphrasing the blog, thereafter claiming their opinions to be my own, which they are. It's just that I didn't realize how important duplicative effort is to you. Oh, wait...I'm not sorry for anything.

It can be formally attacked, but it doesn't *have* to be. Cited articles in well-read journals should be enough for this conversation. I don't really care whether or not you want to impugn the credibility of journalists you happen to disagree with. But I do hope that anyone else reading this thread appreciated that stat and how it relates to density w/r/t environmentalistm.

Perhaps it is because I have manipulated primary and secondary data for personal and professional advancement in the past (not that my data weren't true or accurate), but I'll be the first to question methodology when journalists cite unsourced data. And I don't care how many people have laid eyes upon these articles. Lots of people listen to Rush Limbaugh and Ed Schultz, but that doesn't mean that some cherry-picked unsourced statistic that they throw out there ought to be cited in this discussion on HAIF.

[crunchtastic]

Anyone see the list of shops going in at Cathedral Centre? I hope they get some good money changers.

A few local concerns are looking at possible opportunities at C.C.

But, I also heard Cheesecake Factory is a strong tentative!

[N Judah]

You misunderstood. I'm sorry that that wasn't made explicitly clear. Moreover I'm sorry that I didn't instead just spend additional time paraphrasing the blog, thereafter claiming their opinions to be my own, which they are. It's just that I didn't realize how important duplicative effort is to you. Oh, wait...I'm not sorry for anything.

You misunderstand. I'm not interested in your opinions when I explicitly asked jgriff (not you) to explain his/her stat to me. Next time I want a non sequitur, I'll be sure to ask for one, okey doke? I don't care how useful or interesting you think your opinions are.

Perhaps it is because I have manipulated primary and secondary data for personal and professional advancement in the past (not that my data weren't true or accurate), but I'll be the first to question methodology when journalists cite unsourced data.

Cool -- like I said, take that up with the New Yorker. Give them a call and I'm sure they'll give you a cite.

[TheNiche]

You misunderstand. I'm not interested in your opinions when I explicitly asked jgriff (not you) to explain his/her stat to me. Next time I want a non sequitur, I'll be sure to ask for one, okey doke? I don't care how useful or interesting you think your opinions are.

Has it ever occured to you that I don't care that you don't care?

The fact is that I interjected. I don't regret doing so. If you don't like it, you're welcome to modify your settings and put me on your ignore list. Otherwise, deal with it. If you can't deal with it, and are so compelled to challenge it relentlessly yet without cause, you're only drawing more attention to it and your inability to provide an effective counter.

[N Judah]

Has it ever occured to you that I don't care that you don't care?

Well, that seems like a roundabout way of admitting that you contribute nothing to the conversation at hand. Waste everyone's time if you want to make yourself feel better, isn't that what it's all about?

The fact is that I interjected. I don't regret doing so. If you don't like it, you're welcome to modify your settings and put me on your ignore list. Otherwise, deal with it. If you can't deal with it, and are so compelled to challenge it relentlessly yet without cause, you're only drawing more attention to it and your inability to provide an effective counter.

I am happy when you interject, if you have something legitimately useful to add. In this case, you did not. Consider this an "effective counter."

To anyone else who has bothered to read this far, I hope they enjoyed the stat from the New Yorker (a widely-read, extensively fact-checked publication) and all the furor it caused. In the future, now we all know exactly how to effectively counteract "TheNiche" when he goes on one of his anti-environmental screeds.

[TheNiche]

Absurdity will get you nowhere. Unless somebody else that has a grasp of the consistent use of logic decides to pipe up, I'm done with this.

[N Judah]

Grrrreeeaat. I'll let the New Yorker know you consider their publication to be absurdist. I'm sure they will care.

[cumby]

The article -- right on. I watched my brother go into foreclosure because he bit off more than he could chew in a new neighborhood where he was the target market. I laughed when among all his bills the HOA sent a letter telling him to mow the lawn -- you can just send that to Citibank -- but it has to suck to be the bill paying neighbor who has to live next to that. And just like the article said, you know he sold everything he could before he left down to the blinds and garage door hardware. Frankly, it was slummy to begin with even being new because of that target audience -- it's at Hardy and 45 -- and there have to be hundreds of similar neighborhoods like that.

Thought the comment on the schools going up was interesting -- CyFair ISD, once having been a premier suburban district, has been in dire straits lately. Not that I'm excited about my son going to HISD, nor do I think they are improving in any way, shape or form, but I could see how some of those suburban areas are about to get hit hard.

I understand the living complexes. There are the Uptown Park looking things (one just went up at 249 and Louetta, which is good because no one likes the mall since that is where the haves and have-nots collide) and then Kingwood is developing something that I've heard touted as a Kemah-ish place at Lake Houston on the water. Not that I know where they are, if anywhere, on that development, but you should here the residents talk about it. Frankly, those suburbanites all live closer to a Target than I do living in the Loop!! As for Wal-Mart, I hate them mostly for the way they hurt their communities by building huge stores and then abandoning them to build a bigger one across the street. No conscience.

[cnote]

Thought the comment on the schools going up was interesting -- CyFair ISD, once having been a premier suburban district, has been in dire straits lately. Not that I'm excited about my son going to HISD, nor do I think they are improving in any way, shape or form, but I could see how some of those suburban areas are about to get hit hard.

How is Cy-Fair in dire straits? I have heard of performance issues at one of their high schools, out of the 9 they have open, and are currently building three more. they are putting up schools very quicky. They aren't in financial trouble. What do you mean?

Just curious, I dont want to come off as if I am attacking here, this thread has enough animosity

[TheNiche]

As for Wal-Mart, I hate them mostly for the way they hurt their communities by building huge stores and then abandoning them to build a bigger one across the street. No conscience.

How does that hurt a community? More jobs, larger tax base, a large vacant retail shell building that can be utilized as something else, a new grocery store, relatively inexpensive goods (especially perscription drugs), the necessity to walk around a whole lot even on a small shopping trip (i.e. public health and wellness).

I like them...in large part on account of that I don't have to deal with affluent yuppie shoppers or products oriented towards them. And affluent yuppies shoppers should like Wal-Mart because it is a magnet for poor people that would otherwise only spend more of their time in malls and at other middle-ground retailers that yuppies tend to frequent.

[dbigtex56]

Discussion on Walmart on this thread.

Back on topic, please.

[KatieDidIt]

How is Cy-Fair in dire straits? I have heard of performance issues at one of their high schools, out of the 9 they have open, and are currently building three more. they are putting up schools very quicky. They aren't in financial trouble. What do you mean?

Just curious, I dont want to come off as if I am attacking here, this thread has enough animosity

Yes, they are two years from being in deep financial trouble. There was an article about it in the Chronicle this weekend. Many districts are a few years away from big time trouble due to Perry's tax cuts. Cy-Fair was listed as the one in the biggest trouble.

[VicMan]

Have you checked your specific zoned schools? It'll help to see how your specific zoned schools do. The wealthiest neighborhoods tend to have the highest performing and safest public schools. Also HISD operates magnets, which help when people do not like their zoned schools.

Anyhow, use this tool: http://dept.houstonisd.org/ab/abcx_tool/search.asp

And then use www.greatschools.net and www.schooldigger.com to check out the schools.

Thought the comment on the schools going up was interesting -- CyFair ISD, once having been a premier suburban district, has been in dire straits lately. Not that I'm excited about my son going to HISD, nor do I think they are improving in any way, shape or form, but I could see how some of those suburban areas are about to get hit hard.

[cnote]

Yes, they are two years from being in deep financial trouble. There was an article about it in the Chronicle this weekend. Many districts are a few years away from big time trouble due to Perry's tax cuts. Cy-Fair was listed as the one in the biggest trouble.

Wow, I don't know how I haven't heard about this yet, or how there isn't a thread on it in the Great NW section. Thanks for the heads up Katie and Cumby.

Something needs to be worked out here, as has been stated in this thread, the schools are a significant key in maintaining property values, though there is a little chicken and the egg between the schools going downhill and the property values.

[missmsry]

And don't forget, we can "blame" Edward Teas for the invasive Chinese Tallows.

[longcat]

Twenty years ago, Houston was a donut. Now, it looks more like a target. Most mid-age "suburbs" between 610 and BW8 have trended downward, and even some areas outside the Beltway are reasonably ghetto.

Will skyrocketing gas prices change this dynamic and encourage people to abandon the further out 'burbs and cause the area between 610 and BW8 to redevelop the way that inside the loop has? I'm sure there is some price point that would push us in that direction, just don't know how drastic it would need to be.

[TheNiche]

Will skyrocketing gas prices change this dynamic and encourage people to abandon the further out 'burbs and cause the area between 610 and BW8 to redevelop the way that inside the loop has? I'm sure there is some price point that would push us in that direction, just don't know how drastic it would need to be.

There is a push/pull. High gas prices encourage people to move closer to work and work to move closer to employees.

But the greater driver of location decisions is time. Gasoline is chump change compared to our time. And to the extent that higher gas prices cause some margin of people to use Park & Ride services, thus reducing congestion, it makes living further out that much more attractive to those that can afford it.