Is Dallas Considered A "newer" City Than Houston?

[2112]

I love Houston, and I'd live here over Dallas any day, but the fact is that they are a lot more energetic, upbeat and forward thinking than we are.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That is a generalization that is incorrectly applied to either city. The DART system in Dallas is an example of forward thinking there. We are behind in that regard. But that is not to say "we" were not forward thinking. All that means is that as a collective between the people and our leaders, we have to this point failed to keep up with Dallas

[Gary]

That is a generalization that is incorrectly applied to either city.

[rantanamo]

Don't worry about Houston, it has always been a forward thinking city. Dallas on the other hand has gotten caught up in its own crap so much that it has not looked forward at times. Thankfully that began to change in the 90s though there are plenty of lapses.

[RyanJX5]

I visit both cities frequently, and I live closer to Dallas. Dallas has a very nice feel on the northside of Downtown espcially Oak Lawn, Preston,Northwest hwy, and North Central. Parts of it seem run down like Harry Hines and around Love Field and Garland. Houston is not as planned Dallas, but has just as many nice areas. They both are the same to me, just different enviroments and zoning procedures. Houston has areas such as Uptown and Downtown that has a more modern busier feel to me. The arches and the density of the retail and office space is very sureal and its evolving to something greater with all the renovations. As far millionaires; Houston has more millionaires while Dallas has more billionaires. Both cities have very posh older established communities. Both skylines had there boom in the 70s and 80s. The Rice and Musuem district area is my fav place to visit and future home.

[TxDave]

This topic always amazes me, but when you really get down to it, Houston and Dallas are pretty much the same city (size, characteristics, growth, etc.).

As far as how "new" the cities look, I am still amazed at how dynamic and current the Houston skyline continues to look, even though most of the more prominent buildings are now at least 20 years old. Dallas, on the other hand, seems to need some "new blood" injected into its skyline. Also, the buildings in Houston are definitely taller that those in Dallas.

There is one other current trend that I have noticed that does seem to differentiate the two cities even more. The new buildings planned or being built in Houston (primarily condo towers from downtown to Uptown/Galleria) are still very tall whereas the new buildings in Dallas (mostly clustered in Uptown/Downtown) seem to generally be around 20 stories or less - somewhat small to Houston standards.

In the near term, this leads me to expect Dallas to be populated with a higher concentration of shorter buildings (20 stories or less) and Houston will continue to be covered with a more disperse set of tall building that are more separate from each other.

Houston will be taller, Dallas will be more concentrated. Any thoughts?

[RedScare]

There may be more proposeals for tall condos in Houston, but a lot of them are never built. Overall, given that the density of both cities is identical (Houston is merely twice as large), and the cities are very similar, I would expect both cities to build somewhat alike.

In the close in areas, I personally expect more midrises, since they are cheaper to build. Both cities already see a lot of townhome construction. As more baby boomers retire, look for more construction that appeals to them (both cities draw a lot of retirees, amazingly).

[The Great Hizzy!]

I think your viewpoint, TxDave, is pretty much right on concerning development from about 1970 to 1999. However, I think both cities, due to economics, will probably develop towers in similar fashion, including height and capacity, for the next 20 or so years.

[TxDave]

Thanks for the update. I do see many plans for tall condo towers on this site but don't get much verification (I am overdue for a visit to Houston!). Regardless of what gets built, Houston is taller than Dallas (not sure why that is, given every thing else - seems they should be similar).

RedScare brought up a good example of where both cities' growth could come from - retirees.

Actually, older people or younger people, Houston's Midtown will eventually be spectacular and should have taken off years ago. I only wish I had bought land there when I lived in Houston 10+ years ago and saw the area's potential then... oh, well

[danes75]

yay! i love talking about dallas. again, i think most people's opinions of the city are based on drive-through assessments... what can be seen from the highways. the remark about highrise buildings doesn't seem to reflect all the billion-dollar condo construction taking place along Turtle Creek. Houston has no comparison when it comes to those.

to me, houston feels like a newer city. it is plagued by rapid growth problems like a poor infrastructure and stripmall madness. the feeling of newness is further emphasized by the fact that houston doesn't work a whole lot towards preserving its history. i've found very few areas that have been redeveloped here as they have in Fair Park, Deep Ellum, Lower Greenville, and the West End.

as for skylines, it all has to do with occupancy. if no one is in the ones already built, then no one is going to invest in building another. it seems highrises are pretty much limited to downtown here in houston (and some in the galleria) but in dallas there are concentrations of them as far north as plano and richardson.

i was looking for new office space for my ad agency there a few years ago and found a building that I loved... Class A, built in 1989, 27th floor, sweeping views of Trinity and Uptown. The list price was 32 bucks a square foot, which was WAY out of my price range. Just to see how low they'd go, I said we could only afford about 13/sq ft.

They gave it to me for 12 and threw in two parking spaces.

[Nakatosh]

Dallas seemed older to me when i visited...especially around their downtown area.their freeway's also have an older feeling.

[HOUCAJUN]

Dallas seemed older to me when i visited...especially around their downtown area.their freeway's also have an older feeling.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah like a glorified Lufkin?Nacagdoches

[Gary]

Hey Danes75, how do you figure that Houston only has highrises in DT and Uptown?

There are concentrations of highrises all over this city. midtown, greenway plaza, medical center, westchase, energy corridor, greenspoint, woodlands etc.

That being said, the great thing about Houston vs other sprawl cities is the fact that from many vantage points you can see a massive concentration of highrises within a 5 to 7 mile area. I've always loved that about Houston.

Also to call Houston "strip mall madness" is a little off kilter when refering to Dallas as it has hundreds of strip malls.

You would be correct in your assessment of Houston not being very good in preserving it's historical buildings, however it has one of the finest (imo) preserved art deco highrises anywhere with the Chase Bank building (formally Gulf Oil). Dallas has done a few things with the historicity of the city but it's by no means overwelming. So both cities are fairly similar in this area with Dallas maybe holding a slight edge.

As I said a few weeks ago, both cities must be viewed off the freeways to take in there true culture and vibrancy.

[HOUCAJUN]

Dallas does have a lot of strip malls. Why is it when people go to dallas they somehow become blind and when they come hear they seem to have just come off of Lasik surgery. Why is that.

[NewMND]

Dallas does have a lot of strip malls. Why is it when people go to dallas they somehow become blind and when they come hear they seem to have just come off of Lasik surgery. Why is that.

Well if they're driving down the 45 in Houston, then it's understandable. That has got to be the ugliest stretch of freeway I've ever seen. But the 59 near Montrose and Greenway and the 610 in Uptown are nice. I guess most visitors though end up on the 45, it is the one that goes to the airport.

[HOUCAJUN]

Well if they're driving down the 45 in Houston, then it's understandable.  That has got to be the ugliest stretch of freeway I've ever seen.  But the 59 near Montrose and Greenway and the 610 in Uptown are nice.  I guess most visitors though end up on the 45, it is the one that goes to the airport.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

well I-35 from desoto to downtown then to 635 is real ugly to me. why don't people see that?definitely doesn't give me the impression of newness.

[danes75]

i've stated elsewhere on here that the worst part of Dallas is 30/35, so its not that I don't see it. but come on; the entire way from the woodlands to clearlake is ugly as sin. i mean, how many used car dealerships ARE there in Houston? at least in dallas most of them are in the fitzhugh/gaston area.

i'll take the lighter route and say both cities have unique attributes and hope we can get back on the question of which one looks newer, not which one is ugliest.

[RedScare]

I find it nothing short of comical that anyone would judge any city by how it "looks" from its freeways. If freeways were worth looking at, we'd all fight to live near them. But, if you must decide who has the best view from an interstate, I vote for this one.

http://www.gribblenation.com/ncpics/i-26/

[Gary]

Red scare is correct, in fact I mentioned this around the time this thread started.

Almost any city CANNOT be viewed from it's freeways if you really want to know how the city looks and experience what it's about. Houston and Dallas are no exception.

Danes75 mentions I-45 from The Woodlands to Clear Lake being ugly, and for the most part he would be correct. That being said if you were to venture a measly mile off of 45 in The Woodlands you would find a beautiful city that's well kept and marvelously planned. You would also find Clear Lake, The Heights, and Downtown to give you similar results.

[tierwestah]

i've stated elsewhere on here that the worst part of Dallas is 30/35, so its not that I don't see it.  but come on; the entire way from the woodlands to clearlake is ugly as sin.  i mean, how many used car dealerships ARE there in Houston?  at least in dallas most of them are in the fitzhugh/gaston area.

i'll take the lighter route and say both cities have unique attributes and hope we can get back on the question of which one looks newer, not which one is ugliest.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's a bit much saying that the entire way from The Woodlands to Clearlake is an ugly stretch. I don't see how Dallas is any better. The best part of Dallas is the North Central Expwy north of downtown but everything else seems old and country graze land. How many COW PASTURES ARE there in Dallas? at least in Houston most of them are outside the city limits.

i'll take an even lighter route and say that yes both cities have unique attributes and they both have their own nice areas and bad areas and one is no uglier than the other!

[HOUCAJUN]

That's a bit much saying that the entire way from The Woodlands to Clearlake is an ugly stretch. I don't see how Dallas is any better. The best part of Dallas is the North Central Expwy north of downtown but everything else seems old and country graze land. How many COW PASTURES ARE there in Dallas? at least in Houston most of them are outside the city limits.

i'll take an even lighter route and say that yes both cities have unique attributes and they both have their own nice areas and bad areas and one is no uglier than the other!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

danes 75, read this over and over again until you get it.

[danes75]

get what? most people would rather have cows and grazing lands instead of used car dealerships and run down and abandoned buildings. If you're referring to the area south of Dallas, then yes, there are pastures... and a dump and a landfill. Comparatively, Houston has South Houston and Pasadena and refineries. We're talking about the same highway that runs through both Houston and Dallas, so yes, comparing 75/NCE and 45/Pierce Elevated is accurate.

what I read and read until i got it was that having lived in New York, LA, Dallas, Atlanta and Houston, the only people that actually think Houston is comparable to any of those cities are the people that actually LIVE in Houston.

Houston has areas that look newer than dallas, and visa versa (Galleria area, 59, etc). The difference is that while Dallas' most pricey neighborhoods run along 75 and thus have helped develop the 75/NCE area, Houston's expensive neighborhoods are spread out between River Oaks, Rice U, and Upper Kirby and dillute the development scale.

[tierwestah]

what I read and read until i got it was that having lived in New York, LA, Dallas, Atlanta and Houston, the only people that actually think Houston is comparable to any of those cities are the people that actually LIVE in Houston.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Seriously dude you can't be serious by saying that Houston isn't at least comparible to Dallas. I have many friends/relatives from upstate New York all the way down to Manhattan and they see Houston as a fine place to live. Some are even talking about coming down to live. If that's the case, why did PDiddy who's from New York come down to Houston to have a huge celebrity party a few weeks ago and not Dallas? I would have to say right there that's more than just people from Houston thinking this city compares to those places. And if your talking skylines, i would definitely say it does.

[The Great Hizzy!]

Seriously dude you can't be serious by saying that Houston isn't at least comparible to Dallas.

He/she can if they have a pro-Dallas bias and/or a anti-Houston one. It's just an opinion, which can never be argued. Remember, there are also people on this forum that think Dallas/Atlanta/wherever are dumpy places and not comparable to Houston.

One opinion isn't more important than the other.

[Gary]

what I read and read until i got it was that having lived in New York, LA, Dallas, Atlanta and Houston, the only people that actually think Houston is comparable to any of those cities are the people that actually LIVE in Houston.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm from LA, have lived in New York (although for only a short time), have spent many a day in Dallas and ATL, and your assesment of how people feel about Houston is not my experience at all.

On top of that to make a case that Houston is not in the league of Dallas and ATL is laughable.

Although it's frowned upon somewhat, I will visit skyscraper city from time to time. I mention this because you can get a pretty good feeling of how people feel about a particuler city from many different cultures and mindsets. If you look at any of the Dallas VS Houston or ATL VS Houston threads, Houston wins everytime.

So I say this not to start a flame war but to rebuttle your above comment. Most people think of Houston as larger, more modern and more cosmopolitan than both of these cities.

Of course New York is a whole different ball of wax.

[713 To 214]

How many COW PASTURES ARE there in Dallas? at least in Houston most of them are outside the city limits.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Go to "South Park." Go down 288, South of 610. Exit Belfort or Airport. After you go there, I'll point you to many other places in Houston's City Limits where there are cows grazing right next to urban residential neighborhoods. I swear, some of you must not have lived here long.

[713 To 214]

Houston's expensive neighborhoods are spread out between River Oaks, Rice U, and Upper Kirby and dillute the development scale.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not only are Houston's expensive neighborhoods spread out, but so are many things. That's one thing I don't like about Houston. It's too spread out IMO. But that's just me. I prefer a more dense urban environment.

[tierwestah]

Go to "South Park." Go down 288, South of 610.

[tierwestah]

[RaiderDude]

If that's the case, why did PDiddy who's from New York come down to Houston to have a huge celebrity party a few weeks ago and not Dallas?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh my.. you're post was just fine until you wrote that! lmao I'm from DFW and I'm oh so glad the hip hop/ rap scene isn't as prominent here as it is in Houston. You want PDiddy well then take him! I honestly believe both cities are basically the same with maybe Dallas looking 1 month younger than Houston.

[danes75]

Maybe I mispoke. My reference to comparable/houston was that out of every city I've ever lived in, Houston is the only place where the first question I was asked was "which do you like better, houston or dallas?" To this day, two years later, when I tell someone I moved here from Dallas, its the immediate response.

The PDiddy thing... yeah, rap/hiphop has ruined Deep Ellum.