Westpark Toll Road Mess

[VelvetJ]

agreed - and sheesh, whether it's 9.20 or 6.50 or 3 bucks a day - this is all in addition for having to pay for massive amounts of gas, and having to commute/sit in traffic...ack

and rail? that would mean people would have to ride public transport...eek!

I chose to give up the tollway as well due to cost. Before the dramatic gas increases, I would use it because the time it saved was indeed significant. However, once the gas prices increased, I could no longer spend $120 per month JUST in toll. It began to blow my budget out of the water. Not to mention many of those trips were delayed due to congestion on the tollway. Sevfiv it was exactly the way you described above.

[The Great Hizzy!]

I chose to give up the tollway as well due to cost. Before the dramatic gas increases, I would use it because the time it saved was indeed significant. However, once the gas prices increased, I could no longer spend $120 per month JUST in toll. It began to blow my budget out of the water. Not to mention many of those trips were delayed due to congestion on the tollway. Sevfiv it was exactly the way you described above.

Yeah, that sounds brutal. What do you do now?

[westguy76]

No. I know the difference of before and after. If you are implying anything here, you haven't followed this as closely as I have.

I used to take WT until August 04 or 05 until the congestion suddenly exploded. That was the same week they opened the new ramps.

I also was wondering why they are "obnoxious" Katy commuters? What are you? An annoying commuter?

just a point. There is no dispute that more people started using it alot from the area south of Katy, but why are they obnoxious? Just because they have inconvenienced you or because they are driving you off the road with their bad driving habits?

[IHB2]

METRO definitely needs to incorporate the toll road, bus routes, and P&R lots into and around the Westpark Toll Road facility. But it IS a toll road, and the point is to reduce congestion to the social optimal. So (assuming the completion of the Katy doesn't put an end to the madness) the tolls need to go up.

the WT ROW has room to double its lanes and also run rail to 99 and beyond. that's the future planned by HCTRA and METRO. and I'm sure the tolls will go up forever b/c the concept of actually paying off construction of a road by tolls instead of tax $$ has been erased from social memory by the political class.

[Jeebus]

Light Rail would have been a better solution.

And then what? As in: and then what will all those riding the light rail from SH99 to the Hilcroft Transit Center do? Take the bus? tell that to the thousands of people who don't work along a bus route corridor.

The light rail needs to start in the center and work its way out. The commuter rail needs to start in the suburbs and work its way in.

[Guest Plastic]

Just imagine Westside without The Westpark. It's offering relief. Besides you had no major thuroughfare for Alief,Mission Bend, and South Katy.

The only way to expand it is to make a double decker. That or take Westpark drive away completle and make it 8 lanes wide.Then you'd need a replacement feeder somewhere in the neighborhood behind Westpark.

I studies Electrical Engineering and the problem seems to be the same......too much resistance. THe problem isn't traffic on the Westpark but traffic it want's tomerge on with. This hapens with most freeways......trafic flows fine but it backs up at major junctions. Instead of having everyone in the far right lane have to merge left to stay on the highway make extra lanes to the right so they won't have to move. There and freeway exits are where we have the broblem. If we could fix the problem with highway junctions and stoplights we'd have much of the freeway dilemas solved.

Only question, there was this show on DIscovery saying more lanes aren't the soloution to the problem. THe more concrete you add the more people want to ride not helping the problem at all or making it worse. Would you say this is true and that the Westpark is a prime example of this? You ought to be able to make enough concrete that everyone could be able to ride effeciently. More lanes, more highways,tolllanes, whateber.

[TheNiche]

Only question, there was this show on DIscovery saying more lanes aren't the soloution to the problem. THe more concrete you add the more people want to ride not helping the problem at all or making it worse.

The problem isn't that many people want to use it. It is built to be used. High levels of use justify the Westpark Toll Road's existence.

Congestion is a problem, however. But it is one with an easy solution. It IS a toll road, after all.

[Mr. Chenevert]

Supply and Demand.... I wouldnt recommend any changes until I-10 construction is finished, but once that is done, they need to manage congestion on Westpark by raising the toll amount.

I think we should have variable tolls in Houston. Once the price gets too high, people will use an alternative route, and that will ensure that the people that do get on, enjoy a congestion free ride.

Westpark would be a prime subject for a pilot program that could then be expanded to include all new toll projects.

[desirous]

You could make class based arguments against it now for only allowing those who can afford an EZ-tag access.

Raise the tolls as traffic increases. It is a toll road for crying out loud.

EZTag payments are cheaper than cash ones on BW8.

The Westpark Tollway isn't ultimately meant for Katy commuters - Katy has excellent North-South access to IH10. It's mostly meant for the titanic mass of homes called "West Houston" between SH6 and Dairy Ashford. They have always had a hard time getting to a freeway, and will be the ultimate users of the Westpark Tollway once IH10 construction is completed.

As for the BW8 intersection, what they need is a full interchange. Access to the WT from BW8 is fine; exiting from the WT is the serious ordeal. I wonder why they didn't build a full 4-level interchange, instead of just half of one.

[Pumapayam]

I wonder why they didn't build a full 4-level interchange, instead of just half of one.

I don't know if they had the land for it, and they simply just cut corners.

I mean the damn thing is only 2 lanes.

[MaxConcrete]

As for the BW8 intersection, what they need is a full interchange. Access to the WT from BW8 is fine; exiting from the WT is the serious ordeal. I wonder why they didn't build a full 4-level interchange, instead of just half of one.

Cost is always an issue, and obviously HCTRA built Westpark on the cheap.

Another issue at BW8/Westpark is the high-voltage right-of-way. There are at least two tower guideways, and my suspicion is that the wires would need to be raised to accommodate elevated ramps. Perhaps you could go one level above the Westpark tollway main lanes, but not two levels up. Of course, raising/relocating the high voltage wires would have been costly and this further ensured the project would be done to minimum standards.

[IHB2]

I don't know if they had the land for it, and they simply just cut corners.

I mean the damn thing is only 2 lanes.

the chron reported some months ago that the original contractor bid a full interchange, but then couldn't make it work, and the county sued to remove the contractor or recoup some of the bid $$. too lazy to look up the chron archive, but the whole BW8 WT interchange was a boondoggle. and how come the sunken part of the tollway under 59 has a permanent groundwater leak?

[westguy]

If rail goes on Richmond, is there any chance someone else (NOT Cintra or anyone else feeding off Perry's gravy train) will take over and fix the thing?

[infinite_jim]

I work over off of gessner @ westpark and I see the traffic there get congested at about the same time most other freeways & the tollway get congested.

Edited December 13, 2006 by infinite_jim

[GhostDog]

When the Westpark was built, it was to be the be all and end all for Katy Commuters however most of us knew it was going to be too small.

It seems to be progressively getting worse, taking as much as an hour to get downtown. Heck, if it's going to be an hour communte, we all may as well stay on I-10 into town. It just irks me to be paying top toll dollars to SIT still on the Westpark. Me thinks they made some mistakes with this road.

What are your thoughts...could they have done anything differently to have avoided these congestion problems?

Just throwing something out there for discussion.

Trying not to be an ass here but if you work downtown and live in Katy no matter what the highway situation your commute was not a high priority on your quality of life list.

Seriously tho I really think the Westpark could have been 4 lanes 2 each way with a contraflo 3 lanes during rush hour traffic had they done it right.

I also believe they should have spent the extra money and not had it merge with 59 right before Chimney Rock.

Also the main problem outbound rush hour is the exit at the Sam Houston with that damned stop light.

that's really what backs the whole thing up...

[Trae]

Did anyone know that the Westpark Tollway is suppose to go past Katy (west of Katy Mills, and swoop up just before you get to Brookshire?

[TheNiche]

Did anyone know that the Westpark Tollway is suppose to go past Katy (west of Katy Mills, and swoop up just before you get to Brookshire?

To my knowledge, those aren't official plans just yet. But yes, the West Houston Association is negotiating for that route and seems to have at least a little bit of traction. They want it to connect to I-10, but ultimately to be extended straight north to US 290.

They're trying to push it through as an alternate evacuation route.

[desirous]

Cost is always an issue, and obviously HCTRA built Westpark on the cheap.

Another issue at BW8/Westpark is the high-voltage right-of-way. There are at least two tower guideways, and my suspicion is that the wires would need to be raised to accommodate elevated ramps. Perhaps you could go one level above the Westpark tollway main lanes, but not two levels up. Of course, raising/relocating the high voltage wires would have been costly and this further ensured the project would be done to minimum standards.

I meant underground. There's already a two-level trench on the east side of BW8; I doubt there were engineering reasons not to have another on the west side.

[Trae]

To my knowledge, those aren't official plans just yet. But yes, the West Houston Association is negotiating for that route and seems to have at least a little bit of traction. They want it to connect to I-10, but ultimately to be extended straight north to US 290.

They're trying to push it through as an alternate evacuation route.

290?!? That is a bit much.

[MaxConcrete]

Did anyone know that the Westpark Tollway is suppose to go past Katy (west of Katy Mills, and swoop up just before you get to Brookshire?

You can go to the FBCTRA web page and read the board meeting minutes. It looks like an extension to FM 1463 is being planned for the near-term (it is mentioned in the minutes of the most recent meeting, as well as previous meetings.)

http://www.fbctra.com/1-2-2%20minutes.htm

[texas911]

I don't use the WPTW, but agree with the poster that said TXDOT really f'ed up the connection to 59. That exchange is super dangerous. Because its right before the Chimney Rock exit around the West Park curve. Almost a blind curve at that point. Its especially dangerous when there is not traffic and people on 59 are doing 70mph and the WPTW people are going pretty fast too. What idiot traffic engineer desiged this? Infact I've seen lots of street design engineering blunders all over Houston. Who is accountable for this?

[desirous]

I don't understand why they didn't braid the ramps? I means, the inbound Westpark connector is already a mile tall to start with. It's not like WT commuters desperately itch to exit at Chimney Rock.

[cla]

The Westpark Tollway isn't ultimately meant for Katy commuters - Katy has excellent North-South access to IH10

they need to manage congestion on Westpark by raising the toll amount.

I live in South Katy near the Westpark Tollway and my office is located near the tollway. It only takes me a few minutes to jump on the tollway, but more than 15 minutes to get to I-10. From the tollway to my office is about 5 minutes, from I-10 to the office is more like 20. So, why would anyone say the WPT is not meant for me? And why should I have to pay MORE than I already do to use the most logical route? IMO, there are not enough main East-West lanes. The gap between 59 and I-10 is a big one.

The traffic on both I-10 and the WPT is getting worse every day b/c of the number of people moving out west. Cinco Ranch alone sold around 1000 homes last year. I've lived out here a little more than a year and a half, and the traffic on both Westheimer Pkwy and the WPT has gotten so bad, that I have changed my route to avoid both in the morning.

When I was taking the tollway in, it was not the traffic exiting at BW8 that caused a problem, it was the traffic merging onto WPT from the hiway 6 area.

[sarolabelle]

When I was taking the tollway in, it was not the traffic exiting at BW8 that caused a problem, it was the traffic merging onto WPT from the hiway 6 area.

More like the Eldridge ramp. That Elridge merger is killer! It doesn't give cars enough time to merge before it is over. Also there is one right after that that is just the same so cars are slowing down because people try to merge into the road with cars going 65 at 6:15 in the morning.

Going Westbound in the evening is almost worst. The Beltway 8 intersection wasn't made right.

If anything is a problem on Westpark it is speeding. I've seen people go up to 100 mph on that road! I go around 68 mph and people pass me up and look at me like I stink! The average car goes about 75-80. Too fast!!!