102IAHexpress

 

So you both praise the light rail as being popular with the upper middle class riders but also a free ride for the homeless? This is why Luminare and others don't take you seriously.

Well there are multiple stations on the line. The homeless love the red line between Preston station and Wheeler station. TMC commuters like it between Smithlands and Herman hospital (I forgot the station name).

My girlfriend is a doctor at Methodist. She lives at IMT apartments across from Reliant Park station. She routinely takes the rail from her apt to Dryden. Some of her colleagues who live in the burbs park at smithlands and ride Dryden. I live in Downtown, my girldfriend would never ride the rail all the way into downtown. She would rather drive. Too many homeless people for too much time. It's one thing for a station or two it's another for 40 minutes.

I ride the rail almost everyday. I also ride the bus almost everyday. I live in downtown. If others don't want to take me seriously that doesn't bother me much, but I'm not going to ignore my observations either.

Our city is big enough for two! I want one in Downtown first and then NW Mall.

sounds good. Add one in the med center for me. :-)

Thats such one-dimensional thinking....you seriously don't think that their bus system doesn't at all connect with their rail system? Who does that? You don't have to be native to make the logical step in thinking to say that with confidence...yes they do connect and I'm sure there are buses at Union Station in Dallas and this is coming from someone who doesn't live in Dallas, but then again I'm actually using my brain...

Have you ever traveled on businesses?

Are you saying a business traveler would exit the HSR station in Dallas, take a DART train then take a DART bus to his final destination?

no one is going to reinvent the wheel. People will leave the station like they do any airport in any major city and get picked up by a friend, hail a taxi, get an Uber and/or maybe take DART rail.

Maybe having the Houston station on our light rail in in downtown is what the developers originally wanted but maybe the true costs are making them think else where. I don't know, but the station does not have to connect to every known mode of transportation to make a profit. Easy parking, quick pickup are what business travelers want.

Take a grammar class.

be nice vic. Life is too short.

busses sound cooler than buses anyways.

You do know that DART also is their bus system? Do you even ride DART?

 

http://www.dart.org/schedules/schedules.asp?zeon=bus

 

Look I even provided a source!

 

EDIT: It literally says DART Buses, DART Rail, and Trinity Express! There you go....you don't even need to click!

I will admit I am not a DART expert.

But it looks like their first choice of Dallas stations is an empty lot on the DARTrail lines. Do any DART busses go near the proposed Dallas station? I don't know, like I said I'm not a DART expert but it looks like only dart trains. So maybe the website was inferring dart trains? When I hear DART I think of trains but I suppose we can agree to disagree on that. But when I hear Metro and not specifically metro rail, then I only think busses.

 

Our light rail doesn't have its own name....its all under Metro. Are you a real person?

Really? Have you never heard of METRORail?

METRORail Red?

METRORail Purple?

METRORail Green?

Do you even ride the rail?

From their webpage...

"How will I get around when I get to the station?"

From the stations, you will easily be able to rent a car, be picked-up by a family member, friend or colleague, hail a cab, or access public transportation such as the DART in Dallas or Houston's Metro. These convenient locations also mean that you will be a short walk, Uber or taxi ride away from your final destination.

LOL notice how they remain silent on Houston's light rail.

so far as I know, they are still considering the Houston station inside of downtown. You may not like their possible conclusion, but again, it's their money.

 

Source?

 

I'm also very happy that you aren't making a $10 billion dollar business decision

We live in a free market. If you want to raise billions of dollars and build a HSR then you can put the station wherever you want to.

The problem for your position is that the people who are putting their money where their mouths are and are looking at the data are coming to a different conclusion from you or anyone else who has no skin in the game. They are considering the Houston station outside of downtown. You may not like their possible conclusion but again it's their money.

 

EDIT: One more thing. You can't seriously look at me with a straight face and tell me that that isn't something worth striving for! It behooves us as citizens in our city to think about how people get around who maybe don't want to drive, or can't, or its a financial burden to own a car. Having a car shouldn't be a prerequisite to living in the third/fourth largest city in the country. A car should be something you WANT to have not NEED to have. I'm sorry that some business person doens't feel the need to walk amongst us peasants or plebs, but that doesn't give the excuse that most people are ok with walking or riding next to others just like them.

Well then you should practice what you preach. The problem is you and most everyone else in this sub forum is caught up on trains.  I also want to strive for better public transportation for my city, but where we differ is that you only see rail. Just admit it you hate busses.

I think ross posted earlier about the station having bus access and Vic called him negative. Seriously? A great bus system is also worth striving for..

Anyone that gets on the lightrail at any point is part of the ridership numbers. No matter how they get to it they are still CHOOSING to use it.

 

 

That's a false assumption. There are thousands of BUS riders who are forced to use the light rail. They chose to start there mode of transportation on a different mode but are then forced to transfer to something else.

If it makes you feel better knowing the ridership numbers are high because of the busses that feed it and the park and riders who can't find parking, well I hope that gives you comfort. But luckily the investors of this HSR care more about profit than a warm happy feeling. They will make wise business decisions because that's the obligation they owe their investors, contrast that versus putting a light rail or bus line where policy makers deem it more popular or HAIFers for that matter.

Ridership is inflated because people are using the line?

 

We should eliminate the numbers because too many people are using a particular segment of the line?

To a certain extent yes. The smithland riders commuted using their cars. They would have parked a lot closer in or near the front of their hospital if they could but they can't.

It's like in the old days of the Astrodome, where you would park your car and then one of those long golf carts would pick you up and give you a ride to the front entrance. It's not like they went there looking to ride the long golf cart. It's more like sorry there's no more parking up front, but don't worry we will give you a ride to the front...

A lot of homeless seem to be wearing scrubs and hospital ID badges or brand new backpacks 

 

If you're talking about riders from the Smithlands station to the TMC, that's exactly my point. They ride for a station or two and get off. It's a park and ride. There are park and riders and homeless people on the light rail. Of course there are exceptions but that's the bulk.  If they could they would park in their respective hospital but they can't so they park in the surface lot across from smithlands and ride for a station or two.

I almost feel like ridership numbers for our light rail should eliminate the numbers from the smithlands station. That station must inflate numbers by the thousands. The only reason they ride is because parking is limited in the TMC and their companies subsidize the parking and Qcards.

That's not a total knock on our light rail. It is popular as a park and ride for upper middle class riders from the med center. Which is to say people like their cars but hate expensive parking. A HSR station in the NW mall parking lot makes a lot of sense from a business perspective.

On the bus v train debate, my experience is that buses cater to those that do not have a car and need them for mobility. Trains cater to those who prefer the consistency and ease of use. Yes I'm generalizing and yes there are exceptions.

 

Perhaps true for cities with a heavy rail option. Houston has no heavy rail, so I'm not sure that argument furthers our discussion. In Houston our light rail caters mostly to homeless people and people who park their car near a station and ride for a station or two to their final destination. In Houston commuter busses are very popular. The park and ride system works well. Perhaps that's what the HSR station in Houston will be like?

And It's ASLO my experience that business travelers prefer taxi's and Uber, which is to say they prefer cars once they get off the train or plane.

Jesus quit with your negativity. No no no it's not possible. We get it you're stuck in your ways and hate rail transit and love cars.

What's so negative about his comment? Seems like you're negative on busses. Public transpiration is more than just trains. Don't get stuck on your ways of overlooking the popularity of busses in this city, especially with commuters.

I thought they want to build a HSR to connect Houston and Dallas? I think you all are trying reimagine it as HSR connecting Downtown Houston and Downtown Dallas. Which is not the same thing.

Lets say this actually gets privately funded. The investors are going to have to think outside the box to be profitable. Thinking inside the box (think Europe) will not work here, because well we are not Europe. We have cars. Lots of them. And assuming they want to be profit maximizes the best location for a station will be outside of downtown to the west. I kind of like the intersection of I-10 and 6-10 better (near the Ikea) but it's not my money and if the investors think they can maximize their profits at the NW mall location then who am I to disagree?

The whole point (I thought) is that they want to build something that will be less of a hassle then driving to the airport or less hectic than trying to enter/exit downtown in your car. Have yall seen Downtown during rush hour? It takes 10 minutes sometimes to cross two blocks. And this bus/rail connectivity of downtown, give me a break. How many people take the bus to Hobby or IAH (not employees of the airports but actual passengers)? How many business travelers have you seen on our light rail?

You all assume that everyone's final destination will be Downtown. Downtown is indeed a large employment center, but so is the Med Center, Galleria, Energy Corridor, etc.. The NW mall station proposal is more center(ish) to more people than downtown.

I'm more interested in the chronicle garage. The garage site is a good location for residential.

 It would seem more logical that the park and ride end points in downtown were chosen by the area's development, not the other way around.

If that is your position about the park ride development end points, then would you also take the same position regarding Cloud713's claim about "all the development rail spawns". I'm assuming he's talking about light rail in Downtown.

Not to mention all the development rail spawns.. I don't see any residential towers or mixed use developments popping up at any of the park & rides..

The park and ride system has two end points for possible development. The park point and the point where passengers exit the bus and walk to their destination. You're right, perhaps the park point of the system has not been a stimulus for growth but the passenger exist point has been. Look at all the development in downtown along the park and ride bus stops.

So you are saying that because the legislature is not in session next year, our representatives/land owners/ and politicians up for election will just "forget" about it? They don't have long term opposition plan? Is that what you're saying?

Just for the record, if this is actually built only with private funds, then i'm all for it. But has there ever been, anywhere in the world, a HSR line that has not received government subsidies?

Thanks.

Thanks cspwal. I'll give that a read.

Someone mentioned eminent domain for airports earlier. Do we know if eminent domain has ever been used in a local private airport? Like the Sugar Land airport for example?

Thanks.

Also take a look at Texas Senate Bill 1601 which would strip firms developing high-speed rail projects from eminent domain authority. It's already been passed in the texas transpiration committee. People will fight this. Landowners, politicians, etc. Lets not be naïve here.

Lets not be naive here. Educate yourself on Eminent Domain and what it entails. Oil and Gas use it. Utilities use it. Nobody ever gives a crap when they do it, but then all the sudden a railroad might use and then people have a problem.

Just be honest and say you haven't been reading the thread. I ask you look at it more thoroughly as this very question has been answered before. about 85-90% at the end of the day will be done through the private sector or through land swooping. The other 10% will be where eminent domain might be used to fill in the gaps. TCR isn't hiding this either. Robert Eckels (a former Judge btw) has stated that eminent domain would be used, but only as a last resort.

Finally while this is privately funded it still public transportation! Trains by their very nature are public transportation. Airlines are run by private companies (though subsidized by the government to some extent), but its still "public transport" because its not an individual means of transportation and instead or traveling with others.

 

So lets not just take a single buzzword(s) and then all the sudden rush to conclusions. Use your brain.

I also invite you to use your "brain". Landowners have a right to fight this in court. If you think they won't then you're being naïve. I predict a long expensive court battle. Please educate me as to why you think Texas land owners will just roll over?

The article above mentions that eminent domain can be invoked to consolidate the path...

?

Huh.

I have read in this thread, the word privately funded, everyone talks about it being privately funded. Yet, these "investors" want to use a public tool for their private gain? Eminent domain for a public highway or public airport is one thing, but for a private railroad? I see a long expensive court battle brewing between land owners and these investors.

Lanier won because of a false report by Wayne delcefino that cost Sylvester turner the election.

That's another thread entirely. The report aired twice. The day after Thanksgiving i think. The 5:30pm broadcast and the 10:00pm broadcast. Tough to say how much impact it had just being aired twice but I could see how a viewer may think Turner was involved in some insurance scam after watching it. I get that. But the channel 13 story never said that. never. The story was more about what did Turner know and when did he know it. A legitimate question to ask from the press to a public official. Public officials are not immune from inquiries from the press. Long story short, after many legal battles, Turners lawsuit against channel 13 was overturned on appeal. And the overturned appeal was upheld by the Texas Supreme Court.