midtownguy

It's your typical tacky-looking lower-middle class neighborhood built in the 40s and 50s. It's a decent location between 610 and 45 and I think its just about ready for its next incarnation. There's the Riverview subdivision nearby which has some older bunglalows also if you're looking for an older inner-loop house near the bottom of its cycle. Someone was telling me how amazing it was that she heard about some guy that worked in the Med Cntr and bought a house over there and paid something like 120K for it. My experience has been that Hispanic neighborhoods like this are safe, just a bit ugly.

Gulfgate is one of those places that is sort of reverse the way a lot of us think; that the decent shopping center comes after the housing has been upgraded. In this case, I think a lot of the surrounding areas will get redone because of Gulfgate.

I live in a similar area across 45 and, although a few people have come over lately and fixed up the old homes, I think ultimately these areas are destined for townhouses once land values overtake improvement values, and hopefully we won't get too many apartments.

Danax, thanks for the response. Overall, how do you see the immediate area of Pine Valley shaping up? Sure, Gulfgate is booming, but I also noticed an industrial area along Griggs. What's the story on that area?

Also, did that area flood during Allison? I noticed there's a bayou nearby. Do you really think all the Gulfgate development will creep over to this area?

And, do you thinking buying a home in Pine Valley - which is somewhat established, even if the houses aren't attractive on the outside - versus buying, say, one of those new Perry Townhomes over at Woodridge or Plum Creek?

Sorry for all the questions. Just curious about the neighborhood. Thanks for the help.

What's the word on the Pine Valley neighborhood? It's a smalll, kind of hidden neighborhood near Gulfgate. Wayside drive cuts through the area. There are a couple of solid-looking houses on the market in that area.

What does anyone know about that area? And what are your thoughts on the appreciation of it? I know Gulfgate has been booming, and that area is near Gulfgate, but it's also kind of a hidden, forgotten subdivision.

I have driven through it several times, and it looks like a solid working class predominately Hispanic neighborhood. I liked what I saw.

What do you guys think?

So now the sign is saying that it's coming in 2007????

LOL. This project is toast. Not gonna happen.

As much as I love midtown, the area hasn't evolved to the point where a $300,000 condo (a glorified apartment, basically) is worth it.

The Kroger at River Oaks Shopping Center was a dump. Then, they remodled. They had a grand "reopening" about four or five months ago, and now the place looks fantastic.

They kept the store open during construction and it was a nightmare.

Sources tell me that Post is not only firmly committed to Houston, but specifically to the Midtown market. They are spinning off a new upscale condo division AND finally building the long talked about Phase III of Post Midtown Square. So, that triangular empty lot on Gray street will soon sprout yet another apt midrise building.

Wow. Midtown is really on the move.

Woa! I live there! I had no idea. I know a few of the leasing agents really well, i'll try and get the inside scoop.

Edit: Ah. I see now. It's the high rise. I live in the regular apartments. Still, this is an interesting development.

We'll see. There have been a lot of announced projects that haven't been built.

Quite frankly, midtown has enough apartments, and not enough condos/townhouses. But, I suppose it's great to increase the residential density of midtown, which will bring in more retail.

"get a decent bungalow in the Heights" going for 250 to 400 k..talk about overpriced.

I am wondering what they are doing with that huge empty lot next to Sydnor Street on Clinton, though.

The heights is expensive, but it's a well established neighborhood that's considered LESS RISKY. That's the key. Anyone paying that kind of cash for a house does NOT want a strip plaza next door or homeless people walking by.

Yes, I've known people that live in the Heights that have gotten their cars broken into, but, in terms of resale, that area is far more established and thus, more attractive to buyers.

All the growth is nice, but they're overbuilt and over priced. Once the townhouses hit a certain price point, people are going to high-tail it to the burbs, or get a decent bungalow in the Heights. Buyers (especially those from the burbs who want to live closer in) are only willing to give so much slack to gentrifying inner-city neighborhoods.

They'll look at these areas and say, "Wow, this area is growing and it's close-in to work."

Then, they look at the price, and say, "Screw that. It's close in, but I don't want to pay $250,000 in an iffy neighborhood. I can get more house in Clear Lake."

I've seen it happen.

Don't forget: urbanism is a new concept to most Houstonians, and in order to sell it to them, the price has to be right. A lot of these inner-city townhomes are selling, but they're often to investors and speculators, hoping to profit (which jacks up prices even more).

I live at Post Midtown Square. I love all the retail. We finally got a coffee shop, and it's right inside the complex. We got a wine bar about a year ago that seems to be doing well, we got Christian's tailgate, which has great burgers, and we're about to get a mexian restaurant.

I quite often chat with the owners of Midtown Market when I'm in there, and I know the owner of Farrago.

Urban living: can't beat it.

Midtownguy, you need to factor in also, that the $150,000 you are paying for that house is $250,000 in alot of other parts of the country, and they are paying taxes on top of it, and some places have a state tax on top of that. Houston housing market is still one of the best values in the country.

Actually, no, it's not. Do the numbers. In addition to the super-high property taxes, we have some of the lowest apprecation rates in the country, and the highest homeowners insurance rates in the country.

High property taxes + low appreciation + high insurance rates = disaster.

When I first moved here several years ago, I thought it was great that I finally lived in a state with no income tax. I used to brag to my friends: we don't have an income tax, after the govt takes it's share, we're done.

I felt that it was great because I'd rather spend my money the way that I wanted, rather than have a government entity take it from me. That, combined with Houston's low cost of living made getting a paycheck here a dream.

That was UNTIL I decided I want to buy a house.

I'm blown away.

My thoughts now? This state desperately needs an income tax. I'm seeing $150,000 properties with $5,000 a year tax bills. There have been plenty of properties that I've seen that are within my price range - until I see the tax bill. I know dual-income couples that are shelling out $600 per month JUST in property taxes alone. It's absurd.

The Texas tax structure makes homeownership a detriment. Homeownership, in the long run, is better for local communities.

Don't get me wrong, I"m not necessarily pro-tax, pro spend, but, damn, it just seems that the property tax rates here are outrageous.

Is the Walgreens "urban"?

Nope. Not even close. A gigantic parking lot with a teeny, tiny building.

Totally suburban.

Montrose,

The Astroworld land is prime, prime, prime real estate. It's not next to Downtown or the Galleria or Hermann Park, but it's located in an area that's starting to boom, but hasn't boomed so much that square footage is too high for developers and retailers.

And, it's right next to the rail line.

It's estimated that the market value for the land is $145 million.

The overall debt for Six Flag's as a company is $2 billion.

That's almost 10 percent of the company's overall debt taken care of just by selling Astroworld.

(Having said that, I'll miss Astroworld big time.)

Downtowner, for the most part, I agree. That's why, at work, I bypass Starbucks and go to Kaveh Kanes. I always support locals.

However, as a resident of Midtown, I can't ignore what this means for the area. This is a HUGE deal. Will I go to starbucks once it opens? Probably not. But I WILL enjoy the other eventual retail outlets the chain's presence will bring.

Editor, great point. Hadn't thought of that. It's kind of like that half-assed CVS that closes too early. It's w/in walking distance of several large aparment complexes, and it closes at 10???

Meanwhile, brand new CVS's built AFTER that one are 24 hours.

There's a sign at the corner of Grey and Smith, advertising the new building they're putting in. Right under that, it says "Coming soon", and has the logos of Starbucks and Quiznos. I dismissed it right away, assuming that the Starbucks would be one of those fake, mini-set ups like they have in Randalls.

Nope. Sources have confirmed that it'll be a full-fledged Starbucks. An entire store.

Is this cool or what? Personally, I can't stand Starbucks (I prefer independent coffee shops), but I can't deny what a Starbucks means for a neighborhood. They don't build stores unless they see a future in a place. And, other major companies will see that Starbucks and Bw3 are there, and jump in eventually, too.

So, this is pretty amazing. I'd just about given up on Midtown. But it looks like it's slowly going someplace.

Happytown,

Where exactly do you live? I was thinking about that area, and really like the booming, energetic feel and diversity over there, but wasn't too impressed with the bland Perry Townhomes that are going up. The prices are right, but Perry builds really bland communities.

I"m not "on his back." As I said, I respect his choices and really admire his civic pride. I was merely pointing out that not everyone who choses to buy a townhome is an idiot who comes to regret their choice. That's all.

Ultimately, though, Danax makes a decent point: there are places inside 610 that are affordable. They may take a little work, but they are reasonably priced. I just think it's a matter of personal choice whether one wants to spend time rehabbing a house. Some do, some don't.

Danax,

I respect your opinion and I REALLY respect and admire your civic pride. But you make some major assumptions that I don't think are fair.

1) You're assuming that those of us who don't want to spend every saturday refinishing our doors lack civic pride. We do. We love our neighborhoods and houses just as much as the next person. Some people just want a lower maintenance home than others. What's wrong with that?

2) You're assuming that people who buy townhomes or condos are idiots who will regret their decisions in a few years. Isn't it possibe that there are some people who really don't want to mow grass?

At least now we know who starts this acronym crap.  Maybe they should start a new program to rename John Tuschman.  It will be DouBa, short for DoucheBag.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

LOL!!!!!!!!!!

So true. Here's what I don't get. The area south of downtown, with all of it's shops, restaurants and apartments has a name already: midtown.

And the name "midtown" is already hip, prestigious and trendy.

What a moron.

I was out and about, and was curious about the new Perry development, so I checked it out, and drove along Woodbride and the general area.

Man, there is some serious, serious retail out there. And not small mom-and-pop places, but big, major national, upscale retailers. That area seems to be jumping off pretty well.

I live in Midtown, and as much as I love Midtown, we can't get a Starbucks over here for anything. I'd kill for half the retail they've got along Woodridge. The only thing that area needs is a Target, a movie theatre a gym and a bookstore and they'd be all set.

As much as I'm not a fan of Perry developments, i'm looking to buy w/in the next year, and I may have to consider that area.

Ah, gotcha. Now I see your point.

Yeah, I've been over there a lot. That part of midtown is rough, but i see improvements. It's developing slower, but it's getting there.

IN fact, the friend I spoke about bought a townhouse on that side of main, and that area is improving quickly.

Midtown Coog,

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I'm still not sure how the $1,000 rents in my building are killing midtown. Not everyone can afford that.

And, I know someone who bought a townhouse in midtown, and she certainly doesn't "act like a renter" (whatever that means). She keeps her place up, worries about the neighborhood, is a good citizen, etc. JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER OWNER.

Speaking of which: how does a renter "act" anyway?

I went to Deco.

Ho hum. Yawn. Beautiful place, but at the end of the day, it's just another bar in midtown. Midtown does not need another bar.

Plus, Deco has a bad location. The front entrance is at the back of the shopping plaza. That would be ok, IF the windows weren't covered with curtains. The averge joe walking or driving by wouldn't know what it was.

Now we have to gear up for Pub Fiction (another bar) which will open in a month or two, and Christian's Tailgate (another bar) which is going to open later this month.

For some reason, all we're getting are bars, lounges and sports bars. I've got plenty of places to grab a beer and the game, plenty of places to get drunk at after the game, but few places to get a decent meal and buy a few more retail items.