Huntwick Or Champion Forest

[lea]

We are a family of 4 (two sons, 3 1/2 and 2), and will probably move to Northwest Houston within the next year, mainly for the school districts. We currently live in Westchase Houston. I've been driving around the Champion Forest/Huntwick area, and I think we have narrowed in down to this area.

My question is this...Huntwick is zoned to both Klein and Cy-Fair. (By the way, if we decide to buy a home in Huntwick, we would not buy a home in the Klein ISD, since it would be zoned to Klein Forest.)

What is your opinion about purchasing a home in Huntwick which is zoned to Bleyl/Yeager/Cy-Creek vs a Champions Forest home zoned to Brill/Kleb/Klein?

What do you consider the best elementary and middle schools in this area? FYI, I really do not want to purchase a home past Louetta.

[mrfootball]

We lived on Champion Drive in Champion Forest for over 10 years. It's a fantastic neighborhood. Terrific schools (elementary school inside the neighborhood - no apartments). As a golf course w/country club community, you have plenty of amenities as well as a prime location, with better access to Hwy 249 than Huntwick (by way of Cypresswood - rather than FM 1960). There is going to be a large new Luxury Hi-Rise going in off Cypresswood and Champion Forest Drive, along with Vintage Park, an Interfin Project that is rumored to include a Central Market store along with other high-end retailers. Can't miss in Champion Forest. Great schools, nice amenities. Solid and renown in the area.

Huntwick is another terrific neighborhood in the Champions area. It is and has always been a pristine, and beautifully wooded neighborhood. Its very much like Wilchester in West Houston...and like most of those neighborhoods was also a Kickerillo development. Prices are usually around the mid 200's on up to the 400's...The preferred sections are in the Cy-Creek zone, as Cy-Creek is and always has been a terrific high school with some of the areas best neighborhoods being zoned to it. Cy-Creek is scheduled for a $60 Million renovation next year. Along with that, you have terrific shopping and dining right next door in the Champions Center, nice access to FM 1960, etc. A great choice and well-established neighborhood, IMO but I'd probably choose Champion Forest.

**Agreed on not buying in the KF zone, residents of Greenwood Forest, Woods of Wimbledon, and the other nice neighborhoods that are zoned to KF are trying to get the attendance zones redrawn. Which would again make those great neighborhoods even more appealing and alleviate the overcrowding at KF.

Bottom line, 2 great choices...hard to say which is better without looking at the particular homes you are evaluating, but I think I'd go ahead and buy in Champion Forest. Bulletproof.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

We lived on Champion Drive in Champion Forest for over 10 years. It's a fantastic neighborhood. Terrific schools. As a golf course community, you have plenty of amenities as well as a prime location, with better access to Hwy 249 than Huntwick (by way of Cypresswood - rather than FM 1960). There is going to be a large new Luxury Hi-Rise going in off Cypresswood and Champion Forest Drive, along with Vintage Park, an Interfin Project that is rumored to include a Central Market store along with other high-end retailers. Can't miss in Champion Forest. Great schools, nice amenities. Solid and renown in the area.

Huntwick is another terrific neighborhood in the Champions area. It is and has always been a pristine, and beautifully wooded neighborhood. Its very much like Wilchester in West Houston...and like most of those neighborhoods was also a Kickerillo development. Prices are usually around the mid 200's on up to the 400's...The preferred sections are in the Cy-Creek zone, as Cy-Creek is and always has been a terrific high school with some of the areas best neighborhoods being zoned to it. Cy-Creek is scheduled for a $60 Million renovation next year. Along with that, you have terrific shopping and dining right next door in the Champions Center, nice access to FM 1960, etc. A great choice, IMO but I'd probably choose Champion Forest.

**Word to the wise...DO NOT BUY IN THE KLEIN FOREST ZONE. Klein Forest used to be a great HS, but the rapidly changing demographics on the far Southside of KISD has turned KF into a completely different school than it was 10 years ago. Residents of Greenwood Forest, Woods of Wimbledon, and the other nice neighborhoods that are zoned to KF are trying to get the attendance zones redrawn. Of course, this has no effect on Cy-Fair ISD, the largest Recognized school district in the State.

Bottom line, 2 great choices...hard to say which is better without looking at the particular homes you are evaluating, but I think I'd go ahead and buy in Champion Forest. Bulletproof.

Were you my neighbor and i didnt know it? The apt. complex here is going to the dogs. Its the one of the major motivations for me to sell and move. that said...when are you looking to buy? I SURELY recommend Champion Forest. I know a great place that will be on the market sometime this year

[mrfootball]

HoustonFirstWord - where do you live now in Champions or Westchase?

Lea - FYI they're currently planning a new extension for the Houston Museum of Fine Arts to be located off of Cypresswood "The Pearl" or Pearl Fincher Museum...along with the new Cultural District, should be a major asset to the area.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

HoustonFirstWord - where do you live now in Champions or Westchase?

Lea - FYI they're currently planning a new extension for the Houston Museum of Fine Arts to be located off of Cypresswood "The Pearl" or Pearl Fincher Museum...along with the new Cultural District, should be a major asset to the area.

Champions Dr in Champion Forest....for now anyway. Im looking to move sometime this yr. inside the loop.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

The Champion Greens apt complex right over the wall from me is going to the dogs..........

They have some sort of Gov. bond thing going on there now, and they are housing N.O. evacuees. Seems the more criminal element of the N.O. evacuees have filtered into that place........

[ENGcons]

Both quality neighborhoods. I agree with staying away from Klein Forest. I do not know how old your kids are, but Klein is building some new schools in the area due to the tremendous growth. A new High School will begin construction in 2008 that will take students out of Klein High, and Klein Oak and it will be loated off Spring Cypress. And a ton of new Elementary Schools are going in neighborhoods. Klein considers Hassler ES to be head and shoulders above the rest and that is feed by Gleannloch Farms, which is also going to get Frank ES which will open next year.

I don't know much about Cy Fair, but neighborhoods I would consider would be further north of 1960, along Louetta, and Spring Cypress. I would look at Memorial NW over Huntwick, just my opinion of course.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

And Spring Cypress RD.......my oh my how that has changed

[pineda]

Stay away from Champions Park neighborhood for now. It's been unindated with crime. The local PD thinks it's related to the recent influx of evacuees, but who really knows? Willowbrook Mall is the ghetto now, IMO. Also, ENGcons, where did you hear that information about the new high school in Klein ISD? The last I had heard was that the building of a new high school was about seven years away. RE; Hassler, that is a good school, so is Schultz and some others. Personally, I'd look hard at the intermediate schools that your children would be zoned to. It makes all the difference in the world, what kind of preparation will be going on for the high school years. That being said, I personally think Doerre is a superior Klein ISD Intermediate School. It's graduates feed into Klein Oak and Klein High. Klein Oak has the further distinction of being the only school in Northwest Houston that also has the IB Diploma Programme. That may be something to consider also. If someone is looking for a good "package" deal when it comes to all schools located adjacent to each other, you might also consider the line-up of Northampton Elementary, Hildebrandt Intermediate and Klein Oak High School, all located next to one another in front of the Northampton neighborhood. Or you might want to consider Kreinhop Elementary, Schindewolf Intermediate and Klein Collins High School, all located next to Normandy Forest, across from Dove Meadows, just off F.M. 2920. BTW, I heard that Klein Forest is going to become a magnet school in 2007 (I forget for what subjects, but there were more than one area mentioned) and that Klein Collins and Klein are also studying these options to become magnets for like math/science.

[mrfootball]

The Champion Greens apt complex right over the wall from me is going to the dogs..........

They have some sort of Gov. bond thing going on there now, and they are housing N.O. evacuees. Seems the more criminal element of the N.O. evacuees have filtered into that place........

There are NO apartment complexes on or near Champion Dr. in Champions Forest. These are different neighborhoods. You must be talking about 'Champions' proper on the other side of Cypress Creek, which is zoned to a different school district than Champion Forest.

RE: Champions Park -- "It's been unindated with crime." maybe a tad bit of an overstatement. Probably due to the fact that there was virtually no crime in the area aside from typical teenage property crime back when the entire NW Houston area was lilly white...now the Southern side of FM 1960 has been inundated with low-income housing and the people and the crime that comes with that. There are few (if any) low-income neighborhoods on the Northside of FM 1960 and nowhere near as many apartments as can be found on the Southside in b/w the Beltway. -- Still by no means a 'high crime' area.

As a rule of thumb...north side of FM 1960 good...closer to Louetta best. Its nowhere near as bad as the SW side or even the West side of Houston, but its definitely changed from the sleepy, quiet suburb it once was.

[pineda]

Lea - FYI they're currently planning a new extension for the Houston Museum of Fine Arts to be located off of Cypresswood "The Pearl" or Pearl Fincher Museum...along with the new Cultural District, should be a major asset to the area.

I think this will be located next to the police station there on Cypresswood. Pearl Fincher, wife of Fred Fincher of Fred Fincher Motors, and mother to Patricia Harless, just elected State Rep. is the namesake.

RE: Champions Park -- "It's been unindated with crime." maybe a tad bit of an overstatement. Probably due to the fact that there was virtually no crime in the area aside from typical teenage property crime back when the entire NW Houston area was lilly white...now the Southern side of FM 1960 has been inundated with low-income blacks, mexicans, vietnamese (read Klein Forest) who've brought the crime with them (sad but true). There are few (if any) low-income neighborhoods on the Northside of FM 1960 and nowhere near as many apartments as can be found on the Southside in b/w the Beltway. Still by no means a 'high crime' area.

Champions Park is part of the Cy-Fair school district. It is not zoned to Klein Forest. My take on the situation may be radically different than yours, I've only lived out in this area for 15 years. I've seen a dramatic rise in crime just over the last year that I do believe can be attributed to refugees from Katrina. But, I think the number one contributor to the rise in crime is the proliferation of low-rent apartments sprouting up all up and down F.M. 1960 in the Champions area. I have family members living in Champions Park right now that have had brushes with crime seven times in the last six years. Last week alone, a relative of mine went into a restaurant in the Willowbrook area to pick up a lunch to-go order. He was gone about 5 minutes. He came back to find his window smashed out and his laptop and Blackberry gone. Another relative went into the police station on Cypresswood during the day with her children to pick up some crime prevention booklet. She came ten minutes later to find her lock busted and the door ajar. She had nothing of value in the car so the thieves just ripped up her seats with a knife. They want to sell but the neighborhood values are in the dumper, and they happen to like the Cy-Fair schools their kids go to, so they stick it out. I guess it all comes to whether you've been a victim of crime numerous enough times to justify the word "inundated".

[mrfootball]

I guess it all comes to whether you've been a victim of crime numerous enough times to justify the word "inundated".

I guess so. That sucks, I'm sorry to hear that.

For the record, there aren't near as many here as there are in other parts of the greater Houston area...those Katrina people are doing this all over town (thanks to Bill White and Bob Eckels...forsaking the citizens THEY were supposed to serve). I was over in the Westchase and Memorial areas the other day and felt like a damned foreigner. I'm telling you, they're (Katrina people) all over the place. I'd love to see them go away. I think most Houstonians would agree.

Still, I'd opt for Champion Forest if I were you, it's bulletproof and the Klein HS zone is almost completely built out, with few apartments and lots of $$$ homes and high-end stuff going up over towards Hewlett-Packard.

[pineda]

Still, I'd opt for Champion Forest if I were you, it's bulletproof and the Klein HS zone is almost completely built out, with few apartments and lots of $$$ homes and high-end stuff going up over towards Hewlett-Packard.

If one was looking at being zoned into Klein High, if that is a priority, why not look at Memorial Northwest then? It's cheaper, the homes are just as big, and it's practically across the street from Klein High. It's loaded up with strip shopping centers, just like the Champions area too, if that's something you need/want. Plus there's some high-end homes going in right across the street from the school, which will bring up the property values even more. Memorial Northwest is big, but it's very nice, and has lots of affordable amenities for families. Of course, if one of your priorities is a superior golf course, then skip Raveneaux (beat like a dog) and go for Champions (still a jewel). Good luck with whatever you decide.

[lea]

Thanks for all of your replies. We don't need to make a decision soon...we are hoping to move by next summer. My oldest son will start kindergarden in about 2 years.

The two areas that we are looking at are Champion Forest and Huntwick. Being that this are older neighborhoods, what percentage of the familes do you think are familes with young kids? We like these neighborhoods, but would also like other young kids for our own kids to play with?

Also, do any of you have kids that attend the elementary schools or middle school? Which ones? I need more opinions, as this is one of the top priorities for us.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

Thanks for all of your replies. We don't need to make a decision soon...we are hoping to move by next summer. My oldest son will start kindergarden in about 2 years.

The two areas that we are looking at are Champion Forest and Huntwick. Being that this are older neighborhoods, what percentage of the familes do you think are familes with young kids? We like these neighborhoods, but would also like other young kids for our own kids to play with?

Also, do any of you have kids that attend the elementary schools or middle school? Which ones? I need more opinions, as this is one of the top priorities for us.

Theres lots of new and recent development in Champion Forest, so i would think that there would be lots of young kids around and yound families. The Cy-Fair school buses around here seemed to be filled with younger kids

[mrfootball]

Lea, I think having the elementary school physically in the middle of the neighborhood is a big plus for Champion Forest. There have always been lots of kids there.

I'm not certain about Huntwick, but my wife's best friend from Cy-Creek has multi-millionaire parents who still live in the same $250,000 home in Huntwick if that tells you anything. Lots of original owners. Must be a great neighborhood.

[ENGcons]

Stay away from Champions Park neighborhood for now. It's been unindated with crime. The local PD thinks it's related to the recent influx of evacuees, but who really knows? Willowbrook Mall is the ghetto now, IMO. Also, ENGcons, where did you hear that information about the new high school in Klein ISD? The last I had heard was that the building of a new high school was about seven years away. RE; Hassler, that is a good school, so is Schultz and some others. Personally, I'd look hard at the intermediate schools that your children would be zoned to. It makes all the difference in the world, what kind of preparation will be going on for the high school years. That being said, I personally think Doerre is a superior Klein ISD Intermediate School. It's graduates feed into Klein Oak and Klein High. Klein Oak has the further distinction of being the only school in Northwest Houston that also has the IB Diploma Programme. That may be something to consider also. If someone is looking for a good "package" deal when it comes to all schools located adjacent to each other, you might also consider the line-up of Northampton Elementary, Hildebrandt Intermediate and Klein Oak High School, all located next to one another in front of the Northampton neighborhood. Or you might want to consider Kreinhop Elementary, Schindewolf Intermediate and Klein Collins High School, all located next to Normandy Forest, across from Dove Meadows, just off F.M. 2920. BTW, I heard that Klein Forest is going to become a magnet school in 2007 (I forget for what subjects, but there were more than one area mentioned) and that Klein Collins and Klein are also studying these options to become magnets for like math/science.

I know all about Kleins growth plan becasue I am in the consulting business that deals with school district construction. It is my business to know these things. There are 2 new High Schools to be built, one is scheduled to start construction/development in 2008, mind you that is a forcast date, and I personally don't thinkit is realistic. The other which is further north in the district is the one that is about 7 years from start. On a side note, out of all the districts I have seen, Klein has done better than any other as far as future planning for growth is concerned. The NW side is an incredibly difficult place to plan for district growth because of land acquisition. Klein really has done a great job for the future.

[pineda]

I know all about Kleins growth plan becasue I am in the consulting business that deals with school district construction. It is my business to know these things. There are 2 new High Schools to be built, one is scheduled to start construction/development in 2008, mind you that is a forcast date, and I personally don't thinkit is realistic. The other which is further north in the district is the one that is about 7 years from start. On a side note, out of all the districts I have seen, Klein has done better than any other as far as future planning for growth is concerned. The NW side is an incredibly difficult place to plan for district growth because of land acquisition. Klein really has done a great job for the future.

Thanks for the info!

I had only heard about the one seven years off, I didn't know that there was going to be another one.

If the new one on Spring Cypress pulls from Oak, I wonder if that means we will be dropping back down to 18-4A status again. We've been on that for two years now, and it's been great for our school's teams to be a powerhouse 4A school rather than a small 5A. This upcoming school year, (2006-2007), we will be going back to 5A status. Any idea how many students will be pulled from Oak? When Klein Collins opened, we lost a boatload of students and teachers. I think the students loss was close to 700, which is why we were dropped to 4A. How many students will the new school accomodate and do have any idea of the name? Hopefully it won't be something like Benignus... Also, if the new school is going to be on Spring Cypress, why isn't it going to pulling students from Klein Collins, which is right off Spring Cypress? Klein Oak is much further north, toward F.M. 2920 & Kuykendahl. Where on Spring Cypress will the school be located?

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

There are NO apartment complexes on or near Champion Dr. in Champions Forest. These are different neighborhoods. You must be talking about 'Champions' proper on the other side of Cypress Creek, which is zoned to a different school district than Champion Forest.

RE: Champions Park -- "It's been unindated with crime." maybe a tad bit of an overstatement. Probably due to the fact that there was virtually no crime in the area aside from typical teenage property crime back when the entire NW Houston area was lilly white...now the Southern side of FM 1960 has been inundated with low-income housing and the people and the crime that comes with that. There are few (if any) low-income neighborhoods on the Northside of FM 1960 and nowhere near as many apartments as can be found on the Southside in b/w the Beltway. -- Still by no means a 'high crime' area.

As a rule of thumb...north side of FM 1960 good...closer to Louetta best. Its nowhere near as bad as the SW side or even the West side of Houston, but its definitely changed from the sleepy, quiet suburb it once was.

Champions Green Apartments 14141 Champion DR Houston, Texas 77069

Tell me another one...............

[mrfootball]

Champion Forest is in 77379.

You're talking about Champions.

Different neighborhoods.

Champion Dr. in Champion Forest doesn't connect with Champion Dr. in Champions, they are separated by two golf courses and Cypress Creek with no bridge. Still, I'm surprised the residents of Champions and Champions Golf Club haven't petitioned the owner of said complex to get rid of these people.

[ENGcons]

Thanks for the info!

I had only heard about the one seven years off, I didn't know that there was going to be another one.

If the new one on Spring Cypress pulls from Oak, I wonder if that means we will be dropping back down to 18-4A status again. We've been on that for two years now, and it's been great for our school's teams to be a powerhouse 4A school rather than a small 5A. This upcoming school year, (2006-2007), we will be going back to 5A status. Any idea how many students will be pulled from Oak? When Klein Collins opened, we lost a boatload of students and teachers. I think the students loss was close to 700, which is why we were dropped to 4A. How many students will the new school accomodate and do have any idea of the name? Hopefully it won't be something like Benignus... Also, if the new school is going to be on Spring Cypress, why isn't it going to pulling students from Klein Collins, which is right off Spring Cypress? Klein Oak is much further north, toward F.M. 2920 & Kuykendahl. Where on Spring Cypress will the school be located?

With Klein growth projections Klein Oak will still remain a 5A school. If Construction starts in 2008, and that is a big if, then it will not be completed until 2010. That is 4 more years of growth in the area. I have no idea how many students will be pulled from Klein Oak, Klein Collins, and Klein, and I also have no idea on a name. I do know the location of the school, but I am not permitted to say where since it is not yet public information.

I have so much information on Klein I can tell you that Schultz ES is getting new carpet in 2011, and that Klein Oak is getting more tennis courts in 2010

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

Champion Forest is in 77379.

You're talking about Champions.

Different neighborhoods.

Champion Dr. in Champion Forest doesn't connect with Champion Dr. in Champions, they are separated by two golf courses and Cypress Creek with no bridge.

very good..........

[mrfootball]

I'd like to see the area neighborhood HOAs form a co-op investment pool to buyout a number of these apartment developments and doze them to put up mixed-use retail or office buildings.

[Houston1stWordOnTheMoon]

I'd like to see the area neighborhood HOAs form a co-op investment pool to buyout a number of these apartment developments and doze them to put up mixed-use retail or office buildings.

Bulldoze the apartments, YES. Replace them with offices, no. Build nice homes with yards and plant trees instead......

[mrfootball]

Lea, FYI:

'Outdoor living' goes on display

Garden tour offers four stops this Sunday

By FLORI MEEKS

Chronicle Correspondent

Sometimes people who garden or aspire to garden can benefit from a peek at someone else's handiwork, said Paula Anderson of the Champion Forest Garden Club.

"People see, 'Oh look, I can do this in my yard,' " she said.

On Sunday, the Champion Forest Garden Club will provide a close-up look at four sources of inspiration during its Backyard Garden Tour.

The event, set for 1-5 p.m., will include the following stops:

[SpringTX]

Sorry to chime in late on this one. My answer is "neither". Seriously, look farther north. The farther north, the better. If it's the commuting distance that you're concerned about, move closer to one of the main arteries like I-45.

[mrfootball]

Sorry to chime in late on this one. My answer is "neither". Seriously, look farther north. The farther north, the better. If it's the commuting distance that you're concerned about, move closer to one of the main arteries like I-45.

Beware the Woodlands Evangelists.

They forget to add that much of The Woodlands is filled with shoddy old $110-150k homes.

Transportation-wise, - there are just a few outlets for its 69,000+ residents to get to that main artery...that it takes nearly a half hour to get from the back of The Woodlands (where all of the new development is) --- geographically right behind TOMBALL, next to MAGNOLIA, to the front of the Woodlands during morning and afternoon rush hour.

They'll also proudly proclaim how great their community (which is a collection of highly segmented - highly homogenous sections) is while neglecting to recognize how many apartment complexes there are, the teenage arsonists, and petty crime that exists in every part of town.

They'll rave about their new Mall....yes they got a Mall a few years back. They'll rave about the cultural 'treasure' that is the Cynthia Woods pavillion, while secretly bitching about the riff-raff that it attracts to the community every weekend.

They'll proudly proclaim their property values are "skyrocketing" (as a result of the "town center" effect - right bachanon?)...how their $110,000 house rose in appraised value to a whopping $125,000...

They'll recant the latest Sunday ad put forth by the Woodlands Operating company, about how great life is in the Woodlands...just as they've been doing every weekend now for over 30 years...and yet, they still haven't managed to fill it up completely..unlike Spring, Klein, Champions and Cypress (each individually larger than The Woodlands) and each nearly built out.

They'll casually announce the impending decline of every other area of town, neglecting to recognize half of The Woodlands is an aging, dilapidated community.

They'll imply that The Woodlands has one of the highest AVG Household incomes, despite the fact they fall in behind equally large areas of Klein, Champions, and Cypress.

Someday, they (like the residents of Kingwood) will become Houstonians...

But for now, life is good...In The Twilight Zone.

[SpringTX]

Beware the Woodlands Evangelists.

They forget to add that much of The Woodlands is filled with shoddy old $110-150k homes.

Transportation-wise, - there are just a few outlets for its 69,000+ residents to get to that main artery...that it takes nearly a half hour to get from the back of The Woodlands (where all of the new development is) --- geographically right behind TOMBALL, next to MAGNOLIA, to the front of the Woodlands during morning and afternoon rush hour.

They'll also proudly proclaim how great their community (which is a collection of highly segmented - highly homogenous sections) is while neglecting to recognize how many apartment complexes there are, the teenage arsonists, and petty crime that exists in every part of town.

They'll rave about their new Mall....yes they got a Mall a few years back. They'll rave about the cultural 'treasure' that is the Cynthia Woods pavillion, while secretly bitching about the riff-raff that it attracts to the community every weekend.

They'll proudly proclaim their property values are "skyrocketing" (as a result of the "town center" effect - right bachanon?)...how their $110,000 house rose in appraised value to a whopping $125,000...

They'll recant the latest Sunday ad put forth by the Woodlands Operating company, about how great life is in the Woodlands...just as they've been doing every weekend now for over 30 years...and yet, they still haven't managed to fill it up completely..unlike Spring, Klein, Champions and Cypress (each individually larger than The Woodlands) and each nearly built out.

They'll casually announce the impending decline of every other area of town, neglecting to recognize half of The Woodlands is an aging, dilapidated community.

They'll imply that The Woodlands has one of the highest AVG Household incomes, despite the fact they fall in behind equally large areas of Klein, Champions, and Cypress.

Someday, they (like the residents of Kingwood) will become Houstonians...

But for now, life is good...In The Twilight Zone.

First of all, I think we're going to need a new thread for this discussion, because there's a lot to it.

Almost everything you said has some basis of truth to it. And some of your points are even right on the money; for example, it's true that much of The Woodlands isn't much different from some neighborhoods in NW Harris County, like Champions, for example. But even accounting for all that, there is still a lot to The Woodlands that makes it a better real estate investment than the surrounding communities in NW Harris County.

First of all, the property values in The Woodlands are definitely doing better than the NW Harris areas. From my experience and research, The Woodlands homes are going for as much as 20% more than comparable homes in NW Harris right now. And 20% is pretty significant; the average value of a home in The Woodlands is $200,000, so that means $40,000 more. And I expect that trend to continue. The Woodlands properties could be worth 50% more in a decade's time.

Why?

1) The Woodlands has a huge environmental/aesthetic advantage over most residential communities in NW Harris County. Many older upscale neighborhoods in Klein have custom homes and heavily wooded lots. Some even have golf courses. But do they have an integrated network of hundreds of miles of bike trails and parks? And a high percentage of cul-de-sacs? And every home subject to strict architectural controls? And prohibitions against yard/garage sales? And strictly-controlled commercial development for neighborhood shops for a "small town" scale? And churches and public buildings planned and maintained with the strict environmental controls and aesthetic consistency? And public art works? In all of these respects, the "whole is greater than the sum of the parts". The result is that the neighborhoods in The Woodlands look and feel like an entirely different world.

2) The Woodlands is a retail/tourism hub. Its themed upscale retail complexes, golf courses, concert pavillion, resort & conference center, home shows, ice skating rink, water taxis, etc. draw people from far and wide. Some of this stuff you can find elsewhere on the north side of Houston, but not all of it. If you live in this area, you already know that most everyone in NW Harris County goes to The Woodlands for their shopping (at the mall), their movie-going, and even for a lot of their dining out.

3) The commute time is generally 5 or 10 minutes for the 30,000 people who work in The Woodlands. And that's expected to grow to 45,000.

Why will The Woodlands property values continue to outpace its neighbors?

1) Many neighborhoods along 1960 have been ruined by low-income apartment complexes going up. The Woodlands won't even let a Wal-Mart come in unless they completely re-design it.

2) The Woodlands is big enough that it has its own schools. So if a neighboring community "turns ghetto", it won't wreck The Woodlands schools like what happened with Klein Forest HS, Westfield HS, etc.

3) The Woodlands helps discourage "riff-raff" with high homeowner fees.

4) Since The Woodlands is located in Montgomery County, it won't get bus routes like FM 1960 and Kuykendahl did.

If you're hoping for the death of The Woodlands, it's going to take many major blows on many fronts to even slow it down. The Woodlands was actually on the verge of collapse for the first 15 years of its lifetime (half its lifetime). Almost all other projects like it failed long ago. But for some reason, The Woodlands survived. And now it has grown so strong that it's going like a runaway freight train.

You can call it Disneyland, or the Twilight Zone, or Pleasantville, or Stepford. Say you what you like, it's thriving from a real estate perspective.

[mrfootball]

Ahem....Exhibit B.

First of all, the property values in The Woodlands are definitely doing better than the NW Harris areas. From my experience and research, The Woodlands homes are going for as much as 20% more than comparable homes in NW Harris right now. And 20% is pretty significant; the average value of a home in The Woodlands is $200,000, so that means $40,000 more. And I expect that trend to continue. The Woodlands properties could be worth 50% more in a decade's time.

Once again...subjective. I can show you homes in Klein and Cypress that are going for 25% more than TW (apples to apples)...and 25% is pretty significant. The Average Home in the Cypress Woods HS zone is well over $250,000. So that means $50,000 more than TW. Your assumptions are based on a belief that the rest of the world stands still outside of The Woodlands. You sir are suffering from Woodlands Myopia...a common condition among Woodlands newbies.

If you're hoping for the death of The Woodlands, it's going to take many major blows on many fronts to even slow it down. The Woodlands was actually on the verge of collapse for the first 15 years of its lifetime (half its lifetime). Almost all other projects like it failed long ago. But for some reason, The Woodlands survived. And now it has grown so strong that it's going like a runaway freight train.

We're just hoping you'll go away.

[SpringTX]

Once again...subjective. I can show you homes in Klein and Cypress that are going for 25% more than TW (apples to apples)...and 25% is pretty significant. The Average Home in the Cypress Woods HS zone is well over $250,000. So that means $50,000 more than TW. Your assumptions are based on a belief that the rest of the world stands still outside of The Woodlands. You sir are suffering from Woodlands Myopia...a common condition among Woodlands newbies.

I wasn't familiar with the Cypress Woods HS zone. I just looked it up on a map and I see it's on the northwest edge of town. So this is geographically removed from the Klein/Champions area that we were discussing. And if I'm not mistaken, this area is also a lot newer, and growing. So, just to get it out of the way, this area could easily be doing as well or better than The Woodlands in terms of real estate values and growth and so on.

But having said that...I checked the HAR data out of curiosity.

I hunted around for some names of subdivisions in that zone and the first one I found was Stone Gate. It's at $66 sf (less than all the villages in The Woodlands), and Stone Gate has actually gone down in value over the last 4 years:

http://www.har.com/neighborhoods/showdetai...sid=1119940001&

The next one I found was Riata Ranch at $67 sq ft (lower than everything in The Woodlands), and it's only increased 3% in the last 4 years.

http://www.har.com/neighborhoods/showdetai...sid=1118626001&

The next one I found was Canyon Lakes at Stone Gate, which is at $61 sq ft, even lower than the others, and it's dropped 20% in value over the past 3 years:

http://www.har.com/neighborhoods/showdetai...sid=1121649001&

And then I found Canyon Lakes Village, which is at $67 sq ft, but it has grown 20% in value in the past 3 years:

http://www.har.com/neighborhoods/showdetai...sid=1121389001&

Since these were just the first ones I found, I have no idea if they're a representative sample or not. If they are, then the median price per square foot of homes in the Cypress Woods HS zone appears to be well below that of all the villages in The Woodlands. And the appreciation in home values appears to be slower as well. If you can point me to a list of subdivision names that feed into Cypress Woods HS, I can check them and get a clearer picture.